Races - Don't stick to Tolkien

[cyberarmy]

I think its better to stick with "generic" fantasy races&creatures instead of inventing new ones.

 

And they also told us there will be 2 different race(maybe with sub races even) and new races will come when KS got enough funding, so i dont think there's really a problem here.

[JeremyR]

Fantasy is a broad category. While on the one hand it can encompass pretty much anything, it's also heavily based on real world folklore and mythology.

 

People today might not believe in elves, dwarves, and non-internet trolls, but people did a 1000 years ago. To me, that gives them an added amount of believability that recently made up monsters and people don't have.

[Halberd]

Apparently Chris Avellone hates elves and generic fantasy. There has been hints that elves will be in Project Eternity though.

 

There has also been hints that they will handle the races well though. I saw a concept art picture of what looked like a ranger/woodland dwarf. Better than the stereotypical underground stone mining dwarf right?

[Virgil]

I'm very pleased that traditional races are in. I would like PE to be ultimate RPG and to achieve this it must have elves, dwarves and dragons. Also this discussion is kind of pointless as it well known that Elves and Dwarves will be in the game, along with other races. You don't like elves and dwarves I'm sure you will be able to try "new" races. There is something for everybody so what's the problem ?

[Qumi]

In early christian Britain, elves were considered fallen angels, those who did not rebel against God, but also who did not support him. As punishment they were sent to earth to live as mortals, but still having angelic powers. Their was the power of illusion. They had no souls as well, and as such could not distinguish between evil and good, doing things on whim. I wouldn't mind such elves or similar.

[Chaz]

For me this was a big letdown in DA:O compared to Mass Effect. Seriously when you think Mass Effect you think about the interesting and different races such as the Asari, the Turians and the Krogans and that sense of discovery.

 

I totally agree, specially if they want to establish their own franchise. At least the Dwarf from the artwork was not waring heavy armor and drinking beer, accompanied by an Elven WIzard... oh the genericness!

[novander]

Using traditional tropes such as elves and dwarves does have some advantages. Our PC is very unlikely to be an amnesiac, PS:T style, so is expected to have some familiarity with the world. I see a band of warrior elves heading towards me, I have a reasonable idea of what to expect. These guys can be talked to, probably won't attack on sight. Having talked my way out of a fight with them I carry on down the road to see a band of warrior xnarfoids heading towards me. The PC would know whether to run, fight or smile and offer candy. I, the player, do not.

 

I don't want D&D elves and dwarves, I do want unique races to have a large role, but I'd like something that I can connect to as a player to give me a grounding in the world.

[Haawkings]

They could trade orcs/half-orcs with trolls, trolls are awesome.

 

[Dorateen]

Seems a lot of people are going to be disappointed when the Hobbit movie comes out in December. Even greater Tolkien influence will be felt in fantasy cRPG projects. Just as The Lord of the Rings had its impact on NWN2.

[Amentep]

Seems a lot of people are going to be disappointed when the Hobbit movie comes out in December. Even greater Tolkien influence will be felt in fantasy cRPG projects. Just as The Lord of the Rings had its impact on NWN2.

 

I think Tolkien's fantasy stuff has its place. I just don't think it should be the only flavor of ice cream we get.

 

I loved it in SSI's Phantasie when creating your party you could randomly get some of the monster races to join your party. I liked the inclusion of the planetouched in NWN2 (since they didn't show up much in D&D videogames to my experience).

 

But ultimately as long as the races in the game - standard or non-standard, Tolkien or not - as long as they're fun to play and distinct enough to give reasons to want to play them...well I'm good with that.

[dlux]

I am happy that elves and dwarves from germanc/norse mythology are going to be included in the game. According to Sawyer they are (of course) not going to copy Tolkien's version, they are creating their own dwarves and elves.

 

I would also like to see some original races that I have never seen anywhere else though.

Edited September 20, 2012 by dlux

[Dorateen]

I am happy that elves and dwarves from germanc/norse mythology are going to be included in the game. According to Sawyer they are (of course) not going to copy Tolkien's version

 

You realize that Tolkien's dwarves, in particular, were directly influenced by Norse mythology, yes? Where do you think the names from Thorin's company were derived from?

[dlux]

I am happy that elves and dwarves from germanc/norse mythology are going to be included in the game. According to Sawyer they are (of course) not going to copy Tolkien's version

 

You realize that Tolkien's dwarves, in particular, were directly influenced by Norse mythology, yes? Where do you think the names from Thorin's company were derived from?

 

Uhhhh, what are you talking about? Didn't I just write that? ^^

[Dorateen]

I am happy that elves and dwarves from germanc/norse mythology are going to be included in the game. According to Sawyer they are (of course) not going to copy Tolkien's version

 

You realize that Tolkien's dwarves, in particular, were directly influenced by Norse mythology, yes? Where do you think the names from Thorin's company were derived from?

 

Uhhhh, what are you talking about? Didn't I just write that? ^^

 

You said, "... dwarves from germanic/norse mythology are going to be included in the game."

 

And then you say the developers are not going to copy Tolkien.

 

You don't see the contradiction?

[1varangian]

I would be much more interested in seeing human subraces with their own cultural and physical traits and style. Elves and dwarves really are done to death and they unfortunately mainstream any attempt at an original setting.

 

I would like to see races that have some built-in controversies. Like humans with demon blood. No funky horns or tails though but a more subtle approach. Inhuman strength, mildly allergic to silver, etc.

 

Or say a culture where religious leaders have widely adopted dubious practises like drug abuse. With some interesting psychic side effects or revelations that outsiders view as insanity. That would be much more cool than "pointy ears, long life span, excellent archers".

