Why the Masters didn't mention Kreia in K2?

[Masta Revan]

You have a good point Darthbass123 about they would of put it under influence but remember the story has about a thousand cliff hangers. sometimes I wish you didn't have to kill Kreia because there are still so many qeustions to ask no matter how much I wanted to spill her blood.

[Sikon]

Jediphile, since the Atris-Kreia conversation happens before that ambiguous "Kreia, her name is not" scene, it's safe to assume that Atris deduced who Kreia was speaking about. And let the cut content be where it belongs to - the history's trash bin, making no impact on official canon. (Technically, the TSLRP will never be canon, only the official ending will be.)

Why not just ask Obsidian about their official opinion on the Kreia-Kae issue?

[JamieKirby]

Well, i don't want to turn it into another Handmaidons' Mother thread, but the game story...well if you can call it a story doesn't say that Kreya is or is not Handmaidons mother or not, so no one can give an educated answer at all.

 

Only the Developers can by doing Kotor 3 and give us an answer. lol

 

In the end, no one can give a educated answer without some facts.

[Jediphile]

Jediphile, since the Atris-Kreia conversation happens before that ambiguous "Kreia, her name is not" scene, it's safe to assume that Atris deduced who Kreia was speaking about. And let the cut content be where it belongs to - the history's trash bin, making no impact on official canon. (Technically, the TSLRP will never be canon, only the official ending will be.)

Why not just ask Obsidian about their official opinion on the Kreia-Kae issue?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

You're missing the point. It's the fact that the title of Darth Traya was even considered to be optional (either Kreia or Atris) that tells us that it's not Kreia's real name, and so that cannot be the real name of Kreia that Atris refers to. I don't count Atris as Traya as a legitimate option, I merely use the fact that it was contemplated by the devs to draw a conclusion.

 

But even if we discount the possibility that Atris might have been Traya, I still do not believe that her comment about Kreia not being Kreia's real name is a reference to Kreia's name being Kreia because Kreia would still have become Traya after Atris knew her, and so Atris would have no knowledge of her title as Darth Traya. Therefore "Traya" cannot be the real name of Kreia that Atris refers to.

[Flipside]

OK thanks to jediphile I'am now almost 100% convinced that Kreia is(schould have been) Kae.

I mean they are so many proofs

[Krookie]

I just dont understand how some of you guys can think that  because if it were true then Obsidian would have put it as an influence thing for Kreia.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

...Cut content?? "

[starwarskid15_19]

Personally I think Kreia is indeed Kae.

 

For one thing, look at the names...

 

Kae -Traya = Kreia. I mean, take the "K" of Kae and add it with "Traya" but dropping the "T" - you get "Kraya", which, given how Traya is pronounced, would be identical to how "Kreia" is pronounced.

 

No, certainly not proof, but I do find it a bit telling.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

this doesnt seem like enough proof to me but kreia said something about kae being one of revans masters and also in the game it is said that kreia was his one of his masters as well. this also is not proof but i think that it is interesting.

[GhostofAnakin]

There is also the matter that in the content that was cut, the position of Darth Traya was to befall either Kreia or Atris depending on your choices in the game - in the soundfiles of the cut content where the Exile's companions confront Darth Traya, the dialogue by Traya may be found and heard in two alternate versions - one where Traya is Kreia and one where Traya is Atris. Anyone wanting to hear this for themselves should check the \StreamVoice\907\904KREIA\ folder and listen to some of the soundfiles there. So given that the identity of Traya was optional - either Kreia or Atris - that also doesn't suggest that Traya is a "real" name as much as a title to me.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

While that does make sense, one thing to consider is that perhaps along with cutting the content, Obsidian (and Lucasarts by default) decided to move away from that idea and perhaps now Darth Traya is indeed Kreia's Sith name, rather than just a title that any "betrayer" can adopt.

 

Or something like that.

[Calax]

notice that the Treya name came from the word Betrayer. or in really really fast talk Betraya.

[Ice-Cold]

Exactly. Title, not name.

 

At least that's how it appeared to me - Darth Traya is a title. Kreia is a name, only it is not her real name...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

*only read the first page.. so shh *

 

if "Darth Traya" is a title.. why do they always call Darth Revan "Revan" ? Darth is a title.. meaning "DARk lord of the siTH" that apparently Revan and Malak created, they where the first 2 Darths.

 

so Traya is a name, and Darth is the title.. there you go

[Jediphile]

Actually I'll have to revise my argumentation on the subject of the Darth Traya bit a little because of something Sikon said, and which I didn't pick up on at first...

