The All Things Political Topic - In politics stupidity is not a handicap

[Amentep]

RFK Jr.'s former running mate threatens to primary anyone who votes against RFK Jr.'s nomination

[majestic]

7 hours ago, Amentep said:

RFK Jr.'s former running mate threatens to primary anyone who votes against RFK Jr.'s nomination

 

Quote

“I will make it my personal mission that you lose your seats in the Senate if you vote against the future health of America’s children.”

 

[rjshae]

On 1/28/2025 at 11:32 PM, Lexx said:

So apparently Trump is removing income tax now? Can that really be done? Does anyone know what would happen after? Would he increase sales tax and wouldn't that mean literally everything gets more expensive for everyone?

/Edit: Apparently this stuff gets submitted like once per year and is always blocked.

It's the 16th amendment to the constitution, so no, not easily.

"The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration."

[rjshae]

On 1/28/2025 at 10:16 PM, BruceVC said:

Can you give me your opinion on  something because you often respond in an objective and reasonable way

The PEPFAR  funding has been temporarily  suspended and several  clinics dependant on that US funding have closed until this funding comes back 

https://www.npr.org/sections/goats-and-soda/2025/01/28/g-s1-45030/pepfar-trump-drugs-stop-work

But my question is why is the US seen as the only country that can provide this aid? I realize this is the reality but why

Is that the perception? No, I haven't heard that perspective. In reality, one would hope for a more international response. It's been around since Bush II, a Republican, but has since been mostly criticized by Republicans. The program is promoting abstinence before marriage, a Republican dogma.

To me, shutting off the funding for all these programs suggests that this administration can't hit a moving target.

[Malcador]

And of course the air disaster in D.C. was due to DEI and Biden according to Trump, with no evidence.

 

[BruceVC]

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2025/1/28/us-senate-blocks-bill-sanctioning-icc-over-israeli-arrest-warrants

The Senate has blocked the proposed US sanctions on the ICC because of the issuing of  warrants on Netanyahu and others

Its  a good move by the Senate, this type of sanction was unhelpful and concerning 

 

[BruceVC]

Really funny 

 

 

[melkathi]

Israel is demanding Cyprus allows it to have an armed presence in the control towers at the commercial airports. To exert pressure, all Israeli airlines have suspended all flights to Paphos.

[HoonDing]

South Africa to declare war on Rwanda.

[Malcador]

38 minutes ago, HoonDing said:

South Africa to declare war on Rwanda.

ATACMS for Congo

[Zoraptor]

A lot of South Africans would like Pretoria or Johannesburg renamed, they probably aren't keen on them being renamed Kagamea or Kagameburg though. Still, getting conquered by Rwanda would be one way to end up with competent economic leadership at least (maybe that's the idea?)

[uuuhhii]

great trade war of north america will start soon

hope the rest of the world can survive it

[BruceVC]

19 hours ago, Malcador said:

ATACMS for Congo

Obviously there will be no   war between SA and Rwanda

Its about the pointless deployment of SA troops in the DRC and we unintentionally fighting on the side that has  a militant group linked to the 1994 Rwanda genocide  called the FDLR  and the other side  consists of DRC ethnic Tutsis who say they fighting for there survival and they backed by Rwanda who is also Tutsi 

So Rwanda is asking why  we fighting on the side that has  a  group implicated in the 1994 genocide and we are suppose to be  very   opposed to any genocide if you think of the recent Israel ICJ case which is now become a real local media outrage talking point about our DRC deployment 

And then our government makes things more confusing by saying publicly we in a peacekeeping role but we not in peacekeeping role, that was the UN force and we in the SADC force which is an offensive  force

But then our troops dont have the right equipment and  thats why  we  lost 13 soldiers

In summary its a confusing tribal conflict that is thousands of KM from SA borders and there is  no  reason we should have troops involved in an offensive role. End of the day countries on the border of the DRC should be deploying troops but peace will only be achieved through direct peace talks between the M23 and the DRC

And the DRC failed to sign an agreement that was agreed on  last year that Angola tried to broker 

https://www.reuters.com/world/africa/rwandan-foreign-minister-says-congo-refused-sign-deal-ease-m23-conflict-2024-10-05/

Edited Saturday at 12:47 PM by BruceVC

[Malcador]

I said ATACMS for Congo not South Africa as they resist Rwandan forces.  I should go re read Dancing in the Glory of Monsters, but this seems very similar to 25 years ago.

