B4nJ0

Thx to everybody for your replies, and to @boeroer for all the class guides. I'm happy when I'm used myself to some of your concept, but you push most of the stuff to the maximum, I just checked the other day your blast mage with a nature godlike, brillant! That said, most of my PoE days where done pre WM, and I played to the maximum: -paladin, because everyone and his mother thinked he was underpowered. Guess what, it isn't. It's the only guy that I used for 3crown solo (even if I have to say, kinda boring playstile) - rogue. boy oh boy, I played him in his full retaliation potential, ranged, dual sabre. Really. I'm maybe the biggest fun of rogues out of there, but I'm sick of it -cipher: I was very high at the beginning like everyone, but all the patches rework make me kinda sick to figure out new build every 2 months or so For the guns, I'm kinda locked for the paladin, not so good but low micro management (after the 1st couple of switch) and tanky when needed. Still kinda lost for the 5th dude, is much easier to play an hybrid playstile with melee builds then ranged. Still, the idea of an hybrid gun DPS // spell player in the form of the mage is fantastic, maybe i should reconsider the paladin. If so, what should I throw in melee over the tank mage? mhhh mhh

As most of you, I have founded annoying the lack of multiclass in PoE, even if maybe it was for the best, given the sickness off dual humans running rampant in some series That said, the most I played PoE the most I enjoyed "hybrid" concept. I'm totally addicted to my skaen stiletto priest, since it benefict so much from being your main due to all those sweet extra talents, and being able to both cast and phisical DPS is an enjable experience. Same goes for druid, I still remember how I was lost at the beginning of the game since this class is not a wonderfull caster like others, but eventually I figured out you can build it to be a nice tank and an aoe chain stunner. Lately, I tried the gunslinger chanter build (thx, jojobobo) and I founded rewarding the idea how having an extra support tank in the ranged department to random holding aggro in fights when bottle necking is impossible or things goes bad. So, I would like to create a 4/5man party with only "hybrid" builds. I have started yet another run and this is what my party looks like atm, but I would like to do some changes to fully commit to this playstile. Main: Skaen Priest 15Mig 6Con 15Dex 16Per 16Int 10Ris My favorite char by a huge margin, the epitome of the hybrid build priests are not balanced , plus this guy delivers early game much better then a full support dude. The stats are a little worst in the end game scenario, but that's a tradeoff that I will happily take for such a nice overall build. not to mention I'm totally addicted at killing the caravan no matter what xD Barb The Golden dragon (see the build on forums!) I love how this guy has gimped CON, since I do like to min/max and I found con the worst attribute by a huge margin. It's counter intuitive but, basically, tankish classes have enough HP to stand they own, while low HP classes have huge diminishing return investing in this stat. If I run with a pure tank, I gimp it's con, then the avarage of the group has more or less the same hp (investing the less in CON as possible). This usually leaves me with no more then a TOTAL of 20/30 points invested in con in the whole party! I hate CON that much in party play That said, I wanted to try the "debuff" theme on this one, but I think I should replace him with something that feel more hybrid. Like a melee wizard or cipher? Or a melee ranger of some sort? Druid 15Mig 8Con 10Dex 15Per 15Int 15Ris Oh boy, oh boy. Love this class. the spells are not so strong, but still usefull (storm, a bit of regen, a lot of dots) plus it's naturally tankish no matter what. add a kinda empty talent selection and you got all the space to pick all the stuff to make him a really nice frontliner. I love druid, underpowered class but still super rewarding to use and a true jack of all trades! Chanter the gunslinger I know this build was done for solo, but I wanted to try a ranged chanter. Not only guns are kinda nice couz they naturally position this dude between melee and ranged, but they make me play this class more support oriented. Plus, as I said, the possibility of holding quite a punch without too much micro managment was really nice, even if I hate the chanter recovery mechanic. I would probably switch this guy with a gun paladin, running deep into support and utility (scrolls, items with charges) since it's a class the I like much more. Low DPS, but still a good support and a good 2nd liner when needed, feel like a good "multiclass" concept. Mage 19Mig 3Con 19Dex 16Per 18Int 3Ris My standard blast elf. It soack most of the micro, but I found it a wonderfull dps and controller, and it's one of my favorite char overhall. No matter what, this is a really focussed caster, so I need to drop this guy for a nice class concept. To summit, I would like to make a few changes on this 5man run. Keep: Skaen priest Druid tank Guns paladin Drop: Barb tank Blast wizard So I'm looking for 2 new buddies to finish my run with, that respect the whole concept idea. I will need a new tank, so I was thinking to pick a mage since it can be a good tank given a bit of time (help me with this one, without fear to min/max stats or item sinergy) and I'm totally open to the blast wiz replacement, since that slot is the most troublesome and, atm, I dunno what I can pick. Thx for the help! Let's the "multiclass" team rocks

