KotoR 3: Ideas, Suggestions, Discussion, Part 22

[hawk]

Hm, a release in 2107 or placed a 100 years after the events of Kotor II.

Well, in 2107 we will all be dead.

And placed a 100 years after Kotor? It means all the characters we know are all dead. Except perhaps for Zaalbar (if Revan was LS) since Wookies can become old.

Both options? No, no good. I would like to see Revan and the Exile appear in Kotor III again rather then the cheap "kill them off" option.

[DAWUSS]

If there will be two new game announcements between 24-28 th of may we'll just have to wait what they will be won't we?

ya and its a celebration of starwars so im sure its two new starwars games

 

It's going to be a videogame set in the time of the Legacy comics and another that's going to be set in the time between Ep. III and IV

how did u find that out ? ? ?or is that just ur guess

 

I have a "trusted source" of which I cannot mention

[Brdavs]

Hm, a release in 2107 or placed a 100 years after the events of Kotor II.

Well, in 2107 we will all be dead.

And placed a 100 years after Kotor? It means all the characters we know are all dead. Except perhaps for Zaalbar (if Revan was LS) since Wookies can become old.

Both options? No, no good. I would like to see Revan and the Exile appear in Kotor III again rather then the cheap "kill them off" option.

 

I think it`s pritty much granted that neither protagonist of K1 or K2 will play a major part in K3, simply because that would ruffle too many feathers by setting a 100% visage etc. etc. Better to have them go out whit a bang and then retrace theirs steps (as a padawan in the new order) to finish what they started, as opposed to the alternative of marginalising them and/or lame halfarsed hooded cameons.

Edited May 3, 2007 by Brdavs

[Darth Mortis]

You have to feel sorry for whoever develops K3. If they don't show Revan and the Exile they will get abuse and complaints. If they do show them they will still get abuse and complaints.

[Xard]

Trust me, those who have endured THE HELL by Fallout fanboys would have no problems with Kotor fans. Heck, their abuse would be as harmful as tickling.

 

Although LA haven't faced Fallout fanatics, so I'm not so sure if they would endure

[pantherus]

The fact of the matter is - with so much variety in the history of the games; there is no way the developers will get 100% of people in support of what they do.

 

A lot of people are asking for returns of previous characters - but the game HAS to have a lot of new personalities in it or it will be doomed to be a rehash of the originals; have some of the originals come back/appear in cameo roles by all means - but don't have the same old party people back again. They also have to look very closely of the failings of the previous games (much moreso KOTORII than I) and do their best to avoid/rectify them.

 

To that extent - a few "what they should include"'s for KOTOR III from my perspective:

 

- cameo scenes and appearances from the first 2 games, be they locations, characters, quotes, anecdotes, prophesies - anything. Make them funny, and make them fit. This will make the player feel a connection to the original games, while not feeling repetitious and rehashed.

- have the different fighting styles (saber and force styles) actually LOOK different - what I wouldn't give to watch a lightsaber fight with one and/or both of the combatants moving like Yoda in episodes 2 and 3. They don't have to have a lot of different looking swings/strikes per style (and don't have to have that many styles either...) just make them look reasonably different from the other and actually make players see what they're choosing as a style (I for one barely noticed what style I was using most of the game...)

- more variety in character generation. come on people - who wouldn't want to play the game as a Kel-dor, or Twi'lek, or even a wookie!! (OK - that might be a little far stretched in continousy). The Star Wars RPG system (and Galaxies i've heard...) allows for virtually any race to be played, so it can be done. The restriction will be on plot story and continousy (and a canon storyline), which I'll outline ideas for further below. also things like: more starting classes (be a tech-specialist for example), body customisation...MORE!

- keep the influence system from II - but bigger. Have things more spectacular happen if you get really low on influence with someone, have ways to gain influence for both ways (i.e. even the the goody-goody character can have influence gained in dark side ways - this will allow for much more expansive characters and give you a bit more of a "as you like it" feel. i think there was so more much that could've been done in II with those characters and some of them fell completely flat (mira, mandalore, visas...) with very little feeling of accomplishment in finishing their influence sub-plot (except training Mira as a Jedi). Storyline, plot- and character-development are all important in a good RPG - something 1 did beautifully. Also - have people's changing alignment actually come out in their characters...I realise that this will drastically increase the complexity for designers, but i always found it hard to swallow that even though their alignment showed as drastically evil, their responses and general demeanor still reflected a good-guy...

