EXP balance concern: Mechanics skill

[ilitarist]

PoE goes a long way to avoid making some ways more EXP valuable and therefore more beneficial for power gamer. You don't get an EXP for the act of killing itself, especially killing people. 

 

However I've noticed that Mechanics skill is an exception.

 

1) You get experience for disarming traps. No EXP for just avoiding traps - though of course it'd require some excessive scripting to notice player avoided traps and can't get EXP for disarming them anymore. This creates a cheesy tactics of returning to places were you couldn't disarm traps to get EXP even though it doesn't make sense in-universe.

 

2) When you see a locked door the smart thing is to unlock it if you have skill. You get EXP for that. If you already have the key then you're screwed cause it's probably quest item and you can't drop it. And you won't get EXP.

 

Those kinds of problems are balance issues cause they're easy to figure out, do not require any skill - only time and desire to reload, and don't make sense in-universe. I'm hoping to do Path of the Damned replay of the game and wonder if those are kind of things that  will help me fight through the higher difficulty.

[Sleazebag]

I never felt like returning to a place just to disarm traps - the exp is extremely minimal for doing so, and the game currently gives you a bit too much exp which can lead to reaching the exp cap in act 2. You're not missing much if you don't disarm every trap and pick every lock. Doing so will just make you reach the cap a tiny bit faster.

[ilitarist]

I never felt like returning to a place just to disarm traps - the exp is extremely minimal for doing so, and the game currently gives you a bit too much exp which can lead to reaching the exp cap in act 2. You're not missing much if you don't disarm every trap and pick every lock. Doing so will just make you reach the cap a tiny bit faster.

 

Indeed, I haven't reached levelcap yet so I don't have the full picture. But if it can be reached so early then EXP itself doesn't have much value which is even worse.

[RevBlue]

Like Sleazbag said, the XP you get from traps and lock picking is so minimal, unless you have like 5-6 chests/traps you couldn't access in a certain area it really doesn't give you any unfair advancement in regards to XP

[Jojobobo]

I don't enjoy having to activate scout mode to spot traps and hidden items stashes - what about sneaking makes me be able to see things better? I didn't even realise initially that you had to be in scout mode to spot these things, meaning I missed out on the Disappointer and a truck load of money because of it. I also don't enjoy sneaking everywhere to find these kinds of things - I guess now I'm only activating scout mode when I think it's likely something is hidden, but that's really just my opinion so I'm sure I'm still missing out on a lot.

 

But yeah, mechanics is clearly the best skill by a country mile - regardless of anyway you shake it.

[ilitarist]

 

But yeah, mechanics is clearly the best skill by a country mile - regardless of anyway you shake it.

 

I wouldn't say it's the best one. You have to have one Mechanic in your party. It's also nice to have Lore for your main character for dialogs or for fighters so they use scrolls. But other than that all skills seem useful to me. The problem with Mechanics is it gives EXP and items so you just have to have it.

[View619]

Agreed that disarming traps shouldn't grant experience. You already get to re-use the trap yourself.

[PrimeJunta]

Yeh trap/lock XP is dumb. 

[Sleazebag]

 

I never felt like returning to a place just to disarm traps - the exp is extremely minimal for doing so, and the game currently gives you a bit too much exp which can lead to reaching the exp cap in act 2. You're not missing much if you don't disarm every trap and pick every lock. Doing so will just make you reach the cap a tiny bit faster.

 

Indeed, I haven't reached levelcap yet so I don't have the full picture. But if it can be reached so early then EXP itself doesn't have much value which is even worse.

 

Reaching the cap in act two is an extreme case though, where you finish all side content available and ignore the main quest. 

 

But they should definitely lower exp gains across the board, but not so much that you're forced to do side quests.

[Jojobobo]

 

 

But yeah, mechanics is clearly the best skill by a country mile - regardless of anyway you shake it.

 

I wouldn't say it's the best one. You have to have one Mechanic in your party. It's also nice to have Lore for your main character for dialogs or for fighters so they use scrolls. But other than that all skills seem useful to me. The problem with Mechanics is it gives EXP and items so you just have to have it.

 

True, but there's no bonafide mechanic early on - really putting the emphasis on that being the player character. You're much more rewarded for having mechanic skills than any other skill in the offing.

Edited April 5, 2015 by Jojobobo

[View619]

 

 

 

But yeah, mechanics is clearly the best skill by a country mile - regardless of anyway you shake it.

 

I wouldn't say it's the best one. You have to have one Mechanic in your party. It's also nice to have Lore for your main character for dialogs or for fighters so they use scrolls. But other than that all skills seem useful to me. The problem with Mechanics is it gives EXP and items so you just have to have it.

 

True, but there's no bonafide mechanic early on - really putting the emphasis on that being the player character. You're much more rewarded for having mechanic skills than other skill in the offing.

 

 

Durance or a custom adventurer?

[Volourn]

"Yeh trap/lock XP is dumb."

 

No. It makes sense to be rewarded for using skills. The problem is the mechanic skill is rewarded way more than other skills. I'd lower the xp you get from it.

 

 

"I never felt like returning to a place just to disarm traps - the exp is extremely minimal for doing so, and the game currently gives you a bit too much exp which can lead to reaching the exp cap in act 2. You're not missing much if you don't disarm every trap and pick every lock. Doing so will just make you reach the cap a tiny bit faster."

 

This is true later on when the xp comes fast in mid levels but early every bit of xp counts - see the first puzzle trap. I removed all those even though logically it was silly and unneccessary since the trap is so avoidable.

