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The All Things Political Thread (One thread to rule them all and in the darkness bind them)


Gorth

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6 hours ago, Guard Dog said:

Deficit spending and uncontrollable debt will be our undoing. Not today, maybe not for a little while. But the day will come when the dollar is not the world reserve currency and debt will no longer be able to be monetized without consequences. We will not survive the stupidity of our political leaders nor the indolence of our voters.

 

Continued from old thread

 

“He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would surely suffice.” - Albert Einstein

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Wet, wetter, wettest! NSW (New South Wales) take the prize.

Not sure if visible from non Aussie geolocations

 

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“He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would surely suffice.” - Albert Einstein

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7 hours ago, Gorth said:

Wet, wetter, wettest! NSW (New South Wales) take the prize.

Not sure if visible from non Aussie geolocations

 

I have been following this natural disaster in Oz and it has serious consequences with the potential loss of life but worse is the damage done to infrastructure. Worse floods in 60 years and it still could go on for another few days

Terrible news Gorthfuscious, my thoughts are with your country and its citizens 🇦🇺

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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3 hours ago, BruceVC said:

I have been following this natural disaster in Oz and it has serious consequences with the potential loss of life but worse is the damage done to infrastructure. Worse floods in 60 years and it still could go on for another few days

Terrible news Gorthfuscious, my thoughts are with your country and its citizens 🇦🇺

Thanks. Yeah, looks like the terrain is going to be a bit soggy for a few days still....

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-australia-56485246

"Warragamba Dam discharged 500 gigalitres on Sydney - equivalent to the volume of Sydney Harbour." (this is to prevent the dam from collapsing completely, a predictable flood, where you can warn people being preferable to it simply bursting)

"No deaths had been reported but thousands of people have been evacuated and troops deployed after days of torrential downpours across the country." (good statistic so far, as most deaths in such situations are Darwin Award nominees)

 

"Honey, you forgot to mow the lawn again!" (no, not actually a quote from the article, the picture is though)

Floods engulf a backyard

 

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“He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would surely suffice.” - Albert Einstein

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The Republicans are now the Confederate/Nazi Party...and millions of Americans seem eager to support it.

Then you got your "Blue Dog" liberals who try to project their fascist tendencies unto Mother Russia.

Is there any way out of this mess, or are we doomed for the inferno?

“If we are to have another contest in the near future of our national existence, I predict that the dividing line will not be Mason and Dixon's but between patriotism and intelligence on the one side, and superstition, ambition and ignorance on the other.” 

-Ulysses S. Grant

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35 minutes ago, ComradeYellow said:

 

Is there any way out of this mess, or are we doomed for the inferno?

A complete economic implosion resulting from the collapse of the currency and banking system will certainly shake things up. Don’t know what it will look like after but I’m sure it will be different. Couldn’t even hazard a guess as to how long you will have to wait for that to happen but the fact that it will happen seems a pretty sure thing.

"The man of virtuous soul commands not, nor obeys. Power, like a desolating pestilence, pollutes whate'er it touches; and obedience, bane of all genius, virtue, freedom, truth, makes slaves of men, and of the human frame a mechanized automaton."

P.B. Shelley

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3 hours ago, Elerond said:

Seems bit paradoxical, but what doesn't these days

Oh yes Trumpism will be remembered for many things, more negative than positive Im afraid 

But it will definitely be remembered as that arcane political movement where " it was expected and praised for flipping flopping and being inconsistent on what you say in public  and the word hypocrisy confirms your  commitment  and understanding of the general Trumpism doctrine " 

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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36 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

Oh yes Trumpism will be remembered for many things, more negative than positive Im afraid 

But it will definitely be remembered as that arcane political movement where " it was expected and praised for flipping flopping and being inconsistent on what you say in public  and the word hypocrisy confirms your  commitment  and understanding of the general Trumpism doctrine " 

the gaslighting is... predictable. however, keep in mind ms. powell is facing multiple lawsuits and it would appear the tucker carlson defense is her legal team's strategy. less 'bout a flip flop than it is 'bout trying to avoid the loss o' her life's savings.

'course such a strategy won't help in sidney's efforts to avoid being disbarred, which kinda shows just how worried she must be. her team is gonna argue before a court how her previous legal claims were straining credulity to such a degree no reasonable person would believe? will be lucky if she is only disbarred if such is the argument.

HA! Good Fun!

 

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"If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927)

"Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019)

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Huh.

Edited by ComradeYellow

“If we are to have another contest in the near future of our national existence, I predict that the dividing line will not be Mason and Dixon's but between patriotism and intelligence on the one side, and superstition, ambition and ignorance on the other.” 

