Teioh_White

I liked PS:T, KotOR 2, DM, and MotB plenty well enough, so MCA's done enough right for me. Granted, the stories are a bit samey at times. Which actually makes me disapointed he didn't get the reins for PoE's story. The whole 'past life did bad stuff' thing would've fit right into his M.O. Of course, that could've been the issue, that the rest of the team thought he'd basically just go write the same story all over again.

It wasn't so much the linear nature of PoE's story (or any story, really) that bothered me, but more just the underwhelming quality of what we got. I don't know if MCA having a greater hand in matters would've helped that, but the only times the story ever got me to perk up was during Durance and Grieving Mother conversations. But as those moments had no impetus outside of those conversations, it was more of a tease, rather than anything to look back on fondly.

Well, combat can both be easy and require excessive micro. Micro's not much a pain when you're making decisions, as that's fun. It's a pain when you're just having to manually do the exact same tasks that don't require decision making each fight. An easy example is any fight in this game from 1.X, especially if you wanted to have a portion of the time fire off guns at the start, then swap to melee, then back to guns to start the next fight (or God forbid, multiple guns. That don't manually reload after combat.) Easy things that basic scripts or options could account for, and to a small degree 2.0X has reduced that micro. It can still be reduced further, without any altering of the difficulty of a fight. Basically, forcing me to mindless make a bunch of clicks does not increase the difficulty of the combat, but rather decreases the quality of it. (Not that this game is all mindless micro; it has some good fights that require active decision making. Too much of it though is mindless micro'n the same moves every fight to the point a script could do it with ease).

Yeah, that's why I give ToB a 'maybe'. So many ways to just utterly cheese the game at that point, but if I'm trying not to cheese, it was always rougher for me than SoA. The optional thing is def an issue, but I myself am fine with level scaling. I'd trade a bit of 'immersion' for the sake of better gameplay. (I'd also trade up freedom for increased linearity if it led to better gameplay, but that seems to be an incredibly unpopular opinion.) Even then, I imagine a properly designed stat system could minimize such things. Not that I have an example of anything actually pulling that off. (Sorta as you said, these games are largely only going to be finished once by most people, if even that. Not a great deal of Dev Incentive to make a super awesome balanced game that stays great through the entire process, and is replayable. Mostly because the majority of the player base will see that endgame once, if it all.) Should def give the Souls games a shot if you haven't though. I think Dark Souls 1 and 2 (essentially the 2nd and 3rd of a currently 4 game 'series') are out on PC now. Some of the best, if not -the- best, gameplay I've found. Likely not to be as enjoyable now as they were around launch, as it had a semi PvP element running throughout the PvE aspect to add an edge of tension to the gameplay, which I imagine has died down.

RPG's getting easier towards the endgame's long been an issue with the genre. Yes, to some degree, it's supposed to happen like that, as often we go from some random orphen to a demi-god. At the same time though, the foes we're fighting are supposedly harder as well. I'd like to struggle more having to go down to hell itself to kill Satan at max level, than I did back on first level fighting a pack of wolves. Often however, it's quite the opposite. I think a big issue is that while the player gets all sorts of cool toys and new tactics as we level, the mobs in most RPG's don't follow suit, and do similar things the entire game, with just better stats/ greater numbers. Of the top of my head, I can't really think of a ton of CRPGs that really get at higher levels. Throne of Baal, perhaps? The various Souls games?

Actually, Axe has a really good axe pair, Rimecutter + We Toki. Pre 2.03, it was in the running for best weapon. Large amounts of prone immunity enemies have dimmed it's star somewhat. The downside though is Rimecutter is a RNG weapon; Azzuro sells it, and who knows if you'll ever see it. And We Toki can't be bought until Act 3, so for much of the game it'd just be plain old enchanted axes. -edit- Ignoring quality of weapon, and looking instead at quantity of unique, it seems most weapon types have about 4 uniques now. 2 Unique: Club Hatchet Crossbow Arbalest Blunderbuss Arquebus 3 Unique: Dagger Mace War Hammer Morning Star Pike Pollaxe Wand Sceptor 4 Unique: Flail Rapier Stiletto Axe Sabre Sword Estoc Great Sword Quarterstaff Hunting Bow War Bow Pistol Rod 5 Unique: Spear Just looking at some raw numbers, I'd guess WM2 will throw some of the non-pistol reload weapons a new weapon each, as well as a new Hatchet and Club. Of course, just because something has more options, doesn't mean it's better off as a weapon type than one with fewer. Sword's a great example, as it has 4 Uniques, but none of them are that amazing, where War Hammer can make a really nice pair despite having one less option.

