Tigranes

I have no insider information, but as a general rule, these kinds of decisions are always made by the publisher as a result of pressure / requirements by legal bodies and possibly distributor concerns. Obsidian is not likely to have had any say.

Of course it is.

Thanks for the detailed report. Sadly, definitely sounds like im better off playing the many great fan missions / dark mod for some new thief. I'm not rich enough to pay for something so thoroughly mediocre.

Typically, you won't get any reliable numbers until the publisher declares a milestone passed, e.g. a million, and even then it can be unclear. I expevt it will sell quite well, though.

Keep going, great material as we figure out which of you to flog and ban in the Great Purge...

Oh, you get very powerful at the end of those games. It's just that you can still die, which is no longer a real possibility, say, after level 15 in vanilla Skyrim.

1) Don't play the BG1 / BG2 Enhanced Editions. They are perfectly playable games in their older state, and the changes EE make are controversial. I personally hate the EE's, but that's not why I'm saying this. Rather, my point is that if it is your first time with your game, then you should experience it without an add-on which was not made by the original creators and about which many fans are divided. Furthermore, the originals are half the price of the EE's on GOG. 2) You'll get a lot of contradictory opinions here, which is fine, and eventually you'll make up your own mind. I think having enjoyed FO1/2, you're perfectly capable of settling into BG1/2 and PST without them feeling 'too archaic', and these are really so well loved by almost all CRPG fans that they are the great starting points. After that, with more controversial titles, you can decide. AP is one of my favourite games, but I wouldn't necessarily recommend it as your starting point.

Play a few and then you'll be forming your own judgment about what you want to try next. Baldur's Gate 2 is very strong all-round rather than in one particular thing, so I always find it is recommendable to start with. BG, PST are must try. Gothic 1 / 2 are initially difficult to get into but well worthwhile. Proceed to IWD1/2 if you enjoyed the combat and art in BG. Proceed to Mask of the Betrayer (NWN2 xpack) and KOTOR2 if you enjoyed the writing in PST. Deus Ex is a weird and unique creature but worth playing for anybody. Don't bother with NWN1, Jade Empire, these are weaker games in the genre and not classics. Dragon Age / Mass Effect - you played ME1, so you can make up your own mind I suppose. These are made with a quite different spirit and design philosophy and aren't really in the same ballpark. BG / PST / Fallout represent in general the turn of the century golden age. If you want to try the older RPGs then Piccolo has noted many of the greats. Ultima VII has very weak combat but represents a good entry point with lots of exploring to do.

Ranged attack is significantly more useful with the patch - that is, it was moderatey useful in the very early levels then negligible before patch, now it is a viable character plan. In general it all feels easier with the patch, but maybe that's just my party getting in stride. Second warrior party now with: 2h Mace Barbarian relying on Provoke and crit stun Bow GM Ranger with Earth (Regeneration) backup Mace / Xbow Scout with Light backup as 'support man' Fire / Primordial Runepriest

What's more interesting is the 'orthodox' that is being presumed in order to describe what's 'blasphemous'. I imagine that in this forum quite a few of these opinions are the majority. If I count 'blasphemous' in terms of 'what other people seem to disagree with me about': -Mass Effect was unmitigated rubbish, it is embarrassingly terrible in writing, delivery, setting, and I'll stop there before I have to moderate my own posts -Alpha Protocol is a wonderful RPG and anyone who was willing to give old school RPGs a few hours before they 'became fun' and gave up on AP for its clunkiness are being hypocritical -'You won't like game x if you played it today' is an argument that should result in an automatic flogging, because it assumes that I dont play / enjoy those games anymore, it assumes people's tastes improve over time, it assumes games improve over time, and it means you prefer meaningless soundbites like 'product of its time' as opposed to actual discussion. -TB / RTwP / RT are equally valid choices, the only problem is when the execution doesn't know what it wants to do. E.g. Fallout 3.

Still enjoying it, and actually, it's a pretty long game though obviously not compared to something like M&M 5/6. I have a dwindling questlist and suspect it's only the main plot that has much substance left for this playthrough, with my level 26 party. Liquid Membrane, Sleep, then Blademaster using Provoke attacks + items that steal mana every hit and deal additional damage every hit and deal damage to attackers when hit = ooooh.

If you have to find the entrance to it, then it's not the final dungeon. I thought it was the Tomb of something horrors at the top of the mountain? Guess not.

It feels like I'm heading into the last bit of the game. My 22/23 party has explored almost all of the map and even found the entrance to the final dungeon. Eager to start with a second party once I'm done, really good game.

Hey, if it looks good to you, you should get it. I'm not out to contest that. From what I've seen it's a lot closer to Dishonoured and Assassin's Creed than Thief - so as long as people know what they're getting. E.g. see 15.30-16.30 here: If that looks cool, go for it. (Obviously this isn't representative, just an egregious example) For me, it's the complete opposite of a Thief game in just about every single way, so I'm not interested, and it's just a pity someone couldn't go and make an actual Thief game.