-Ulysses S. Grant

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1 hour ago, Guard Dog said:

Don’t know what it will look like after but I’m sure it will be different.

Probably something out of Snow Crash.

Why has elegance found so little following? Elegance has the disadvantage that hard work is needed to achieve it and a good education to appreciate it. - Edsger Wybe Dijkstra

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https://www.journalgazette.net/news/world/20210324/israeli-election-too-close-to-call

Exciting outcomes for the Israeli latest elections, its still to early to call a winner but no party will get a majority which means coalitions and political compromises will be created....it will just be interesting if the winning party is more moderate or like Likud, Netanyahu's party, leans more towards right wing nationalism 

 

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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Interesting developments in geo-pol. Not sure how many tracked the recent meeting between Russia and China, and what was said afterwards in their statements. (especially removal of dollar from any transactions and reliance on western banks settlement systems) 

 

It also seems that Iran is pulled into the triangle of the huge pan-Asian block. 

Looking at the map, and with dwindling influence in Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan, it seems that only India is not really on board in that continentl Asian conglomerafe, although the current leader in India is not really easily digestable to US admin and US tech. 

Turkey also seems to stray away further from "important values", with the recent withdrawal  from the (ironically) Istambul convention, which aimed to secure protection to women against  voilence. 

 

 

 

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15 minutes ago, Darkpriest said:

Interesting developments in geo-pol. Not sure how many tracked the recent meeting between Russia and China, and what was said afterwards in their statements. (especially removal of dollar from any transactions and reliance on western banks settlement systems) 

 

It also seems that Iran is pulled into the triangle of the huge pan-Asian block. 

Looking at the map, and with dwindling influence in Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan, it seems that only India is not really on board in that continentl Asian conglomerafe, although the current leader in India is not really easily digestable to US admin and US tech. 

Turkey also seems to stray away further from "important values", with the recent withdrawal  from the (ironically) Istambul convention, which aimed to secure protection from voilence to women. 

 

 

 

Not sure how you  would remove the dollar from your international trades as so many things are fixed on dollar being the agreed on currency and measurements like  the price of commodities like oil. The dollar is the worlds chosen reserve currency for several reasons but mainly because of its stability

https://www.thebalance.com/world-currency-3305931#:~:text=Another name for a global currency is the,of all known central bank foreign exchange reserves.

Secondly if China and Russia want to create their own global banks and not deal with the likes of Western banks or the IMF they are perfectly entitled to. You can arrange finance from any legal source you want as a government 

But both Russia and China have attempted this before and it was an epic failure, that was one of the original objectives of BRIC and it didnt go anywhere 

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2015/12/can-bric-countries-move-away-from-the-dollar/

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/business/international-business/BRICS-bank-launched-in-China-as-alternative-to-World-Bank-IMF/articleshow/48160116.cms

Countries still get loans from the IMF and World Bank and very few people will stop using the dollar as the unofficial global currency so this view from Russia and China is meaningless and just a response to the valid new sanctions against China and the current sanctions against Russia 

 

 

 

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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Depends, with how dollar was treated and its spilloever effect of trillions printed into the system, that whole stable/reserve is put into question. 

Also, recently there was a trading block formed in Asia, which can easily use an alternative to USD and it is self sustainable. Plus China, Russia and other countries of 2021 are in a much different place than those of 2015. 

I would not dismiss that possibility that easily. When it comes to land, resources and popultion, plus technology, do you really see a real rival. The one thing that could cripple this is the semiconductor production capabilities, that's why China is so fixed on Taiwan. 

 

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4 minutes ago, Darkpriest said:

Depends, with how dollar was treated and its spilloever effect of trillions printed into the system, that whole stable/reserve is put into question. 

Also, recently there was a trading block formed in Asia, which can easily use an alternative to USD and it is self sustainable. Plus China, Russia and other countries of 2021 are in a much different place than those of 2015. 

I would not dismiss that possibility that easily. When it comes to land, resources and popultion, plus technology, do you really see a real rival. The one thing that could cripple this is the semiconductor production capabilities, that's why China is so fixed on Taiwan. 

 

It always fails because the countries involved arent consistent with their own rules around adhering to various global  financial regulations and having transparent legal systems like China

So to repeat what I said earlier, you will be waiting a long time if you think the "evil, Capitalist , Western ,Banking " system is going to be replaced by " open, transparent , non-greedy, socialist/Communist " banking systems of China and Russia

Sorry Dark, its not going to happen. You need trust in a currency and stability to make it the worlds unofficial reserve currency 

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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1 minute ago, BruceVC said:

It always fails because the countries involved arent consistent with their own rules around adhering to various global  financial regulations and having transparent legal systems like China

So to repeat what I said earlier, you will be waiting a long time if you think the "evil, Capitalist , Western ,Banking " system is going to be replaced by " open, transparent , non-greedy, socialist/Communist " banking systems of China and Russia

Sorry Dark, its not going to happen. You need trust in a currency and stability to make it the worlds unofficial reserve currency 

And you think US and USD are now beacons of stability and development? 