Looking forward to a Barb companion myself. I like having a Barb in the team just to handle the relentless trash the game throws at us, but also only use NPC's companions outside of 'weird' party set ups. Be nice to not have to be the Barby myself, and still get that sweet Carnage. On the downside, I imagine recruiting will be even worse than Zahua and Croc, who right now can't get till midgame at the earliest, and that requires wasting one of the few high level areas in the game. Likely this companion will be hidden even further back, making her end-game only for most of my playthroughs.

That is pretty spiffy, I'll have to give that look. No clue why it'd have +8 acc, but I've never really gone in depth into Bash mechanics, as it seemed like such an obvious DPS hit. Maybe it gets to ignore it's own shield penalty or something? Or...maybe it's +deflection bonus also equals the Bash +acc bonus? I don't know if those other things will boost the spell strike, as this game is weird and inconsistent on it's rules. The Chanter Flame Lash buffing the strike, however, is perfectly normal, as it buffs all damage already, even spells. So, if a wizard with the lash chant on throws a fireball, he gets an extra 25% on top from the flame lash. The lash alone is the main reason I consider Chanters to be pretty balanced with the rest, and what earns them spot in almost all of my teams.

Yeah, I actually tend to put stealth on my characters so I can sneak -into- a room, so not to get the idiot enemy AI stuck in a doorway. Likes me a fair fight, and all that.

It's not that out of the question, really. Barb base on 14 is 256. Could then have 20 base con, + 3 from Con belt, + 3 from resting bonus, + 2 from food, and up to +4 more for the MC, so up to a possible 32 con, or 2.1 mod. Would put a Barb way past that, at 537, and could put a few +endurance items on top if really wanted too.

Yeah, if you take the Benevolent option with the couple, you get the Ring of Deflection. Generally the choice I take. I also tend to kill the back npc's for free loot and tidy'n up the town some. The plate mail is really nice, and makes a Act 1 a lot more manageable with just Aloth, Eder, and Durance.

Yeah, it'd be a bit kooky if they did, as once a weapon proc'd a stun, it'd get +30 to proc'n another one, leading to really easy stun locks. For what' it's worth though, Ranger's Stunning Shot is a real stun, and it just needs to be on hit, so that can really fuel a team ripping through targets. Toss in Scon Mica's Roar for harder targets, and it's not tough to give the team +60 acc.

