Help a nooooob?

[Slack83er]

Hello folks, I'm new here, and glad to know you. I just started playing this game, and I wonder what class to pick. I come from pen and paper, so I value role play much. I was oriented on barbarian, but I'm not completely sold... I wouldn't want to be a brutish villain in dialogues, and don't want to be a war machine only either. I would like to play a very useful character, who can be a good frontman in battle as well as be useful for something while out of combat.. Paladin would be obvious but I already played it in many games, and wish to change a bit. Since I don't know the whereabouts of this game, who can help me take a decision? Please if you can... State your reasons, so that I can understand some mechanics of this game. Thank you all, for the time you took to read my post first of all.

Slack83er

[AndreaColombo]

In PoE, INT is one of the most useful attributes for barbarians so you wouldn't necessarily have to role play as a brute if you went for it.

 

As for usefulness outside of combat, that depends on your dialog options (which in turn depend on RES, INT, PER, and the Lore skill for the most part) and whether you are stealthy or skilled at mechanics (but you only need one mechanic in the party and it needn't be your protagonist.)

 

Every class can put ranks in any skill, so if you want high Lore and/or Stealth on a barbarian, you can do that.

Edited August 4, 2016 by AndreaColombo

[Boeroer]

I would use a barbarian with a tanky approach. That means normal MIG, normal CON (or maxed MIG and 3 CON later), dropped DEX, high PER, high INT, high RES. At the beginning he will be a bit squishy and not good at tanking alone, but after some levels he will be great. Use defensive talents, a shield, use Barbaric Yell & Shout, Threatening Presence, Savage & Stalwart Defiance, Glittering Gauntlets, Veteran's Recovery, fat armor. I'm at level 13 atm with such a barbarian and I have to say he's awesome. Great Tankyness, but good AoE damage, too. In the White March look for the rapier Spelltongue and you're complete. I just soloed the Nalrend bounty on PoTD (aka annoyingly difficult) and lost about 5% of my total health (and in this case I even had max MIG and 3 CON). Dialogue checks are also good: he has high INT, PER and RES - all the things you need for most dialogue options. And it doesn't matter if you switch from "aggressive" to "diplomatic" - it doesn't influence your stats like paladins'. You can play him as the noble savage - you don't need frenzy, so that's plausible. Go for Bloodlust and Blood Thirst instead.

 

I did a lot of playthroughs so far and I have to say this simple approach is one of the best (for a barbarian as main char). Nearly all the dialogue checks, low micromanagement, few knockouts (all in the early game) and enough damage - even good damage for a defensive char. One of the best things about him is that he not only tanks well because of his frightening/terrfying/sickening and dazing skills (which all stack), but he also makes his fellow teammates more tanky because of that.

Edited August 4, 2016 by Boeroer

[Slack83er]

So barbarian would be a good frontman class in your opinion, am I correct? What race would be more suitable for it? I saw a section of this forum dedicated to builds, but I'm too inexperienced to understand them correctly.. Can you help?

[Slack83er]

Thank you boeroer, I'll try this idea! Which race should I choose? I'm new, so I won't play difficult, just normal..

[Dr <3]

I can't belive what i see, boeroer that build a low constitition barb? And without frenzy Poe is doomed :O

[Skie Nightfall]

I'm playing brute of a barbarian in path of the damned, and enjoying it quite a bit. I made it quite balanced, and I handle dialogues well, especially after some PER/RES boosting items/rests.

My beginning stats were: MIG 16 CON 8 PER 13 DEX 12 INT 16 RES 13

Not really a main tank, but mostly a damage dealer. Using Frenzy, lots of carnage, and a two handed weapon.

[Slack83er]

So, I understand there are two playstyles... One with frenzy and one without. And also understand that dialogue is more stat dependent than class... Which race would suit each playstyle? Thanks again for your knowledge sharing.

[Loren Tyr]

A low-CON barbarian seems like an odd choice from a roleplaying perspective, though. Also doesn't really help his survivability either, of course. 

