C&VG: Sega rules out Alpha Protocol sequel

[Wrath of Dagon]

At least Obsidian tries to do something different. Bioware doesn't have a single creative thought in their collective brain.

 

AP isn't so great that it has to have a sequel. The cancellation of the Aliens RPG was probably a far greater loss.

[Volourn]

"At least Obsidian tries to do something different. Bioware doesn't have a single creative thought in their collective brain."

 

This line of thinking continues to be hilarious. Obsidian hasn't done one original or creative thing. NWN2, KOTOR2, ME3 (aka AP), DS, FO:LV. Nothing creative.

 

BIO has gone from making MEDICAL SOFTWARE to creating games. From RTS to Action RPGs, to RPGs to RPGsn with 'shooter elements', and they've created original material.

 

Wake me up when obsidian actually does something on their own and soemthing different.

 

 

P.S. The fact you then complain about the cancelation of the Alien RPg which is MORE proof that Obsidian hasn't done anythuing creative on their own says a lot.

Edited July 7, 2010 by Volourn

[WorstUsernameEver]

AP isn't ME3 more than Mass Effect is Gears of War 2.

In other words, it's not.

If anything, keeping on the action side and polishing just the commando route would have probably given the game a more favorable reception.

[Volourn]

"AP isn't ME3 more than Mass Effect is Gears of War 2."

 

AP and ME have a heck of a lot more in common than ME and GOW do.

[Flouride]

This line of thinking continues to be hilarious. Obsidian hasn't done one original or creative thing. NWN2, KOTOR2, ME3 (aka AP), DS, FO:LV. Nothing creative.

 

I found KOTOR2 more original and creative than KOTOR as a Star Wars game. Mask of the Betrayers soul eating thingie (can't remember what it was called) was also somewhat original if you compare it to say NWN which didn't have anything creative nor spectacular when it comes to sp. Calling AP ME3 means that ME2 was Gears of War 3? And you haven't even played DS3 or FNV.

[Wrath of Dagon]

"At least Obsidian tries to do something different. Bioware doesn't have a single creative thought in their collective brain."

 

This line of thinking continues to be hilarious. Obsidian hasn't done one original or creative thing. NWN2, KOTOR2, ME3 (aka AP), DS, FO:LV. Nothing creative.

 

BIO has gone from making MEDICAL SOFTWARE to creating games. From RTS to Action RPGs, to RPGs to RPGsn with 'shooter elements', and they've created original material.

 

Wake me up when obsidian actually does something on their own and soemthing different.

 

 

P.S. The fact you then complain about the cancelation of the Alien RPg which is MORE proof that Obsidian hasn't done anythuing creative on their own says a lot.

I didn't say Bioware has never been creative. And while Obsidian did make some sequels, they brought something new to all of them.

[Purkake]

And no reason it should be not.

Well, luckily they can't now, so that problem is solved.

 

P.S. The fact you then complain about the cancelation of the Alien RPg which is MORE proof that Obsidian hasn't done anythuing creative on their own says a lot.

Just wanted to say the same thing. Hilarity all around.

 

This line of thinking continues to be hilarious. Obsidian hasn't done one original or creative thing. NWN2, KOTOR2, ME3 (aka AP), DS, FO:LV. Nothing creative.

 

I found KOTOR2 more original and creative than KOTOR as a Star Wars game. Mask of the Betrayers soul eating thingie (can't remember what it was called) was also somewhat original if you compare it to say NWN which didn't have anything creative nor spectacular when it comes to sp. Calling AP ME3 means that ME2 was Gears of War 3? And you haven't even played DS3 or FNV.

While I love both games, KotOR 2 and MotB actually have the same concept as their basis(suck force/suck souls).

Edited July 7, 2010 by Purkake

[Volourn]

"I found KOTOR2 more original and creative than KOTOR as a Star Wars game."

 

KOTOR2 is a sequel to KOTOR which is a pre existing IP.

 

 

" Mask of the Betrayers soul eating thingie (can't remember what it was called) was also somewhat original if you compare it to say NWN which didn't have anything creative nor spectacular when it comes to sp."

 

MOTB (which, btw, I love, so I'm not about to bash it) is an expansion to NWN2 which is a sequel to NWN which is a pren exisiting IP.

 

 

" Calling AP ME3 means that ME2 was Gears of War 3?"

 

Again, AP and ME series have a lot more in common than ME and GOW of do. At best, the only thing ME and GOW have in common is a similar combat system while AP and ME share a heck of lot more similarities including and not limited to dialogue system, main charater, actual C&C,a nd overall style.