That's a fine stat spread, really, just takes a bit more micro. Barb's get 25% more health than fighter/pld, so taking a 35% hit isn't the end of the world. Especially for a player, you can later buff that up 15% by feeding Durance to the blood pit and getting Gift of the Machine. And even though the actual endurance is a bit low, Savage Defiance will let you tap into Barbs large health reserves though. This is assuming, of course, you've got 3 other guys up front with the Barb, so he's not having to take on all comers. If you want to use as him as one of your tanks, can't afford to dump all over the Con and Res so much. Savage Defiance and some Armor will be plenty to keep a barb up from 1-2 things for a bit in the fight otherwise though. As for what weapons to use, Tall Grass is always great. Reach weapons not only let you take off the Plate mail for a psedo dex boost, they also let you aim the Carnage's a bit better, to help squeeze in one more enemy. And Tall Grass with a little support from the casters will be passing around Prones easy peasy. Not as a good start as it used to be, of course, as Prone has a good deal of immunity to wade through now. Other weapons, of course, mean the Barb will want some plate mail up front, but are still good considerations. Pure damage, of course, would be Purgatory+Resolution sabres, but always seems a bit of waste to not AoE CC with a barb. Favorite weapons for that choice is the Cladhaliath + Vile Loner's Lance, giving +10 acc to all of your hits, and some stuns. Mabec's Morning star is a good compromise between the two options, having the higher damage of a 2 hander, still has stun on crits, but also always does 1 sec interrupt on everything, at the least. As for talents, pretty much the same it is for almost every class trying to do damage. For general talents, Focus, Weapon Style, Savage Attack, Sneak Attack, and Accurate carnage are the must haves. Vulnrable Attack is great early game, but you'll probably want to spec out it by Act 3-4. Last one or two are more self preference than anything. For Barb talents, most aren't that great beyond the baseline Carnage, but some are...okay. I'd go Frenzy/Savage Defiance/Bloodlust/Threatening Presence/Venegful Defeat/Eye of the Storm/Dragon Leap. Savage Defiance and Bloodlust being the only two I might consider 'key'. Level 1 has underwhelming -10 acc debuff for 20~ sec, or +0.12 mod + 20% speed for 20 sec, giving about...maybe the value of 2 free swings a fight. Neither is amazing, but I prefer Frenzy to frontline the damage a bit, and ideally any enemy in range of the Barbs yell is getting stuck under Carnage's thumb. Level 3 has the Great Savage defiance, about 175 hp or so over 18 sec, make sure to grab this. Great thing to pop once an enemy has gotten around to the Barb, and will generally keep him out with crap beating on him for it's duration. Blooded has a place in some tank builds of Barb, but not useful as a DPS, without some wonky self injury plan. (which be risk as hell with 3 con/res.) Wild Spriint has some use, but generally you won't wanna strand Barb by themselves, and it's per rest nature makes it lackluster as a defensive mechanics. Level 5 has Blood lust, 13% speed boost for 13% speed boost for 12 sec after getting two kills. Barb with it's AoE nature gets a decent number of kills, so this'll turn on a bit, but it's by no means up the majority of the time. It's competition is weak though. Brute Force lets Barb target Fort instead of Deflection....but most enemies have a higher Fort score than Deflect, and it's easier to debuff Deflect. One Stands Alone is a great Barb tank talent, but a really weak Dps one. Level 7 has Threatening Presence, -10 to Fort/Will of everything around Barb. Was great pre 2.3 to help out the Debuffers. However, sickness has a ton of things immune to it now, greatly knocking down it's value. It's only competition is Thick-Skinned, +2 DT physical attacks, great for tanks. For DPS, I'd still go with Threatening Presence, unless for lore reasons you join the Crucible Knights. Then i'd just go with it and double stack the +2 DT for aggro pulls. Level 9 isn't a great level either. Barbaric Shout gives a nice offensive debuff, but 2 per rest make it very bleh. Would've been a great per encounter. However, Vengeful Defeat isn't that great. Barb's strength lies in constant AoE; firing off a single one on death isn't super amazing. Taking anything here, even one of the older talents, will work out fine. Level 11 has two decent choices. Eye of the Storm is nice, as it'll basically make the Barb immune to engagement. Few enough enemies can overcome it on level 11, almost none can on level 14. Take it, slap some movement increase on the Barb, and never worry about your squishy dps getting swarmed again. Heart of Fury is really lame with it's 1 per rest, but it's got the same sort of pressure cooker effect of Blast+Blight, or 1.X barb retaliation. If a lot of mobs are bunched up, it'll wreck them. It gives barb some sort of trick to play in this 'tough' fights, where normally it's a drag, as it's main strength is taking out the trash. Level 13 has just once choice, Dragon Leap. It's not that amazing an ability, but it gives the Barb a tool it didn't have before, and by this choice, there isn't much else left to take. Either grab it for minor every down utility, or Heart of Fury for one big for the 'boss' fights.