[rjshae]

16 hours ago, uuuhhii said:

great trade war of north america will start soon

hope the rest of the world can survive it

Canada enjoys a trade surplus with the USA, but it's entirely because of oil exports.

[Malcador]

And apparently if Canada retaliates, then tariffs increase.  The US really deserves much worse than it gets.

[Bartimaeus]

"Even if Trump is elected, nothing will change," said the stupid bastard.

[uuuhhii]

really feel like watch brexit again

except usa brexit itself even harder and faster

 

[Sarex]

2 hours ago, Bartimaeus said:

"Even if Trump is elected, nothing will change," said the stupid bastard.

Probably someone somewhere wrote C needs to get big tariffs again and someone assumed it was Canada. Abbreviations cause trouble I tell you... Either way I don't see how more conflicts is exactly a change in the foreign policy of the US, or why these tariffs are world ending as was stated.

I would much rather trade actual wars for economics war, but I guess we will see how that pans out.

[uuuhhii]

9 minutes ago, Sarex said:

Probably someone somewhere wrote C needs to get big tariffs again and someone assumed it was Canada. Abbreviations cause trouble I tell you... Either way I don't see how more conflicts is exactly a change in the foreign policy of the US, or why these tariffs are world ending as was stated.

I would much rather trade actual wars for economics war, but I guess we will see how that pans out.

 

actual war are most often started for economical reason

like the biggest one 80 year ago

[Malcador]

9 hours ago, Sarex said:

Probably someone somewhere wrote C needs to get big tariffs again and someone assumed it was Canada. Abbreviations cause trouble I tell you... Either way I don't see how more conflicts is exactly a change in the foreign policy of the US, or why these tariffs are world ending as was stated.

I would much rather trade actual wars for economics war, but I guess we will see how that pans out.

US has free trade deals with Canada and Mexico, who are friendly nations - particularly Canada, including the USMCA deal Trump was so proud of regardless of how it differed from NAFTA.  As is most common in life doing broad things is dumb, so raising prices for Americans, damaging allied economies for nebulous reasons.

Shame Putin's hostile to us, we could appeal to him to host some Oreshnik launch sites.

[Sarex]

10 minutes ago, Malcador said:

US has free trade deals with Canada and Mexico, who are friendly nations - particularly Canada, including the USMCA deal Trump was so proud of regardless of how it differed from NAFTA.  As is most common in life doing broad things is dumb, so raising prices for Americans, damaging allied economies for nebulous reasons.

Shame Putin's hostile to us, we could appeal to him to host some Oreshnik launch sites.

As far back as I remember Americans have been complaining that jobs are being moved outside the US, now they get the opportunity to move them back. I find it amusing that tariffs are somehow terrible on the scale of what a president can do, considering how many wars were started or facilitated by the previous presidents.

[Malcador]

Well, raising prices is one thing. Long term damage to US soft power with allies is another.  But these Americans only understand force, so allies are to be vassals, I guess.  In terms of jobs, not too sure many jobs have left the US for Canada of all places, also here we send the Americans raw materials - stuff like lumber, aluminum, potash - and energy - a lot of our electricity goes to the US, and oil.  Goes back to targeting the industries you want to bring back to the US rather than just everything.

Project 2025 wanted tariffs instead of income tax, no ?

 

[Zoraptor]

21 minutes ago, Sarex said:

As far back as I remember Americans have been complaining that jobs are being moved outside the US, now they get the opportunity to move them back. I find it amusing that tariffs are somehow terrible on the scale of what a president can do, considering how many wars were started or facilitated by the previous presidents.

The wars, by and large, haven't been terrible for the US though. If they were they'd stop having so many. They cost money that goes on the fantasy pay back pile, a lot of people make a lot of money from them and, by and large, those who suffer most are people who aren't important.

Problem is that those jobs aren't going to move back to the US, certainly not long term. The economy is based on buying cheap pap from overseas, not expensive guff from the US; making the overseas pap expensive isn't magically going to turn Detroit back into a thriving industrial powerhouse, it will just make everything expensive. To believe the Trump response requires the parallel belief that every other US President has been a malign actor deliberately stiffing their own country for the benefit of those overseas. Someone working 16 hour days in a Bangladeshi sweat shop making shoes or T shirts probably isn't that happy about it, but you're never going to get an american able to make T shirts to sell at 5 bucks a piece. You can only get an american to compete selling them at maybe $15 bucks a piece.