yeah 3,05 other users already confirmed this. It's just a retarded designer choice, as I said u just annoy min/maxer while don't bringing ANYTHING to other users. Totally done with PoE

I have to be honest, I'm totally sick of it. I hated IWD random loot list and I was so glad they stopped to do this sh**t. In PoE, I wasted hours to figure out what items to get to min/max, and they changed the loot list so many times. Why you dont stick with one list so min/maxer can share it figuring out an excel list (which was done multiple times already) and casuals /rpgers just play with a single random loot list and grabbing things while ignoring the list? This is not how you make a game better in the long run, the idea of doing another run while having to do yet another random list gives me vomit, I disinstalled PoE already. Refreshing random loot list just annoy people who like to min/max while doesn't bring any prop to any other user. I dunno how designers can't understand such a simple thing. Totally done with this game, I don't have high hopes on PoE2 either, modded BG2 is still by far the best (and hardest) rpg I never played but anyway this random loot list refresh is just the icing on the cake that gived me a "fresh" 2 hours experience in my re installed poe.

Spelltongue is by far the best weapon in the game if you know how to abuse it, it's so cheesy that is not even fun

For solo or team? My solo Pally PoTD skillbuild is (starting background +1stealth +1 mechanic) 9 Stealth 3 Athletic 2 Lore 10 Mechanics 2 Survival Plus ALL the situational +skill points that you can achieve when needed (standard rest PLUS the b*tches rest, items swap, consumable etc) This is basically what I would suggest if you have an HEAVY metagaming knowledge of the game, otherwise you will need 12 mechanics on at least one character, and 3 athletic on everyone. It's not that I don't like survival, indeed it's a very powerfull skill but in solo stealth it's still way more effective from my pov.

This is my point of view, even on PoTD @Torm51 I perfectly know that dex is kinda of useless for a paladin, but still it help balance your save rolls overall AND after max might/int/res there is no stat that you actually need in a group party. Con is still the stat that need most rework in the game IMO, it's kind of useless to go any over the avarage roll even for a tank. In a group party, on PoTD, with a good min/max party you will squish in so MUCH freaking damage if you know what you are doing after the per buff that fights will last too shortly to gain anything from CON, and at that point any extra bit DPS or better saves are gonna help you much more. Maybe it's just my playstile, since I now know PoE so much that I don't mind running around with a semi glass cannon party (melee 10 con ranged 3 con). With the spread of MAX Might/con/res ( must have) 10 con and the rest into dex/per you achieve MAX utility and damage (even if you are an utility tank) and better saves split overall. And you will do at least some damage if things go terribly wrong. In fact in a couple of occasions I had my pally and my fighter (10 con, weapon shield tank with stack of retaliation items later on) finished a couple of hard fights while I was rushing into ched nua dungeon on PoE with a low level party. Anything can happens, and if you can switch role or at least help into something different, even a bit of auto attack, that can be a game changer. Or maybe it's just me that I still hate CON so much and I still honestly believe is a game fail design and the the worst attribute in the game