Supress type effects sadly won't work on Charm, because their friend only, and anything charmed no longer counts as a friend, and can't be targeted/affected by anything with a friend only designation. Which means most things, like scrolls of protection and Pld's liberation also don't work. One thing you can do is Charm them right back, as it will put them back under your control, which is easy to do if it's they're under Charm, as it gives -25 to all defenses. Domination's a little trickier. Beyond that, there's not much defense until the later levels. 13+ Chanter's are especially useful, as unlike the level 11 priest spell, their +40 Charm defense is put up as soon as combat begins, meaning no need for annoying micro pulls to get the Priest Circle or Crown up before the charms crash. Early game can just have Chanter +10 will song and have the priest quickly cast the +15 will buff, and hope that's enough. Beyond that, Monks and Pld's can normally make the saves, so they can handle all those Spore fights. The Fampyr ones might be tougher, as they usually have lots of buddies, and they'll go after the backline with charms if they try to help out in the fight.

Well, I'm not sure if it's intended, or just a quirk of the engine, but the reason it won't work is because once they're charmed, they're not part of your team. So anything you have that works on team only will no longer affect them. And, as far as I know, there's no supress effect that works on enemies. So, unlike all the other ailments, the only way to stop charm is pro-actively, no just have the CC bounce of the Pld, then it free's the rest of the team. Similarly, any friend only buff's your team member had start working for the enemy once charmed. I've lost to Raedrc/Bounty quest before because Kana with Shod-in-Faith on got charmed and proceeded to heal all the enemies while buffing them with Flame lash.

I've never understood the dislike of Engagments myself; if anything, the system is negligible to the point it doesn't influence how I play the game at all. The biggest impact it has on my gameplay is if I'm planning on kiting a mob, I have to start kiting sooner than later. Though kiting is terrible gameplay, so it would've been nice if something had been done for it, but this ain't it. I'd barely notice if engagements weren't part of the game. As for punishment for movement, yeah, this game does heavily punish movement, but the engagement system isn't what causes it. It's more that every single thing in the game is basically a 'channel' type attack, even an auto attack. A lot of games use 'channel' to add more layers to balance, letting some attacks do more/better/different things, at the cost of having to stand still. Here, everything is standing room only. You noted that yourself, of course, it's just the engagement system's never seemed to largely been the impetus. As for this being a good/bad thing, I'm okay with it here, mostly because we're controlling 6 people. Games micro heavy enough without me having to try to constantly be moving 6 units for optimal gameplay. As for the game being rote, it sorta is. The vast majority of the fights, it's the same plan. Of course, the vast majority of combat is just trash. There's probably a link somewhere there. So much so, that I now pick party composition based on mitigating the need for me to micro in those rote encounters. At least it's not quite so awful as it was in 1.x, where repetitive micro got two of my friends to quit (the lackluster story got two more, the last one just was never going to be an IE guy). Certain strategies, of course, are so cheesy even the 'designed' fights are over powered by them, and make even those fights rote, but not much to do about those but avoid using those taciics in lieu of better design.

So...if I play well and keep my QB (caster) in the pocket (back line) and the O-line(melee's) don't let any DE/T(mobs) sack(hit) the QB, that Res will be doing literally nothing outside of Will saves, letting it basically be free points? Cuz that's how it tends to go in my games. (Will saves is legit though, Fampyr can mess Res tanking up bad....but that applies to Int as well). Seriously though, Res still has a function for backline, it's just it's generally going to give less value than any other stat due to rarely coming up, so it's a worse decision. I also pretty rarely just let a caster try to cast through hits, so the concentration isn't very useful. If a caster has come under fire, I just fix the situation, not stand there with stuff wailing on him. I'd agree if you're not really sure how to play the game, having some resolve and dropping Plate Mail on everyone and putting it on a non-PotD isn't a bad idea. I wouldn't argue it's an optimal way to play though.

For the Slaying/Lash question, I don't think there's a good answer. For lashes, it's not a big enough change to be worth worrying about. Gameplay wise, stacking Flame Lash with Chanter Lash song is the only large difference. Otherwise, it evens itself out enough to just go with what you like. The creature types are pretty decently distributed through the game with annoying mobs you can't go super wrong. I guess if forced to claim the best I'd go with Vessel or Spirit, as some of the really tough fights will involve those two, and a number of dungeons are populated largely by those. The only one I'd avoid is Beast, as those are the most tame of the monster types. And often a weapon won't allow both a Lash and a Slaying enchantment, so you don't have to worry about the enchantment. As for what stat to put into armor...that's more annoying. You can't really answer that unless you've pre-planned out what gear you want everyone to wear.

