Vargr

In PE you gain companions with fully fleshed-out backstories and personalities, who will banter and be responsive to your actions. PE will be more like BG, not IWD. The Adventurer's Hall is OPTIONAL, in case you don't like some (or all) of the NPC's, or whatever else your reason might be.

That's a preference I'd have as well. As long as the world reacts to you as a Barbarian or whatever. What's the point in having different classes/titles if no NPC's recognize it? I hope we get that in PE. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Crom the Barbarinator approaches the City Gates, and the guard eyes his furs and rugged appearance with a smirk. "Ho, what have we got here? Looks like one of them savages from the mountains. What brings you to the civilized world? Looking for a woman? Heh-heh, tired of shagging goa-..." *Crom the Barbarinator splits the guard's skull with his axe and has to escape from a large group of Guardsmen who witnessed the deed* --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Honestly, I think we'll get this martial arts monk no matter what. Give him weapons, and he more or less just becomes another fighter. Make him a more european-type monk, and he's too similar to Priest. Honestly hope Obsidian have some nice twist to it, and good lore. I'll probably not recruit this NPC. If there's no other NPC to fill the gap, that's what the Adventurer's Hall is for, I guess.

Not so bothered about "Bare fists vs. Armor". Hell, you can still use your bare hands to mess up joints etc underneath the armor or whatever. Take the Heruli. They ran into battle naked, and in the first battle, they were not even allowed a shield. Only if they survived their first battle (obviously) were they allowed to carry a shield into subsequent ones. No, my problem is with the "Bare fists vs. longer reach weapons" An unarmed man in a battle situation against one or several other opponents with any kind of weapon that give longer reach, armored or otherwise, is at a *severe* disadvantage. If they have spears or such, there's no way he'd come out of it on top. It's just too fantastical for me to be able to accept. Give him a weapon of some sort, and I'd be grudgingly ok with him, at least. Don't care so much about whether he wears armor or not.

Actually, I think it sounds interesting with a morale system. Be a good leader and keep your companions happy = they perform better in battle and will eventually stand by you no matter the odds. Be a bad leader and they'll think "F**k that jerk, I'm not dying for him!" at the first sign of a battle going the wrong way. Optionally, it could be part of Expert mode.

Agree with this. Especially when moving one slider moves another, and no matter what you do your character is wearing an expression as if he's about to start bawling like a baby at any moment. Obviously, some games do it better than others.

What? What? What is this thread? What? You're assuming a lot of x means less y, when this is obviously not the case. Those things aren't mutually exclusive and it opens story possibilities into itself. In the other thread someone mentioned story/game mechanics that could tie into them to give the player more freedom. What is not to understand? If the dev doesn't know what appearance/race/gender you choose he can't use it in the dialogues. Hmm they can make different conversations trigger based on what race/gender/whatever you picked. It all doesn't have to be set in stone for it to be reflected in dialogue.

Seconded. Especially if there's a companion of Quara-level of annoyance. If it's a companion with a class I'd like to have in my party, but the companion itself is annoying as all hell, I definitely welcome the ability to leave them broken and bloodied in a ditch somewhere and go and recruit a custom made follower of the same class.

I'd pay for a Chris Avellone Hardcover novella add-on.

Hmm... I hope that whatever they come up with for their quirky, "odd" races/species, it's fairly down-to-earth. I think in a fantasy world where you see too much weird stuff, it just becomes too much. Torment got away with it due to the setting, I might add. But in this semi-historical world they seem to be creating with PE, if I commonly see lizard people or insectoids or minotaurs running about like it was normal, I'd be disappointed. I'd honestly like what "fantastical" races/species there are already (elves/dwarves) to be just that - fantastical. I really dislike when elves and dwarves are just treated as normal humans with pointy ears or short, stocky build and a strange urge to dig holes. Give them more character and uniqueness! Make them fairly uncommon, so whenever you come across an elf or a dwarf, you pause and think "Wait... is that... Could it be...? Here..? Is he/she alone...? Is there a settlement/colony/secret entrance somewhere nearby...? Maybe it has something unusual I could trade from it...?" Something like that, I dunno. As for the unannounced races/species, I'd definitely not want minotaurs or anything like that. Make them human-like, but with something.... off about them. Something hard to define, but makes them obviously not human when you look at them. I know, it's pretty vague. But that's how I'd prefer it, personally

Even without the 2.6m stretchgoal, there's no *need* to take on NPC companions. You can leave them out and play the game solo if you wish, it's been stated, I believe. If you want to play through with companions to banter with and provide story feedback etc, you can. With the 2.6m goal, if you want to have custom followers, you can. Just a simple case of "If you don't like it, don't use it." (I never like it when people use that term in response to anything I say, but it's true in this case.) I probably won't use it myself, at least not for the first playthrough. All a matter of preference.