My build stat wise is min maxed but in party I think that (Moon like) 18 10 7 4 19 18 is better. You don't need more then 10 cos to tank good in a party. Dex goes basically auto to 10 with the ched nua rest (dex is the best one for the team, MORE casting speed for anyone >>>>> any other "free" rest buff) and with this spread you gain better saves overall, IMO. Max Str and Int is a MUST for aura, heals and max Sacred Immonlation damage output. Anyone who build a pally without going max Str and max Int in a party is just doing it WRONG. Can't stress this enough. For solo is different, in fact my 3 crown run that I have still opened with a paladin I delayed to go high in int thx to the respec. You don't need + range modifier for aura's in solo, so the utility of the int is kinda meh until you go up to sacred immonlation I chosed to focus on dual sabre for max auto dmg in act 1/2 for example, planning to rase up int later on. The fact is that you are an amazing tank but finishing a run by auto attack is so boring that you are gonna hate it quite soon, better to max the damage early, if you know what you are doing <3 Act 1 in fact I strongly suggest 18 15 10 10 4 18 You can then make a more balanced build when you will start to gain the 1st few bonus stats items to improve the int and make a good use of the on proc sacred ground boots in act 2. Dont forget to loot "right" all the "random" chests in act 1 and later on, that is the main difference between a good run and an epic fail from my point of view

Yeah, I didn't think about Gaillant's focus but since it's the 1st time (EVER) that I'm dropping a paladin from the party I will take it on my main for sure. 20 Int is enought for all melee characters to take it, and I like the concept of the hybrid melee DPS / support char. Thx for the tip ps: yeah I put into account end game stats when I think about a character, even if now it's gonna be super easy with the respec future. That's the main reason couz I left 6 open points to allocate, I want the "basic" stats to be achieved ASAP (18str 20 dex/int 10 rest) and then see if I will have big holes in the playstile (resists, more accuracy, more str etc). Btw I gived up the idea of the almost full moon god like party couz is waayy to cheese IMO plus I don't have the time to redo my run in Iron Mode If I got whiped so I'm gonna make a more balanced race distribution and use the Power Word: Reload if needed Still I think I'll make a recap of the run (potential whipes included, let's be honest!) if any one found it interesting enough edit: I like what you said about multipliers and I don't expect my Priest to be a god in melee, I just honestly think that Nightshroud opened us an interesting slot for a min maxer MELEE caster that's, stand alone, amazing since I can open myself to yet another ranged caster slot in a full party run and since ranged casters > all this is the true "strongest" point of the build!

Hi folks! Since WH hitted, I wondered around guessing if there was a way to take advantage of the universal future of the game. On my next run I will do a PoTD run with a Priest Main (time to drop my pally, for once!) Since I believe that Prey of the Weak is one of the best DPS talents in the WHOLE game per se, but the build always missed a good main hand to go with. Nightshroud+Prey of the Weak+Flick of the Wrist will give use +14 accuracy to BOTH main and off hand weapons, creating the opportunity to have an interesting hybrid caster that want to play in melee and leave yet another slot for the ranged characters. Race Moon Godlike, the basic stats build that I usually put into the account are basic stats point + talents (protagonist) + ced nua rest + items, leaving the full buffs calculations only for bosses fights. So let's resume: 78 basic points +4 from main char protagonist extra feats +9 from items (back, belt and chest) +3 from Ched Nua Rest (dexterity) That's good for AT LEAST 18 Str -> mainly heal and DPS multi 10 Con -> Priest and Moon, don't bother with this 20 Dex -> the MOST important stat for a caster 10 Per 20 Int -> The MOST important stat for a priest 10 Res 6 extra points to reallocate where needed. Gear: Lilith's Shawl: +3 stats AND 20 int to make the aura function for everyone. Shod-in-Faith and Sanguine Plate: Given the 20int and High DPS of the char, I think this is one of the few builds optimized for the nerfed sanguine.I like the Proc but honestly on any melee that I usually run doesn't looks like is worth it (pally high int but low DPS, Rogues and Fighters from good to decent DPS but dumped INT). I wanted to maximize this on proc items and I think this is one of the very best builds to go with them. Broad Belt of Power: +4 stats in one slot, kappa. Rings and Gloves: U need 2 slots dedicated for +saves and + deflex, then you have one free slot to go, gloves for DPS (+5 accuracy or +atk speed) or Ring (+extra spells) are safe choices. I think that, since the universal weapons appared, skaen is quite easily the BEST priest deity and the one who is open to the most building and min maxing potentials, Prey of the Weak finally have found an AMAZING buddy to play with (nightshroud) and we got a cool free talent from WH that sinergy with the build as well in the form of Flick of The Wrist. For reference this will be a PoTD Trial Of Iron run, where I'll try to clear ALL the contest (and most likely fail in the result). Total party composition is gonna be: Pale Elf Fighter (to use the new retaliation helm) dumb Int, defender + Retaliation Items stack. Moon like Rogue: classic semi glass cannon melee DPS with dumb int 2x Moon Like Mage with dumb con and Res Moon like Cipher with dumb con and Res I know, I should add a 3rd mage somewhere but I love rogues too much. I will update the post from time to time to tell you how much I can go further into Iron run and how much the Priest will perform with nightshroud