I'm really not sure if your serious. This is some deadpan stuff, if not. But we'll rehash things. What started this? Folks claimed Barbs are worse than the other martial classes. (Everyone I think agrees everything is lackluster compared to Wizzy). Folks also make claims that getting value out of on-crit weapons in PotD is not sustainable. Thesis statement here: ----Barbarians power level is in-line with the other martial classes---- Reasons and facts for why this is so followed in same post. 1.)List out what advantages have over Barbarian (fighter was initial example, which is getting irrational praise in this thread) 2.)List out what Barbarian has in exchange for those. 3.)Spell out why it's simple to get consistent crits in PotD The response to this? 1.)Request for a build (Which is incredibly asinine; beyond that doesn't have many 'builds', it doesn't argue against anything. It's attempting to punt an argument) 2.)Respond that we want to compare to Fighter and Rogue, not casters. (which I did in the initial post, but I guess not in-depth enough) 3.)Respond with extremely narrow and off target mark on a side topic (high functioning stuff, not sure if intentional, again) 4.) Respond to on-crit argument by bringing up level 3 fights in Act 1.....where there are no on-crit weapons. When the post specifically mentioned Act 3. Where'd we go next? 1.)Mention the obvious logic flaws and point missing in 2+4 2.)Go in-depth on the requested comparisons, Fighter and Rogue. Give stat values for the Barb. Assign conservative estimates for stats, and focus on damage only; standard procedure to bias against what is being proven. 3.) Come to conclusion that yes, Barbarian is very solid in what it's stated niche is: 3+mobs. Stuggles against Rogue in Rogues niche: single target. From there: 1.)Response gets weird; difficult to interpret response on 'hypo's v. 'playthroughs' as though numbers weren't giving proof to what happens in play throughs. Confusing, hence the 'Let's Play' comment attempting to make the statement have some logical worth. 2.) Mentions Barbarians start out worse, but get better later. Progess? (no) confusing comparison to Casters, which already established were stronger and said we're not comparing too. 3.) Strange response that it doesn't matter that Barbs are stronger later on, as everyone is stronger. Only logical implication I can draw claiming it does not matter how strong a class is, once it gets a certain strength it becomes a wash, all classes will reach this point, so only the relative power before this point matters? 4.)Possibly related follow up: claiming that a class being good in the larger physical timeframe of the later levels is insuffcient to make up for being worse in the shorter physical timeframe of the early levels. Where we ended? 1.)Attempt to c;arify if the arguments above, were in fact the intended arguments, as they are very.... strange arguments. 2.) Quick run down over Act 1 class strength, if that was actually the hidden argument all along. 3.) As relates to initial desired discussion of Barb v. Fighter/Rogue, Barb similar to fighter, blown away by Rogue And that's about where the discussion ended. I'm not sure where any misrepresentations took place, but that's really beside the point, which is for anyone reading this thread without fully understanding the game mechanics to come away with the idea that Barbs are somehow an inferior class to the other martial classes. As an aside on Barb, I do find it funny that of all the Cheesey stuff in the game, Barb was the one who had it all taken away. I actually used to put it up with the casters in the power level around launch. Granted, that's because it was clearly not working as intended, but what some of the casters can do makes it strange to think it was okay to intend to do that. (Referring to Carnage jolting touch scrolls, Carnage Retaliationx2+Battle-forged, and One Stands Alone +20 hilarity)

Rapier does seem more fitting than a hatchet, but I won't profess any martial knowledge that a Rapier in actual combat would make it easier to parry an attack than some other weapon. It'd also be nice, as daggers and clubs already have the 'accurate' trait. (yes yes, I know all 3 cover different damage types, but I'd prefer a bit more difference than just that). Not sure what would take hatchet's new trait would be, I guess could change dagger's damage type to pierce, and then put the old accurate trait on hatchet, but that's by far the most boring solution. (As it'd just be a slight change on what we have now).