Edited April 5, 2015 by Volourn

[Ink Blot]

I don't enjoy having to activate scout mode to spot traps and hidden items stashes - what about sneaking makes me be able to see things better? I didn't even realise initially that you had to be in scout mode to spot these things, meaning I missed out on the Disappointer and a truck load of money because of it. I also don't enjoy sneaking everywhere to find these kinds of things - I guess now I'm only activating scout mode when I think it's likely something is hidden, but that's really just my opinion so I'm sure I'm still missing out on a lot.

I agree with this. Why they tied discovering hidden objects and traps to Mechanics and also require you to be in scout mode is an odd decision, to say the least. I feel it should be tied to perception with perhaps a bonus to the chance as well as the detection radius if you're in scout mode.

 

As for trap/lock XP, I believe they added it in because so many people complained about not having it. The original plan was to not give XP awards for it, if memory serves.

[Jojobobo]

As for trap/lock XP, I believe they added it in because so many people complained about not having it. The original plan was to not give XP awards for it, if memory serves.

They probably should have kept it as such, the phat lewt really is reward enough already (people don't need both the physical reward and extra experience base upon a fairly arbitrary skill choice).

[gkathellar]

Considering there's way more than enough XP in the game to hit level 12, I'm not sure it matters much.

[Luckmann]

This has been discussed time and time again, but for whatever reason, they've decided to keep trap/lockpick experience. Unfortunately, it's unlikely to change at this point. There are bigger issues that are not being addressed, so this ultimately relatively minor issue is unlikely to even be acknowledged.

[Jojobobo]

 

 

 

 

But yeah, mechanics is clearly the best skill by a country mile - regardless of anyway you shake it.

 

I wouldn't say it's the best one. You have to have one Mechanic in your party. It's also nice to have Lore for your main character for dialogs or for fighters so they use scrolls. But other than that all skills seem useful to me. The problem with Mechanics is it gives EXP and items so you just have to have it.

 

True, but there's no bonafide mechanic early on - really putting the emphasis on that being the player character. You're much more rewarded for having mechanic skills than other skill in the offing.

 

 

Durance or a custom adventurer?

 

What is Durance - like a 2 to begin with? Even then, you have to know to go to Magran's Fork (admittedly, not such a hard decision, but no where you'd make a beeline for) - plus you miss out on the valuable Disappointer, which is greta to hit the ground running.

 

And personally I don't like faceless customs, at least at this stage. I'd rather go for the storied characters on these early playthroughs and then concoct weird harebrained parties when I start to get bored. Currently I've only accepted storied companions and not hired help.

[Volourn]

"hey probably should have kept it as such, the phat lewt really is reward enough already (people don't need both the physical reward and extra experience base upon a fairly arbitrary skill choice)."
 

No need for any xp then by that logic. Of coruse most of the loot you get is pure junk. Not much of a reward. Lower the xp for it. Also, lowering xp for quests should also be done. Getting thousands of xp for chatting someone is silly when your character is no danger and doesn't use any skills. Lowering xp per monster also should be done. Some enemies give you 200+ xp when they aren't that tough. Getting no xp (or at least cut it in half) xp for new areas and getting rid of xp  all 3 areas in an empty inn would be logical too.

 

\Lower xp gains across the board,  make combat tougher, and raise level cap to 15 (even if not everyone reaches it that is okay as that rewards explorers) would make the game even better.

[Mungri]

No XP for killing enemies but XP for traps and locks is just dumbassery.

[Jojobobo]

"hey probably should have kept it as such, the phat lewt really is reward enough already (people don't need both the physical reward and extra experience base upon a fairly arbitrary skill choice)."

 

No need for any xp then by that logic. Of coruse most of the loot you get is pure junk. Not much of a reward. Lower the xp for it. Also, lowering xp for quests should also be done. Getting thousands of xp for chatting someone is silly when your character is no danger and doesn't use any skills. Lowering xp per monster also should be done. Some enemies give you 200+ xp when they aren't that tough. Getting no xp (or at least cut it in half) xp for new areas and getting rid of xp  all 3 areas in an empty inn would be logical too.

 

\Lower xp gains across the board,  make combat tougher, and raise level cap to 15 (even if not everyone reaches it that is okay as that rewards explorers) would make the game even better.

That's pretty silly. Task XP at least takes more effort than a simple click - all the other stuff mentioned takes even more effort. It terms of balance, you're really looking at one skill that is very advantageous as opposed to a lot that offer little use. Besides some of the loot is pretty good, I'm sure it proffers unique weapons in some locations.

 

I never said it was "ruining the game" for me, but as of a slight preference I would prefer no XP offered - or at least the other skill XP to be brought into line with that.

[Volourn]

"Task XP at least takes more effort than a simple click"

 

Nah. You get thousands of xp just talking with companions. You get tons of xp being an errand boy - go get this steel dagger for me. DONE. 100s of xp + secret tip. That's ridiculous.

Edited April 5, 2015 by Volourn

[Jojobobo]

You still don't get that from other skills, the point stands. Don't tell me how other things which offer XP (available to all characters), tell me how it balances with the XP gain of other skills - which it does not.

[Ink Blot]

 plus you miss out on the valuable Disappointer, which is greta to hit the ground running.

 

'Valuable'?

[Emptiness]

What is Durance - like a 2 to begin with? Even then, you have to know to go to Magran's Fork (admittedly, not such a hard decision, but no where you'd make a beeline for) - plus you miss out on the valuable Disappointer, which is greta to hit the ground running.

 

Is there more than one Disappointer?  I found one, but it is much, much later than Durance.

[Emptiness]

 plus you miss out on the valuable Disappointer, which is greta to hit the ground running.

'Valuable'?

 

 

The disadvantage can be enchanted off of it.