Obsidian US Presidential Poll

[Guard Dog]

Stein is definitely on 38 as of now. She should be able to get six more. They have the signatures, they just need the State elections folks to approve. It looks like 44 is where she will top out. The LP is on the ballot everywhere and has some 4k candidates in races across the country, 

[Barothmuk]

I'd have voted Libertarian, but think Trump is needed to undo all of that.

Give them a shot - I'm sure Libertarian economics would be just as if not even more destructive.

[BruceVC]

The damage of New Age Nazism ie. SJW nazis.

 

It used to be it was the Right who I had to fight so they wouldn't enslave me by telling me what i can watch, eat, drink, read, say,or play. Now it is the Left that does.

 

The Left is evil SJW Nazism. PERIOD.

volo you mustn't see it as Nazism when governments try to improve the lives of all its citizens by enforcing rules and being concerned with human rights

 

This is about a better society for all, I'm surprised you think this has anything to do with Nazism ?

[aluminiumtrioxid]

 

This is about a better society for all

 

 

I'm pretty sure that's what the Nazis said, too 

[Guard Dog]

Bruce there is a dirty little secret you need to know about governments. They exist solely for the purpose of self perpetuation. Governments are made of of people who want their jobs to continue and enrich them. Absolutely everything they do is in furtherance of that goal. If they happen to so some good along the way that's great. Those who serve in Government if they trouble themselves to think of that at all console themselves with the notion that in the end they did more good than harm. To quote one of my favorite Americans George Washington "Government is not reason, it is not eloquence — it is force. Like fire it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master" 

Edited September 17, 2016 by Guard Dog

[aluminiumtrioxid]

Bruce there is a dirty little secret you need to know about governments. They exist solely for the purpose of self perpetuation.

 

Funny, I thought they exist to take care of all the boring **** without which modern society couldn't function. Silly things like making and enforcing laws and the like.

[Guard Dog]

 

Bruce there is a dirty little secret you need to know about governments. They exist solely for the purpose of self perpetuation.

 

Funny, I thought they exist to take care of all the boring **** without which modern society couldn't function. Silly things like making and enforcing laws and the like.

 

That is what I mean about doing more harm than good along the way. In the US there are 2057 individual laws governing just the sale, transport, and regulation of purchase of alcohol. That is just FEDERAL laws. That isn't counting State, County, & City laws. The IRS internal regulations and tax codes are over 3.4 million words long. Just to give you an idea is you printed that in Arial size 10 font at 60 lines per page it would be over 7500 pages long. And that is just the IRS. Every State and small has their own tax code. From 2000 to 2007 Congress CREATED 452 crimes. These are actions that in 1999 were not criminal, in 2007 they would land you in prison, or in debt to Uncle Sam for a long time. There are 4450 FEDERAL crimes with mandatory prison time. Most of which were "created" since 1938. Since becoming President Barack Obama has signed 386 new laws into effect and issued 191 Executive orders as of 2014. Bush did even more of both.

 

At what point in enough going to be enough? We are being governed to death. I'm probably breaking a law right now sitting here at my desk in my own home. Every one of these laws requires a staff to write them, that means staff jobs. Lawyers to fight or argue them, that means jobs. Congressmen to pass them, political jobs and a huge never ending bureaucracy to enforce them and when convenient or incentivzed to do so, look the other way on them .

 

This is gotten way out of hand. Small wonder the US has the highest percentage of citizens in prison of any western nation.

 

Edited September 17, 2016 by Guard Dog

[Longknife]

Like hell I'm missing an opportunity to sit on my ass all day just so I can vote for one of these losers.

[aluminiumtrioxid]

 

 

Bruce there is a dirty little secret you need to know about governments. They exist solely for the purpose of self perpetuation.

 

Funny, I thought they exist to take care of all the boring **** without which modern society couldn't function. Silly things like making and enforcing laws and the like.

 

That is what I mean about doing more harm than good along the way. In the US there are 2057 individual laws governing just the sale, transport, and regulation of purchase of alcohol. That is just FEDERAL laws. That isn't counting State, County, & City laws. The IRS internal regulations and tax codes are over 3.4 million words long. Just to give you an idea is you printed that in Arial size 10 font at 60 lines per page it would be over 7500 pages long. And that is just the IRS. Every State and small has their own tax code. From 2000 to 2007 Congress CREATED 452 crimes. These are actions that in 1999 were not criminal, in 2007 they would land you in prison, or in debt to Uncle Sam for a long time. There are 4450 FEDERAL crimes with mandatory prison time. Most of which were "created" since 1938. Since becoming President Barack Obama has signed 386 new laws into effect and issued 191 Executive orders as of 2014. Bush did even more of both.

 

At what point in enough going to be enough? We are being governed to death. I'm probably breaking a law right now sitting here at my desk in my own home. Every one of these laws requires a staff to write them, that means staff jobs. Lawyers to fight or argue them, that means jobs. Congressmen to pass them, political jobs and a huge never ending bureaucracy to enforce them and when convenient or incentivzed to do so, look the other way on them .

