Llyranor

Like I said, amnesia applies SPECIFICALLY to PST's story. Applying that as a general rule is just meh.

Only if you want to make the assumption that mysterious past = better storytelling. I just find it a poor crutch. If devs can't tell a good story without involving the PC's past, they're pretty bad storytellers.

Key here is a Bhaal spawn. On it's own it's a story hook not a character. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Irrelevant. Amnesia was a requirement for PST's story BECAUSE the story was centered around it, not because proper interactive storytelling can't occur without it. Besides, backstory != personality. BG1 had an enjoyable plot (BG2 is another story, but bleh), but the storytelling was completely abysmal. Uncovering the whole plot behind a iron shortage would have set the stage for some very nice storytelling, had it actually been done right. The interactivity comes in how you would uncover said plot, or how you would make meaningful choices therein, not in how pretty your dress is. It's perfectly viable to have a story in which you pull off proper choices and consequences without having the story focus on you. In any case, force a single avatar choice on the player and BG1 would have pretty much been the same story as a whole. Beyond that, it's just superficiality. In the same way, you could have easily made TNO female with a few adjustments in the story (mostly Deiodude and Ravie). The story was probably used as an excuse, but it just sounds like lazy design. BG1 was a disappointment simply on account of bad storytelling, not because you weren't an amnesiac.

Well, it's better than 'I hate men, I don't want to play a scarred man. I want to be empress of the world and have drow slaves and munchkin levels lol'.

At SP: What are you talking about? Just because you're a freaking Bhaalspawn doesn't mean you can't have consequential choices within that context.

Why is amnesia a requirement? I could care less if a background is imposed on me. That's not the point. The background in and of itself is just part of the story. The player's involvement comes in during the CURRENT unfolding of events. This is why roleplaying for its own sake has zero appeal to me in CRPGs. It's futile and ultimately limited ANYWAY when you just bring up PnP. It's all about the storytelling context.

I dunno, aren't all CRPGs pretty much pathetic when it comes to roleplaying, only to varying degrees? I think one advantage JRPGs might have is 'better' storytelling. I used to be quite the JRPG fan, but I find them inconsequential nowadays, given that the genre is filled with many archaic conventions that get in the bloody way of storytelling. I'd take a good anime series over a JRPG any day. The draw of CRPGs - to me at least - comes in the form of interactive storytelling, and with roleplaying within that context (as opposed to roleplaying for its own sake, in which case there is no bloody way it can ever even remotely compete with PnP, and any attempt to do so just ends up in disappointment for me - though, I guess some people like it, though I wonder why they wouldn't rather just go PnP in the first place). Of course, some people bring up the argument of 'If I wanted a story, I'd rather read a book/watch a movie' (which is exactly what I'm doing vis-a-via JRPGs, anyway, but that comparison applies because I don't see JRPGs adding anything to storytelling that anime doesn't already, unless you count arbitrary segmentation of the story to introduce gameplay, resulting in some awkward compromise). It's a fair argument, especially in the current state of the industry. Most CRPGs as of now have both poor storytelling AND roleplaying. So, why bother? The advantage of the gaming medium lies in its interactivity. The advantage over PnP lies in its highly structured format comparatively (an analogy from the uninteractive spectrum would be a novel vs watching an improvised play). I don't want to be a passive observer in the story. I also don't want the story to lack proper structuring or to require a group of people in order to progress. In that sense, the gaming medium in many ways can offer the ultimate form of storytelling. In interactivity, you can project more involvement to the player/reader. 'Immersion', if you will. Yet, by its very structured format, the writer/designer can convey his/her vision to the player, much in the way of the novelist, as opposed to the dungeon master/improvisiont. Of course, PnP has its own structure as well, but with it always comes more opportunities for divergence and freedom (which is a good thing, though that may depend on your point of view). For those reasons, I see the gaming medium as - eventually - a step up from the novel. PST in many ways was a small hint at the future for me. It provided good structure as to convey its story to me, and yet allowed interactivity so as to allow further identification with TNO - in ways a novel wouldn't have been able to. Of course, it has many flaws, but it also did many things right. For the most part, though, I refer to the gaming medium in a hypothetical way, because - as it is now - the commercialization of the industry is really hurting its potential for greater storytelling. Then there's the discrimination against games, lack of talent, etc. As the next generation grows up, we may yet have our own unique brand of storytellers - some of whom might hopefully not see the novel as the only way to express themselves.

What the freak?

Walsingham sure showed us

Oh, man. You just got told, dawg.

I might have missed this title earlier: Interview about the Madden game: http://revolution.ign.com/articles/703/703727p1.html Monkey Ball interview: http://revolution.ign.com/articles/703/703834p1.html

No, he'd probably hate it. Many of the same flaws still apply.

80 endings!!!1!1!1!!11 SO2's final battle made up for the relative crapitude of the whole game.

They should have made it 360-only.

And the choices ended up being relevant and meaningful, too!

I dunno. Wii isn't copyrighted yet. We'll see what E3 holds.

If Jefferson is made as a NWN2 module, the dev cycle will be rather quick. BIO released 2 expansions in the same year, remember? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Heh. Imagine the numbers of corners they'd have to cut to bring something the 'scope' of Jefferson to short module status. I'll take a complete product, thanks.

Here's another one I missed from a while back.

Meh, that would just replace another game that would have been in its place given the same dev cycle.

Yeah, and he just dragged Role-Player's honor into this now! There will be blood! In any case, living in the past and reminiscing old games is one thing. Living in the past and fixating over games that never got released is quite another. #1 Torn fan 4EVA

I'll frag doll *you*.

I was personally attacking Eldar because he's a jerk, but the post was meant for all the losers in this thread.

Pinnacles are meant to be shattered. You guys can live in the past if you want, but those games are all flawed no matter how you look at them. It doesn't matter how bleak the future can look, the point is that there is a future, and products will keep being made. I, for one, look forward to them. Or, I guess you could keep replaying old games again and again and whine about the good old days.

We find him inside one of the cats we just killed.

Well, actually, since the lure and corruption by wargames, I have absolutely no interest in anything remotely RTSesque anymore. TW still seems too mainstream for my tastes. The only possible exception would be China: Total War, but that's not due to being rational or anything.