Left 4 Dead

[alanschu]

Odd. When I do that I rip my teammates to shreds. A

I think you may have missed the point.

 

I think I am getting it now haha.

 

Must have led to some fun verbal exchanges haha.

[alanschu]

Just to clarify, there is no crossover between 360 and PC versions right? In that 360 owners can't play with PC owners?

[WILL THE ALMIGHTY]

Just to clarify, there is no crossover between 360 and PC versions right? In that 360 owners can't play with PC owners?

Isn't that one of the features of Vista?

[Deraldin]

Just to clarify, there is no crossover between 360 and PC versions right? In that 360 owners can't play with PC owners?

Isn't that one of the features of Vista?

No.

[Zoma]

Guyz. You gotta play on expert, for realz. Advance mode itself is for nubs. Normal and beginner modes? Psssht, they iz for grandmas and 'pas yet I bet they will think its too chicken easy.

[alanschu]

Normal and Beginner are for cheats enables and "z_spawn mob" bound to a key

[Zoma]

Man, this reeks great potential to make a Starship Trooper mod or even Aliens.

 

Gearbox has a serious competitor for its Coop mode for its Aliens game. So its single player is best not to be a half-arse game.

[mkreku]

So.. Basically you go from safe room to safe room while shooting endless amounts of grey people over and over again? Did I miss something? Is there anything else to this game?

[Purkake]

So.. Basically you go from safe room to safe room while shooting endless amounts of grey people over and over again? Did I miss something? Is there anything else to this game?

 

Well there was this whole "fun" thing but that's just me...

[Morgoth]

It's actually astounding how well the aged Source engine still looks. Especially the superb dynamic shadows, the lighting and particle effects. Not to mention the smooth framerate despite having a few dozens high-poly zombies rushing at you.

 

Edit: And it's the first game that uses film grain that doesn't look like crap.

 

Well, technically the Source engine is 10 years old and at its core a heavily modified Quake 1 engine. Valve is always updating it, adding HDR, swarming AI, multicore support. I think the Source engine in HL2 is roughly equivalent to UE2, while in HL2:E2 and L4D it's more comparable to UE3.

Wrong. The HL1 engine called "Gold Source" (but barely used by this name) was a heavily modiefied Quake1 engine. Source (HL2+) otoh has been completely written new from scratch.

 

One thing I also like about the Ep2 iteration (which L4D uses) are the excellent dynamic shadows. I could direct the flashlight against a tiny tea cup, and I'd see the huge projection on the wall without any aliasing effect or other graphical artefacts. Something in which UE3 completely sucks, which is especially apparent in Mass Effect (flickering and broken self-shadowing).

 

Source Engine FTW!

[Zoma]

So.. Basically you go from safe room to safe room while shooting endless amounts of grey people over and over again? Did I miss something? Is there anything else to this game?

 

Well there was this whole "fun" thing but that's just me...

 

And me too. I suppose its always a challenge to make a group of 4 people to work together and survive instead of busy killing each other accidentally. You will be surprised how many times you died is due to careless friendly fire.

 

There's the versus mode as well where 4 additional players will play as special zombies to make the survivor's life difficult

 

Source Engine FTW!

 

If anything else, the updated version of source engine for Left 4 Dead is absolutely stunning:

 

-Incredible animations as well as incredibly 'realistic' death physics. The enemies don't die like ragdolls. Shoot any portion of the enemy, they will react to the injury accordingly.

 

-Incredible high resolution textures surpassing even Ep2's. I never thought I be able to see the source engine succeeding in this area.

 

-Dynamic lightning and shadows. Morgoth covered that.

 

-Supports dozens of high polygon characters that can appear in one screen.

 

The only gripes I have is the limitation of the level size still imposed as well as the things that are breakable in the game.

[crakkie]

Wrong. The HL1 engine called "Gold Source" (but barely used by this name) was a heavily modiefied Quake1 engine. Source (HL2+) otoh has been completely written new from scratch.

It was rewritten piecemeal from GoldSource and I think by HL2 it was completely Quake free, but the engine's structure still resembles it's granpappy. Anyway, I like Source, and I REALLY like it in Left4Dead. I found it to be very well optimized now as well. My 8600GT pulls it off at full detail.

 

Expert is a bit hopeless though. You need to find 3 other good players to have a chance, and I know no such people. I tried 6 times on the subway with 2 different groups and we never even got to the end of the tunnel.