He does drop on a random chest in lvl 12 of ced nua, but I will not spoil the day To be honest I'm almost done with an excel file with ALL the drops in 2.03, mb I will post it when it will be rdy ^^

I honestly think that I'm one of the biggest lovers of the pally class since the 1st patch of the game, even when the class needed a lot of rework. Let me say something: if you are gonna build a DPS paladin you are just doing something wrong. fact: there are AMAZING melee DPS classes and off tanks that can achieve a lot of more damage. fact: a paladin with 20+ int 18+ might 18+ resolve 10 cos/10dex/10per is an utility GOD with the best saves AND best tanking in the game and you can achieve this stats and utility after 20 minuts in side quest running in act 2. I'm too lazy to write a good guide about paladins, but I rly hate when people want to make the WORST damage dealer class in the game a dps one when it's so easy to min/max an amazing main char pally. Also, I hate that people STILL SAY that Darcozzi paladin are the "best order" since the change to the per stats. Having CRUEL has a disfavored behavior is the worst thing ever couz you are losing attributes that you SHOULD NOT skip from a min/max pov plus you are gonna take inspiring liberation that it's, one again, a waste even in PoTD after 2.0 if you know how to build, gear and buff a 6 man party (so, overall, that's gonna be 3 talents wasted). Oh, and I indeed did a run with a DPS hybrid gunner paladin, just for fun, so I think I know the topic quite well. ps fighters are WAY better at dealing dmg even has a main tank in a party. In fact with 6man parties you should dump int, just take defender+weapon and shield style and then take ALL dmg talents + retaliation to make them do almost 30% of the damage of a min maxed melee rogue. You are NEVER gonna achieve that with a pally, even if you try to off tank/"dps" while using a 2h weapon (and while losing ALL the amazing stuff you gain with 20+ int and all the utility items auras) But maybe it's just me, I'm still quite addicted to this game since for some reason he reminds me a bit of Baldur's Gate 2 without the hardcore deep of the best mods that changed the game into a truly gaming single player nightmare experience. This game is easy, play how you wish, chees with bottle neck pulls and crush anything you will encounter :V

This is one of the most newbie post I have ever seen. Right now melee rogues are as amazing as ever, even if all those ranger buffs in the latest patches finally gived another decent option for a single target DPS class. Btw with the per change one of the most funny things in my last PoTD run was that I was able to take tidefall as my 1st act 2 encounter in a min/maxed 6man party and that plus optimal gear (all random chest "unrandomed", adra dragon kill kind of rushed etc) gived me a wonderfull single target dps char from the very beginning of act 2 till basically the end, he srly looked so much ahead untill casters didnt have access to lvl 5+ spells :D props: insane damage op from mid to late game only char with 2 mechanics starting points -> the true reason why I hate so much to drop a rogue from a 6 man run slops: high micro not a caster (lvl 11+ drama )

Int and Rogue is the worst combo ever. If you are not putting points into it for saves I dunno what u're doing

Point is that a melee off tank / hybrid with a pet would be an amazing concept. Problem? As usuall feats sucks in this game and you got 0 costum choices. The Swift Aim ability also, it's NOT worth it imo. Why the hell should I pick 1 ability AND 1 feat to counter Cautios attack? Cmon it's 2 talents and 1 ability to have a grand total of+10 deflection -3 precision,,,,,,,,,,,,,, WOW! I would like to see an almost total revamp of the pets, better talent for them and at least 2 decent option for melee style rangers. And stop trash talking about classes difference. Almost ALL the talents and abilities atm are not worth taking. This is why class variance sucks and the main problem of this game.