[Slack83er]

Boeroer seems quite sure of his opinion, though.... maybe worth a try... I just need your suggestions on the race! plz

[mundanesoul]

Boeroer seems quite sure of his opinion, though.... maybe worth a try... I just need your suggestions on the race! plz

 

I would think playing on Normal that race isn't as important...you should pick whichever you think looks the most appealing and will work the best for you from an RP standpoint. Aumaua and Dwarf always seem like good Barbarian choices for me RP-wise, but then an Orlan barb could be pretty fun and funny too.   And I definitely think you could justify a low CON barbarian RP-wise in a few different ways. The character is suffering a strange illness at the beginning of the game and also survives a biawac. You could use these as justification for the low CON or consider that your character might be the sickly type. After all, you can be a raging monstrosity and still have a crappy immune system.   Or even consider that your barbarian is so focused on Murderings that he cannot be bothered to focus on defense at all.

[Faerunner]

The good thing about this game is there are a number of homelands and backgrounds.

 

On top of choosing a class (barbarian, paladin, etc) you can choose where your homeland is (Adyr Empire, the epitome of class and sophistication, the Living Lands, a perilous tropical jungle where everything tries to eat you, the White That Wends, a frozen tundra, the Deadfire Archipelago, a huge cluster of volcanic islands where the water is filled with sea monsters, and others), and based on your homeland you can choose one of several professions. Depending on your home, you could have been an aristocrat, artist, clergyman, merchant, mercenary, hunter, philosopher, scientist, slave, etc.

 

If you want to be a barbarian but don't like the idea of being a war-mongering brute, you can choose a background that fleshes your character out. For example, if you want to play a barbarian, you don't HAVE to be a raider or mercenary. Your barbarian could be a scholar, scientist, colonist, merchant, laborer, slave, and much more. In fact, a character near the start of the game will always ask your character a bit about themselves, and you can elaborate a little on your background. For example, if you choose the "laborer" background, you can say that you were a blacksmith, or a builder, or a cook. If you were a hunter, you could say you were a trophy hunter, you lived alone out in the wild and hunted to sustain yourself, you were responsible for hunting for your village, or you were actually a fisherman. Same goes for all backgrounds.

 

So, yeah. Play your cards right, and you can have a barbarian with a laborer background who was actually a blacksmith in his home village. Or a dissident that took part in a rebellion against a tyrannical government. Or maybe he was a scientist who went to study the variety of life out in the Living Lands and became a buff barbarian-like fighter in order to survive the huge number of giants, ogres, huge cats, and man-eating plants large enough to eat a man out there. Or maybe he was an artist; who knows! The sky is the limit as far as your backgrounds are concerned. You don't HAVE to box your character into a narrow stereotype. 

Edited August 4, 2016 by Faerunner

[Slack83er]

Fantastic! So you're saying to me, I can basically be whoever I want to be, no matter what the class tells. Perfect! The race though... I believe I saw some people speaking about how good the orlan was as a barbarian due to critical hits... is this so relevant in NORMAL difficulty? I don't honestly want to min-max, I am not into numbers, I'm more into roleplay. I liked Aumauas, and liked the third weapon set they can carry... but maybe someone out there knows more?

[Boeroer]

Race doesn't matter much - Wild Orlan, Moon Godlike, Island Aumaua, Human, Pale Elf - it all works. Take what you like. Wood Elf may not be the best option though.

 

As I said I wouldn't start with dumped CON, but leave it at 10. At the beginning the low starting deflection of a barb has a big impact - later on it's neglectible.

 

But later, with Glittering Gauntles, Barbaric Yell or even Shout, Stalwart Defiance and Threatening Presence, a plate armor and Thick Skinned and so on plus a large shield your "virtual" defenses (defense combined with ACC malus of the enemies) are so high that you don't need CON - you just need self heals and buffs. You stack dazed (-10 ACC), Frightened/Terrfiied (-10/-20 ACC) and even Minor Fatigue(-10 ACC - if you have that hatchet Captain's Viccolo's Anger) together with Stalward Defiance +10 to all defenses. That's like having +50 to all defenses. Add that on top of your maxed RES, large shield, Superior Deflection and so on and you can imagine how tanky he is. Another thing is that with 3 CON he still has a lot of endurance and health - a bit less than a paladin with 10 CON. He doesn't need that awful lot of endurance and health like a dual wiedling dps sabre barb with 3 RES and 20 CON (who also works very well - he would have nearly 2.5 times more endurance and needs it because he gets hit/crit a lot).

