Overreaction theater!

Well people at 4chan /v/ are overreacting about gay inclusiveness, and people at the codex are overreacting about cooldowns and level scaling.

Just what I got from the forums I'm lurking...

 

Whine on the codex and /v/? Don't you say?!

VANCIAN STRONG! REMOVE SAWYER FROM PREMISES!

Vancian sucks. Remove evdk from premises.

 

Well when the forum is filled with people from the RPGcodex, what'd ya expect?

Good design advice.

Funny that none of them work in the gaming industry then.

Funny that rpgs turned **** by following crowds that disgree with them.

Did someone fart ?

Alright OP, I was mean to you, it's just that I can't stand when people are talking out of their asses and I'm a little tiny bit sorry if I hurt your feelings in the process with some of my remarks. This is not the Bioware knitting circle so I assumed people are less thin-skinned.

 

But look at it from the bright side; the next time you talk out of your ass and someone says something mean to you, it won't hurt as much as the previous times and you won't feel the need to open an "I'm butthurt" thread. :D

 

uh... huh... if you think your insults are why i opened this then you're a bit full of yourself on that account, had nothing to do with this, and i don't care i you believe that or not. what it did have to do with was the sky is falling mentality that the OP and most of the rest of the comments in the thread were fostering. making assumptions like it was going to be the worst thing ever (because that's always what happens IRL...) don't accomplish anything.

 

No, I wasn't assuming it will be "the worst thing ever". It's not like level scaling is something new, right?

 

The only other swords&sorcery(&technology) game mechanics and combat ruleset they designed was Arcanum. I don't think Arcanum shined in this aspect.

So I do have my doubts and these doubts have just become bigger when they confirmed they'll use level scaling for (some) encounters. It's really simple. I'm not going to lose sleep over it or anything. I just stated it blatantly without ifs and apologies.

 

part of the problem with arcanum was that the publishers literally demanded that they include the real time with it because that was they way everything was going at the time. the game itself was designed to be turn based, in which form it is highly enjoyable. but the realtime part of it is so tacked on that it's barely functional.

 

i do have one question for you though. considering the quote does specifically say that level scaling is only one of the systems that they're using, and it also specifically says that it is going to have static areas, why were you so upset with having just part of the game level scaled when they already said it was going to have static areas as well? why did you assume that it was going to take over every aspect of the game, which was what i got from what you posted. maybe i misread, which i'm sure you'll let me know if i did.

 

not going to reply to what you say about it, just want to know.

 

Because I don't want parts of the game being a ****ty level scaled experience. I believe it's really simple to comprehend.

Why are you upset about me not wanting to deal with level scaling in parts of the game?

 

 

 

guess i was just curious why you focused so exclusively on that one part of the quote.

 

anyway, i'm done. not going to talk about it anymore until there's more information.

Edited October 2, 2012 by Madzookeeper

Well people at 4chan /v/ are overreacting about gay inclusiveness, and people at the codex are overreacting about cooldowns and level scaling.

Just what I got from the forums I'm lurking...

 

Whine on the codex and /v/? Don't you say?!

I wanna see a good argument as why level scaling and cooldowns are a bad thing, so far I've only seen pure hatred lol.The way Sawyer was explaining the magic system sounded pretty reasonable to me, still, what do I know...

Well people at 4chan /v/ are overreacting about gay inclusiveness, and people at the codex are overreacting about cooldowns and level scaling.

Just what I got from the forums I'm lurking...

 

Whine on the codex and /v/? Don't you say?!

I wanna see a good argument as why level scaling and cooldowns are a bad thing, so far I've only seen pure hatred lol.The way Sawyer was explaining the magic system sounded pretty reasonable to me, still, what do I know...

 

because if you use what dragon age had it makes for exceedingly boring and button mashy combat. i have a combo! must use at every opportunity!. but if you actually have consequences for using those button mashy things... well, then it could be interesting. but i think that's really the biggest complaint about cool downs. you just get bored with the combat.