Which will have an awful effect on poorer people who need those cheap shirts and will find their clothing bill and food bills going up significantly to be the last straw. Contrastingly, it's also 'bad' if too many poorer people get jobs due to all the illegal immigrants getting biffed out since that drives wage inflation which further drives prices up...

Don't get me wrong, the orthodox economic model is awful, but it's the way it is for a reason.

And when it comes to heavy industry type stuff coming home, well, to put it in perspective: nearing 3 years of a supposed existential crisis and with something as simple to make as artillery shells and it's still too hard to, uh, hit the targets.

32 minutes ago, Malcador said:

Shame Putin's hostile to us, we could appeal to him to host some Oreshnik launch sites.

As always, the proper troll option is to buy French nuclear subs.

[Sarex]

11 minutes ago, Zoraptor said:

As always, the proper troll option is to buy French nuclear subs.

Oh now that would be a good one.

11 minutes ago, Zoraptor said:

The wars, by and large, haven't been terrible for the US though. If they were they'd stop having so many. They cost money that goes on the fantasy pay back pile, a lot of people make a lot of money from them and, by and large, those who suffer most are people who aren't important.

Problem is that those jobs aren't going to move back to the US, certainly not long term. The economy is based on buying cheap pap from overseas, not expensive guff from the US; making the overseas pap expensive isn't magically going to turn Detroit back into a thriving industrial powerhouse, it will just make everything expensive. To believe the Trump response requires the parallel belief that every other US President has been a malign actor deliberately stiffing their own country for the benefit of those overseas. Someone working 16 hour days in a Bangladeshi sweat shop making shoes or T shirts probably isn't that happy about it, but you're never going to get an american able to make T shirts to sell at 5 bucks a piece. You can only get an american to compete selling them at maybe $15 bucks a piece.

Which will have an awful effect on poorer people who need those cheap shirts and will find their clothing bill and food bills going up significantly to be the last straw. Contrastingly, it's also 'bad' if too many poorer people get jobs due to all the illegal immigrants getting biffed out since that drives wage inflation which further drives prices up...

Don't get me wrong, the orthodox economic model is awful, but it's the way it is for a reason.

And when it comes to heavy industry type stuff coming home, well, to put it in perspective: nearing 3 years of a supposed existential crisis and with something as simple to make as artillery shells and it's still too hard to, uh, hit the targets.

Well aware that things are not as simple as that, but on the other hand the EU is defending its jobs from Chinese auto manufacturing by imposing even worse tariffs, even though everyone apart from Porsche is in freefall. Another thing to consider is for how long the far east market is going to remain open, things there are far from certain and everything done so far to curtail China's rise has been ineffective.

The next logical step for cheap/slave labor would be Africa, go figure, but China seems to have been ahead of the game there. Which leaves South America and that will be a though nut to crack considering the history with the west. Point being that it may not be a bad idea to have a self sufficient economy in the near future, question is if it's too late.

As I said, I find it amusing how unabashed folks seem to be regarding what constitutes as world changing.

36 minutes ago, Malcador said:

Well, raising prices is one thing. Long term damage to US soft power with allies is another.  But these Americans only understand force, so allies are to be vassals, I guess.  In terms of jobs, not too sure many jobs have left the US for Canada of all places, also here we send the Americans raw materials - stuff like lumber, aluminum, potash - and energy - a lot of our electricity goes to the US, and oil.  Goes back to targeting the industries you want to bring back to the US rather than just everything.

Project 2025 wanted tariffs instead of income tax, no ?

I mean if you guys actually thought the US somehow cares for you apart from caring about what benefits they can get from you, then you brought this upon yourself. They stole tech from their allies, they spy on their allies, they coerce their allies to join wars. From the outside looking in to us it always seemed like the US allies are just vassals, the treatment you would get only depends on the power you hold.

I won't pretend to know why he did it or if it was even a good idea, but I guess we will find out how it plays out.

People here are pissed off that Trump is going to build a hotel on the site of the ruins of our Military headquarters that were bombed in 99. That's a slap in the face if there ever was one, so it's not like I care for him much either. But a slap is better than a bomb I guess.