20 Levels

[GhostofAnakin]

I'm finding myself agreeing with Hades more and more. This truly is a sad state of affairs when that happens.

[Judge Hades]

Ghostie, you are just realizing the common sense truth of good gaming. Nothing wrong with that. :D

[GhostofAnakin]

Nah. I think I'm just getting old and senile as well.

[Influence]

The new levels are needed to accommidate the new powers and the new powers are needed to accomidate teh new classes (i.e. assassin and so on). So unfortunately hades, it would have been difficult to put the other options in the game because the powers woudl be disproportional to the amount of levels. So, after reading every argument against more Lthe only three actually make sense.

 

1) The addition of more levels would create some contradiction in the story line

2) too many levels would allow a player to master too many skills and powers

3) Unregulated leveling up in a final fantasy or Diablo format is stupid and iresponsible. If you want that type of game go by that not KOTOR. A jedi cannot gain infinite power and the game shoudl not allow that.

 

The GARBAGE about the game becoming easier is ridiculous. The game coudl very well become harder and more complex with the addition of ten levels. But progress should most certainly be regulated, and there must be a limit.

 

Unregulated leveling with an infinate amount of levels would be disasterous and lame. But not everyone who thinks the responsible addition of levels is neccessary is a lame power hungry noob.

 

The arguments, which make sense, that are in favor of the addition of more levels are the following:

 

1) The addition of levels are needed to make room for the added force powers

2) a reasonable amount of levels (30 MAX, which need to be regulated) would be beneficial to the game, add some longevity and not turn create a god like character with infinite power.

 

THrowing the choice of infinite leveling and unregulated leveling out teh window we are left with only two valid and reasonable opinions.

 

1)No, more levels because the way the system is based it woudl not work.

2) Ten more regulated levels becasue they are neccessary for teh further evolutoin of the game

 

In my opinion the ideal leveling system would be a combination of levels and a progress bar. As you start the game you would be on level 1 and a padawan, in the middle of the progress bar you would be a Knight level 10 and by the time you reached level 20 and the bar was full you woudl be a jedi master level 20.

You would not gain skills and feats at each level, but rather, as the bar increased you would gain the ability to chose a force power and a skill at certain intervals, but NOT NECESSARILY at each leve upl. Perhaps every half level you chose a force power and every level your stats would increase or visa versa.

 

THis system would allow a slightly greater amount of force powers to be utilized in the game without bunking the 20 level based system. Also it would simulate more slow but steady progress and is at the same also flexible.

Maybe it would look something like this.

 

Padawon----------------------- Jedi Knight----------------------------Jedi Master

[llllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll ---------------------------------------------------------]

 

CURRENT LEVEL: 8 JEDI KNIGHT

 

Maybe every half centimeter you would learn a new force power and every centimeter you would level up and gain a new force power and stat increase. Just an idea.... Ill wait for the POsts telling me its Crap!!!

[Volourn]

"When you have a Paladin/Cleric/Champion of Torm with a fully pumped Holy Avenger in Dragon Plate, things tend to die pretty easily."

 

WOW! You had a Champion of Torm in BG2! Wowsers! No wonder you thought it was easy. You had an overpowered 3E character in a 2E game. Uhuh.l..

[ShinIchiro]

Just tell me how the game would be harder with 10 more levels...

 

 

And the stuff about needing the levels for more classes...in the pnp there are around 80 classes in total and you have 20 lvls.

 

 

I think that you gained levels to fast in KOTOR 1, where there were 20. That's what really made it so easy...

 

Besides, I can maybe see 30 lvls...maybe...really streching...more...just no...just no.

 

 

Someone said they should not just limit the game without a good reason...THEY HAVE A VERY GOOD REASON OR HAVE YOU NEVER PLAYED A D20 RPG?!!!!!!!!!! Whew had to get that out. People here are just sort of not getting what game this is...

[Influence]

Just tell me how the game would be harder with 10 more levels...

 

 

And the stuff about needing the levels for more classes...in the pnp there are around 80 classes in total and you have 20 lvls.

 

 

I think that you gained levels to fast in KOTOR 1, where there were 20.  That's what really made it so easy...

 

Besides, I can maybe see 30 lvls...maybe...really streching...more...just no...just no.

 

 

Someone said they should not just limit the game without a good reason...THEY HAVE A VERY GOOD REASON OR HAVE YOU NEVER PLAYED A D20 RPG?!!!!!!!!!!  Whew had to get that out.  People here are just sort of not getting what game this is...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

RELAX i already adressed that issue in my Bis A$$ post. Anyone who thinks the levels shoudl be unlimited is dumb. ENd of story the question is how many more levels should be implemented if any? or should the system be altered so it can accomidate both 20 levels and the other new stuff. Read my post i talk about a possible solution... but its kinda crappy.

 

P.s. the argument that suggests teh game woudl be ahrder with ten more levels refers to that it woudl take longer to get up to the tenth level, with the addition of more formidable dark jedi opponents, at such higher levels, the game could become more difficult. I never said i agreed i jsut said it made sense. See above post

[ShinIchiro]

Just tell me how the game would be harder with 10 more levels...

 

 

And the stuff about needing the levels for more classes...in the pnp there are around 80 classes in total and you have 20 lvls.

 

 

I think that you gained levels to fast in KOTOR 1, where there were 20.  That's what really made it so easy...

 

Besides, I can maybe see 30 lvls...maybe...really streching...more...just no...just no.