 

 

" And you haven't even played DS3 or FNV. "

 

They are sequels to popular series. It's not creative to make a game with a number beside it.

[Wombat]

AP isn't ME3 more than Mass Effect is Gears of War 2.

In other words, it's not.

If anything, keeping on the action side and polishing just the commando route would have probably given the game a more favorable reception.

Have you read some reviews at major sites? Quite many of them seem to have expected shooter stealth action game-play and have been disappointed by the results. Making game-plays complete is one thing and making game-plays which can be sold to the targeted players is another. If the first condition were the only one, Obsidian could be making games on Infinity Engine or something similar. As I said, Bioware has been updating their game-plays, adapting to the preferences of their targeted market. Henry Ford was equivocally said to be a brilliant innovator but GM understood the market better. However, if Ford may have come up with better ideas if he had checked out what GM was doing.

 

The exact same thing can be said about this thread. Even if Obsidian were successful in realizing Deus Ex style game-play, if there are not enough demands, the resulted work would not be commercially successful. Simply, these arguments don't have the size of the market in their sight. This is related with the reason why Eidos Montreal has to update the game-play.

 

Back to Obsidian, I guess it would be rational for them to stick to game-plays which can be realized by their home-brewed Onyx engine, at lest, for the time being.

 

BTW...does this thread need to become Bioware/Obsidian fan-boy war? IMO, the story is not that simple...

[Volourn]

"BTW...does this thread need to become Bioware/Obsidian fan-boy war? IMO, the story is not that simple... "

 

Now ar from me. Despite my dissapointment in AP; I still quite like Obsidian.

[Purkake]

And I'm only a Valve/Blizzard fanboy, sorry.

[Wombat]

Now ar from me. Despite my dissapointment in AP; I still quite like Obsidian.

O.K. Then, the story was, indeed, that not simple, after all.

[Oblarg]

Claiming AP is similar enough to ME to be ME3 is a joke.

 

Aside from the third-person action combat and the inclusion of a dialogue system, the two don't have all that much in common.

[Volourn]

Sure, they do. I even gave an example. The main characters. Please don't tell me you don't see the similarities between Thornton and Shepard? Even, the fact that Thornton got recruited to a 'super duper elite organization' just like Shepard is a similarty. Seriously, did you actually play the two games?

Edited July 7, 2010 by Volourn

[Purkake]

There are also striking similarities in the skill system.

 

It is pretty sad that the only innovation to the level up system these days comes in the form of some crazy skill maze thing from a Final Fantasy game.

Edited July 7, 2010 by Purkake

[Flouride]

Sure, they do. I even gave an example. The main characters. Please don't tell me you don't see the similarities between Thornton and Shepard? Even, the fact that Thornton got recruited to a 'super duper elite organization' just like Shepard is a similarty. Seriously, did you actually play the two games?

 

Yea, since no one has ever done that basic plot/start before Mass Effect...

[Purkake]

The perfect time to deploy this:

 

 

 

Everyone knows that female Shepherd is canon, though

 

Edited July 7, 2010 by Purkake

[Oner]

Isn't Mike's hair black?

 

BTW, Spy Game makes the protagonist an elite agent by default, Epic Sci-fi does not.

[Purkake]

Maybe it's really dark brown?

[Flouride]

They are sequels to popular series. It's not creative to make a game with a number beside it.

 

So with your awesome logic a game can't be original or creative at all if it's a sequel even though they might have added and changed stuff that are creative&original and as well as created a way better (and new) plot, dialogue and characters.

 

And now you are comparing c&c from AP to ME and the dialogue system that differs quite a lot from Bioware's system. C&C in ME series so far is something like you getting an email, or meeting a npc that wouldn't show up at all if you did something differently in the original game as well as your basic c&c that has been in pretty much every western rpg done by Bioware/BIS/Obsidian/Troika. Now compare that to AP where a lot of things change during your playthrough depending what you do.

Don't get me even started about the dialogue system...

[Purkake]

I think we're talking conceptually here, a sequel isn't original because it is based on something else.

 

He isn't saying that the game itself doesn't have original ideas.

[Volourn]

"And now you are comparing c&c from AP to ME and the dialogue system that differs quite a lot from Bioware's system. C&C in ME series so far is something like you getting an email, or meeting a npc that wouldn't show up at all if you did something differently in the original game as well as your basic c&c that has been in pretty much every western rpg done by Bioware/BIS/Obsidian/Troika. Now compare that to AP where a lot of things change during your playthrough depending what you do.

Don't get me even started about the dialogue system..."