I'm not saying that this will happen tomorrow, but I can certainly see that happening in 5-10years. To be frank, I believe we are one big financial crisis away from the permanent shift. 

 

Even people like this guy see issues with where the focus is placed. 

 

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6 minutes ago, Darkpriest said:

And you think US and USD are now beacons of stability and development? 

I'm not saying that this will happen tomorrow, but I can certainly see that happening in 5-10years. To be frank, I believe we are one big financial crisis away from the permanent shift. 

 

Even people like this guy see issues with where the focus is placed. 

 

Yes the US Dollar, and the USA economy,  is considered stable and sustainable. You may not agree with it but the reality of how the  majority of the worlds Central Banks and global Investment banks see it is that  the dollar is the best currency to buy and keep in foreign exchange  reserves 

To quote from that link I provided all these paragraphs below confirm what I am saying but the link also discusses the negative or reasonable ways to find alternatives to the US dollar 

According to the International Monetary Fund, the U.S. dollar is the most popular. As of the fourth quarter of 2019, it makes up over 60% of all known central bank foreign exchange reserves. That makes it the de facto global currency, even though it doesn't hold an official title.

The relative strength of the U.S. economy supports the value of the dollar. It's the reason the dollar is the most powerful currency. As of 2018, the U.S. had $1,671 billion in circulation. As much as half that value is estimated to be in circulation abroad.Many of these bills are in the former Soviet Union countries and in Latin America. They are often used as hard currency in day-to-day transactions.

In the foreign exchange market, the dollar rules. Around 90% of forex trading involves the U.S. dollar. The dollar is just one of the world's 185 currencies according to the International Standards Organization List, but most of these currencies are only used inside their own countries.3

Almost 40% of the world's debt is issued in dollars.4 As a result, foreign banks need a lot of dollars to conduct business. This became evident during the 2008 financial crisis. Non-American banks had $27 trillion in international liabilities denominated in foreign currencies. Of that, $18 trillion was in U.S. dollars.5 As a result, the U.S. Federal Reserve had to increase its dollar swap line. That was the only way to keep the world's banks from running out of dollars.

 

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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1 hour ago, BruceVC said:

Yes the US Dollar, and the USA economy,  is considered stable and sustainable. You may not agree with it but the reality of how the  majority of the worlds Central Banks and global Investment banks see it is that  the dollar is the best currency to buy and keep in foreign exchange  reserves 

To quote from that link I provided all these paragraphs below confirm what I am saying but the link also discusses the negative or reasonable ways to find alternatives to the US dollar 

According to the International Monetary Fund, the U.S. dollar is the most popular. As of the fourth quarter of 2019, it makes up over 60% of all known central bank foreign exchange reserves. That makes it the de facto global currency, even though it doesn't hold an official title.

The relative strength of the U.S. economy supports the value of the dollar. It's the reason the dollar is the most powerful currency. As of 2018, the U.S. had $1,671 billion in circulation. As much as half that value is estimated to be in circulation abroad.Many of these bills are in the former Soviet Union countries and in Latin America. They are often used as hard currency in day-to-day transactions.

In the foreign exchange market, the dollar rules. Around 90% of forex trading involves the U.S. dollar. The dollar is just one of the world's 185 currencies according to the International Standards Organization List, but most of these currencies are only used inside their own countries.3

Almost 40% of the world's debt is issued in dollars.4 As a result, foreign banks need a lot of dollars to conduct business. This became evident during the 2008 financial crisis. Non-American banks had $27 trillion in international liabilities denominated in foreign currencies. Of that, $18 trillion was in U.S. dollars.5 As a result, the U.S. Federal Reserve had to increase its dollar swap line. That was the only way to keep the world's banks from running out of dollars.

 

I envy you your optimism and roae tinted glasses. However, we now have End of March 2021, after a lot of political map changes, relationship changes and most importantly economies and policies affected by pandemic and different priorities that surfaced during it. 

Data from end of 2018 and 2019 is most likely vastly outdated and not representative. If you could show me the same content for March 2021 I'd be more inclined to share your view 😉

Edited by Darkpriest
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20 minutes ago, Darkpriest said:

I envy you your optimism and roae tinted glasses. However, we now have End of March 2021, after a lot of political map changes, relationship changes and most importantly economies and policies affected by pandemic and different priorities that surfaced during it. 