[Morgoth]

Working together well makes or breaks the game for me. Expert is cool because if you think you could play a super hero and run forward without giving a crap to your team mates, chances are you#ll get raped by a Hunter or strangled by these tongue zombies. This game encourages team play, something that I miss in Team Fortress 2, which is just too arcady and "deathmatch-y" imo.

At any rate, I can't wait to try out the other maps, and the Versus Mode.

[alanschu]

The versus mode looks like it'll be a ton of fun as well. You could sort of hack it in with a console command before the public demo, but they removed it in a patch for the public demo unfortunately.

 

It's gotten a bit "old" for me because I really, really can't wait to try other maps. I have played the first 2 probably a hundred times now haha.

[Walsingham]

I'm just watching my housemate fend off an entire populace by repeatedly swinging his gun butt.

 

I'm afraid I can't approve of these hordes of fast moving zombies. It's just a blurred firefest. There should be a large mob of slow moving bastards, with specialists fething you up unexpectedly. Also, limitless ammo? Survival horror? Am I the only one failing to make a connection?

 

Overall, I'd say it was incredibly disappointing. We're deleting the demo now.

[alanschu]

The melee fending off is a bit overpowered, though without it you wouldn't stand a chance on expert.

 

Even with the "limitless ammo" (assuming you happen to be near an ammo cache) I still find myself chewing through it. Sure the pistols may have limitless ammo...but I think that's more because the game intends on sending zounds of zombies at you.

 

I don't consider it so much "survival horror" in that you need to worry about conserving ammo, but just about surviving the movie.

 

 

That said, I won't dispute it's not for everyone. I'm having a blast, and find it chaotic in a good way. Nothing sucks more than being "mobbed" when there are no convenient corners to back yourself into and the 4 of you are all "back to back" chewing through ammo praying you'll survive...and you suddenly hear the Tank theme start up.

 

I had to laugh when a smoker pulled my friend through the fire of a molotov ****tail I tossed. Wasn't expecting that haha.

 

 

I don't mind the quick zombies. Makes it more challenging for me, and makes the mob moments that much more frantic. Though I find it very satisfying to go full auto with the m16 at close range when the mob rushes you and watching their heads all explode. Ahhhh, good times.

Edited November 13, 2008 by alanschu

[Zoma]

Limitless ammo? You got to be kidding.

 

My team (consisting of random pubbers) spent many countless rounds unable to complete the subway stage in expert mode, mainly due extreme ammo shortage. We could easily backtrack to the nearest ammo cache, but that would mean encountering another combo of special bosses or a possible horde during the way which is not worth it.

 

Considering the enemies are unlimited, we are damn thankful there is at least a supply of ammo to or replenish our combat strength a little on top of the injuries. Unfortunately, the real issue is health packs and pills that is limited.

 

Do understand that the concept of survival horror for L4D is not anything remotely close to Resident Evil style, but rather the old school Doom style where you battle against hordes of enemies with respawns. I can see why some people will not like this sort of gameplay, so I still encourage those who have yet to play to simply download the demo and judge for it yourself.

 

 

=================

 

Since we're discussing about Left 4 Dead gameplay, here's some teamwork tips that will tremendously improve your team's survival rate in expert:

 

-With every room you leave, make sure you close the door behind you. The zombies aren't capable of opening the door which they can only destroy it. Use the advantage to shoot through the door.

 

-Make sure there is one player always to be receptive to the group's rear flank. Never know when will one special enemy boss lurk behind or a horde even.

 

-Common sense: When a player is shooting at zombies in front of you, don't try to outrun him to compete for zombie kills. You will only get yourself shot by him accidentally. Also, NEVER EVER STRAFE SHOOT ZOMBIES when you are in close proximity with your team mates. Sure you will encircle them, but that includes your comrades which will result in mass friendly fire. Hold your position and retreat backwards if its too much to take while at the same time meleeing them. Make sure you know where your team members were position on the fly to avoid getting friendly fired by them. Its just like basketball.

 

-Walk button. Use it to engage enemies if you want to push forward or circle an enemy. This makes your movement much more coordinated and your team members will recognise your movement in their sight which they will unlikely shoot you. You have no idea how fast players move when in green health, which is super fast.

 

-When you can, always reload your weapons before they are empty. They reload much faster. Apparently there is a bug for all weapons except the shotguns in which that the submachine guns and rifles do not perform the extra animation of pulling the blowback when the magazine is empty.