Thief is one of my favourite games, and I loved Thief 3 which some 'hardcore' fans consider much inferior, but the new Thief looks so, so, so, so bad in every way that there's not even an iota of regret that I'm not getting it. I generally like to try then give up or like it for what it is but it's been amazing how just with trailers and description they've already provided so much clear evidence it will be rubbish. Thief 4 promises to be 'I'm a super cool ninja with a dark past and amnesia and I want to save the world in my own dark hero badass totally righteous brooding way by killing people when shiny contextual icons light up and also by escaping scripted 'run like hell' sequences' than, you know, an amoral thief who can't be arsed about all that stuff and just wants some cash and above all not to be seen. I'm not even exaggerating. Garrett now has amnesia. And likes justice. Wants to save the world, or at least the city. Hints of a romantic undertone. Shiny contextual icons to show when the guard is ripe for killing or blackjack. At least they took out the kill XP, I think. Platform-like escape sequences. Focus highlighting. Slow motion. The new standalone Dark Mod now provides a platform for plenty of excellent user-made mods, thankfully, so there's plenty of actual Thief to play. I couldn't get into Dishonoured because playing it for half an hour on hardest difficulty I realised you can just stand somewhere high up top and shoot people in the face and the guards will all come gather round the guy, who I'm still shooting in the face from right next to them on top of a roof standing still, and they'll just wildly spin around going HEY COME OUT YOU. Then they eventually give up and wander away, even as their colleague is now burning to a crisp from the fire arrows I'm launching into his face, half a metre away from them. Gah. But at least I've heard / seen enough things about it to suggest it may be worth another try in the future.

Really really enjoying this. Level 16 and just beat Montbard on Warrior difficulty with a party of a Sword/Hvy Armour Crusader, Dagger dual Bladedancer, Earth/Fire/Air Shaman & Dark/Primordial/Water Freemage. Bladedancer is indeed the primary damage dealer and with plenty of Evade to stay alive; Crusader is very good at staying alive, but perhaps not so good at keeping others alive. Sleep is definitely overpowered due to permanent duration. Got surrounded by 6 dudes? Put 5 to sleep!

Finally had time to start this. Level 7 on warrior after beating mamushi in the lighthouse, my might-pumped crusader amd bladedancer kept missing him so i had to rely on direct spells from shaman and freemage with all my man pots down the drain. Lots of fun, just wish there were a bit more abilities and spells to play with.

You can thank me for Alpha Protocol taking its rightful place in the pantheon. It's a very good list in terms of "RPGs you should check out if you missed them".

I don't see how the argument that it's hard to have a female PC who does exactly the same things a male PC does in a game which tries hard to be historically accurate to medieval Europe - is sexist, regressive, or whatever. Indeed, suggesting that opposing female PCs in the game is an act of ignorance, sexual discrimination, crawling out of a permafrost cave, etc. I would say is the only part of the entire discussion that seems aggressive and disrespectful. If you wanted to argue that the 'no woman' stance is historically regressive, technically, to argue that women should be equally represented anywhere and in whatever form is, from the perspective of contemporary philosophy and feminist debates, outdated and quaint. It would also be very easy for me to point out, in that case why can't I play as an old man, or as a gay person, or as an Asian? Why is being female privileged above other historically repressed groups that development resources must always be siphoned off to them? But in fact, neither line of argument would be really a constructive one to make. The heart of the matter is, what kind of representation of history do you want this game to have? Do you believe that recreating the gender differences in history in this context contributes to sexism today? I don't. You might. But the moment you make this a question of ARE YOU SEXIST, you're cheapening the discussion. This addresses Brry's last post. Basically: is a historically accurate game primarily a work of history or a work of popular culture? Well, obviously, both. But one might argue that every cultural form produced today should reflect the political norms of today. I tend to believe that there is value in accurate depictions of bygone or now rejected political norms. And I think the argument that 'being historically accurate can't be an excuse for bigotry' is essentially a strawman and has no relevance. It's not like anyone wants the game to not have a female PC because they want to play the game to live out their misogynistic fantasies or continue to repress women. The pro-female PC side might have a stake in the game reflecting and advancing their political beliefs, but the anti-side generally does not.

You.... you mean, when volo finishes all his posts with roofles, that makes people not think he is an idiot?

The thing is, everyone wanted an old school game, so WL2 shouldn't innovate on that front, obviously. But to me the best kind of KS game we could conceivably get is an old school game that also makes innovations within that genre's spirit and thus makes of itself its own character. Arcanum, Fallout 1, Baldur's Gate 1, Torment all achieved this one way or another. WL2 plays and feels exactly like, well, some kind of 3D, non-proprietary setting total conversion mod of FO1/2 or something. That makes it a very fun game, a good game, a game I'm liking a lot and am glad I backed. But I have a lot more expectation for Eternity and Torment in the sense that I hope they go on and try to be their own thing more.

Sorry Grommy. I'm sure you speak The Truth and The Way, but I love Arcanum.

It's a decent fun RPG with its heart in its right place. So worthwhile for any old school RPG fan. Just don't expect something as good as FO1 or Arcanum.

Here, my impressions that I posted on the Codex a few days ago. I don't know if I'd have put down $75 for it if I knew at the time P:E and the rest were coming, but I think the game itself, pre-ordering is a no-brainer for anyone who likes classic RPGs. Some basic things first: -I expected a good game but not a great one - decent writing but no Obsidian, decent setting but no FO1/2, decent combat but nothing mindblowing. It pretty much conforms to my expectations, and I think I'll very much enjoy it without it dethroning any classics. -Writing/Quests are decent multiple choices fare - nothing particularly nonsensical or cringey, but nothing particularly thought-provoking or difficult to choose, either. -Character development and skills are nice and there are some 'fun skills' that if implemented correctly could give some spice. The lack of perks compared to Fallout do make it a bit less customised. -Combat is not particularly difficult or complex, and the major problem is the lack of aimed shots or other special moves, but it stays decent and if they add some things in it could be very nice. -Graphics are OK - the indoor areas I think are very nicely done, the outdoors can look pretty meh with all the brown. -UI sucks, but you mostly get used to it.

NWN1 modding was a massive, massive investment, and a big part of why the game took 5 years. I don't think they could use Unity, for instance, because substantial modding would require the Pro toolkit that costs thousands - something other Unity KS projects are now coming up against. They could use Onyx, but (1) it has now been retired, and (2) they couldn't use it for P:E because the middleware that Onyx depends on is so expensive for a budget of 4-5 million.