Nowhere near the frustration I had with Quara of NWN2... By Oden's Private Parts, THAT was one brat I just couldn't stand! I kept wishing for a way to beat her to a bloody pulp the first time you run into her. But uh... yeah, OT, sure, I'm all for an extremely rare opportunity to hug an NPC you care for. As long as you can make the choice yourself, of course.

An obese hero would just be hilariously awesome. "Right! Onwards, to glory and riches, and to Deliver this World from Evil!" "...... right after I finish this meal. And dessert." ".... and someone brings me a Breastplate-stretcher..." (Or is that chestplate....? I forget....)

Bit late to this party, but... I'm also one of those who have some issues with the Monk. Mainly the bare-hands thing, in a world where almost everyone wears some type of armor along with usually a fairly long piece of sharp metal, which is designed to mess human bodies up. Even more so if there's no armor in the way. Fair enough, in PE their fists will be Soulpower Enhanced, but still... I think I could grudgingly tolerate a Monk if they redesigned it to be more unique. The whole Shaolin/Bruce Lee angle always felt out of place. Even the suggestions others here have about making them european Warrior Monks doesn't sit right with me. Sounds too much like the Priest class. If they *absolutely* must have this class in, at least do away with the overly asian design. And give him a staff or spear, at the very least. *Shrugs and grumbles about these "damned Monks"....*

For an isometric game like this I don't think sliders for every feature of the face is needed. As long as we can pick between faces, change skincolor, eyecolor (might not be needed, depending on how far you can zoom in), hairstyle/color and facial hair/color, along with maybe some other options for flavour, (tattoos, scarring, maybe earrings), and maybe adjust body type, I'd be happy enough. As a matter of fact, the body type would be the only feature I'd like sliders for. 3 of them. Height, Fat and Muscle. (So yeah, what the others' said )

This stuff is definitely things Obsidian should consider thoroughly, and if nothing else, implement in the Expert mode. Like what some say about saving/loading anywhere. Yeah, I always thought that takes away from the tension and feeling of reward as well. TrashMan suggested saving at camp locations etc only, and I could live with that. The "Save & Quit" option could generate a savegame that is deleted when you load it again. You know, if you need to run out all of a sudden, or get a sudden urge to do the dishes because you realize your wife/girlfriend will be in shortly and asked you to do it this morning...

I'll add my voice to this. Loved the art in IWD I+II far more than BG I+II.

As long as the campsite isn't identical no matter where on the worldmap you make camp. That always bugged the hell outta me in DA:O. If anyone ever played SWG, THAT game had a nice camp system, in my opinion. When you were out hunting or whatever, camp was the only place you could heal wounds and buff up, etc. Camping actually had a use. And it was cool. My character always being invested in the Scout profession, would set up a camp big enough to accomodate the party, and it was especially nice at night time, with torches illuminating the camp. And the smoke could be seen from a fair distance too, so if you were NOT a scout and needed healing or whatever, seeing the smoke from a distant campsite could be a nice surprise. Uhh... what were we talking about? So, uh, yeah. More to do in camp = Good.

Definitely like this. Camping has been a missed opportunity most of the time in games. Ugh... sincerely hope we get NOTHING like the Rest mechanic in NWN and NWN2. Far too spammable, and removes much of the tactical thinking.

It was handy in.. uh... was it called hardcore mode? You definitely were better off if you crafted ammunition. And the survival skill allowed you to craft things to purify water, or extract it from various plants, among other things. Not perfect by any means, but I enjoyed it well enough. Plus, of course you could craft/modify equipment.

Isn't that somewhat similar to how it worked in FO:NV? Been a while since I played it, so can't be sure. To me, a refinement of NV's crafting would do the job well enough.