I recently killed Nalrend the Wise with this guy and as I said I did not even lose 5% health of my 3-CON pool. Self heal with Veteran's Recovery and Savage Defiance is enough to even out the grazes. For Heart of Fury I recommend switching to Badgradr's Barricade or Dragon's Maw shield (if you don't want to switch to a double sabre setup just for that single attack).

[mundanesoul]

Hey Boerer, psst! See my post in the "Newbie questions" thread! 

[Faerunner]

Fantastic! So you're saying to me, I can basically be whoever I want to be, no matter what the class tells. Perfect! The race though... I believe I saw some people speaking about how good the orlan was as a barbarian due to critical hits... is this so relevant in NORMAL difficulty? I don't honestly want to min-max, I am not into numbers, I'm more into roleplay. I liked Aumauas, and liked the third weapon set they can carry... but maybe someone out there knows more?

 

Yep! =)

 

Some backgrounds are tied to homeland--for example, Mystics can only come from The White That Wends, Philosophers can only come from the Ixamitl Plains, etc. But you always have at least six background options, so you won't be disappointed. =)

 

As far as race goes, I can talk up the roleplaying aspects of it, but not the gameplay or combat. I'm also only really into roleplay, so I just play on easy or "storybook" mode. 

 

I like orlans though. They're my FAVORITE race in Pillars. Throughout their history they've been bullied, subjugated, and enslaved by the larger kith races. In fact, originally all orlans were wild orlans, but after many of them were enslaved and selectively bred by larger races for a thousand years or so, the new subrace of domesticated cats, the hearth orlans, formed.

 

Hearth orlans sound really good for a barbarian, though. The Hearth Orlan's special ability is Minor Threat, which is "When attacking any target that is also being targeted by a teammate, Hearth Orlan convert 10% of their Hits into Crits." So basically, every time you enter battle just have one of your companions attack the same enemy that your orlan is attacking, and you'll get an exra 10% critical hit chance. The Wild Orlan's special ability, Defiant Resolve, is a little less useful for gameplay reasons. It basically says, "After being subjected to a Will attack, Wild Orlan temporarily gain a bonus to all defenses." I can't remember if the Barbarian has low defenses this game like in other games, but if so I guess a temporary bonus to all defences is helpful. (Certainly is for my wild orlan ranger, since I lowered defense stats to increase conversation stats.)

 

So, you could easily roleplay a hearth orlan from a small village who's just trying to live their life but gets attacked by larger kith races, so your character became a berserking barbarian to fight off larger invaders. Or he's just a barbarian because, as an orlan, he wouldn't be allowed to have the same fancy martial training and shiny armor and weapons as the larger kith races, so he learned to fight with what he had. There's a lot of directions you can go with this. =)

 

The Aumaua are awesome too; don't let my bias for orlans sway you. All aumaua have +2 Might (or Strength), so that's helpful. The Coastal Aumaua (the blue shark people) have Towering Physique, which gain defense bonuses against Prone or Stun affects (fantastic!), and the Island Auamaua (the brown and orange shark people) have Armed to the Teeth, the extra weapon slot you heard about. The Island Aumaua are also from the Deadfire Archipelago, which I think is hands down one of the coolest areas in this fantasy world. And again, you don't have to roleplay an auamaua barbarian as a villainous killer. Lots of empires are fighting over control of the islands in the Deadfire Archipelago, so you can headcanon or choose a background that your aumaua became a "barbarian" to fight to defend their home, or to fight back when a bunch of pirates, raiders, slavers, or settlers tried to bring the fight to you. There are so many possibilities.

[Loren Tyr]

I still maintain that from a roleplaying perspective a low CON barbarian just makes no sense. Though then again I never believed in giving barbarians a shield or having them pike-poking enemies from behind a tank with either. At the end of the day, these are your recklessly aggressive, grind-them-into-pulp style warriors. A defensive style just doesn't suit them. If you want a barbarian tank, go high Might, high Constitution (and high Intellect for the Carnage range), heavy armour, dual-wield some swords (I prefer them over sabres, anyway; base damage is lower, but you get pierce/slash and Whispers of Yenwood early on) and charge in. You get tons of health and endurance and an enormous Fortitude (especially when Frenzying). You also get hit all the time, but that's barely noticable (and works nicely with Binding Rope). Works nicely with Coastal Aumaua to get Towering Physique, though personally I've always been partial to Dwarven Barbarians as well. 

