Gaza - conflict, war, land, water rights, bad colonional legacies...

[BruceVC]

You guys are over-analysing the UNSC ruling and misunderstanding why its significant 

No country is going to invade Israel to enforce it if thats what you hoping 

But its symbolic and it matters to global and UN  opinion and the continuation of the legitimacy of the IDF campaign in Gaza

We tend to confuse Internet opinions and grandstanding with RL optics and how governments want to be seen in conflicts like this 

Its like with Russia, some people will say " Russia doesn't care what the world or the UN thinks. Its ignored the ICJ ruling to end the invasion and no country will invade Russia because it was nukes " 

But Russia absolutely does care  what UN thinks, it wants legitimacy for the invasion and it has several cases in the ICJ and one of them is around how the invasion was justified because of genocide committed against Russians in Donbas. Russia wants the world to see it as a country that believes and supports  international law so despite what we think and see Putin doesn't want Russia to be seen as a  rogue or warmongering state who would invade a country without a legitimate reason 

And this is the same as Israel, they want legal legitimacy for the IDF campaign in Gaza. Netanyahu is a terrible leader but optics do matter to Israel 

Israel has ignored UNSC resolutions in  the past but this is different. There is far too much global attention on Israel in this latest conflict and Biden is also getting negative views of perceived indifference and lack of action

Just compare most of  the worlds support for Israel after 7 October and look at it now? Global public opinion is now generally  very critical towards Israel and if they ignore this UNSC it will only get worse 

Thats why it matters, its not  so much about words like binding or enforceable. Its that it was passed and how the globe  and the UN will reflect on this UNSC ruling 

 

 

 

 

[Malcador]

https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-war-news-04-02-2024-9bdf66771b62af37d85a2800f71c0e6c

Guess they mentioned hummus and that triggered the IDF.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

41 minutes ago, Malcador said:

https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-war-news-04-02-2024-9bdf66771b62af37d85a2800f71c0e6c

Guess they mentioned hummus and that triggered the IDF.

I think this is one of the first articles I've seen in a "mainstream" outlet that hasn't stuck with the awkward exonerative wording to avoid saying that Israel killed people.

[Zoraptor]

Meh, AP is still running interference for Israel- still got to have the obligatory reference to how everything was started by/ is justified by Oct 7- it's just very hard to run interference with something so very obviously a war crime beyond an implicit "it wouldn't have happened if Hamas didn't exist". Also a lot harder when those killed are mostly nice westerners rather than icky Palestinians.

To put it in perspective, even Haaretz is running tougher articles than those AP blancmanges are. And Haaretz is actually subject to the Military Censor, AP just censors itself.

Quote

 

..Some of the passengers were seen getting out of the car after the missile hit and moving to one of the other two. They continued their journey and even informed those responsible for them that they had been attacked, but seconds later another missile hit their vehicle. The third car in the convoy approached them, and the passengers began to transfer into it wounded people who survived the second attack - in order to keep them away from any danger. But then a third missile was fired that hit them. All seven of the organization's volunteers were killed in the attack..

 

The very definition of, to quote Bibi, "unintended", that. I often unintentionally do something three times in quick succession with deadly results. That's why I'm posting this from a high security prison/ insane asylum/ am a Major in the most moral army in the world.

I'm very very sure Israel is utterly appalled and despondent that WCK has suspended operations and that wasn't the aim of the operation in the first place... yeah right, the only 'unintended' thing was there being people from friendly countries in the vehicles. Even then, not like those spineless jellies like Sunak Trudeau or Albanese will actually do anything about it apart from verbal diarrhoea about the tragedy of it all.

[BruceVC]

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/israeli-military-withdraws-most-ground-troops-southern-gaza-spokesperson-says-2024-04-07/

I think this is a really positive development, the IDF is withdrawing most of its forces from southern Gaza

Is this the beginning of a permanent ceasefire and real negotiations between both sides or is it something else?

I also think the mistaken killings of the Kitchen Aid Workers was the  " final " straw for the US and the Biden administration around the egregious IDF military strategy and continuous and callous killing of Palestinian civilians 

 

 

 

 

[BruceVC]

 So true this type of protest outrage 

 

[Malcador]

7 hours ago, BruceVC said:

So true this type of protest outrage 

They're wishing death to America? Thought all the fainting was over them wishing it to Israel.

[BruceVC]

10 minutes ago, Malcador said:

They're wishing death to America? Thought all the fainting was over them wishing it to Israel.

Its used interchangeably for most of these Islamic  extremist groups or protests about US involvement in the ME which is the point of the parody in the article 

There is almost always  a " death to Zionists\Israel\USA " but its mostly from protesters  outside the US 

In South Africa  since 7 October its common for many anti-US activists on talk shows  to refer to the US as a country controlled by a " crusader\Zionist " agenda which is about the destruction of the Islamic world by the US but you  generally only  hear this rhetoric during Israel vs Palestinian conflicts

If that conflict is not ongoing then the US is normally referred to as a warmongering, Colonial and Imperialist power 

But this is anti-US activists, its not the majority of people in SA 

 

[majestic]

Is it my bias and/or political leaning that makes right-wing/conservative satire always seem so incredibly cringeworthy, or is it just really just cringeworthy?

[BruceVC]

3 minutes ago, majestic said:

Is it my bias and/or political leaning that makes right-wing/conservative satire always seem so incredibly cringeworthy, or is it just really just cringeworthy?