 

as for level scaling, i think the biggest complaint of seen about it (when done poorly) is that you just don't feel like you've gained any ground when you level up. basically you should feel more powerful when you go back to somewhere you've been, but whne everything levels with you sometimes you feel weaker than when you were first there.

...damn...most o' these kiddies wouldna lasted a day on the Isle...gonna 'ave ta start handin' out tissues at the door...

 

 

...WHO LUVS YA, BABY!!...

Alright OP, I was mean to you, it's just that I can't stand when people are talking out of their asses and I'm a little tiny bit sorry if I hurt your feelings in the process with some of my remarks. This is not the Bioware knitting circle so I assumed people are less thin-skinned.

 

But look at it from the bright side; the next time you talk out of your ass and someone says something mean to you, it won't hurt as much as the previous times and you won't feel the need to open an "I'm butthurt" thread. :D

 

uh... huh... if you think your insults are why i opened this then you're a bit full of yourself on that account, had nothing to do with this, and i don't care i you believe that or not. what it did have to do with was the sky is falling mentality that the OP and most of the rest of the comments in the thread were fostering. making assumptions like it was going to be the worst thing ever (because that's always what happens IRL...) don't accomplish anything.

 

No, I wasn't assuming it will be "the worst thing ever". It's not like level scaling is something new, right?

 

The only other swords&sorcery(&technology) game mechanics and combat ruleset they designed was Arcanum. I don't think Arcanum shined in this aspect.

So I do have my doubts and these doubts have just become bigger when they confirmed they'll use level scaling for (some) encounters. It's really simple. I'm not going to lose sleep over it or anything. I just stated it blatantly without ifs and apologies.

 

part of the problem with arcanum was that the publishers literally demanded that they include the real time with it because that was they way everything was going at the time. the game itself was designed to be turn based, in which form it is highly enjoyable. but the realtime part of it is so tacked on that it's barely functional.

 

i do have one question for you though. considering the quote does specifically say that level scaling is only one of the systems that they're using, and it also specifically says that it is going to have static areas, why were you so upset with having just part of the game level scaled when they already said it was going to have static areas as well? why did you assume that it was going to take over every aspect of the game, which was what i got from what you posted. maybe i misread, which i'm sure you'll let me know if i did.

 

not going to reply to what you say about it, just want to know.

 

Because I don't want parts of the game being a ****ty level scaled experience. I believe it's really simple to comprehend.

Why are you upset about me not wanting to deal with level scaling in parts of the game?

 

 

 

guess i was just curious why you focused so exclusively on that one part of the quote.

 

anyway, i'm done. not going to talk about it anymore until there's more information.

 

If someone gave you a cake which has a half that contains ****.. would you focus on the good parts or throw the cake in a waste container?

Well people at 4chan /v/ are overreacting about gay inclusiveness, and people at the codex are overreacting about cooldowns and level scaling.

Just what I got from the forums I'm lurking...

 

Whine on the codex and /v/? Don't you say?!

I wanna see a good argument as why level scaling and cooldowns are a bad thing, so far I've only seen pure hatred lol.The way Sawyer was explaining the magic system sounded pretty reasonable to me, still, what do I know...

 

because if you use what dragon age had it makes for exceedingly boring and button mashy combat. i have a combo! must use at every opportunity!. but if you actually have consequences for using those button mashy things... well, then it could be interesting. but i think that's really the biggest complaint about cool downs. you just get bored with the combat.

 

as for level scaling, i think the biggest complaint of seen about it (when done poorly) is that you just don't feel like you've gained any ground when you level up. basically you should feel more powerful when you go back to somewhere you've been, but whne everything levels with you sometimes you feel weaker than when you were first there.

It all boils down to how are they going to implement those things, people are getting mad too soon IMO. I really don't see they making the same mistakes of other RPG's, they are professionals and probably played those games, and know their faults...

