So... Democracy...

[Calax]

Not sure how far this has flown under the radar, but I saw it initially on the Colbert Report.

 

http://www.suntimes.com/news/jackson/50132...ton-harbor.html (uh, that's written by Jesse Jackson... so it's a TINY bit biased)

http://maddowblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011...n-benton-harbor (that's from Rachel Maddow's show)

 

Apparently in the Michigan town of Benton Harbor the State leadership has gone in and basically replaced the town's democratically elected government with an "E F M" or Emergency Financial Manager, because the town is the lowest income and most financially troubled town in the state.

 

Literally the guy got appointed, and then the next day used his powers to strip the mayor and city commission of their ability to do anything, because they might oppose his "drastic measures" to save the place (including merging the Police and Fire departments).

 

According to Mr. Jackson, one of the first things that happened was that a state park that Whirlpool was trying to get privatized so it could put a development there (it's beachfront onto the great lakes) had been blocked by the city. As soon as the new guy rolled in, Whirlpool got what it wanted in the name of "mo money!"

 

Anyway, thoughts?

[WDeranged]

Grim stuff, my conspiratorial side suspects they'd love to pull this **** all over the place, nice to see it's getting coverage.

[Enoch]

I know nothing about the particulars of the case, and if this is actually an exercise of pure moneyed influence doing at the state level what it couldn't at the local level, it is alarming. But, in a more general sense, there is often a counter-argument for when higher levels of government 'overstep their bounds' and override more local levels of government: Sometimes-- pretty often, actually-- local governments suck.

 

It's a common and often unfair criticism that governments are made up of people who couldn't cut it in the business world, but in certain areas it has an element of truth. And it is more and more true as you move down levels of government. In the vast majority of cases, the pay, the prestige factor, the standards of acceptable performance, the level of institutional oversight, and the level of scrutiny from the media and the voters are all dramatically lower at the local government level than they are at the state or federal level. A higher incidence of third-rate employees and politicians, combined with few oversight mechanisms makes for some really bad situations. Federal waste, fraud, and instances of moneyed influence get talked about a lot (largely because there are dozens of media organizations watching the feds quite closely), but if you actually had reliable data and looked at all the comparable governmental waste and fraud by local governments as a percentage of expenditures, it would absolutely dwarf what happens at the federal level.

 

 

 

Also, at least the citizens of Benton Harbor get to vote for representatives at the state level. Congress does this kind of thing is done to the D.C. government on a regular basis, and, due to a series of historical anomalies, D.C.'s representative in Congress doesn't even have a vote.

[Walsingham]

I agree that it sucks to have a democratic body usurped. And there is no reason I can think of to let the administrators corruptly feth deals.

 

HOWEVER, as Enoch says, a huge amount of govt. waste occurs. And I'd go further and suggest that if people knew that they might have democracy sezied by the repo men then they might pay a little morre ****ing attention.

[Calax]

The question is how much of a precedent does this set.

[Raithe]

I agree that it sucks to have a democratic body usurped. And there is no reason I can think of to let the administrators corruptly feth deals.

 

HOWEVER, as Enoch says, a huge amount of govt. waste occurs. And I'd go further and suggest that if people knew that they might have democracy sezied by the repo men then they might pay a little morre ****ing attention.

 

Heh, the old "if you go into politics you're accounts are checked and frozen, and when you leave office if you caused a fething waste you'll be fined money but if it all ran well and true you'll get a bonus" idea?

[Freedom Fighter]

Democracy is evil. It is definetely worse than anarchy.

 

A)ELECTIONS

 

Under democracy, 30-year cretin can vote, but 17-year genius cannot. That is wrong. Decisive amount of electors know nothing about politics or economy. They are just brainwashed by media, which is, in turn, in private property. When people are ill, they go to doctor, they do not ask people in the streets. But when democratic country is ill, it is asking people on streets, and people on streets are controlled by media, and media is controlled by those who have money.

 

B)PRIVATE PROPERTY

 

Under democracy, everything, even media, is in private property. That is wrong. That means that some capitalist with lots of money can just buy television channel and brainwash electors, or do other such thing. Money is everything under democracy. Democrats see culture, education and science as some sort of commodities. Private property is more important than human life under democracy.

 

C)DISTRIBUTION OF WEALTH

 

Under democracy, distribution of wealth is unjust - most hard-working individuals are usually most poor ones. That is wrong. Because low level of life spreads unrest, modern democracies usually prefer to increase level of life of workers - by decreasing level of life in controlled countries, by exploiting them. Democracy is impossible without exploitation.

 

D)LIMITED PSYCHOLOGY

 

Under democracy, people are judged by what they consume, not by who they really are. People seek only profit, and those who try to seek self-improvement often cannot earn much money to survive.

 

E)CONSUMPTION PARADIGM

 

Democratical economy is based purely on consumption - most money is circulating in non-productive spheres, while productive spheres produce only consumer goods. That is wrong. Best-selling goods under democracy are lies and madness - democracies have wide media, show-business and public relations web. Moreover, democracy does not seek to improve methods of production, it just seeks new resources. Instead of building better machines, it exploits countries with cheaper and cheaper labor. Instead of seeking new resources, it conquers other countries to leech their resources. When resources are exhausted, democracies move to another area, using brute force when necessary. Like a virus.

 

Democracy is disease, a cancer of our planet. And we are the cure.

 

A)DEMOCRATIC CENTRALISM

 

Under our order, all will have right to say, but only competent will have right to vote.

 

B)SOCIALIST PROPERTY

 

Under our order, all institutes will belong and will serve to people, not to rich individuals.

