How do you rank or compare the other popular cRPGS?

[Verde]

I've gone through the gauntlet of Pillars 2, Tyranny, and now Torment: ToN, and I wanted to offer brief thoughts on each.  Keep in mind this is my subjective opinion, however I do believe they are some objective thoughts in here (such as Torment's combat compared to the others).

- Overall I feel like Pillars 2 and Tyranny are more enjoyable than Torment, because Torment is really a visual novel with much worse combat. If you like reading you may enjoy Torment more, but be warned - it is REALLY weird. Like take the Forgotten Sanctum DLC and make it weirder, and make that the whole game.

- Tyranny was ingenious in the way they handled action and consequence. I thought they integrated it seamlessly within the game - it never felt "gamey" to me.  I think the replayability is an illusion though - it's worth trying out different decisions, but the game is quite linear. I think PoE2 actually has more replayability that any cRPG I've played, maybe close to BG2, only in that PoE2 has a top tier character building system.

- Pillars 2 has the best graphics and combat by a mile for me. Clean and weighty. However, as we all know, the main story is rubbish and the factions are all morons. However I applaud Obs for adding the book of Woedica, which provided SOME explanation for God's childish behavior. I think the biggest disappointment I had with Pillars since Day 1 were the bugs, some deeply rooted in core mechanics and quests.

- Torment is...just an odd game. I like a lot of the ideas, but I don't see how anyone can play a combat-focused character. It's not just that the combat is slow - you only get a tiny amount of actions each round - the character abilities and equipment are just terrible. How many years in the future? +2000? And we are still using bladed weapons and wooden shields? And bullet-weapons that can barely hit? I feel like they missed the mark tremendously on anything related to equipment and combat. The abilities are just not varied, exciting, or powerful. A hook? 2000 years in the future and a grappling hook is an ability?Heck you can't even switch you companions gear (minus weapons).

So to sum up my ramblings -

PoE2 and Tyranny are both very quality cRPGs, two of my favorite, whose strengths are almost opposites. I'll give both 9/10. If PoE2 had less bugs, and more believable factions tying into the main story, I'd give a 9.5. If Tyranny had better combat with less difficulty spikes, with more opportunities to solve conflicts peacefully, I'd give it 9.5.

Torment is not worth the price tag of $50...it really should be $20 in my opinion. A weird, questionable romp through an alternative universe with rich lore, but complete falls on itermization and combat (which yes, you are forced into several times throughout the game) with little to no replayability. The game feels like it forces you into an Intelligent Nano to avoid the combat and exploit the power of the Intelligence stat in conversations. I'll give it 7/10.

Edited June 26, 2019 by Verde

[daven]

Out of the ones you have mentioned, I prefer Deadfire. Primarily because of the gameplay.

However, out of all the modern iso CRPG's I think Shadowrun Dragonfall might be my favourite. Or at least I enjoyed it the most, and felt quite engrossed in the story and that. I'm not a huge fan of the battle system though.

I played D:OS 2 for about 15 minutes when it came out and haven't tried it since. Serpent in the Staglands is quite interesting. Oh yeah, Pathfinder Kingmaker has been pretty decent. Now my PC is finally repaired after months I can carry on with some of these bloody games.

 

I almost went on a rant about giving things a score out of ten but I wont bother.

Edited June 26, 2019 by daven

[xzar_monty]

For me the big question is whether I will end up preferring Pathfinder: Kingmaker or Deadfire. I have played most of Deadfire now but rather little of P:K so it's far too early to say. I think both are definitely good games.

 

Some of the writing in P:K is extremely cheesy, and some of the design is punishingly harsh, but I'm fine with that. There is far more narrative and literary ambition in Deadfire, which I very much prefer, but the game also seems to be almost filled with unrealized potential, which is a disappointment in a sense.

[bringingyouthefuture]

I am going to give P:K a run where I don't reload any and all DC rolls ... just to really get into the punishment, I will be honest have never tried that before with any CRPG so will be interesting to say the least.  Almost finished with my first full playthrough of Deadfire including all DLCs.  After all is said and done it definitely deserves the 9/10 ranking most people gave it :) - I put about that same hours into P:K, DOS2, POE1, DOS1, and Tyranny - all are worth playing and enjoyable.  Deadfire is my favorite though.

[Elric Galad]

T:ToN is a category by itself.

I played it, I'll remember it, I didn't regret buying it but I won't play it again and I would have troubles giving it a grade. It was really a one-time experience, unique enough to worth it.

There were so many mistakes made with this game. The 2 main battles were some of the most horrible experiences in my Gaming Life, and the simultanneous console port was beyond idiotic (=>lamest interface ever). So many time, money and hopes wasted with this game...

The old Planescape had kind of "good" combat. It wasn't very interesting but it was nice changes of pace with AWESOME MUSIC and it made you feel powerful thanks to all the experience you gathered from dialogues. 

[ShadySands]

I feel like I'm forgetting something but here is my ranked list

1. SR:DF/HK
2. Yoga Fire
3. P:K
4. Tyranny
5. WL2
6. POE1
7. T:ToN
8. SR:R
9. D:OS1
10. D:OS2

Edited June 30, 2019 by ShadySands

[daven]

3 minutes ago, ShadySands said:

I feel like I'm forgetting something but here is my ranked list

1. SR:DF/HK
2. Yoga Fire
3. P:K
4. Tyranny
5. WL2
6. POE1
7. T:ToN
8. D:OS1
9. D:OS2

I really need to play Shadowrun Hong Kong at some point, as good as Dragonfall?

[ShadySands]

It's not as great storywise but I liked the additions to combat and gearing

It also changes decking to real time until combat starts and I've heard of a lot of people hating that change

Edited June 26, 2019 by ShadySands
and another thing

[Gromnir]

52 minutes ago, Elric Galad said:

 

The old Planescape had kind of "good" combat. 

