The Military

[Lucius]

I'm not one to argue against militaries (being the son of an officer and former soldier), most euro nations have had their fair share of wins and losses in the past. But I still think the US is a tad too militaristic, as depicted in how Hooie describes his role in society.

 

I still want a pic tho.

[Judge Hades]

The key difference is that Hitler had the civillian populations fully behind him while the civilians here in the US do not. Right now Bush is enjoying a less than 30% approval rating less I checked.

 

Also Germany's economy was based off the War Machine mentality. If ther was no war then Gernmany's economy would have collapsed. Thusly as long as the war continued people's jobs and lively were secured and protected.

[Surreptishus]

Yeah...

 

Invading Austria, Poland, Tsjechie, Holland, Belgian, France and England were "keeping the country secure"

 

Hello, no they weren't!!!

 

Military forces can be used for peace-keeping yes, but note that the war they should restore was caused by militaries in the first place...

 

WO II was caused because soldiers followed the orders of Hitler without questions, like American Soldiers now follow orders of Bush without questions...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

If you were the leader of a non axis country being invaded by Germany at that time, you would have used what to defend your country. your....? Thats right , your military forces! )

Edited December 18, 2005 by Surreptishus

[Commissar]

I'm not one to argue against militaries (being the son of an officer and former soldier), most euro nations have had their fair share of wins and losses in the past. But I still think the US is a tad too militaristic, as depicted in how Hooie describes his role in society.

 

I still want a pic tho. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well, he's in the Ranger pipeline. I honestly can't think of any other group in the US military that has quite that level of espirit de corps, not even the old-fashioned oohrah devil dog Marines.

 

We have just under a million and a half folks on active duty, and that's not even a noticeable dent in our population. Our soldiers, sailors, airmen and Marines are committed to their jobs, for the most part, and I don't think that's such a bad thing, especially when you look back a mere three and a half decades.

[Atreides]

WO II was caused because soldiers followed the orders of Hitler without questions, like American Soldiers now follow orders of Bush without questions...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Countries not taking responsibility to pressure Germany during the buildup also played a significant part.

[213374U]

WO II was caused because soldiers followed the orders of Hitler without questions, like American Soldiers now follow orders of Bush without questions...

While I understand it's trendy to compare Bush to Hitler, it's neither a realistic nor a smart thing to do.

 

And, just for the record, the German military didn't follow Hitler "blindly". There were several attempts on his life, some of them arguably orchestrated by the military.

 

It actually saddens me to see people arguing from such ignorant stances, considering that it were those people who forged the society you live so well off today. Ah, the irony.

 

Again, if you can come up with a better alternative to military forces that is feasible, then please, by all means, share it with the rest of the world.

 

Edited for stuff.

Edited December 18, 2005 by 213374U

[213374U]

The key difference is that Hitler had the civillian populations fully behind him

You might want to check your figures.

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

I'm not one to argue against militaries (being the son of an officer and former soldier), most euro nations have had their fair share of wins and losses in the past. But I still think the US is a tad too militaristic, as depicted in how Hooie describes his role in society.

 

I still want a pic tho. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well you could say that Europe being a more mature country has gotten it all out their systems. Cant really claim to be a millitary power unless you have a hundred year long war on the books . America is a young country and feels it has stuff to prove. However it's not all about them, people are always begging for military intervention when they are getting slaughtered by the 1000's since the UN is basically a complete waste of space , corrupt and ineffective that just leaves the yanks.

 

All those people turning out to vote didnt look like they wanted Saddam back which makes the insurgents little more than criminals.

[BattleCookiee]

The key difference is that Hitler had the civillian populations fully behind him while the civilians here in the US do not.  Right now Bush is enjoying a less than 30% approval rating less I checked.

 

Also Germany's economy was based off the War Machine mentality.  If ther was no war then Gernmany's economy would have collapsed.  Thusly as  long as the war continued people's jobs and lively were secured and protected.

 

And still he can continue fighting unauthorized non-UN wars..., it doensn't matter that you don't have support as long as the army still follows...

American's economy not war-based? Why attack a country for oil-profits then?

And note that it was only war-based because of 1920/1930's economical crisis, and because of the promises of jobs and money he was supported (like Bush, but just not the population, but "Fuel Bosses")

 

If you were the leader of a non axis country being invaded by Germany at that time, you would have used what to defend your country. your....? Thats right , your military forces! )

 

Which I didn't have to use, if the Germans had no military forces...

[Lucius]

If you were the leader of a non axis country being invaded by Germany at that time, you would have used what to defend your country. your....? Thats right , your military forces! )

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

... actually we staged an invasion and cooperate instead, most of my kin died for Germany on the East Front.

[Commissar]

Which I didn't have to use, if the Germans had no military forces...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You're dodging the question.

 

If Iran, North Korea, and China give up their militaries, we'll scale ours down considerably. Cut it in half. How's that?

 

Now, tell me how you get them to do it.

[BattleCookiee]

Countries not taking responsibility to pressure Germany during the buildup also played a significant part.

 

Including our big boss US.

 

As a matter of fact, the US said: "Screw Europe" untill they were attacked by Japan...