Atm I see the ranger more like a melee toon then anything else... And I like it. Maybe 1 or 2 more playable feats and he will be decent in that role. But if you talk about ranged well... I don't see why I should play him over any other toon to be honest :V

Ahahah I support your caps frustration here

Indeed I'm playing with Main tank Moon like fighter Off tank moon like rogue Off tank / DPS char Fire like Baba And Finally I cut the need for more then 10con in PoTD in a six man party. Both the tanks run around with 18 Might 10 con 10 dex (only dump stat is int). It's THAT better for my DPS meter ;p Honestly I like it, the heal is not that OP since you will have to rest a bit more if you want to improve the overall DPS of the party dumping con a bit. I ended resting less when I used an Orlan tank (18con) + pala off tank because you have more total HP to play with so I found it a decent balance between the 2. Basically IMO Moon Like let's you be more DPS oriented with more rest overall, while having 2 HEAVY tanks doesn't require the moon godlike and you'll rest less but you will do less dps as well. And I'm talking in a min/max set up with 6 ppl in PoTD. For solo run you more or less try to "cheat" the game with split pulls, bottle neck, figurine / retaliation. I don't see moon to be more game changing then any other abuse people use out of here (main reason couz I don't like the solo mode, to be honest). And about role play, I'm in the group of players who likes RPG games on PC but don't care about roleplaying. I ended up running BG2 modded (ascendancy and all the others "hard mode" mod you can find out of here) more then any other single player. I played competitive WOW for a couple of years (top 100 world pve progress guild here) so I honestly just care about hardcore progress and that's my playstile. RPG games on the PC are "hybryd" for masses of people that have very different playstile, from casual to hardcore to full roleplay oriented. You can't demand to have perfect balance (in not modded setup) IMO it's too hard to achieve that, honestly I ended running BG2 for years with more or less the same class (dual classed wizards) + 1 inquisitor. Here the choices aren't that deep but at least I can run with 4 different classes and try different set-up without hurting myself too much. It's OK atm after all. Isn't it? Everything great, but the problem is that Moon Like racial is straight better by miles than other racial. I wouldn’t argue with your opinion if all racial benefit player in similar way you described- one heal, one reduce damage, one increase attack speed, one increase defensive rolls, one make you do more damage the less/more Endurance you have etc. etc. So all racials can compensate for some class lacks or stat dumping, similar to like Moon Like compensate for lack of self-heal or dumping CON. I don’t have problem with Moon Like racial idea. However, I have problem with it being superior to every other racial in game. Did someone said human in baldur's gate vs others? (multi class against dual class, CMON) Again the problem is not that godlike are too good, but that the other races are USELESS and don't have nice triggers to build around them. Even the bonus/malus stats of each race are almost useless if you don't DUMB 2 attribuites, witch not all classes wanna do even in min/max set up IMO. This game is just around moon/fire/wood elves and that's it (you can add island if you like to build a ranged gunner cipher like most of the people do). All the other races are quite fail from a design pow since the abilities are situational or not good enough to reserve a spot IMO and that's the true problem.

I tried to be serious here ;P did I say a lot of stupid things? ^^

Are you just saying that the most retarded top meter DPS class in the game is not good enough? Re-think :V You can both build a very decent dps ranged build that require only 1 debuff or you can go for the 2 debuff build It's just up to you and party composition. And I found the rogue to be one of the best designed class atm, at least he got variance. The main problem are not rogue features and feast, the main problem is that A LOT of the other classes features / feat are HORRIBLE so you can't build around them. Buff useless feats first, then maybe work a bit on this class as well. But nerfing everything to the ground, up to a point that u force people to just take +accuracy feats is NOT a good solution.