Data from end of 2018 and 2019 is most likely vastly outdated and not representative. If you could show me the same content for March 2021 I'd be more inclined to share your view 😉

Yes I do agree the pandemic has changed or rather impacted how globalization works to ensure global trade and benefits. So no one can say with certainty " their cant be a new global currency"

But once the vaccines are implemented we will go back to normal, pre-pandemic , policies where the world will  continue to use the US Dollar in the same optional way it always has. I cant see logically why the global financial systems we currently have will change or need to change and even if it should change using China or Russia as an alternative would be one of my last options 

Maybe you can  tell me in summary why you want to change the dollar as the worlds unofficial reserve currency, why do you think it needs to change is probably more relevant to this debate ?

 

Edited by BruceVC

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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I do not want it to change. I have no real interest in it changing. Quite the contrary, it would just bring a bit more pain and restrictions. However, I can understand why Russia-China-Iran-other continental Central/East Asia aside of India and South Korea would like this to happen. 

It would make them self reliant, self sufficient and an economic and demographic powerhouse. Ask yourself where most of the valuable natural resources is? Where the most of the production capabilities are? Where most of the advancements in communication and tech happens. Which societies are more unified with a more common vision and are hungry of successes? 

 

Paper without underlying real production economy is just a piece of paper. You can't have serviced based economy, if you have no means on which you will be providing this service. 

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7 minutes ago, Darkpriest said:

I do not want it to change. I have no real interest in it changing. Quite the contrary, it would just bring a bit more pain and restrictions. However, I can understand why Russia-China-Iran-other continental Central/East Asia aside of India and South Korea would like this to happen. 

It would make them self reliant, self sufficient and an economic and demographic powerhouse. Ask yourself where most of the valuable natural resources is? Where the most of the production capabilities are? Where most of the advancements in communication and tech happens. Which societies are more unified with a more common vision and are hungry of successes? 

 

Food for thought and you never know what the future holds but if I was a betting man I would bank ( excuse the pun ) on the system that the world currently uses by choice as the system that will continue to be used. This pandemic created an artificial global economic crisis....it wasn't structural and you normally only see the changes you are suggesting around structural economic problems ...not artificial 

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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11 minutes ago, BruceVC said:

Food for thought and you never know what the future holds but if I was a betting man I would bank ( excuse the pun ) on the system that the world currently uses by choice as the system that will continue to be used. This pandemic created an artificial global economic crisis....it wasn't structural and you normally only see the changes you are suggesting around structural economic problems ...not artificial 

That's why I also mentioned that the next big crisis will be responsible for the more permanent shift. The pointnhere is, the last couple of years are weakening the status quo and the plans and diaagreements, which emerged more to the spotlight, do not carry an insurance and going back to strenghts. On the contrary, there are initiatives and determinatio  to change the status quo, and the 'western' nations proven how swlf interested they are, whenever something wrong happens (self centered, short sighted movement in economic policies and 'vaccine wars' and protecting own interests and profits vs sharing the vaccine tech for a pandemic threat and underlining the self centerism and mistreatment of poorer asian, south american and african nations, while russia and china bank on that) 

 

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9 minutes ago, Darkpriest said:

That's why I also mentioned that the next big crisis will be responsible for the more permanent shift. The pointnhere is, the last couple of years are weakening the status quo and the plans and diaagreements, which emerged more to the spotlight, do not carry an insurance and going back to strenghts. On the contrary, there are initiatives and determinatio  to change the status quo, and the 'western' nations proven how swlf interested they are, whenever something wrong happens (self centered, short sighted movement in economic policies and 'vaccine wars' and protecting own interests and profits vs sharing the vaccine tech for a pandemic threat and underlining the self centerism and mistreatment of poorer asian, south american and african nations, while russia and china bank on that) 

 

You care about poor, impoverished African, Asian , ME and South American countries...really ? I have never known you or  most people  to talk about inequality in Africa  in a meaningful way ?

I apologize for not being aware of this , what debate have you raised around this popular subject because I hear a lot about perceived inequality in first world countries  but not much about where the inequality exists at its worst in places like Africa ? :p

Dark you need to come live in  SA and then come live with me, we can do  a tour of some African countries where  I can show you real poverty and inequality that has nothing to do with Capitalism, The West or the US dollar but has almost everything to do with corruption and a failure of governance and zero accountability 

 

 

"Abashed the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is and saw Virtue in her shape how lovely: and pined his loss”

John Milton 

"We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing.” -  George Bernard Shaw

"What counts in life is not the mere fact that we have lived. It is what difference we have made to the lives of others that will determine the significance of the life we lead" - Nelson Mandela

 

 

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