They're really not covered at all, the questions are there because the arguments are so horribly flawed, I'm honestly not sure if that's what your proposing, or if you just worded it terrible. And it's as direct response as it can be for the argument to have it's support, but that's okay. A forums not here for folks to try to prove the other wrong. They're here to foster debate so others folks reading can gain an understanding of a subject. And that's been accomplished, and no one wanting to figure out what class to play or how they stack up with one another should think Barb is somehow less than it's fellow second class citizens.

So..you don't want to compare Barb to casters, so you hold it against them they need to stack stats to hold up to caster AoE? Sounds right to me. Every class is better with gear? No one's arguing otherwise; what I'm (as one facet) arguing (with numbers!) is that Barbarian scales better with optimization. New argument is that that doesn't matter, because everyone is good enough at 10+ to steam roll enemies; it doesn't matter if someone steam rolls more? Is that what we're going with now, despite just trying to bring up Casters? So, you entire reason for not thinking Barb is good, is because it underwhelms in Act 1? Is that essentially the argument we're going with here? I mean, if the discussion is "what classes are best in Act 1" that's a different discussion than what we're having, but lets run through that one. Barbs are weak there. So are fighters (weak all the time). Monks not that great either. Rangers rock, Rogues rock, (2.15 mod to everyone's 1.45 mod is huge in Act 1). Pld's are rock solid as well. Chanter's are extremely powerful Spectre spammers. Wizards are still amazing, Priests and Druids aren't as strong relatively. Ciphers still good, either with debuffs or trademark cheese. And that's about it for discussions on Act 1, as it's just a brief (but entertaining; my favorite portion) of the game. But at the portions of the game we spend the most time in, Barbs are just fine compared to all the non casters. That's significantly more useful to me than being good at the briefest portion of the game. And as an aside, I don't know what you mean by hypo's v playing the game; I've played close to a dozen times through on PotD. But that's useless to mention; there's no room for discussion there, so instead we talk very real numbers that make up those playthroughs, to explain to others why things work the way they do. Unless you mean you want someone to make a Let's Play, or nothing can change anyone's opinion. Which would be...well, amusing, at the least.

Well here is why: https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/82950-starting-new-game-after-patch-whats-your-favorite-group-of-companions/?p=1746632 You play with a full NPC party. There's nothing wrong with that, but when you hire Merc's to do powerbuilds, being able to take advantage of a Knockdown becomes an entirely different story. So Knockdown wasn't "bad" ... you just couldn't take full advantage of it. A lot of threads on this forum have a similar theme. When you read enough of what certain people say across multiple forums, you start to realize that their Gameplay choices are the cause of their likes/dislikes, as opposed to the game mechanics. For the sake of Analogy: Imagine a post describing how Debuffing an enemies "Slash Reduction" is completely useless, as dictated by their entire Party of Mace wielders I'm not sure I follow; knockdown is good because...you can have 6 fighters or something? I..uh..that doesn't really make it better. Or are we talking about it killing a 'play style'? If so, I guess yes, the introduction of prone immunity would damage the...fighter knock down team.

I'd actually agree Knockdown was pretty bad. Not that prone is a bad status or anything, but there is just tons of crap in every fight on PotD past Act 2. Two single target knock downs a fights barely registered value on any fight, so I wouldn't even notice if was gone. Knockdown's main benefit was it's competitor is also pretty underwhelming. Not that Fighter's didn't take a bit of a hit, and not even that's its for a different reason than prone immunity. Fighters, like really any class, could toss around nice prone on crit with weapons, but that plans taken a bit of hit against a decent number of mobs. It was another reason knockdown was a bit underwhelming, actually; knockdown would often be doing something my weapon was doing on it's own, anyways. The stun on crit still seems fine enough, I've only noticed Spores and Lurkers immune to stun.

I've pretty much settled into the same crew for my numerous play throughs; Eder- Dual wield front line, more offense focus Pallegina - Dual wield front line. more defense Sagani - Range in back, Fox up front Kana - Depends on PC; up front with SnS if ranged, back with Roar if melee G.Mother - Debuffer in back I'd likely use Zahua and Devil more (and do swap them in later), but as I save WM for last, I don't get them until terribly late in the game. I don't use Aloth, Durance, or Hirvias much anymore, just do to how much stronger the casters are.