[Boeroer]

Sure, that works nicely.

 

But why do you want to dictate how I or others should play barbs? The tank approach works like a charm and it's fun that way - as is the opposite approach. 

 

If you want to limit yourself to a that "cliche" barb then that's ok. To each their own.

 

Concerning role playing and "low CON on a barb makes no sense": why stick to the usual? I can imagine several reasons why a barb (especially one from the Vailian Republics) would only have 3 CON (Sickness maybe, old war wound etc.) and why he chose a different fighting style than his "brothers". Maybe the low CON was the main reason he chose to hide behind a shield and yell at his enemies. I mean vailian barbs are smart with their high INT. Why not adapt?

 

I only wrote what I would do with a barb at the moment - doesn't mean everybody should do it. It's just an example of what works. 

Edited August 4, 2016 by Boeroer

[Slack83er]

First of all thank you for giving me so much to think about. Now, I'm a bit more into the mechanics so as to understand what you say with ease. I'm not completely sure which race to choose, but I'll make up my mind soon. As a beginner, I'm not sure I can follow boeroer's build... Maybe this requires a little more experience than I have... Just some more micromanagement than I can provide... But I'm just like him... I like to tweak and think out of schemes. Sometimes I also choose races based on appearance... In Poe for example, I absolutely dislike the way dwarves are drawn. I find Orlans nice but maybe too small... Something like halflings... And I kinda like aumauas... I'll just try to figure out a way to create my toon. Thanks again!

[Loren Tyr]

Sure, that works nicely.

 

But why do you want to dictate how I or others should play barbs? The tank approach works like a charm and it's fun that way - as is the opposite approach. 

 

If you want to limit yourself to a that "cliche" barb then that's ok. To each their own.

 

Concerning role playing and "low CON on a barb makes no sense": why stick to the usual? I can imagine several reasons why a barb (especially one from the Vailian Republics) would only have 3 CON (Sickness maybe, old war wound etc.) and why he chose a different fighting style than his "brothers". Maybe the low CON was the main reason he chose to hide behind a shield and yell at his enemies. I mean vailian barbs are smart with their high INT. Why not adapt?

 

I only wrote what I would do with a barb at the moment - doesn't mean everybody should do it. It's just an example of what works. 

 

I don't want to dictate anything. But the OP indicates that he values the role-playing aspect, which means the "making sense" part is certainly relevant. And sure, there is a plethora of reasons why a character might have low constitution; but many of those reasons would also prevent him from being or staying the kind of warrior that fits the Barbarian class. You may consider it cliche, but the class does represent a certain type of character, a certain attitude. And sure, you could come up with a scenario in which it somehow does make sense; just like you could justify a mage who is as dumb as a brick, or a Bleak Walker cuddling every bunny in sight. It's just not likely to come across as particularly believable. 

[Faerunner]

I personally think min-maxing is excessive. And the OP isn't really interested in it anyway, so why recommend something the OP isn't interested in? I think 7 or 8 is the lowest I go with any stat. (My ranger's Constitution is 8.)

 

Personally, I just fired up the game to see what an Island Aumaua Barbarian looks like. I found out that, for barbarians, Might and Constitution are "HIGHLY RECOMMENDED," while Dexterity and Intelligence are just "RECOMMENDED." So for a decent build that isn't necessarily min-maxed, I would go with...

 

Might: Max. (20) Aumaua look so strong! And the stat matches the muscles.

Con: 14-15, or higher depending on your game's difficulty. (Higher difficulty = more Con.) I think it only makes sense to have a little endurance, again, due to the muscles.

Dex: 12 or higher.

Intelligence: At least 13. Believe it or not, the lowest intelligence checks for dialogue tend to be 13 (I once made a ranger with 12 intelligence, and I was always frustrated that she was one point below the threshold to make the lowest intelligence check), so I'd use that as a minimum. It comes in handy for roleplaying conversations, especially if you want a Barbarian with a brain between his ears.

