Politics 20/20 now with extra hindsight!

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Darkpriest said:

Yoy might not be entirely correct on this statement. 

What policies show that Trump can't

What policies show that Biden can by comparison? 

lol

[IndiraLightfoot]

25 minutes ago, Guard Dog said:

Here’s a little nugget. Last night six states voted to legalize marijuana to one extent or another. One state voted to decriminalize drug possession. That’s a pretty good step towards keeping people out of jail for victimless crime’s

I'm pretty liberal, no doubt about it, but what Oregon did, legalizing heroine (also cocaine), but I'm talking about heroine, specifically, is not a very wise move. It takes so little to become absolutely lifelong addicted to that ****, and it ruins each and every life it infests, not to mention the lives of friends and family, if any, surrounding the user. 

Edited November 4, 2020 by IndiraLightfoot

[majestic]

  

1 hour ago, pmp10 said:

That's this strange notion that US troop movement is somehow good to Poland.
They don't come cheap you know.

Is the US running a protection racket in Poland? Otherwise it's good for the economy, those soldiers spend a good deal of money wherever they are stationed - which is why removing US troops was used to threaten Germany (and a lot of US troops are to be moved/rotated out of Germany) and Poland got increased troop numbers as "thanks" for their continuing support.

What other problems they might bring, US military bases also bring lots of dollars with them.

[Malcador]

Just now, IndiraLightfoot said:

I'm pretty liberal, no doubt about it, but what Oregon did, legalising Heroine (also Cocaine), but I'm talking about Heroine, specifically, is not a very wise move. It takes so little to become absolutely lifelong addicted to that ****, and it ruin each and every life it infests, not to mention friends and family, if any, surrounding the user. 

Doesn't seem they were so drastic, possession now gets you a small fine or sent to rehab.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, IndiraLightfoot said:

I'm pretty liberal, no doubt about it, but what Oregon did, legalizing Heroine (also Cocaine), but I'm talking about Heroine, specifically, is not a very wise move. It takes so little to become absolutely lifelong addicted to that ****, and it ruins each and every life it infests, not to mention friends and family, if any, surrounding the user. 

That's one take.

Another is that legalizing it makes it easier to get people off of it (because they are no long self-reporting illegal activity if they ask for help) and safer for those that can't (needle exchanges, etc).

[ComradeYellow]

3 minutes ago, IndiraLightfoot said:

I'm pretty liberal, no doubt about it, but what Oregon did, legalizing heroine (also cocaine), but I'm talking about heroine, specifically, is not a very wise move. It takes so little to become absolutely lifelong addicted to that ****, and it ruins each and every life it infests, not to mention the lives of friends and family, if any, surrounding the user. 

It ruins more peoples lives keeping it illegal considering what they do to get it.

I would rather have heroin cheap and readily available so people live how they want with less collateral damage.

[Guard Dog]

6 minutes ago, IndiraLightfoot said:

I'm pretty liberal, no doubt about it, but what Oregon did, legalizing heroine (also cocaine), but I'm talking about heroine, specifically, is not a very wise move. It takes so little to become absolutely lifelong addicted to that ****, and it ruins each and every life it infests, not to mention the lives of friends and family, if any, surrounding the user. 

They didn’t exactly legalize it. It’s still illegal to sell it. Or traffic in it. It’s just not illegal to have it. What it means is a user won’t be facing a draconian prison sentence just for being in possession of a small amount of it. But on a philosophical level it’s nobodys business what a consenting adult puts in their body. Orr has taken out of it for that matterOrr has taken out of it for that matter

[IndiraLightfoot]

I'm fine with needle exchange. But I feel very non-liberal when I say that each and every heroine addict should be registered and given best possible treatment ASAP, hopefully detoxed at the expense of the state. I realize that the crimes they do would do to get it would be reduced (still not much, people hooked on it will keep on doing that stuff anyway), but I don't want any heroine coffee shops Amsterdam-style. Pay for their treatment at specialist rehab centers and give them substitute drugs, sure. I know, this is utterly naive on my behalf, but any cost is okay to keep them miles away from that drug. 

[ComradeYellow]

The problem is also the cops, they kicked up a fuss here when they started the slow and awkward process of legalizing weed, saying they "weren't gonna change their ways".  

"We don't make the laws we only enforce them" my ass, they have an agenda.

[IndiraLightfoot]

7 minutes ago, Guard Dog said:

They didn’t exactly legalize it. It’s still illegal to sell it. Or traffic in it. It’s just not illegal to have it. What it means is a user won’t be facing a draconian prison sentence just for being in possession of a small amount of it. But on a philosophical level it’s nobodys business what a consenting adult puts in their body. Orr has taken out of it for that matterOrr has taken out of it for that matter

I see, this calms me down quite a bit, still, really life-wrecking stuff. I have had heroine-using buddies die on me at a young age.