 

My point that Atris couldn't know about Darth Traya becomes void, as Sikon said, because Atris' comments about it to the Exile comes after the meeting between Atris and Kreia, where Kreia explains about Darth Traya to Atris. So of course Atris knows about Traya after that. I'll have to skip that as an argument.

 

I do maintain, however, that Darth Traya is a title and not a name proper. For one thing, note the quote I made above:

 

Kreia: "'Sith' is a title, yes, but like you, the title is not who I am. It is not what I believe.For you... it is different. Know that there was once a Darth Traya. And that she cast aside that role, was exiled, and found a new purpose. But there must always be a Darth Traya, one that holds the knowledge of betrayal. Who has been betrayed in their heart, and will betray in turn."

 

The latter bit in no way suggests that Darth Traya is a unique individual. On the contrary, it says right out that Traya must always be there, no matter who holds the position. So it cannot be a real name. It falls into the same category as many other "Darths". For example, "Darth Sidious" was really Palpatine, "Darth Vader" was really Anakin Skywalker, and "Darth Tyranus" was really Count Dooku.

 

Many of the "Darths" of the KotOR age seems to fall outside this principle of assigning a new name, including Revan and Malak, though that might just be because Bioware couldn't be bothered to think up cool "Darth" names for them. Strangely, Exar Kun and Ulic Qel-Droma weren't "Darths" at all... Darth Maul is uncertain, since we just don't know if that was ever his real name. Similarly we don't know about Darth Sion and Darth Nihilus either (though I naturally have my suspicions on Nihilus).

 

But I do take the fact that Kreia says there must always be a Darth Traya to mean that Traya is closer to Vader, Sidious, and Tyranus. If nothing else, I believe that because the names seem to carry meaning. Darth Sidious seems close to "insidious", which is appropriate for Palpatine. Darth Vader might come from "invader", since Anakin did destroy the jedi. Darth Tyranus probably comes from "tyrant", which is consistent with a Sith. Darth Traya, however, is clearly based on "betrayal", which is even mentioned as a condition for the title. So I doubt Traya was Kreia's real name.

[Marka Ragnos]

Exactly. Title, not name.

 

At least that's how it appeared to me - Darth Traya is a title. Kreia is a name, only it is not her real name...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

*only read the first page.. so shh *

 

if "Darth Traya" is a title.. why do they always call Darth Revan "Revan" ? Darth is a title.. meaning "DARk lord of the siTH" that apparently Revan and Malak created, they where the first 2 Darths.

 

so Traya is a name, and Darth is the title.. there you go

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

something I found interesting about darth, "The term first appeared in the original script for Star Wars IV: A New Hope, which bore little resemblance to the final release of the film. In it, a "Darth Vader" appeared as an Imperial official who would be renamed Grand Moff Tarkin in the final film, with Darth Vader becoming the name of the menacing black-armored villain." a quote about the darth prefix.

[Masta Revan]

Jediphile you really Know your star wars stuff how in the world do you have time to think about this. After what you just said you starting to get me to thinking. Now I really agree 100%.

[Jediphile]

Jediphile you really Know your star wars stuff how in the world do you have time to think about this.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I really can't help myself - it's a curse I tell you!

[Gabrielle]

[darthbass123]

Exactly. Title, not name.

 

At least that's how it appeared to me - Darth Traya is a title. Kreia is a name, only it is not her real name...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

*only read the first page.. so shh *

 

if "Darth Traya" is a title.. why do they always call Darth Revan "Revan" ? Darth is a title.. meaning "DARk lord of the siTH" that apparently Revan and Malak created, they where the first 2 Darths.

 

so Traya is a name, and Darth is the title.. there you go

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

First of all Revan and Malak didn't create it. Darth Bane did. Bioware and Obsidian just got it wrong.

[Masta Revan]

whose Darth bane?

[Jediphile]

whose Darth bane?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

linky

[Carnage]

First of all Revan and Malak didn't create it. Darth Bane did. Bioware and Obsidian just got it wrong.

 

Nope you will find that Revan And Malak were the first to use the title Darth

 

Eventually, Bane took his own apprentice, a young girl named Zannah, and set his new order in motion. Future Sith Lords were taught the virtues of patience, planning, and secrecy, and each was to take on the title of Darth, a tradition that is believed to have begun with the great Dark Lord of the Sith Darth Revan millennia earlier.

[Masta Revan]

Hoe did you all find out that Revan was the first to start the whole Darth thing?

[starwarskid15_19]

originally darth bane WAS the first darth. (i think darth is actually his first name and later sith took the name to honor him or something) but bioware decided to make their sith which appear 3,000 years before darth bane have the title darth (possibly because in the movies the sith are all darths). so now it is thought that revan and malak were the first darths.