[dlux]

I am happy that elves and dwarves from germanc/norse mythology are going to be included in the game. According to Sawyer they are (of course) not going to copy Tolkien's version

 

You realize that Tolkien's dwarves, in particular, were directly influenced by Norse mythology, yes? Where do you think the names from Thorin's company were derived from?

 

Uhhhh, what are you talking about? Didn't I just write that? ^^

 

You said, "... dwarves from germanic/norse mythology are going to be included in the game."

 

And then you say the developers are not going to copy Tolkien.

 

You don't see the contradiction?

 

Uh, no. Just because you have elves and dwarfs in a game does not automatically mean that you are using Tolkien's interpretation.

[Dorateen]

I am happy that elves and dwarves from germanc/norse mythology are going to be included in the game. According to Sawyer they are (of course) not going to copy Tolkien's version

 

You realize that Tolkien's dwarves, in particular, were directly influenced by Norse mythology, yes? Where do you think the names from Thorin's company were derived from?

 

Uhhhh, what are you talking about? Didn't I just write that? ^^

 

You said, "... dwarves from germanic/norse mythology are going to be included in the game."

 

And then you say the developers are not going to copy Tolkien.

 

You don't see the contradiction?

 

Uh, no. Just because you have elves and dwarfs in a game does not automatically mean that you are using Tolkien's interpretation.

 

You made the point to make a distinction, specifically referring to dwarves from germanic/norse mythology... which has a direct link to Tolkien's interpretation.

 

Choose your words more carefully.

[dlux]

I am happy that elves and dwarves from germanc/norse mythology are going to be included in the game. According to Sawyer they are (of course) not going to copy Tolkien's version

 

You realize that Tolkien's dwarves, in particular, were directly influenced by Norse mythology, yes? Where do you think the names from Thorin's company were derived from?

 

Uhhhh, what are you talking about? Didn't I just write that? ^^

 

You said, "... dwarves from germanic/norse mythology are going to be included in the game."

 

And then you say the developers are not going to copy Tolkien.

 

You don't see the contradiction?

 

Uh, no. Just because you have elves and dwarfs in a game does not automatically mean that you are using Tolkien's interpretation.

 

You made the point to make a distinction, specifically referring to dwarves from germanic/norse mythology... which has a direct link to Tolkien's interpretation.

 

Choose your words more carefully.

What? Dwarves and elves originated from germanic/norse mythology and not from Tolkien. If I design a 10 meter tall elf with green skin that comes from the planet mars and sniffs on farts, does that make him a Tolkien elf or what just because he has pointy ears?

 

You have no idea what you are talking about. Elves and dwarves from germanic/norse mythology are not exactly the same as in Tolkiens interpretation. There are actually many different interpretations of these mythical creatures in germanic/norse mythology itself.

Edited September 20, 2012 by dlux

[maggotheart]

Please, please don't stick with stock races from fantasy games by which I mean Elves, Dwarves, Gnomes, Halflings etc... These races have been done to death and lack any feeling of discovery. Elves feel like elves and dwarves feel like dwarves no matter what spin is put on them. No matter how anyone tries to redfine them, they always carry the stereotypes.

 

I'd really like to see Obsidian put effort into crafting interesting and original races than rehash tired old tropes which we've all seen dozens of times from Tolkien. For me this was a big letdown in DA:O compared to Mass Effect. Seriously when you think Mass Effect you think about the interesting and different races such as the Asari, the Turians and the Krogans and that sense of discovery. Same with Planescape Torment as a setting which introduced Tieflings, Succubi, Automatons, Githzerai, Githyanki etc... all really different from standard Tolkien. When you're launching a new IP like this don't you want to be remembered for your unique creations?

 

I agree with this so much, it was the first thing I thought when I heard "new IP" and "elves and dwarves" in the video. There is a real opportunity to do something different and original here. If I could have one wish come true for this project, it would be this.

[Scryer]

Mass Effect is the epitome of originality when it comes to species/races design, allow me to demonstrate:

Asari - Blue humanoid space chick stereotype

Turians - Humanoid alien with a noble warrior culture stereotype

Krogan - Humanoid alien with a barbaric (but still noble in a primal kind-of-way) warrior culture stereotype

It is the perfect example in a discussion about how not to design stereotypical fantasy races.

 

Also yes on the elemental races, I suggest Plutonium elemental with a special racial ability to kill through radiation poisoning.

[Darji]

Please, please don't stick with stock races from fantasy games by which I mean Elves, Dwarves, Gnomes, Halflings etc... These races have been done to death and lack any feeling of discovery. Elves feel like elves and dwarves feel like dwarves no matter what spin is put on them. No matter how anyone tries to redfine them, they always carry the stereotypes.

 

I'd really like to see Obsidian put effort into crafting interesting and original races than rehash tired old tropes which we've all seen dozens of times from Tolkien. For me this was a big letdown in DA:O compared to Mass Effect. Seriously when you think Mass Effect you think about the interesting and different races such as the Asari, the Turians and the Krogans and that sense of discovery. Same with Planescape Torment as a setting which introduced Tieflings, Succubi, Automatons, Githzerai, Githyanki etc... all really different from standard Tolkien. When you're launching a new IP like this don't you want to be remembered for your unique creations?

 

Here is the concept art for the dwarf like race

 

 

So yeah Thread can be closed.

[Dorateen]

That is one female dwarf, from one cultural region in the proposed setting. Notice she is beardless, just how female dwarves are typically presented in fantasy cRPGs.

 

Do we know what male dwarves look like, and the variations of the race, such has Hill and Mountain dwarves?

 

Thread re-opened.

 

Harumph!

 

PS: No doubt she's an outcast, not a proper Dwarf.

Edited September 20, 2012 by Dorateen