NOK222

I've wondered if Kickstarter will end up teaching a renewed appreciation of publishers ... No

Bears Specifically bear cavalry.

A dark elf pimp

Gambling dens, brothels, opium dens and such.

Remember how all the choices you made in the ME trilogy affected the ending?

This is true, there are also no infantry-women, at least in the U.S.

I recommend Orange Tea

Enslavement of prostitutes, mentions of rape in Ceaser's Legion camp, the fiend warlord whose named "the cook" who rapes people then fries them with his flamethrower. Skyrim, a daedric prince called "the prince of rape", who created vampires and a ritual involves offering yourself to him in order to become a vampire. Do people plant their hands over their ears and go "LALALALLALA" over this? Because apparently sexual assault doesn't exist in video games.

This, in a ****ing nutshell. Nobody is making a case against sexyness of fan service, but dear god the justifications some of you are putting in for boob armor and chainmail bikinis is infantile and ridiculous.

Hold your horses white knight, and leave the petty insults to BSN. First off Don Quixote, I meant threathened not the actual action. Maybe the...no, actually I'm not going to say anything else since this makes people go ****ing crazy Thanks for coming back and clarifying. While I still dislike even the idea of being threatened with it (you likely would to, had you suffered from it), it does lower my hackles having you explain yourself more. I also wasn't meaning to be insulting, just that - if you meant the phrase the way I took it to mean - I was honestly worried about your interests. I know the response you quoted got your hackles raised as much as your first one got mine, but I want to re-iterate my appreciation for your clarification here. I mean it: thanks. Being sensitive to issues is admirable and a virtue. But a bunch of roving mercenaries threatening to just take your stuff and kill you is silly. As someone explained earlier with the glorification of murder and violence, real issues, but are tossed around and even joked about. I'm not saying turn this world into a dark crapfest filled with murder AND rape, but the kiddification in our media to these issues is silly.

Hold your horses white knight, and leave the petty insults to BSN. First off Don Quixote, I meant threathened not the actual action. Maybe the...no, actually I'm not going to say anything else since this makes people go ****ing crazy

No. Let's not go there. No matter the execution, this would cause a ****storm of epic proportions. Right, I forgot about the Tomb Raider fiasco.

I would like to see some of the darker aspects of this in the game. People threatening you with...certain actions if playing a female.

I follow the practical choices

Armor makers in the past could be silly too. I like this pic, she needs to get her sword though

Which means that the -10 intelligence thing on Oblivion was not intentional or a jab at black people saying "lol ur stupid but strong" Bethesda isn't a perfect company, and I criticize them a lot, but they're not racist. But I do wanna see variations of humans, many many human ethnic backgrounds. "Sub-races" I think is a bit too..strong a word for a human.

Well, except for the fact that none of these portraits are from Baldurs Gate. But on a serious note, I thought the whole discussion about "maturity" and "realism" would have ceased shortly after we were shown the Planescape Torment pics. Which, by themselves, manage to prove two things: 1) That you can have Revealing/Boob armor in a game, and that game can still maintain all of its maturity. 2) That Realism becomes quite the red herring in a game who's setting is so deliberately non-realistic in the first place. Personally, I see this issue as much ado about nothing. We're not dealing with Bioware. We're not talking about a company who's got a history of trying to use sex appeal to sell their games to hormonally charged teenage boys. We're dealing with Obsidian, a company that has always done their games in good taste. People here are grossly over-reacting. Dude except I have little issue with leather armor or mage robes, as long as it's not too insane. Did you see my earlier posts about rangers and rouges? My issue is on the practical of plate or mail armor on women. I make a case for no "boob-plate", no unnecessary things that make the armor unrealistic, and no chain mail bikinis. I said fan service, sexyness and hot scenes are fine at it's moments. Those moments aren't on the front lines of party battle with cleavage armor and mail skirt and panties. Once again on the cod pieces, that particular historic fact has been ignored by developers for years, there's no need to bring this here just to try to make a point on double standards.

This is also 100% Historically Accurate and Realistic - for the people that seem so concerned about that. These attempts at compromise would make sense if it wasn't for the fact that this particular male fan service has barely appeared in fiction alongside the female fan service, boob armor and chain mail bikinis. So this cod piece argument falls apart.

I agree - totally like hot women to look hot. I think they want to give the game a more serious tone but hopefully we get some mages in slinky dresses or something So, I went through my Baldur's Gate portraits folder and pulled out some examples of "boob armor." Don't see anything wrong with any of these. First one is tactically a liability, since the other three are mages, I don't particularly care. The third pic is a bit over the top though

Oh Geez what I have done, I think I did bring BSN back here. None of those two armours are correct at all, nice try. As for the old Black isle games, I'm sure the good devs here are aware of their old style and what not to repeat. I'm not going to call it mistakes, but ten years later it's different and there needs to be a different representation of realistic females in all types of media. Video games included. Also none of those girls are wearing the armor I'm making an issue about, I'm taking about plate and chain mail. What do you guys thing mages and rogues should style themselves? To me it seems ok for rouges to show some skin, it could be their style, a rouge is not an honorable or easy life. Seduction could play here. A "ranger" kind of chick can wear light leather armor. Mages can go anywhere really. The concept pic of the female elf is fine.

I agree which is why I didn't comment on rogues or mages, but to armor wearing soldier women.

As a historian also, I can say probably not, first off women combatants wearing medieval armor (the one we are taking into account here) was rare to begin with. Even the Order of the Hatchet, an actual order of women knights, masqueraded as Men. The point of being, knights or warriors were to be like men, not women. Joan of Arc wore men clothes. Going to Japan, there were women samurai or "Onna Bugeisha", if they were ever in battle, I'm pretty they were dressed to survive not to make attract male gaze. I can't ever say for certainty that there was ever such armor for the woman body in history, but it if did exist, it was rare and probably unsuccessful. Except I'm a guy addressing a serious issue and not a fangirl who also wants male fanservice (which is BSN)

There's nothing wrong with creating attractive pretty characters, there's nothing wrong with showing deep meaningful sex scenes between two people. Hell, there's nothing really wrong with fan service. But when writing sci-fi, high fantasy, steampunk, or other genres of the such. When presenting females in combat, practicality over looks matter. Marine Women in real life Fictional "Future Marine" Was the boob armor necessary there? No, it really wasn't. I'm not saying there's anything inherently wrong with the showing the female form. Even real life dress uniforms, which is supposed to show off the attractiveness of both sexes, don't tighten it around the chest area for women in such a ridiculous manner, much less combat uniforms. Trust me, I'm an actual veteran. I'm glad you changed the boob armor, you guys might actually be the first to do such a thing, and not try to objectify the female form in such a ridiculous and unpractical manner. Sexiness is fine when the situation calls for it, not when wearing full body armor in combat. I'm off course taking into account armor wearing classes as I don't know how I feel about casters or roguish/thieves yet.

Exactly, he just said that there are stone-age elves, although they might not be like that by the game's start.

A Faction of Brothel Maiden/Masters, do it Obsidian.