 

This is gotten way out of hand. Small wonder the US has the highest percentage of citizens in prison of any western nation.

 

 

So when you're saying "governments exist solely for the purpose of self-perpetuation", you really only mean the US Government?

 

I mean, other countries have governments without them resulting in anything like the shambling monstrosity that is the USian legal system.

[Volourn]

yeah theya ctually do. Kanada's lawmaking is  nod fiferent. I bet European coutnries are the same. And, a country like China probably just kills or flatly  just 'disseappears' undesrieables. China has one main law - don't be anti gov't.

 

Governments are and always will be about power, control, and slavery.

 

 

As one example, the fact the gov't and (most people) feel the gov't has the right to order  agrown adult to wear a seatbelt or else they will have their money stolen is evil nazism of the highets order. It is an absolutely ridiculous law. PERIOD.

Edited September 17, 2016 by Volourn

[HoonDing]

goyim sheep cannot handle freedoom

[Oerwinde]

yeah theya ctually do. Kanada's lawmaking is  nod fiferent. I bet European coutnries are the same. And, a country like China probably just kills or flatly  just 'disseappears' undesrieables. China has one main law - don't be anti gov't.

 

Governments are and always will be about power, control, and slavery.

 

 

As one example, the fact the gov't and (most people) feel the gov't has the right to order  agrown adult to wear a seatbelt or else they will have their money stolen is evil nazism of the highets order. It is an absolutely ridiculous law. PERIOD.

 

Not to mention the UK. They don't even have a constitution, just a series of laws and court precedents dating back hundreds of years.

[HoonDing]

thats why they drive on the left

[Zoraptor]

No, they drive on the left because that enables people to pass each other with their sword arms free for easy defence. Fools, morans and the terminally naive drive on the right which simply means all their highwaymen are left handed. Americans may think their right to bare arms protects them from crime but it's simple fact that the UK has a lower crime rate because it drives on the left and so does Japan, another country with a low crime rate.

 

Statistics don't lie.

[BruceVC]

yeah theya ctually do. Kanada's lawmaking is  nod fiferent. I bet European coutnries are the same. And, a country like China probably just kills or flatly  just 'disseappears' undesrieables. China has one main law - don't be anti gov't.

 

Governments are and always will be about power, control, and slavery.

 

 

As one example, the fact the gov't and (most people) feel the gov't has the right to order  agrown adult to wear a seatbelt or else they will have their money stolen is evil nazism of the highets order. It is an absolutely ridiculous law. PERIOD.

Volo please be honest. You  can whine, use hyperbole and criticize your government as much as you want ....but do you think you would  survive even a month without a government running Canada? You need to be told what to do because if decisions were left to you your  country would absolutely collapse 

 

Can you imagine

 

Canadian Finance Minister : " Volo should people pay tax ? ......

 

Volo : " No, taxes are Nazi systems that try to control people...I believe in a free society "

 

Canadian Finance Minister " But then we need to increase corporate tax " 

 

Volo  "  No I dont like corporates because they are a  form of SJW Nazi control ...we dont need corporations  in our society as they push a SJW agenda "

 

Canadian Finance  Minister " But how will we manage the government  budget and achieve fiscal stability  " 

 

Volo " Budget? Fiscal stability ? Those are meaningless terms used by Nazis and SJW to enforce control over citizens ....I reject those things  "

 

 

And when the electricity stops working and suddenly you cant access the Internet anymore you will realize the great circus is over ....the great illusion has ended. 

 

Guess what volo, RL and RL institutions like governments matter and have real responsibilities and real deliverables to citizens

 

They dont exist on the Internet and worry about meaningless things like  " Nazi SJW "  nonsense   

 

[quidproquo]

Made me chuckle. Government is a game of Rock Paper Scissors, in't?

[BruceVC]

Made me chuckle. Government is a game of Rock Paper Scissors, in't?

Indeed ...

[Guard Dog]

If anyone had told me Trump would be in the lead after 35 votes I don't think I'd have believed it. 

[BruceVC]

If anyone had told me Trump would be in the lead after 35 votes I don't think I'd have believed it. 

Its no surprise to me, there are many Trump supporters on this forum. Most of them live outside the USA 

 

Hilary seems to have the least amount of support on these forums, I am surprised she got so much support 

[Volourn]

"volo you mustn't see it as Nazism when governments try to improve the lives of all its citizens by enforcing rules and being concerned with human rights

 

This is about a better society for all, I'm surprised you think this has anything to do with Nazism ?"

 

Gov't doesn't care about 'improving' society. It cares about maintaining power.

 

 

"Volo please be honest. You  can whine, use hyperbole and criticize your government as much as you want ...."

 

L0L Not if you had your way. If you were in power, I'd probably be in prison or executed.

 

 

."...but do you think you would  survive even a month without a government running Canada?"

 

We'll never know because gov't in some form will always be around. It's needless speculation.

 

 

" You need to be told what to do because if decisions were left to you your  country would absolutely collapse"

 

It's amazing I've survived 2 decades as an adult without being told what tow ear, what to eat, where to live, where to work, what to spend my money on. Shocking, really.