...

am kinda old, but isn't it customary nowadays to use an emoji or "rofl" or similar to denote sarcasm?

HA! Good Fun!

Edited June 26, 2019 by Gromnir
changed traditional to customary... sounded too old the first ways

[the_dog_days]

My highly biased list of games I liked the most among the recent crpg revival:

1) Pillars of Eternity

2) Battle Brothers

3) The Bard's Tale Trilogy (a remake of the first three Bard's Tale games)

4) Divinity Original Sin 2

5) Shadowrun Dragonfall

6) Pillars of Eternity 2

7) Shadowrun Hong Kong

Pathfinder Kingmaker

9) Tyranny

10) Underrail

11) Divinity Original Sin

12) Wasteland 2

13) Shadowrun Returns

15) Druidstone (haven't finished; been way too busy with work)

16) Serpent in the Staglands

17) The Age of Decadence

18) Low Magic Age (still in development but shows a lot of potential)

19) Torment Tides of Numenera (the only game on this list I didn't care for)

[bugarup]

I keep hearing from quite a few trustworthy sources that Shadowrun Hong Kong is good, but I have a Witcher problem with it -- I want to do it chronologically, and the first Shadowrun is kind of boring so I keep restarting and stalling over and over. 

(Took a look at my GOG account to do that ranking thing, felt guilty about abysmal quantity of games unplayed while I do the umpteenth replay of New Vegas, Bloodlines or KOTOR2)

[daven]

33 minutes ago, bugarup said:

I keep hearing from quite a few trustworthy sources that Shadowrun Hong Kong is good, but I have a Witcher problem with it -- I want to do it chronologically, and the first Shadowrun is kind of boring so I keep restarting and stalling over and over. 

(Took a look at my GOG account to do that ranking thing, felt guilty about abysmal quantity of games unplayed while I do the umpteenth replay of New Vegas, Bloodlines or KOTOR2)

The Shadowrun games are completely stand alone. Well, Shadowrun Returns and Dragonfall were. 

Yeah I know what you mean, I have more unplayed games in my library than played. Need to just sit my arse down and get on with it.

[xzar_monty]

I found it hilarious that I hadn't even heard of over half the games in that list that was 19 titles long.

[daven]

32 minutes ago, xzar_monty said:

I found it hilarious that I hadn't even heard of over half the games in that list that was 19 titles long.

Only haven't heard of Low Magic Age, and having checked it out looks quite interesting. I like the look of the art style, I miss old sprites like that.

[Verde]

I really couldn't get into DOS2, because of the quirky humor, weird questing, and camera. I may give it another try though. I appreciate the level of detail.

[Boeroer]

Druidstone ist cool - but I wouldn't compare it with games like PoE or Pathfinder. It emphasizes a lot more on the (turn based) combat and its mechanics. Doing mission after mission. The role playing and writing are rudimentary. There is no exploration or anything. The former two titles of the devoloper (Legend of Grimrock I and II) are more RPGish. But dungeon crawlers.

It doesn't need all that, it's a good game. But I wouldn't put it into a CRPG list. 

 

 

Edited June 27, 2019 by Boeroer
Stupid typo

[Myrtillo]

If the total hours played and number of playthroughs is the primary indicator, then for me the number one is NWN2, closely followed by Deadfire.

I played and loved a lot of the others cRPG mentionned here  (Dragonfall being a highlight), I think that what makes the difference for me is the voice acting of companions. I always get more attached to the party than to my own character.
 

 

[daven]

I found the companions in Dragonfall to be some of the best in any CRPG, I like that they get pissed off at the player sometimes and take a while to warm up to you. I agree some voice acting may have made them even better, depends on the quality of the VO work. 

[bringingyouthefuture]

I'm considering buying the whole Shadowrun series for $18 right now ... is combat more like Wasteland? I couldn't get into Wasteland, but for that cheap I should just do it.

[daven]

6 minutes ago, bringingyouthefuture said:

I'm considering buying the whole Shadowrun series for $18 right now ... is combat more like Wasteland? I couldn't get into Wasteland, but for that cheap I should just do it.

Haven't played wasteland but... it's turn based. I found it okay, i didn't love it but the story and music pushed me forward. Returns is mediocre, Dragonfall is really good. So start with Dragonfall i'd say.

[Myrtillo]

1 hour ago, bringingyouthefuture said:

I'm considering buying the whole Shadowrun series for $18 right now ... is combat more like Wasteland? I couldn't get into Wasteland, but for that cheap I should just do it.

Combat is comparable to X-COM, square grid, cover mechanics and move/act action points.

It is enjoyable enough but not the highlight of the game.

[xzar_monty]

22 hours ago, daven said:

Only haven't heard of Low Magic Age, and having checked it out looks quite interesting. I like the look of the art style, I miss old sprites like that.

I follow computer games so inconsistently that I probably miss a lot. Although it has to be said that I don't feel like I'm ever missing anything: the little time I have for playing can be spent playing good games (like Deadfire and P:K within the past year). Entire years may go by without playing anything, so if there was something really good between, say, BG2 and PoE, I probably missed it. (I did check NWN but that doesn't count as good in my book.)

[Boeroer]

I thought so too. At first. But then I liked it a lot. Especially the expansions.

[xzar_monty]

The two main -- and insurmountable -- problems are the graphics that become overly repetitive in about two minutes, and the lack of any sense of there being a party of adventurers. (I don't mean that every RPG should have a party of adventurers, it's just that NWN's henchman-type solution doesn't work for me.)

[Verde]

Lots of other great suggestions in here.

x - you will have to let us know about Pathfinder.