Definitely your bias, that  link is funny 

 

[Chilloutman]

9 minutes ago, majestic said:

Is it my bias and/or political leaning that makes right-wing/conservative satire always seem so incredibly cringeworthy, or is it just really just cringeworthy?

every political comedy is cringeworthy to some degree especially if you don't agree with that viewpoint, but man nothing is so embarrassing as some woke stuff out there

[Elerond]

40 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

But this is anti-US activists, its not the majority of people in SA 

 

Isn't SA effectivelly a Russian ally against USA in world politics these days?

[BruceVC]

4 minutes ago, Elerond said:

Isn't SA effectivelly a Russian ally against USA in world politics these days?

Not  according to our government which often still says what  an important friend and ally the  US is 

But  there  are  people in the ANC that use a  lot of  anti-US   ideological rhetoric around certain developments but its very  selective and they flip-flop 

So  for  example when Russia invaded  Ukraine  the ICC  and ICJ were   "biased  US\Western controlled institutions that should be ignored   "

But  when SA takes  Israel to the ICJ and ICC  these  institutions become " very important and authoritative UN bodies and all Democracies  must  adhere  to what they rule   on  "

But  the ANC and our foreign affairs  says we  neutral and non-aligned  when it  comes to  Russia and the  US and they say we  friends  with  everyone 

The truth  is  it  depends  on   who  is speaking from  the ANC and  do they have lived experience  from  the Cold War  and the  struggle to end Apartheid because these ANC  members always  see  Russia\USSR  in a more  favorable way than the US\West 

 

 

 

[Hurlshort]

1 hour ago, majestic said:

Is it my bias and/or political leaning that makes right-wing/conservative satire always seem so incredibly cringeworthy, or is it just really just cringeworthy?

Babylon Bee does tend to try and bludgeon you to death with their satire. It lacks any of the self awareness and subtlety that you tend to see with The Onion.

[uuuhhii]

1 hour ago, majestic said:

Is it my bias and/or political leaning that makes right-wing/conservative satire always seem so incredibly cringeworthy, or is it just really just cringeworthy?

 

most non conservative satire are more sad than funny

pretty difficult to laugh at the stupidity of conservative when most people are too busy suffering it

[Bartimaeus]

2 hours ago, majestic said:

Is it my bias and/or political leaning that makes right-wing/conservative satire always seem so incredibly cringeworthy, or is it just really just cringeworthy?

There's a lot of factors that go into humor, and that can definitely be part of it. But I would say framing also matters a lot, and one of the ways in which framing strongly affects humor is precisely who is telling you the "funny" and in what context. I have a friend that likes to occasionally link me clips from the demon/televangelist known as Kenneth Copeland...

...and in the context of knowing that my friend also thinks he might be a demon, the clips are usually pretty funny. But if I saw the same clips linked by one of his cult members (i.e. charitably, probably a moron...though potentially someone much more insidious than that), it would be a whole different story: you might well be able to apply a similar train of thought to some of the things said/linked to here, though probably for different kinds of reasons in different situations. I also think Alex Jones can be the funniest guy on Earth...sometimes, but I'm certain that I don't find him funny in the same ways that his true believers can, and I would no doubt be an alien in their midst.

Edited April 24 by Bartimaeus

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

2 hours ago, majestic said:

Is it my bias and/or political leaning that makes right-wing/conservative satire always seem so incredibly cringeworthy, or is it just really just cringeworthy?

Oh no, it's incredibly cringeworthy. In addition to the fact they're creative black holes, it's because they're largely incapable of engaging with or even investigating anything outside of their bubble, so their satire is coming from a place that's not really aware of what they're trying to satire.

[Malcador]

3 hours ago, majestic said:

Is it my bias and/or political leaning that makes right-wing/conservative satire always seem so incredibly cringeworthy, or is it just really just cringeworthy?

Maybe bias, these satire places aren't subtle generally I find. Kind of get carried away with their axe grinding.

[Gorth]

Wouldn’t good satire be based on reality and actual quotes, just condensed to create absurdity? Just making up things doesn’t automatically make it funny

edit: doesn’t mean made up stuff can’t be funny, but I would think of it as a joke, good or bad, not satire. Point in case, the (fake) announcement of Elon Musks death in the funny thread was funny, but I didn’t think of it as satire. It didn’t put words in his mouth either, as far as I know, he never claimed himself to be dead

[BruceVC]

13 hours ago, Malcador said:

Maybe bias, these tire places aren't subtle generally I find. Kind of get carried away with their axe grinding.

But dont you find the SNL parodies on Trump hilarious?

Or all the Sacha Baron Cohen imitations funny, I have mentioned this before but he is my favourite comedian 

What I have found is most of the criticism towards one type of comedy or another is because " my team is getting teased and mocked" 

And thats missing the point of  comedy and parody 

 

 

[Malcador]

5 hours ago, BruceVC said:

But dont you find the SNL parodies on Trump hilarious?

Or all the Sacha Baron Cohen imitations funny, I have mentioned this before but he is my favourite comedian 

What I have found is most of the criticism towards one type of comedy or another is because " my team is getting teased and mocked" 

And thats missing the point of  comedy and parody 

 

 

Not really, Trump is a parody of a human being enough.  Cohen I've never really found all that funny, but I've never watched enough of his stuff to judge I suppose.

But that piece you linked is too much of a strawman.  But I suppose is better than labelling them jihadis as was done by our Sun (so basically the same thing as a satire paper I guess..).  Right wingers have some reflex hatred for protests sort of funny, given how many jerk it to the Gadsen flag essentially.

[Gorth]

More war in the Middle East