 

-Pipe bombs are your best friends. These are decoys that kills and could save your group's life during horde moments. Molotovs are much trickier to use but they can effectively set an area of denial against the horde. But it can also unintentionally stir chaos to your group if you do not throw it properly.

 

-All weapons can penetrate with each respective weapons having their own penetration power. Sniper rifles could pierce almost everything while uzi could only pierce through wood.

 

-Learn to share your health packs and pills. One crippling team member handicaps the group's strength since he is slowed. One dead team member would mean one flank less covered.

 

-Never stay at one place for long. Sure you may feel safe being near an unlimited ammo or weapon cache, but your life is still limited and may be at the point of being in temporary health. More time wasted, more health is diminished. Keep moving forward unless your dead team members spawns close by at the timely moment.

 

-Saving friends from hunters or smokers. Unless you have precision weapons like uzi, do not attempt to use shotgun since you will also hit your team member you are trying to save. Instead, for hunters, melee the hunter to free it from your team mate and blast it freely at point blank. As for smoker, you could melee your friend to free him from the tentacle if the smoker is beyond your sight, or shoot the tongue itself to free your friend.

 

-Last, most important and common sense of all: DON'T PANIC when hell goes loose. If a team member is incapcitated, do not panic. He has enough health to keep himself safe unless a hunter got to him. First make sure that all zombies that are targetting you are downed. Next, shoot at the zombies, not at your downed friend. Do this by aiming at the zombie's chest to head level area. Common sense right? I see stupid players doing that every single time which kills the poor guy instead of saving him since all weapons penetrate.

 

 

-Helping your friend when he is surrounded by zombies. Shoot your targets perpendicular to the friendly, not at the centre of the friendly itself that results in friendly fire. Its just like peeling an apple. This is common sense, something alot of new players do not have which is aggravating.

[alanschu]

Game is out! Already beat No Mercy haha.

 

Though we had to switch to advanced difficulty because expert is hella hard!

[Nightshape]

Wrong. The HL1 engine called "Gold Source" (but barely used by this name) was a heavily modiefied Quake1 engine. Source (HL2+) otoh has been completely written new from scratch.

It was rewritten piecemeal from GoldSource and I think by HL2 it was completely Quake free, but the engine's structure still resembles it's granpappy. Anyway, I like Source, and I REALLY like it in Left4Dead. I found it to be very well optimized now as well. My 8600GT pulls it off at full detail.

 

Expert is a bit hopeless though. You need to find 3 other good players to have a chance, and I know no such people. I tried 6 times on the subway with 2 different groups and we never even got to the end of the tunnel.

 

Source is a sloppy, crap engine.

 

That said, Left 4 dead is very very cool.

[Zoma]

Managed to beat No Mercy on expert. ^.^

 

Such awesome team was so hard to come by. I hope to never fight 3 tanks again in one chapter. Its ridiculously INSANE!

Edited November 18, 2008 by Zoma

[alanschu]

Wrong. The HL1 engine called "Gold Source" (but barely used by this name) was a heavily modiefied Quake1 engine. Source (HL2+) otoh has been completely written new from scratch.

It was rewritten piecemeal from GoldSource and I think by HL2 it was completely Quake free, but the engine's structure still resembles it's granpappy. Anyway, I like Source, and I REALLY like it in Left4Dead. I found it to be very well optimized now as well. My 8600GT pulls it off at full detail.

 

Expert is a bit hopeless though. You need to find 3 other good players to have a chance, and I know no such people. I tried 6 times on the subway with 2 different groups and we never even got to the end of the tunnel.

 

Source is a sloppy, crap engine.

 

That said, Left 4 dead is very very cool.

 

 

How so?

[Llyranor]

It's not based on the engine of the secret PS3 game he's working on, which isn't sloppy or crap.

[alanschu]

Ah that makes sense!

 

 

Expert was a bit too hard with only 2 people and learning the maps haha. I found the hospital very hard!

[Zoma]

Found a cool easter egg reference to a particular movie quote when your team's health condition is terrible.

 

Zoey: "GAME OVER MAN! GAME OVER!"

 

Haha, awesome.

[alanschu]

Yeah there's a few. I love Bill's "GOD DAMMIT! SON OF A BITCH!" when you gets boomer juiced.

 

Francis has a "Get to the chopper!" scream too hehe.