Indeed I'm playing with Main tank Moon like fighter Off tank moon like rogue Off tank / DPS char Fire like Baba And Finally I cut the need for more then 10con in PoTD in a six man party. Both the tanks run around with 18 Might 10 con 10 dex (only dump stat is int). It's THAT better for my DPS meter ;p Honestly I like it, the heal is not that OP since you will have to rest a bit more if you want to improve the overall DPS of the party dumping con a bit. I ended resting less when I used an Orlan tank (18con) + pala off tank because you have more total HP to play with so I found it a decent balance between the 2. Basically IMO Moon Like let's you be more DPS oriented with more rest overall, while having 2 HEAVY tanks doesn't require the moon godlike and you'll rest less but you will do less dps as well. And I'm talking in a min/max set up with 6 ppl in PoTD. For solo run you more or less try to "cheat" the game with split pulls, bottle neck, figurine / retaliation. I don't see moon to be more game changing then any other abuse people use out of here (main reason couz I don't like the solo mode, to be honest). And about role play, I'm in the group of players who likes RPG games on PC but don't care about roleplaying. I ended up running BG2 modded (ascendancy and all the others "hard mode" mod you can find out of here) more then any other single player. I played competitive WOW for a couple of years (top 100 world pve progress guild here) so I honestly just care about hardcore progress and that's my playstile. RPG games on the PC are "hybryd" for masses of people that have very different playstile, from casual to hardcore to full roleplay oriented. You can't demand to have perfect balance (in not modded setup) IMO it's too hard to achieve that, honestly I ended running BG2 for years with more or less the same class (dual classed wizards) + 1 inquisitor. Here the choices aren't that deep but at least I can run with 4 different classes and try different set-up without hurting myself too much. It's OK atm after all. Isn't it?

Give them a couple of ranged companion: why we can't have smthing like a vivern has a feat future? Also, buff ALL the AC to be playable in PoTD, pls. You should rescale them to fix difficulty at the very least. Also, make them viable has off tank at least like retaliation rogue, not even talking about reta baba here. OR delete the class, ty. This class NEED some serious improvement, cmon. I would never pick them over nothing in this version...

I'll resume the post couz I want to give some feedback about this build: I restarted a 6man potd run (no cheese pull, I wanna cc/tank the whole thing and I'm at my 3rd run atm and It's still not easy ) My 6 man party set up Moon Fighter Tank - retaliation toon number 1 Moon Rogue Off Tank - retaliation toon number 2 - the build of this topic more or less Wild Orlan Baba - Melee 2h DPS - Not too min/maxed since it will not use retaliation but still fine Wood Elf Rogue - Ranged DPS - Hunting Bow High interrupt build concept Wood Elf Priest - Support / Ranged DPS - Magran for Arquebus feat Island Aumaua - Ranged DPS - Blunderbuss / weapon switch Build Let me say that I'm quite impressed on the overall DPS of the rogue in heavy armor + shield, even before retaliation items will be add into consideration he's in my top 3 DPS meter without any problems at the beginning of act 2 with all the side quests done. I'll start checking how this work when I'll got my 2 retaliation items for fighter + rogue. The main problem for this set up is, the way I see it, that maybe an off tank Fire Baba + a Melee DPS rogue (not using retaliation then) could be better damage. Going for an off tank rogue force you to play a "standard" melee DPS barbarian but I feel like that class can be much, much better while off tanking for maximum party damage output. OR maybe I should just run 3 rogues in my party (off tank/melee DPS/ranged DPS) couz I love this class Anyway I have totally dropped PALADIN has choice for my runs. I love the class concept and I have tried to min/max it more then a lot of ppl out of there but, let's be honest, it's much worst then any other class that can be viable as an off tank, at least ATM. Finally, I would like to discuss the stats that my Off Tank Rogue has. Might 19 Cos 10 Dex 10 Per 18 Int 4 Res 18 I think that constitution is an horrible stats overall unless you have an high % of base end from the class (IMO only barbarian and fighter) so points are better used elsewhere. You still don't want to dump it but I doubt I would consider investing points here unless I'm in a solo run. Intelligence is the dump stat of the class for sure, not even close no matter role your rogue is going for.

Paladin were also the worst class in BG by far (with ranger and monk) from a min/maxing POW if not for that ULTRA cheesy inquisitor dispell (even if hard mods rebalanced it) and Carsomyr... In the end I usually Avoid it with the good old kensai9/rogue to pick up Carsomyr, with the other 3 kensai9/mages doing the real things (sometimes throw in a bers9/cleric to do smthing else just to not feel THAT cheesy) Rly, it was like a class with ZERO features aside from an "enter godlike buttom - Dispell" and "enter godlike weapon - Carsomyr". AD&D... yeah...