 

 

"Canadian Finance Minister : " Volo should people pay tax ? ......

 

Volo : " No, taxes are Nazi systems that try to control people...I believe in a free society "

 

I have never claimed to be anti tax. That is unrealistic. I don't live in a bubble of Fantasy land. Like you where you think the gov't is some loveable parent taking care of its kid. You know much like God loves his chidlren while he mass murderers them with massive floods and other plagues. For their own good. L0L

 

"Canadian Finance Minister " But then we need to increase corporate tax " 

 

Volo  "  No I dont like corporates because they are a  form of SJW Nazi control ...we dont need corporations  in our society as they push a SJW agenda ""

 

L0L Youa re gettingc razier and crazier.

 

 

"Canadian Finance  Minister " But how will we manage the government  budget and achieve fiscal stability  " 

 

Volo " Budget? Fiscal stability ? Those are meaningless terms used by Nazis and SJW to enforce control over citizens ....I reject those things  "

 

Financial stability? That's hialrious considering how much in dept both Kanada and the United States are in. I'm more financially stable than either of those gov'ts. That is a friggin' scary thoguht.

 

 

"And when the electricity stops working and suddenly you cant access the Internet anymore you will realize the great circus is over ....the great illusion has ended. "

 

You should REALLY live in Ontario consideirng how in horrible shape our hydro industry is thanks to your precious gov't.

 

 

But, hey, keep telling me when it is okay for the goiv't to steal people's money just becuase over miniscule things. I mean talk about micro transgression and is SJW Nazism. that's the gov't in a nutshell.

[quidproquo]

Trump is the ultimate protest candidate. Most times, protest votes are against a party. Trump is a protest against the system from all sides. Surprised to see him winning, but not much. Online poll where some votes might well be to tweak the anti-Trump people in the forum. Know I'd take a dim view of people attacking me for my vote. Done so in the past when people get on me about my views. Had a friend one time ask me how I could vote the way I did since I was so smart. Told er that I weren't that smart... and neither were she. If looks could kill I'd be posting from Hell right now.

 

Well, maybe heaven, I hope, but if I were in heaven I probably wouldn't take time with the lot of you.

Edited September 18, 2016 by quidproquo

[Volourn]

If you ar eposting on the Obsidian boards, you already are in hell. Sorry for the bad news.

[Gorth]

The poll is rigged... no 'Gorth' on the ballot

[Hiro Protagonist]

The God Emperor will be victorious.

[BruceVC]

"volo you mustn't see it as Nazism when governments try to improve the lives of all its citizens by enforcing rules and being concerned with human rights

 

This is about a better society for all, I'm surprised you think this has anything to do with Nazism ?"

 

Gov't doesn't care about 'improving' society. It cares about maintaining power.

 

 

"Volo please be honest. You  can whine, use hyperbole and criticize your government as much as you want ...."

 

L0L Not if you had your way. If you were in power, I'd probably be in prison or executed.

 

 

."...but do you think you would  survive even a month without a government running Canada?"

 

We'll never know because gov't in some form will always be around. It's needless speculation.

 

 

" You need to be told what to do because if decisions were left to you your  country would absolutely collapse"

 

It's amazing I've survived 2 decades as an adult without being told what tow ear, what to eat, where to live, where to work, what to spend my money on. Shocking, really.

 

 

"Canadian Finance Minister : " Volo should people pay tax ? ......

 

Volo : " No, taxes are Nazi systems that try to control people...I believe in a free society "

 

I have never claimed to be anti tax. That is unrealistic. I don't live in a bubble of Fantasy land. Like you where you think the gov't is some loveable parent taking care of its kid. You know much like God loves his chidlren while he mass murderers them with massive floods and other plagues. For their own good. L0L

 

"Canadian Finance Minister " But then we need to increase corporate tax " 

 

Volo  "  No I dont like corporates because they are a  form of SJW Nazi control ...we dont need corporations  in our society as they push a SJW agenda ""

 

L0L Youa re gettingc razier and crazier.

 

 

"Canadian Finance  Minister " But how will we manage the government  budget and achieve fiscal stability  " 

 

Volo " Budget? Fiscal stability ? Those are meaningless terms used by Nazis and SJW to enforce control over citizens ....I reject those things  "

 

Financial stability? That's hialrious considering how much in dept both Kanada and the United States are in. I'm more financially stable than either of those gov'ts. That is a friggin' scary thoguht.

 

 

"And when the electricity stops working and suddenly you cant access the Internet anymore you will realize the great circus is over ....the great illusion has ended. "

 

You should REALLY live in Ontario consideirng how in horrible shape our hydro industry is thanks to your precious gov't.

 

 

But, hey, keep telling me when it is okay for the goiv't to steal people's money just becuase over miniscule things. I mean talk about micro transgression and is SJW Nazism. that's the gov't in a nutshell.

You raise some interesting points, we agree on some things but disagree on most things 

 

Anyway we are so far divided on our views on certain topics there is no way we would convince each other so it seems pointless to continue this particular debate 

 

Until next time