 

The Rest: Really, I think it's okay to keep them at 10 or 11, or even take a few points below (the aforementioned 7 or 8 ) to put more points into the above stats.

 

I hope that's helpful.

Edited August 5, 2016 by Faerunner

[Faerunner]

First of all thank you for giving me so much to think about. Now, I'm a bit more into the mechanics so as to understand what you say with ease. I'm not completely sure which race to choose, but I'll make up my mind soon. As a beginner, I'm not sure I can follow boeroer's build... Maybe this requires a little more experience than I have... Just some more micromanagement than I can provide... But I'm just like him... I like to tweak and think out of schemes. Sometimes I also choose races based on appearance... In Poe for example, I absolutely dislike the way dwarves are drawn. I find Orlans nice but maybe too small... Something like halflings... And I kinda like aumauas... I'll just try to figure out a way to create my toon. Thanks again!

 

If you like Aumaua, then go for it. =)

 

I personally like orlans because they're tiny hobbit-cat people, and I like that they have high perception and resolve, but that doesn't have to be the reason you like them.

 

Like I said, I just fired up the game and tested making an Island Auamaua Barbarian from the Deadfire Archipelago. (Sue me, I like that location. A huge cluster of volcanoed islands with pirate- and sea monster-infested waters? Yes please!) The red and orange color scheme for her skin and clothes, the height, the muscles, the skull and ax icon for the barbarian class and serpent for the homeland, was freaking badass. That's not to say that's the homeland or background you have to have, but it's an endorsement. Have fun with it!

[Boeroer]

Ok, I understand you guys, but OP wanted:

 

- a barbarian as MC

- who is not too wild or brutish

- can use most of the dialogue options which are mostly determined by RES, PER, INT

- to think out of bounds

 

I think I described exactly such a character, thus delivering what the OP was asking for, didn't I. It's ok if everybody else doesn't like it or if it's not what OP was looking for - but it isn't wrong or bad in itself. It's good to show what different approaches can work. It's not my wish that everybody plays a barb this way.

 

Concerning minmaxing: as I said (two times now) you don't need to dump DEX. 10 also works. I would dump it, but I'm not your boss who can tell you what to do.

 

Following the recommended stat spread all the time would lead to pretty boring characters. But for beginners it's ok of course. The more traditional approach also works very well. I would then give him high MIG and CON, low DEX, high PER, high INT and low RES. Take Veteran's Recovery as soon as possible. Also Frenzy and Savage Defiance. Use dual wielding and in the early game the thickest armor you can find. Survival 12 or even 14. Search for Shod-in-Faith boots. But RES checks are not working then. High lore is also not an option then. Such a barb is more suitable as a normal party member than MC (if you want a lot of dialogue options I mean).

[Loren Tyr]

My experience playing this kind of Barbarian on Hard difficulty is that you don't need Veteran's Recovery all that quickly (probably not at all, really). Between the enormous endurance pool and the heavy armour and extra DR you just don't really need it, especially with Savage Defiance and Second Wind to get some healing done. I went for Weapon Focus and Two Weapon Fighting first to get some better damage output. Did get Veteran's Recovery and Shod-In-Faith boots later, but having both seems to get rather redundant. Though I might be inclined to put the boots on someone else, it can get a bit annoying having them trigger on every little trash fight. Would be a different story on PotD of course, but since the OP is new to the game I assume he's not starting there.

 

Anyway, in terms of starting stats I went for 20/19/15 for MIG/CON/INT on a Coastal Aumaua, 8 points each for DEX/PER/RES. It does remove some dialogue options, sure. But there are plenty of other ones left, it's not like with low(er) RES you're really forced into specific dialogue trees that don't fit your character or you need to go all brutishly aggressive in your conversations, so that still works fine for a main character. 

[Slack83er]

Well, tbh, I value conversation A LOT so maybe going low res is not a good idea for me.. I know I'm not a mage, but the more options I got in dialogue the merrier. I won't even play hard, I'll just stay normal, since I like story and role far more than sheer difficulty and challenge. 

Going just a little OT, I saw in another thread that Cyphers have even more options in dialogues.. is that due to mind control? 

I also have a little doubt: It appears that in this game you can "tankify" quite every character... is that so or am I mislead?