 

C)MERITOCRACY

 

Under our order, most hard-working individuals will receive best positions. Our order is society of equal opportunities. There will be no poor people - everybody will receive food, medicine, shelter, free education and free access to information.

 

D)STRUGGLE FOR SELF-IMPROVEMENT

 

Under our order, people will be judged only by what they really are. Struggle for self-improvement is a backbone of our order.

 

E)CREATION PARADIGM

 

Under our order, society will struggle for creation, not for consumption. Material things will no longer rule people. Instead, people will rule material things. Our order will prosper through conquering blind powers of nature, not through conquering other people. Progress is everything.

 

Our order is communism. Future is our time.

 

Vote for Communist Party of United States of America (CPUSA)!

 

Go Stalin! Go communism!

[Walsingham]

Democracy is evil. It is definetely worse than anarchy.

 

A)ELECTIONS

 

Under democracy, 30-year cretin can vote, but 17-year genius cannot. That is wrong. Decisive amount of electors know nothing about politics or economy. They are just brainwashed by media, which is, in turn, in private property. When people are ill, they go to doctor, they do not ask people in the streets. But when democratic country is ill, it is asking people on streets, and people on streets are controlled by media, and media is controlled by those who have money.

 

*snip*

 

A)DEMOCRATIC CENTRALISM

 

Under our order, all will have right to say, but only competent will have right to vote.

 

Yeah, sure thing. Voting wil be ony by those who are competent... as expressed by their faith in Marxist-Leninist ideology, since only a fool wouldn't agree. The Party is all. The Party is the state. Without any alternative power structures such as personal wealth or church the Party dominates all.

 

All rights and freedoms are accorded by the State-Party, rather than having any inalienable basis. Disagreement is ruthlessly suppressed both to maintain ideological progress and to preserve the purity of the revolutionary society.

 

The consequence is total abject slavery to the State-Party, and the elite social class of Marxist-Leninist apparatchiks. Mankind becomes a dumb beast of burden.

[Freedom Fighter]

^You never even been in USSR, how do you know that it's "slavery to the State-Party", from your gov-t propaganda (i.e. CNN)? Bah, load o bullcrap

[Gorgon]

I guess the Russians overthrew the regime because they were bored then.

[Gorgon]

On second thought that's probably too kind, more like it collapsed under its own ineptitude.

[Morgoth]

How is it Freedom Figher still has 0 posts? A Soviet Wunderwaffe?

[Pidesco]

Way off-topic posts do not increase you post count.

[Gorgon]

WOT post don't count towards post count.

[Morgoth]

Wow, almost 7k posts and I haven't figured this out yet. I really post too much...

[Humodour]

Your face posts too much.

[Walsingham]

^You never even been in USSR, how do you know that it's "slavery to the State-Party", from your gov-t propaganda (i.e. CNN)? Bah, load o bullcrap

 

What makes you assume that?

[Freedom Fighter]

^You never even been in USSR, how do you know that it's "slavery to the State-Party", from your gov-t propaganda (i.e. CNN)? Bah, load o bullcrap

 

What makes you assume that?

1 Iron Curtain

2 KGB

[Gorth]

You do know that 'Walsingham' is just yet another cover, right?

 

[Gorgon]

You could get into the Iron curtain without too much hassle, Their main concern was keeping their own citizens in. If you were connected with politics and even better, socialism, they would roll out the red carpet and give you the grand tour.

[Freedom Fighter]

^Looks like bull****...

Edited May 13, 2011 by Gorth
Non party approved language...

[Raithe]

We went to Russia back in the early 90's. The days glasnost was starting to break through. Stopped off in both Odessa and Yalta as part of a cruise.

 

The family had gone to the trouble of getting proper full visas rather then the "only as part of a guided tour" you got as part of the cruise packet.

We actually went on one of the official tours in the morning, mentioned to the tour guide that we had those visas and intended to wander around on our own.. and she really tried to be persuasive that we shouldn't be on our own, and that she could take us around and show us the sights that most people didn't realise were there.

 

So my parents thought why not, we met up with her later... and this "tour guide" took us around, would walk us up to private homes, rap on the door , the door would be opened and the tour guide would bark in russian, show some form of identification..and we'd suddenly be welcomed into these houses and shown the architecture and art inside.. After this happened a few times, we reaaaally got the feel that the woman might by chance be more then just a "tour guide".

 

But yes, the locals if they realised you were a westerner.. really loved you. They'd flock around, and the black market would just.. hell, more then just the black market. A police officer on duty sold his uniform hat to crew members for american dollars.

You literally had guys in seedy trenchcoats approach you, pull open the coats and pull out a rolled up newspapers festooned with watches.. or the inside of their jacket hanging with tins of caviar.. Off duty soldiers trying to sell pieces of their uniforms to tourists.. It was a little bit crazy in its way. They pulled out all the stops to get you to buy something with american dollars. They never wanted rubles, just clean dollars.

[Gorgon]

My dad was in East Germany twice, both times passing through. Earlier every west German citizen could pass check point charlie just using a passport. It was only after the mass escape attempts and the shootings by the east side guards that it was tightened up.

[Walsingham]

^You never even been in USSR, how do you know that it's "slavery to the State-Party", from your gov-t propaganda (i.e. CNN)? Bah, load o bullcrap

 

What makes you assume that?

1 Iron Curtain

2 KGB

 

I actually know some former KGB men. Border Guards. Nice chaps. Taught me a lot of what I know about throwing parties.

[Freedom Fighter]

I actually know some former KGB men. Border Guards. Nice chaps. Taught me a lot of what I know about throwing parties.

No such thing as a former KGB agent.