 

The dialogue systems work in the basic same way. The C&C - whether or not you think Obsidian or BIo does it better - work the same. 'Differs quite a bit' is such a ridiculous stretch it's quite laughable. Based on the same principle where the tone/approach of the character's choice is more important than the exact words.

 

 

"So with your awesome logic a game can't be original or creative at all if it's a sequel even though they might have added and changed stuff that are creative&original and as well as created a way better (and new) plot, dialogue and characters. "

 

Quality is irreleavnt. They're sequels, and they're made strictly to take advantage of the the pre made fanbase. You cana rgue to you are blue in the face that KOTOR2 is better than KOTOR1 but the bottom line is as a sequel it's not creative since the game is a sequel to KOTOR and is not original.

 

 

"He isn't saying that the game itself doesn't have original ideas."

 

This. BG2 is not more 'creative' than BG1 even though its approach tom quest design is difference since it's a sequel. We were also talking about taking chances, and BIO has taken way more chances than Obsidian ever has. From medical software to games. From suing the publisher for the rights to keep a game (NWN), from deciding on making a ME trilogy which was an unknown IP instead of simply sticking with the KOTOR series (KOTOR MMO notwithstanding, of course) which is the mor well known IP. That's taking chances. You aren't taking chances when your list of games is a who's who list of popular games/series made by OTHER developers like Obsidian; NWN2, KOTOR2, DS3, and FO: NV. The only 'original' game in Obsidian library is AP and has been pointed out by EVERYBODY including Obsidian is there is a LOT of commonality with ME. Just a fact. deal with it.

 

And, there's nothing wrong with Obsidian's game plan. Sticking with sequels to popular games has worked for them and it's why they can keep going and be successful despite the misstep with AP. They'll bounce back. FO: LV will sell a couple mil, and DS3 shouldm at least hit the mil, and the failure of AP will be forgotten.

[Flouride]

The dialogue systems work in the basic same way. The C&C - whether or not you think Obsidian or BIo does it better - work the same. 'Differs quite a bit' is such a ridiculous stretch it's quite laughable. Based on the same principle where the tone/approach of the character's choice is more important than the exact words.

 

Quality is irreleavnt. They're sequels, and they're made strictly to take advantage of the the pre made fanbase. You cana rgue to you are blue in the face that KOTOR2 is better than KOTOR1 but the bottom line is as a sequel it's not creative since the game is a sequel to KOTOR and is not original.

 

 

This. BG2 is not more 'creative' than BG1 even though its approach tom quest design is difference since it's a sequel. We were also talking about taking chances, and BIO has taken way more chances than Obsidian ever has. From medical software to games. From suing the publisher for the rights to keep a game (NWN), from deciding on making a ME trilogy which was an unknown IP instead of simply sticking with the KOTOR series (KOTOR MMO notwithstanding, of course) which is the mor well known IP. That's taking chances. You aren't taking chances when your list of games is a who's who list of popular games/series made by OTHER developers like Obsidian; NWN2, KOTOR2, DS3, and FO: NV.

 

No it doesn't. Other one lets you explore multiple choiced and go back and worth. Other one has a system that doesn't allow that and has a timer limit on how long you can think about what to answer. Quite a difference already there. General concept of C&C has been mostly the same for ages, so your claim that AP copies ME c&c is just silly, which was my point, but I guess you choose to ignore that. AP's c&c did add something to it, with the story branching already in the middle depending what you did 1st etc.

 

Nonsense. Quality isn't irrelevant nor is making a sequel completely unoriginal amd uncreative.

 

Taking chances... It's not that simple as you make it sound. Not that many indie developers can go and just decide that oh we are gonna make xxxxxxx instead of xxxxxx 5. It's mostly up to the publishers since they have the money to pay for the development and with the current economy crisis how many companies are actually willing to put millions of dollars into a brand new IP when they can just create a sequel to something previously made. As for what comes to Obsidian taking chances.. I think it's a quite huge chance Feargus etc. took when they formed their own indie crpg studio.

And Bioware didn't just decide to make a Mass Effect trilogy, for that they needed a) publisher, in this case Microsoft b) a succesful 1st title to guarentee sequels.

[Volourn]

"As for what comes to Obsidian taking chances.. I think it's a quite huge chance Feargus etc. took when they formed their own indie crpg studio. "

 

This. This is hilarious.

[DarthCaine]

It was all Sega's fault, they didn't give Bugsidian enough time, only 5 years

Just like how it was LucasArts fault KOTOR2 was unfinished

And how it was Atari's fault NWN2 was one of the buggiest games ever

And how it will be Bethesda's fault New Vegas will be buggy

 

It was never Bugsidian's fault, it's always the publisher