Edited November 4, 2020 by IndiraLightfoot

[Malcador]

2 minutes ago, ComradeMaster said:

The problem is also the cops, they kicked up a fuss here when they started the slow and awkward process of legalizing weed, saying they "weren't gonna change their ways".  

"We don't make the laws we only enforce them" my ass, they have an agenda.

Well it means budget cuts, so ...

[Darkpriest]

 

And it starts, now Trumps campaign will start investigations into theese 100% Biden dumps, legitimacy will be contested etc. 

 

Brace for the Fun times. 

@Guard Dog you better examine your defences and consider some mines

[Raithe]

For the random political philosophy...

[Hurlshort]

Frankly, Trump already won the election. He said so, it must be true.

[Guest]

Politicos have been reminding people about the potential for a "blue shift" for weeks, if not months. The part where low information voters get their minds blown.

[Guard Dog]

Apparently Wisconsin is reporting more votes in their results then we’re actually cast.

[Raithe]

Well for the cheap shot...

When Americans say "this is not who we are" in the future,  I think we can clearly say "this is who half of you are" without any argument...

[Guard Dog]

2 minutes ago, Achilles said:

Politicos have been reminding people about the potential for a "blue shift" for weeks, if not months. The part where low information voters get their minds blown.

They are surely disappointing the results of this election. There was no blueshift. The Republicans actually gained seats in the House of Representatives. As for the presidential race the traditional states and counties are falling out as they usually do. The red states are still red the blue states are still blue and the tossups 

[Raithe]

1 minute ago, Guard Dog said:

Apparently Wisconsin is reporting more votes in their results then we’re actually cast.

Would it be my paranoia or would it not fit for Trump to deliberately arrange a bunch of fraudulent votes for the Democrats, just so he can "catch" them...?

Or am I being too cynical?

[Darkpriest]

8 minutes ago, Achilles said:

Politicos have been reminding people about the potential for a "blue shift" for weeks, if not months. The part where low information voters get their minds blown.

You will really have a hard time explaining to people that a sudden appearance of 100k+ votes in the late night hours and were 100% Biden. 75% maybe, if those were from demo strongholds, but 100% is a bit hard to explain to already biased people. 

Edited November 4, 2020 by Darkpriest

[Guard Dog]

1 minute ago, Raithe said:

Would it be my paranoia or would it not fit for Trump to deliberately arrange a bunch of fraudulent votes for the Democrats, just so he can "catch" them...?

Or am I being too cynical?

LLOL you’re giving Trump way too much credit! He can’t play a game that deep

Edited November 4, 2020 by Guard Dog

[Hurlshort]

Honestly the voting numbers are rally impressive though. Trump is going to really outperform his 2016 numbers by a large amount. I certainly didn't see that happening. 

Just now, Guard Dog said:

They are surely disappointing the results of this election. There was no blueshift. The Republicans actually gained seats in the House of Representatives. As for the presidential race the traditional states and counties are falling out as they usually do. The red states are still red the blue states are still blue and the tossups 

And yet you are looking at over 70 million votes for Biden, so I don't see how they can be disappointed. 

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, Guard Dog said:

Apparently Wisconsin is reporting more votes in their results then we’re actually cast.

Uh...based on what? 2.7m ballots cast in 2016. 3.2m cast in 2020. That's an increase, sure, but pretty consistent with other states.

4 minutes ago, Guard Dog said:

They are surely disappointing the results of this election. There was no blueshift. The Republicans actually gained seats in the House of Representatives. As for the presidential race the traditional states and counties are falling out as they usually do. The red states are still red the blue states are still blue and the tossups 

You're confusing "blue shift" with "blue wave"

Added by edit: also, there were several states that went for Trump as a result of red shifts in those states. Can't have it both ways.

Edited November 4, 2020 by Achilles

[Guard Dog]

1 minute ago, Hurlshot said:

Honestly the voting numbers are rally impressive though. Trump is going to really outperform his 2016 numbers by a large amount. I certainly didn't see that happening. 

And yet you are looking at over 70 million votes for Biden, so I don't see how they can be disappointed. 

I think they were hoping for a blowout and they surely did not get that

[Guard Dog]

Just now, Achilles said:

Uh...based on what? 2.7m ballots cast in 2016. 3.2m cast in 2020. That's an increase, sure, but pretty consistent with other states.

You're confusing "blue shift" with "blue wave"

Fair enough. There really has not been a shift though. If you break down this election along with the last five going back to the year 2000 the patterns are kind of similar. 2008 and 2012 might be exceptions but Obama was a particularly strong candidate. Otherwise were the candidates have been evenly matched what states and what counties voted what way appears quite predictable