- more minigames, and more appropriate benefits. things like lightsaber duelling to increase your skills, swoop racing increases you reactions, target practice improves shooting...so many possibilities...I enjoyed the swoop racing and gun shooting in 1 - but the racing got pretty tedious after a little while...pazaak was OK in 2..but just OK...

- a plot twist!!! I cannot stress this enough!! any RPG fans who played the games remember the feeling they got in Baldur's Gate when they found out ***possible spoilers if you haven't played them...***

that you're the child of Bhaal

, even more so in KOTOR 1 when you find out

that YOU are revan

- my heart was pounding like anything when that happened the first time for me - it was fantastic! if Obsidian want KOTOR III to be a cult favourite (as 1 is) then they need a massive pull that is the ultimate twist.

- more varied characters for NPCs. I wonder if people found, like me, that there were just too many humans there, and wanting more aliens - is anyone else on that boat too?

- increase party size to have 4 at a time instead of three, and more to choose from - more more more!!!

 

Now - regarding the storyline - how can you progress the star wars universe, maintain a level of canon for future-based stories that have already been made, and yet come up with a whole new idea that works? KOTOR 1 was fantastic - 2 i feel fell down somewhat. 3 needs to stand tall...here's my 2c on it:

 

- a lot of people are saying "you should play as revan and/or the exile!!" - this is bollocks. One of the biggest complaints I've read/heard about KOTOR II is that it didn't feel very different to the first game. If you play again as Revan in III, people are going to feel cheated - there HAS to be something new come out of this game.

- possible base story - The Lost Jedi (Those trained as Jedi in KOTOR 2) are working to reform the Jedi order in the absence of the Exile and any other Jedi. Main character is (or can become maybe?) an initiate into the new academy. This is a pretty simple base, it is pretty unoriginal (both KOTOR and Jedi Academy do the same thing) - but it's solid, allows for in-game training as a Jedi, and provides a base to move from. Alternatively you could just be your average "force sensitive" that these guys pick up in their attempts to find their way as Jedi without their teacher. Using the Lost Jedi (I got this off the Star Wars Wiki by the way...) as a foundation is pretty much the only way to go with it to maintain storyline. The villians almost has to be the "True Sith" that Revan and the Exile were investigating - if nothing else to ensure that KOTOR II doesn't wind up looking even more fragmented than it already does. Possibly the hero(ine?) could be initially from the place where these True Sith are from? this could be the basis of their key importance (and thus why they're the main character...)

- the ending MUST end significantly. there are things that both 1 and 2 did really well in their endings: 1 had a solid storyline finish, while 2 detailed "what happens now" for the party members (though not all of them). KOTOR III should do BOTH of these. I have to say that my favourite kind of finish to a movie is one that resolves everything, AND details what happened to the characters afterwards, even if just showing their portrait and giving a blurb ("Jason went on to become a great Jedi Knight...") and it really gives a sense of understanding of the greating world of the movie/game. Sure you can say "but it leaves it open for a sequel" but can anyone really say they were happy with 2's ending? and talking about a sequel is all well and good - but we're going on 3 years later with KOTOR and sequel hasn't come...

- intertwining backstories are always good. I though it was fantastic that Bao-Dur served under the Exile in the wars, things like that are almost always more enriching in a storyline.

 

Finally - and this is way out of mid-field - how about making a PREQUEL to the games? Be a Jedi who was around when Revan and Malak were Padawans? even earlier? there's a lot of time before KOTOR 1 came out...

 

Please feel free to reply/argue any of this, it always makes for good discussion and hopefully we give the lovely folks at Obsidian something to think about for what should likely be a wonderful game.

 

cheers

Pantherus

[Yodaman]

Because the possible KotOR III news threat has been closed, I post it here:

 

Well, in the podcast of Steve we here about two new games, that shell be presented on comic con. The first game will be the upcoming Indy game, it hasn't been talked much about it in the last time. I know, everybody hoped to see announcements about KotOR III - The Porn Lords but the second presented game will surely be a new LucasArts game named Fraction. This game takes part in the Future of USA and the only nice thing about is that you can change with grenades the environment. To create a whole game for this feature is in my opinion a damn ****ed idea, I think, everybody wants KotOR III or at last Battlefront III, Republic Commando 2 or simply anything with Star Wars in it. Future Shooters with great new technologies are so damn common.

