Lancer

And isn't the d20 SRD for fantasy (spells, monsters,etc..)? I don't see how this can be used for postmodern New York: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20/article/srd35 OOoooh.. the "other" SRD. The modern SRD http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=d20/article/msrd

Except you brought in d20 into the mix which isn't a baseline system either(a whole hodge podge of third party products). It is only fair to compare 2ndEd with 3.x not with d20.

There are a whole bunch of these things.. Fantasy Grounds, OpenRPG, WebRPG, Ghost Orb, GRIP, Screenmonkey, kLoOge, and TRIS. I'ts been a while since I checked, but there are probably even more of these virtual tabletop RPGs out now. Basically, they have evolved from IRC (Internet Relay Chat) roleplaying to a virtual environment where the GM and players can move their characters around on a virtual grid complete with virtual miniatures (very useful for visualizing combat!). I've tried all that I've listed and although OpenRPG is not the prettiest graphically, it is the best one to handle other games that aren't 3.x/d20 (2ndEd, Vampire, Hero..etc).

Let's debunk this myth, shall we? -The lockpick percentages most likely will be very different(not to mention all the other skills). -Non weapon proficiencies could vary tremendously from one thief to another. -If 2ndEd Player's Option is used, a thief could have a totally different set of thieving skills from another. -In PO, A dwarf can also have a totally different set of class skills from another. - Traits/advantages/disadvantages also bestow a huge degree of variation among characters of the same class. - And of course, any house rules that a DM sees fit. -And perhaps most important, a good DM with a healthy imagination that can think "outside the box." This is self-evident, since d20 is not a singular universal ruleset ala GURPS (as you seem to imply), but represents a whole slew of modified third party rulesets (with original base in 3e) each focusing on a different genre or setting. AD&D and 3.x OTOH, were created for one genre only ---fantasy roleplaying. The Buck Rogers ruleset , with roots based on AD&D 2ndEd, would be able to handle post modern New York quite well.

You are truly in the minority here.

Return of the Jedi is the best!

The New World

Merengue and Swing all the way. Sometimes good ol' booty dancing is fun too.

Absolutely nothing!! Can you believe it!?

What the heck is wrong with the name "Altered Beast?" I think the name is quite fitting.. And , no, I don't believe seeing it on the list.

If your pockets are deep enough to get both, then get both. Otherwise, if you must pick one your safest bet is with a Desktop for the reasons that Hurlshot and I have already given.

Although I am far too poor (or cheap) to get metal miniatures, I do usually rely on some sort of physical representation of the PCs/NPCs via tokens or cardboard heroes. Having minis is very helpful in running strategic combat and keeping track of combat minutiae.. Not to mention that combat is much more fun with them. That said, minis are not meant to duplicate the characters down to the underwear they used, but are only meant to approximate general characteristics (i.e. class). Because the minis are more or less undefined, they have never replaced the players'/DM's imagination. On the contrary, they help enhance it by giving the parties involved a vivid picture of the local environment.

Nah. I was just bold enough to actually say what was on everyone's minds. Funny though. For those with a sick mind.

Geneforge 2

There is something most disturbingly phallic about this "mushroom."

A bowl of Apple Jacks.

Not everyone was uber-rich as a college student. I know I wasn't.

It depends. If inferior screen resolution isn't a problem and/or you are willing to pay several hundred extra for comparable performance than get a Laptop. I would particularly get a laptop if you plan on traveling a lot (i.e. conferences) and need to keep up with your email even on travel..etc. Otherwise, I would get a Desktop. For most undergraduate students, there is no real reason to get a laptop. The only real reason to have one in college is if you are one of those that like typing notes during class... Most schools have sizable and easily accesible computer laboratories that make lugging around a portable computer everywhere ill-advised. EDIT: As for laptops being useful for doing homework anyplace you wish, that is only true if the homeworks in your intended major are mostly of the type where you can just do on a laptop (essays, compositions..etc).. If you are a literature major I can see it possibly being of some benefit although for me I just prefer to work at home. OTOH, if you are an architecture, engineering, or physics major a laptop won't really help you here since most of their assignments are usually done by hand. Overall, I'd say for undergrad it is probably better to get a desktop. It is slightly more justifiied to go for a laptop in grad school.... Certainly when you are a professional in your field...Wait until then.

@ JEDIPHILE: BTW, from your posts it is painfully obvious you don't play 3e or d20.. What is your ruleset of choice now?