 

They made profit of the war... were unhappy to end such a profitable business, but the Japanese forced them...

[Judge Hades]

The oil in Iraq was just an added bonus. The Bush family has had a long standing feud with Saddam since the first Gulf War. Hell, Saddam even tried to assassinate daddy bush a while back. This was mostly for revenge I think. WMDs were the excuse, the oil was a bonus, but Saddam himself was who W really wanted.

[Lucius]

I'm not one to argue against militaries (being the son of an officer and former soldier), most euro nations have had their fair share of wins and losses in the past. But I still think the US is a tad too militaristic, as depicted in how Hooie describes his role in society.

 

I still want a pic tho. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well you could say that Europe being a more mature country has gotten it all out their systems. Cant really claim to be a millitary power unless you have a hundred year long war on the books . America is a young country and feels it has stuff to prove. However it's not all about them, people are always begging for military intervention when they are getting slaughtered by the 1000's since the UN is basically a complete waste of space , corrupt and ineffective that just leaves the yanks.

 

All those people turning out to vote didnt look like they wanted Saddam back which makes the insurgents little more than criminals.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Might have something to do with the fact that we have to go back like 500 years since Denmark was anything near a military power... its been a while.

[Surreptishus]

Which I didn't have to use, if the Germans had no military forces...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well thats the kicker. Power exists, somebody will make a grab for it sooner or later. That is a fact of human nature demonstrated time and time again throughout history.

 

 

Edit: Bloody Commie already made my point. (note to self: learn to type faster.)

Edited December 18, 2005 by Surreptishus

[BattleCookiee]

You're dodging the question.

 

If Iran, North Korea, and China give up their militaries, we'll scale ours down considerably.  Cut it in half.  How's that?

 

Now, tell me how you get them to do it.

 

Certainly not by showing them that armed invasions with use of a lot of power and weaponry are profitable...

[BattleCookiee]

Well thats the kicker. Power exists, somebody will make a grab for it sooner or later. That is a fact of human nature demonstrated time and time again throughout history.

 

But if there is just this leader, without 1.000.000+ people who love guns, tanks and other "war stuff" he can't do alot to another country, can he?

 

Now give the guy Armed slaves and wham... you can invade whoever you wan't by snapping your fingers

[Commissar]

Well thats the kicker. Power exists, somebody will make a grab for it sooner or later. That is a fact of human nature demonstrated time and time again throughout history.

 

But if there is just this leader, without 1.000.000+ people who love guns, tanks and other "war stuff" he can't do alot to another country, can he?

 

Now give the guy Armed slaves and wham... you can invade whoever you wan't by snapping your fingers

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Okay. You know what? I agree.

 

Now, like I said before, just get every military member in every country to stop serving, and you've solved the problem of global conflict.

 

But once more, you have absolutely no way to do this. Might as well try to stop the earth from spinning.

 

Start dealing in reality.

[Judge Hades]

Certainly not by showing them that armed invasions with use of a lot of power and weaponry are profitable...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

But it is. The US has proven that with Iraq.

[Commissar]

Edit: Bloody Commie already made my point. (note to self: learn to type faster.)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No worries, man. I've made that point about six times anyway, and we still keep coming back to the whole, "Well, yeah, but if we got rid of militaries..." argument.

[213374U]

And still he can continue fighting unauthorized non-UN wars..., it doensn't matter that you don't have support as long as the army still follows...

So, a war unauthorized by the UN is wrong, but one authorized by it is "right"?

 

WOW, considering that the UN is nothing but a farce, a lobby for the powerful to push their agendas forward, I must say that your view on what is "right" and what is "wrong" is somewhat random, and definitely lacking the moral high ground you seem to believe you step on.

 

 

American's economy not war-based? Why attack a country for oil-profits then?

Proof that the US are taking Iraq's oil?

 

 

Which I didn't have to use, if the Germans had no military forces...

A world without violence is a utopia. Now get back to the real world, and provide real world solutions, if you can.

Edited December 18, 2005 by 213374U

[Surreptishus]

I don't mean to be facetious but i think Battlewookie proposes going back in time and erasing the concept of military and any kind of armed force.

[Judge Hades]

I have one soloution. Wipe out all life on this miserable lil' mudball and you will have total peace.

[BattleCookiee]

Okay.  You know what?  I agree. 

 

Now, like I said before, just get every military member in every country to stop serving, and you've solved the problem of global conflict.

 

But once more, you have absolutely no way to do this.  Might as well try to stop the earth from spinning.

 

Start dealing in reality.

 

Indeed, it is impossible to stop that. But if every soldier just stops acting like a "slave" and develops a free mind and will, things will begin to improve alot...

 

But it is.  The US has proven that with Iraq.

 

And that is exactly why there never shall be peace on this planet...

[Commissar]

Indeed, it is impossible to stop that. But if every soldier just stops acting like a "slave" and develops a free mind and will, things will begin to improve alot...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Man, you're full of it.

 

Tell you what. Walk into work tomorrow and inform your boss that you're not filing the TPS reports because you have a free mind and will, and are not a slave.