 

Well, at last, we have hope, that Indy will not be presented or wasnt meant.

 

Ok, I see, I am to late with my infos. But I read now the post of Mr. pantherus and liked much of it. Well, of course, KotOR III should be AFTER KotOR II. But the plot should be with nice cameos and stuff like that. I really loved, how you were able in TSL to choose, who to support, Vaklu or the Queen. I want this in KotOR III, choosing who to join, in which way to support, to destruct all, so you have in:

KotOR: Deciding about your fate.

KotOR II: Deciding about your and your mates fate.

KotOR III: Deciding about yours, your friends, the peoples and states fate and maybe even the end of wars, the beginning of wars (maybe your pacifistic like I am and dont want situations to escalate) and the whole galaxies fate.

 

Also, in KotOR II a real nice thing was how to get party members. You get Brianna only if you are male, Hanharr only if youre dark side, why shouldnt this expand in KotOR III? Of course, changing and manipulating your friends is the greatest joy you can have (also in real life ) but you should choose who you wish to be in the party, not the party members. Ok, well, some of them maybe want to be with you, but you kick their asses then.

 

Lets hope, that KotOR III is the second project to be announced and not Indy, if LucasArts creates this Fraction **** instead of Star Wars things, we should make fractions on their bones. I will not buy this game, I want KotOR!

Edited May 4, 2007 by Yodaman

[Darth_Nihlus]

is it possible for a save game reader in K3 that lets you choose which one of your exiles or revans to use, and for people who havent played then i dont know...

[dustin19]

is it possible for a save game reader in K3 that lets you choose which one of your exiles or revans to use, and for people who havent played then i dont know...

i think that would be a great idea if they plan for r playable charecter to be revan or exile . . . but i think there gunna have us as someone different again ! ! !

[Omelette]

i think that would be a great idea if they plan for r playable charecter to be revan or exile . . . but i think there gunna have us as someone different again ! ! !

I would prefer not to play them again. I've already played them in K1 and K2. Why would I want to be the same people again? Besides, they're too powerful. And this should be about three different people, seeing as there was Revan, then the Exile, now someone new. Make sense? I hope so, because I confuse myself at times.

[dustin19]

i think that would be a great idea if they plan for r playable charecter to be revan or exile . . . but i think there gunna have us as someone different again ! ! !

I would prefer not to play them again. I've already played them in K1 and K2. Why would I want to be the same people again? Besides, they're too powerful. And this should be about three different people, seeing as there was Revan, then the Exile, now someone new. Make sense? I hope so, because I confuse myself at times.

ya i agree i want sumthin new ! ! !

[Guest Accept]

i think that would be a great idea if they plan for r playable charecter to be revan or exile . . . but i think there gunna have us as someone different again ! ! !

I would prefer not to play them again. I've already played them in K1 and K2. Why would I want to be the same people again? Besides, they're too powerful. And this should be about three different people, seeing as there was Revan, then the Exile, now someone new. Make sense? I hope so, because I confuse myself at times.

Why don't make the "Fantastic three"?

 

Revan - The Exile - Possible new character.

 

We would rule the rulers of the galaxy...

[hawk]

@pantherus

 

I like all your idea's, except for the idea of a prequel game. Because really, we know what happened then. Revan and Malak will win the mandalorian wars and will fall to the DS, you can also read a comic book set during the mandalorian wars and there isn't really much opportunity for an RPG IMO. For a new actiongame? Sure, I would like to play a JK game set in the mandalorian wars.

 

@brdavs

 

Actually, the more I think about it, the more it makes some sense. Now that I think about it, how about a game in which you have a 1 hour intro where you play as (yes) the Exile. You fight alongside Revan and you defeat the True Sith. Revan and the Exile are, no matter what their alignment, heroes of the republic.

But have they defeated the true sith? No, off course not. That's when the game takes you to a 100 years later where your new main character have to finish what Revan and the Exile "forgot".

No doubt the developers will come with some very unoriginal concept in which you play the grandson/daughter of Revan, who knows?

 

@Darth Mortis

 

Yeah, that's right. On one hand, you have those LA dictators who set a deadline where you simply can't finish a game. And on the other hand, you probably have some fans demanding that "their" characters will be back in game.