Just a slight clarification, Jediphile, although I agree with most of your anti-3e bashing arguments. . I didn't mean that 2ndEd's ACs going down is necessarily better than if they were going up like in 3e. All I am saying is that neither method amounts to rocket science (pun intended)and both ways are easy enough to learn. And I did also espouse the 3e AC conversion if one didn't like the 2ndEd one. At any rate, people talk about how much more streamlined 3e is than 2ndEd. Ok.. Fair enough. I can agree with the consensus that 3e is certainly more streamlined than 2ndEd.... What I can't agree with is that 3e's streamlined nature somehow exonerates it from its glaringly piss-poor game mechanics (AoOs, skill/class systems, onerous rule exceptions..etc) or its atrocious marketing campaign. Ironically, everything that people complained about 2ndEd is becoming true for 3e as well. At any rate. We all need to chill and relax. Like Volourn said earlier, can't we all just get along? I prefer having variety as it tends to encourage competition and evolution of the industry, IMHO. But I do agree that 3e/d20 being chosen as the "standard" RPG is a big mistake. If there was going to be an uber ruleset that ruled over everything I'd even prefer Rolemaster over 3.x/d20. Heck, I'd almost prefer the Shadowrun 1st edition ruleset over 3.x/d20

Canonically, Demogorgon is supposed to have two babboon heads... At least as is stated in various AD&D/OD&D PnP products.. (not just BG2). Unless of course things have changed in 3e..

Second one looks better and actually looks like Demogorgon. The first one looks emaciated.

As you know, Eldar, that was one of the key selling points by WotC, (aside from 3e being streamlined) that there would be a concise singular ruleset without many variants, no more kits..etc. I remember that campaign. Ironic how the reality is different from what they had first claimed. And to go a step further as well, this is related to why many 2ndEd gamers refuse to to go 3.x. Myself and other diehard 2ndEd'ers have become quite content with 2ndEd over the years and have been able to make enough rules changes that our campaigns run close enough to our own liking that we don't see any motive to change. So it was kinda like.. 3e is out.. But so what? Who would want to invest in the 5 years + of effort to get their old campaigns converted to 3e? And this deluge of alternate rules put out by WotC only further discourages potential gamers of the new system from even trying it. But as much as I love my 2ndEd + PO + House Rules campaign, and as much as 3e'ers love their new system, there are a lot of other systems that are as good if not better than both. And I am the first to admit it. Systems like FUZION (which is free, btw) or Feng Shui, are as good if not better than any edition of D&D/AD&D. Of course, the only problem is getting your players to want to switch to the new system. But that is a different issue for another day... This is what I don't like about WotC and OGL. The market is saturated with enough 3.x/d20 stuff as it is. I think OGL, in particular, inhibits creativity in the smaller game developers that otherwise would have come out with their own rulesets. Of course, 3.x/d20 is a BIG name and as such a major cash cow for these smaller companies.. But, this means that these smaller developers see less need to make their own rulesets due to the high lucrative potential of the powerful d20 license. This just kills competition and creative drive and in the long run I doubt it is good for the industry. Unless, of course, you want to see a world where the only RPGs around are d20 ones. Hades probably would.

My comments at the beginning of this thread was an attempt to get to the heart of the matter from a different approach: I was trying to find a psychological explanation based on what one grew up with that would help explain one's preference for one system or the other, rather than wholistically comparing each system's weaknesses and strengths. From people's responses, I find no real correlation. This just confounds me even more especially since nor I nor my gaming buddies found THACO (or anything in 2ndEd for that matter) notably hard to learn. It really is hard for me to believe that anyone would find 3e/3.5e easier to learn than 2ndEd. This is because in my own experience that has not been the case.. at all. My own half-rationale explanation at this point would be that people learned 2ndEd at a relatively young age.. It was probably the first RPG for many and as such was correspondingly difficult to learn. And then they ditched it for easier systems like d6, Vampire...etc. As they got older and having much more RPG experience under their belts, that made 3e (or any other new RPG they would come across) that much easier to learn. EDIT: Either that or people gave 3e more of a chance when they first learned it due to its more streamlined (not necessarily easier) nature. OTOH, in 2ndEd, once people saw THACOs counting "backwards" and negative ACs meaning good, they automatically turned themselves off to the system.. Without giving it much of a chance. Again this is all speculation on my part..

And I apologize for the misunderstanding. And although you like 3e, you are alright