Berserker not a subclass to fighter? It was a fighter kit in BG2, as far as I can recall. A berserker, in my own very personal opinion, is a fighter with a twist. A fighter with some, I'd say, shamanistic powers. As for the Paladin... I'd rather not see Paladins in PE. At least not by that name. Call them something else, unique to the Eternity world, if they must be in. I'd say priests, no matter what, are not primarily trained to fight with weapons. I'd say they take the role of a medium more, channeling the divine powers through their body to heal, or banish demons or whatever, whereas Paladins are imbued with the Holy power to strengthen their martial abilities against the evil powers. I dunno, something like that. Paladins being the soldiers of their faith. Or something... Regardless, this thread isn't so much about what subclasses to include, but rather about the system I'm suggesting. The system would work for some subclasses, but others might be a bit of a stretch, and would probably be better off with their own main class. The whole point would be that you'd gain these extra abilities and restrictions, and NPC's and the world would recognize it and comment on it, where applicable. Think of it as the kits from BG2, only woven through the world and narrative instead. Or a bit like the guilds from TES.

Yes, right, so... They keep wanting to add more classes, and that makes me wonder how the subclasses will work, and how much of a difference playing a subclass will make as opposed to playing the vanilla class. If we take the Fighter as an example; They want to add Barbarians as a stretchgoal. Now, how different will a barbarian actually play compared to a fighter? I'm sure they will add some nice twists to it to differentiate it, but I think a better option would be to make barbarians a subclass of the Fighter. And while on that point, rename it to Berserker, because that is essentially what they are. Barbarian to me is a cultural background. Not all barbarians would be fighters. There could be Barbarian Hunters/Rangers, Barbarian Druids/Shaman, Barbarian Rogues.... and Barbarian Warriors. Most likely not Wizards though. And possibly not Priests. So add *Barbarian* as a cultural background/subrace instead, which I was under the impression we'd get to pick. A pc with the Barbarian background could gain bonuses to some physical attributes, due to their ruggedness, and a bonus to Wilderness Lore, if that is in, while recieving penalties to maybe intelligence, charisma and speechcraft, or something. Much like how Arcanum handled it, in fact. Right, enough about that! Seems a lot of people want Paladins as well. But when you get down to it, they are merely fighters (which are in the game) with a strict moral code (which can be RP'ed) and holy abilities acquired through their faith. Now, on to my idea for how subclasses could work. Take the Paladin for an example. Say you start out creating a normal fighter. Through your travels, you come across a Holy Warrior (Paladin) whom you engage in conversation with. You become interested in his order, and ask how you might join. He directs you to their closest Temple/Church/Chapel, or wherever it is Holy Warriors (Paladins) hang out, and you thank him and head off to pay it a visit. When you arrive, you inquire about joining, and after some preaching and whatnot are to undergo initiation. Upon completion, you join their ranks as a bottom-rank Holy Warrior (Paladin), and recieve a few new special abilities tied to this, along with restrictions (to balance things out a bit). You have to follow the teachings and the Code, and in doing so, gain more favour from the God of your faith. You may rise through the ranks, and as you keep cementing your dedication, your God grant you additional abilities and enhance old ones. Of course, mess up, and you lose favor along with abilities. Should you "fall" or simply choose to leave the Order, you lose all abilities and revert to being a normal fighter again. Free to steal, threaten, bully and intimidate as much as you want again. This way, you would be free to switch careers with your Fighter, or just stay vanilla, if you wish. Not really sure what other "subclasses" would work with a system like this... Berserkers, maybe. To become one, you'd have to find and bond with an animal spirit (with the guidance of a mentor). Then have to sort of... increase the strength of the bond, by making the spirit "happy", for lack of a better word. The spirit might be uneasy in towns, cities, and you might lose favour with it the longer you stay around these areas, whereas being in the wild, hunting and killing things pleases it. A stronger bond makes it easier to drawn forth the spirit and enter the Berserker rage, and maybe increase the duration while reducing the fatigue that comes after. Displease it enough, and maybe it will wrest control from you and lash out at everything around, including allies, or simply leave, robbing you of your Berserker abilities. Just trying to convey my thoughts how the system could work, here... Of course, there would be subclasses for the other classes as well, not just Fighters, I hope you understand I might also add that with this system, abilities gained from your subclass would grow in strength independently from your main class. So, RP your subclass, and you are rewarded. I realize this is very different from how subclasses/kits worked in the IE games. Just think this system could be very rewarding and flexible. Not sure what class you want to play, just that it's some kind of fighter? You get to play the world and see what subclass might interest you, or switch if you want. Of course, to play a subclass from start, if you know what you want to play and really feel like an established adventurer, you should be able to pick subclass at character creation. Just start the subclass at lowest rank. You can still switch if you want to change later, with this system. Sorry for a slightly chaotic post. Hope it's somewhat coherent. Really want to hear your thoughts!

Ho there! I'm Vargr, Cursed and Slightly Mad Berserker of The Obsidian Order.