[Bass-GameMaster]

1.I think there should be alot more missions and sidequest. I hate being restricted to the main quest so more I would love more freedom. And make use of the armys both sith and republic, It would be cool if u could have battles in the game where u could be on one side but help the other side by sabotage...Etc.

2. U shouldn't arive to planets so fast without any encounters. It would be cool on a trip to Naboo,coruscant, or many other planets; All of a sudden u are attacked by credit thirsty pirates. U should have the option to sleep,train, and just examin and talk to your party.

3. U shouldn't just know how to use a lightsaber, make it kinda like KoTor 1; Where u are taught by one of the members from previous. But I understand how hard it would be to pro longue the past but It would be highely appreciated by many.

4. Should have to age like Fable (to a certain extent), and choose really who u want to be with. More interactibillty eith the sith, not just infiltrate but become one. U should have a choice when u are little say a robber enters your home, u should have choices like kill robber or knock out; Maybe even negotiate with him. Make choices who u want to be with, for example: On the way to a jedi academy u are boarded by sith they want to make u a acolyte; but give u the choice to join or carry on your trip to the academy.

5. More large scale battles including ships and soldiers. MORE INVOLVEMENT!!!!! Defend with cannons and snipers.

6. Keep the battle style an rpg! Dont make it like Battle Front or Jade Empire, keep it as it is but modify it delude glitches and tricks.

7. Further the customization of your character, eye color hair etc. In depth conversations and influence, manipulate characters or romance them. View some as diposal not be forced to have them with u. Have more quest steming from your party's past's.

8. Further the customization of your weapons lightsaber crystal,scopes, etc. Make your weapons unique and not one of a kind.

9. When u explore u get items, but don't make it to where u kill a cannok and get a lightsaber or a suit of armor. Maybe broken parts that can be used to build stuff.

10. Start completely with a new in depth character ( sorry u revan and exile fan's Read below tho xD). Learn about your future and learn of the past events.

11. Bring exile and revan back to life in their fight against the sith. Maybe join Carth as a soldier or Bastilla as a padawan.

12. Extend game play for more fun and time.

13. Dont rush the game. Millions are awaiting it's arrival we don't want another Kotor 2, which left us wanting more.

14. More freelance work and things that affect your future example: Fable.

15. Friends both good and bad to come to u through twist's and turns like Disciple and handmaiden.

16. Bring back everyones beloved ebon hawk!!!

17. Make accesible stores to buy goods,parts,medpacs,ships, and accesories.

18. Downloadable content for 360 only

19. Realese a demo before the game comes out with few missions and weapons.

20. Read all of the comments and ideas of everyone in this topic thats where u will find ideas....

[Omelette]

Revan - The Exile - Possible new character.

 

We would rule the rulers of the galaxy...

 

Sounds like a plan.

[no i am not a geek]

does anyone know when 3 is going to come out?

[Tale]

does anyone know when 3 is going to come out?

No. And I mean that, nobody knows when, or even really if, 3 will come out. It's not even announced as in development.

[Guest Accept]

does anyone know when 3 is going to come out?

The closest thing to an announcement we've had is a report saying that LucasArts still is interested in the KotOR-universe, and that they won't leave it behind.

[Brdavs]

When ppl tell you you won`t get left behind that is usually when your ass gets ditched

[pantherus]

As we can all see from all the above comments - there are a large number of things that people want in the next KOTOR game.

 

Something I think we can all agree on, is that the third game has to do 2 key (general) things to have a real shot at a successful game:

 

1. They have to keep the key features of the first 2 games that made them so successful. KOTOR 1 was such a fantastically fabulous game, but KOTOR II did a lot of things better than 1. Some little things like the ability to have 2 sets of weapons equipped and being able to switch between them (I used to have my main character have 2 sets of lightsabers - my main fighting pair, and a "droid-killing double blade", just one of many possible permutations of this functionality), and other, bigger things; like the influence system, and having different characters if you're male/female and good/evil. Obsidian/LucasArts will need to read all these forums and the reviews the first two games got to get a good feel for what they did right so they know what to keep in the games; and also (especially reviewing II) what they did wrong to not make the same mistakes. We want a solid game without so many bugs as II; we want a resolutory ending; we want it FINISHED...