 

 

Someone said they should not just limit the game without a good reason...THEY HAVE A VERY GOOD REASON OR HAVE YOU NEVER PLAYED A D20 RPG?!!!!!!!!!!  Whew had to get that out.  People here are just sort of not getting what game this is...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

RELAX i already adressed that issue in my Bis A$$ post. Anyone who thinks the levels shoudl be unlimited is dumb. ENd of story the question is how many more levels should be implemented if any? or should the system be altered so it can accomidate both 20 levels and the other new stuff. Read my post i talk about a possible solution... but its kinda crappy.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I'd say 20 with you having around 17 at the end unless you work really hard and stuff...

 

 

But, if it has to go over 20, 30 is best...

[Influence]

I agree 30 is best if it MUST go over 20. and 20 is good if it only takes a lvl 17 jedi to beat teh game. THsi adds room for extra advancement if the player so desires to perfect their skills. But for KOTOR 3 i think they should implement a system such as this

 

In my opinion the ideal leveling system would be a combination of levels and a progress bar. As you start the game you would be on level 1 and a padawan, in the middle of the progress bar you would be a Knight level 10 and by the time you reached level 20 and the bar was full you woudl be a jedi master level 20.

You would not gain skills and feats at each level, but rather, as the bar increased you would gain the ability to chose a force power and a skill at certain intervals, but NOT NECESSARILY at each leve upl. Perhaps every half level you chose a force power and every level your stats would increase or visa versa.

 

THis system would allow a slightly greater amount of force powers to be utilized in the game without bunking the 20 level based system. Also it would simulate more slow but steady progress and is at the same also flexible.

Maybe it would look something like this.

 

Padawon----------------------- Jedi Knight----------------------------Jedi Master

[llllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll ---------------------------------------------------------]

 

CURRENT LEVEL: 8 JEDI KNIGHT

[ShinIchiro]

Maybe...

I don't like D20 that much actually...but that system could use some improvement.

 

BTW the "no good reason" for level cap came from Jast, not you. That was the argument i was pissed about.

 

 

Though now that I think about it, in the SW D20 there was a system where you got free stuff at lvl 7 and 13 (7 you become knight and 13 you become master). Similar idea...but kinda different...

[Influence]

I think you should become a jedi master at level 17 but thats jsut me, i think it hsould be harder to level up, but i also think you need more oppurtunites to learn more force powers since they ahve added so many new ones, there in lies the paradox.

[Jast]

Someone said they should not just limit the game without a good reason...THEY HAVE A VERY GOOD REASON OR HAVE YOU NEVER PLAYED A D20 RPG?!!!!!!!!!!  Whew had to get that out.  People here are just sort of not getting what game this is...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I won't lie, I won't front: I have never played a d20 rpg, except this one. All I know is that Obsidian themselves opened this all up when they said there would be more then twenty levels..... :ph34r:

[Forever Cast in Deepest Night]

They are going to scale the difficulty depending on your level. So the higher level you are, the more difficult your enemies.

 

That ofcourse depends on the AI being good which i think will be.

 

Level 20 Cap is fine with me.

[Judge Hades]

Then this will not be a proper d20 Star Wars game. d20 Star Wars only have 20 levels. Period. They don't have epic levels in Star Wars. Another rule broken in the efforts to draw in the Diablo crowd and power lamers, all compacted in a 20 hour game.

 

Just bloody lovely.

[Forever Cast in Deepest Night]

Then this will not be a proper d20 Star Wars game.  d20 Star Wars only have 20 levels.  Period.  They don't have epic levels in Star Wars.  Another rule broken in the efforts to draw in the Diablo crowd and power lamers, all compacted in a 20 hour game.

 

Just bloody lovely.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree. I for one was glad to hear that NWN 2 was having a level cap at 20 as well. There just seems to be no point to going beyond that. I liked Diablo but i like a RPG with a ruleset more.

[KOTORFanactic]

I do not want KOTOR2 to be like a little japanese anime cartoon called Dragonball Z

In DBZ, each new power level is met with another higher power level, just to prolong it, with no real depth at all.

When KOTOR2 becomes like that, it will simply ruin it toatlly.

[Judge Hades]

Agreed. That is what KotOR 2 looks like to me.

 

Canderous and Carth! FUSION!

 

Cartherous!

[Influence]

My final word.. is it is unfortunate they are going over 20 levels. However i do see the reasoning and argument for it. I think the best way to solve the problem is a modified 20 level system.

[oherror]

No.  Those stupid "no level limit" games are retarded.

 

And my eyes hurt after reading that one big jumbled post.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

plz put your post in paragraph form...most people just don't read what you posted.

 

i like having a level cap...i wouldn't mind a level 30 but any hinger would kinda suck.

[Influence]

No.  Those stupid "no level limit" games are retarded.

 

And my eyes hurt after reading that one big jumbled post.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

plz put your post in paragraph form...most people just don't read what you posted.

 

i like having a level cap...i wouldn't mind a level 30 but any hinger would kinda suck.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ok that was a while ago my posts since then have been better.. Im a work in progress

[Master Jedi]

once u pass a certain level levelling up would be pointless and having too many levels would mean learning all the skills and powers, that it would lessen the amount of different ways of playing the games possible and having ridiculous stats that would make hacking computers and such too easy and since you could have insanely large stats you wouldn't have to worry about which stats to learn as you'll just max out your stats by leveling up and you won't bother focusing on a strategy and levels after you've learned every skill and power is even more pointless as there is nothing to gain, an upper limit is only logical

[Judge Hades]

Thats how KotOR 1 was at the end. No need for strategy because all the uber power my character had. I was hoping that KotOR2 would have fixed this but obviously it hasn't.

[ShinIchiro]

Just have to hope they did something weird with the scale...this could either be ok or really really really dismal...

[GhostofAnakin]

I have faith that Obsidian will be able to pull it off. Although I agree that level 20 should have been enough, since we start as a Jedi already.

[Judge Hades]

Thats another thing that irks me. Jedi are so uber to begin with that the game will be no challenge from the start.