Their's a reason why I'm a hell of a lot less active on here. It's tiresome to read most peoples comments. Really, this whole MB is starting to remind me of why it is I limit myself to interacting with a very specific set of people online. People just need to learn how to chill out, and deal with things from a rational standpoint.

 

And sure, I can understand the emotional investment. I'm financially and emotionally invested in this, too. But, I'm not going to allow that to be an excuse for me to act the part of a blithering idiot.

@ valorian

 

i'd wait for more information about what they were doing with it in this case.

 

@ troller

 

yea, that's pretty much what i was thinking overall. there isn't enough info.

I prefer the way it was handled in FO:NV. All I'm going to say about level scaling (because I hate it).

 

It is interesting to see what gets people all riled up though, as you can sort of shortlist it on 5-6 subjects that brings out the worst (and most passionate) in people. Favourite contenders so far are romances, camera perspective, turnbased/rtwp, vancian/cooldown and level scaling.

@ gorth

 

yea, pretty much noticed that in the comments on the kickstarter. but it wasn't anywhere near the level of vitriol that i saw on here. kinda surprised me in all honesty.

I prefer the way it was handled in FO:NV. All I'm going to say about level scaling (because I hate it).

 

It is interesting to see what gets people all riled up though, as you can sort of shortlist it on 5-6 subjects that brings out the worst (and most passionate) in people. Favourite contenders so far are romances, camera perspective, turnbased/rtwp, vancian/cooldown and level scaling.

Thi smight have something to do that questionable design decisions regarding these terms are one of the symptoms of the overall decline of the genre.

Please, we gotta make a plea to those haters, be more specific as to why those systems suck and will suck forever, and there is no way to implement them in a good way.

Haters going to hate. Just keep spreading the love to balance it out then pity them as they are proven wrong(or when they are proven right) and move on to hating something else.

I prefer the way it was handled in FO:NV. All I'm going to say about level scaling (because I hate it).

 

It is interesting to see what gets people all riled up though, as you can sort of shortlist it on 5-6 subjects that brings out the worst (and most passionate) in people. Favourite contenders so far are romances, camera perspective, turnbased/rtwp, vancian/cooldown and level scaling.

 

I agree some people want to eat,sleep and sh*t PE and other just want a enjoyable fun game that you don't have to poke your eyes playing.

 

I agree some people want to eat,sleep and sh*t PE and other just want a enjoyable fun game that you don't have to poke your eyes playing.

 

That's pretty crafty, framing the debate so that your side just wants an enjoyable experience, while the other side consists mainly of fanatics.

All sides want an enjoyable game. We just can't come to a group consensus on what "enjoyable" is.

It IS crafty. He made all the posts here prove his point for him!

I agree some people want to eat,sleep and sh*t PE and other just want a enjoyable fun game that you don't have to poke your eyes playing.

 

That's pretty crafty, framing the debate so that your side just wants an enjoyable experience, while the other side consists mainly of fanatics.

 

Thanks I guess..lol It just what I feel when I read the post. There are some people trying to force feed how they want the game to be. What's wrong with making the game enjoyable for all types of game players that love RPG's ???

It IS crafty. He made all the posts here prove his point for him!

If you say so.

Unfortunately this is a symptom of a clear lack of detail on Obsidians part. If they would come out and tell us at least in general terms what they are are going to make the combat like then there would be no overreactions. People would either back the project or not.

 

All we are getting is comments on the kickstarter comments section from Feargus. If they dont know what they are doing yet, then I'm sorry but maybe they launched the kickstarter too soon.

Let's face it - all of us want for Obsiadian to make a perfect game. And all of us would gladly campaign to get our vision of the perfect game trough.

 

Not me. Perfection is the enemy of good. I'm just hoping they'll give us the table-top feel and atmosphere of the Baldur's Gate series, but push the envelope with new capabilities, refinements, and options.

All sides want an enjoyable game. We just can't come to a group consensus on what "enjoyable" is.

This is very true !

Edited October 2, 2012 by Vampero