 

2. As I mentioned in my above post - they need something new. I've read a lot of reviews on II and a lot of them complain that it feels like a spruced up carbon-copy of 1. Now, while the old addage of "if it ain' broke, don't fix it" can be applied to this; the developers will need to take note of making a NEW game. Here's a potential equivalent: Diablo -> Diablo 2. Diablo was a great game, awesome feel, etc etc. Diablo 2 was announced and everyone figured it would be a similar dungeon run - but no, they had you running across the countryside, then the dessert, then forest/marshlands/then hell/then mountains (in the expansion). This is the kind of change that III needs to go with - keep the fundamentals, but do something totally different. Someone above (I can't recall who) suggested multiple sites on a planet, I LOVE that idea. Say you land on an initial landing place of a planet (say Tatooine for example) and do a few missions around. then you eventually have to take a landspeeder (or desert skiff) to a whole nother place (Sand People village? Pit of Carkoon?) to do more missions. II did a bit of this with the Onderon/Duxn combo, that was great. If they can make something work better, or add something new - GO FOR IT! Or as Nike says: JUST DO IT!!

 

Finally, I just had a random idea for a character - someone finds the destroyed remains of HK-47 (I know he's everyone's favourite character, but we can't have him AGAIN in the third game, neither can you have T3-M4 again) and someone (member of the party?) builds a new combat droid using some parts of HK, like remnants of the Assassin Protocols or something. The character will have a whole new personality (whatever that may be) but elements of HK keep popping up randomly; like the first time you take it into combat again humanoids, it screams out "DIE MEATBAGS!!!" and then afterwards wonders in shock why it said that

 

I would also love to see a Twi-lek Jedi, and a Kel-Dor...and of course...A WOOKIE!!!

 

cheers

Pantherus

[DAWUSS]

Finally, I just had a random idea for a character - someone finds the destroyed remains of HK-47 (I know he's everyone's favourite character, but we can't have him AGAIN in the third game, neither can you have T3-M4 again)

 

T3 destroyed is doable, but HK-47 isn't due to the fact that he shows up on Mustafar during the height of the Galactic Empire...

[dustin19]

la announced a new game called fracture . . .

[pantherus]

T3 destroyed is doable, but HK-47 isn't due to the fact that he shows up on Mustafar during the height of the Galactic Empire...

 

Ah - thanks for that. I did read that recently, but forgot about it. Friggen canonicity and storyline - meh!

 

More ideas (the more the better) for how to get previous characters in with cameo roles as alternatives to just have them sitting somewhere randomly:

 

- some of the Jedi (even Revan...) could be somewhere as Force Ghosts if the game is based sufficiently after the previous one

- add to my original though of dismantled HK / T3 - G0-T0 could also be found somewhere (although I hated G0-T0's character to be honest...)

- some could simply be mentioned (like Jolee was in the "pulling a Bindo" line from K2)

- there's always named equipment (there was enough of it in K1) that could pop up, like "Onasi Blaster" was in K2. Like Hanharr's Blade, or Mira's Cannon, or Brianna's robe...lots of possibilities. I remember how cool I thought it was to find the Onasi Blaster - any link like that was fantastic to me.

- find their remains, with either named equipments, or a datapad (or a crazy old person...) nearby to tell of their demise. Holocrons can also be useful.

 

Most KOTOR fans would love to see some (if not all) of the characters from the first 2 games find their way into K3, but having them as playable characters, or even coincidently standing around in the player's path) would feel very fake and be a mistake.

[Purgatorio]

Finally, I just had a random idea for a character - someone finds the destroyed remains of HK-47 (I know he's everyone's favourite character, but we can't have him AGAIN in the third game, neither can you have T3-M4 again)

 

T3 destroyed is doable, but HK-47 isn't due to the fact that he shows up on Mustafar during the height of the Galactic Empire...

Which is fu... idiotic.

[Tale]

Finally, I just had a random idea for a character - someone finds the destroyed remains of HK-47 (I know he's everyone's favourite character, but we can't have him AGAIN in the third game, neither can you have T3-M4 again)

 

T3 destroyed is doable, but HK-47 isn't due to the fact that he shows up on Mustafar during the height of the Galactic Empire...

SWG isn't movie canon nor EU canon.

Edited May 7, 2007 by Tale