Have i made a mistake going Monk?

[kriscorrie]

Im probably only about 3-4 hours into the game, but i started my character as a monk. Ive always liked the monk playstyle and generally it seems implemented well in this game...so far.

 

However, from what ive read monks being unarmed means i lose bonues from equipped weapons.

 

Is this going to make me feel next to useless?

 

Also, whilst im here are there any character builders, or a way i can try and plan my monks talents and abililtes?

 

kind regards

[gkathellar]

Generally, armed is the better option for monks.

[Jarlhen]

A lot of people are running monks with a one hander, shield and heavy armor. The issue is twofold. A, you can't enchant or upgrade your fists. Yes, they get a bit better on their own over time, however they're still inferior to weapons. B, monks need wounds to do... well anything. And to balance the amount of damage you take it's much easier to just slap on heavy armor and a shield. Now, I'm not saying that it's the right way to go. I'm saying a lot of people do it. I'm sure there are plenty of people who don't, but to me the monk is a bit poorly designed. I get that Obsidian wants to give people choices and all that. But the truth is that it's not always a great thing.

That said, the monk is capable of some serious DPS. They also work as tanks. Overall it's an amazing class, in a really good state when it comes to numbers. It's just that wearing full plate, sword and shield seems a bit weird on a monk yet here it's not only viable it's downright pretty good.

[Stahlbart]

Wow, that makes me kinda not wanting to play a monk anymore

I love unarmed combat and would have no problem putting a monk in heavy armor. But with sword n board? No way!

That's sad. Seems like it is really hard to implement unarmed combat in any kind of game without making it inferior to using weapons...

[cane]

I don't understand why they couldn't make some fist weapons. Like brassknuckles, cestus and wrist spikes

[Stahlbart]

I don't understand why they couldn't make some fist weapons. Like brassknuckles, cestus and wrist spikes

Or even claws,

[Oneiromancer]

I don't understand why they couldn't make some fist weapons. Like brassknuckles, cestus and wrist spikes

 

They don't even need that, the IE games (well the one with the monk class at least) had monk-exclusive gloves that boosted their damage. Have an enchant that gives +acc +dmg on gloves and make it work only for unarmed. Done. You don't even need to metagame to be sure to find them because of crafting. 

[bob54386]

My PC monk had the highest DPS in the party by about a factor of 4.  Other characters were Eder(Full Tank), Aloth, Pellegrina wielding justice + retaliation plate armor, Durance, and hired blunderbuss rogue on a normal playthrough.

 

I went greatsword monk for a little while, but the attack speed was really slow.  Switching it back to fists I was hitting for 15-30 on a ridiculously fast attack speed.  I was perma-interrupting some casters.

 

I went for heavy armor for the first half the game until I had enough of a deflection and health pool that he wasn't losing much endurance in a fight.  Switched to exceptional leather armor and then exceptional robe when available.

 

Useful traits are:

-swift strikes (upgrade to lighting strikes seemed like it was only doing 1% bonus dmg instead of 10%)

-Turning Wheel (1 wound = 5% bonus burn dmg, up to a cap of +50%)

-Vulnerable Attack (5DR melee dmg pierce at a slight attack speed penalty)

-Two Weapon Style

 

The bottom two helped immensely.  Vulnerable attack would probably be the most helpful of the 4 in early game.

[Smorensky]

I created a monk as my main and so far (lvl 5) I'm having a blast. The monk can dish out some crazy dmg if built right.

 

On the topic of NOT BEING ABLE TO ENCHANT FISTS. It is only a slight handicap since Transcendent Suffering will provide a massive boost to both accuracy and dmg, of +12 accuracy and +8 dmg on max lvl. Keep in mind that this skill only activates in combat, so if you look at your character screen you won't see any bonuses while out of combat. Once you start a fight, checking the character screen will show buffed stats.

 

With unarmed you will loose out on a few enchantments, such as bonus elemental dmg and slaying enchantments, but for most of the game it won't present a mayor issue as the shear dmg buff of Transcendent Suffering mostly balances out the missig enchantments (+12 accuracy and +8 dmg is far better then Superb quality enchantment). Late game however, once you get access to all enchantments and crafting materials, the difference will start to show so switching over to spears or hatchets (both in peasant wpn category) might be more effective.

[portedgoblin]

Like Smor said. Transcendent Suffering is making up for much of missing enchant for damage and accuracy and Turning Wheel is like a +fire damage enchant.

 

I play my monk in Cloth (0) armor unarmed on hard difficulty with campaign companions and he is destroying everything. My priest and Wizard are debuffing and if he still take too much damage you can just start CC the mobs.

[Magrusaod]

I haven't gotten far at all, I have rebuilt a few times just testing out the various classes. Ugh for the time it takes to get through that intro/tutorial and actually get into Gilded Vale again if you restart. However, the monks I've made have been Might>Dex>Con focused DPS characters. Anything heavily armored, yes, I have issues with due to no armor penetration, but just going with Two Weapon Fighting and Turning wheel I am working them over pretty well. 

With a backup option to swap to a set of Slashing weapons in case something is highly resistant to Bludgeoning, he put simply, kicks ass. Then again, I haven't gotten very far like I said. It could be I run into issues and that is something I just haven't gotten far enough with the game yet to find out. He's not my tank, but does a good job of it with twin Hatchets if things get hairy for him. Swapping to those if I keep getting hit will keep him in the fight until I can heal him and then swap back to unarmed. 

[Dongom]

Like Smor said. Transcendent Suffering is making up for much of missing enchant for damage and accuracy and Turning Wheel is like a +fire damage enchant.

 

I play my monk in Cloth (0) armor unarmed on hard difficulty with campaign companions and he is destroying everything. My priest and Wizard are debuffing and if he still take too much damage you can just start CC the mobs.

 

Sounds like a DW Rogue, Fighter, Barb but without the capability to use life-leech weapons and no escapes and overall less utility.....and has to actually get hit resulting in pointless micro and wasted Priest spells.

 

Monk isn't terrible, but could use some love as he's not really the best at anything.

Edited March 31, 2015 by Dongom

[dusklight]

Monk has Torment's Reach, which for the cost of one wound does 2 attacks at +50% damage each. They also have Force of Anguish, which for 2 wounds does a ridiculously long knockback and prone. With Soul Mirror and Rooting Pain, monk doesn't even have to attack to kill everything, they can just stand at the front of the party. It's pretty good. 

[portedgoblin]

 

Like Smor said. Transcendent Suffering is making up for much of missing enchant for damage and accuracy and Turning Wheel is like a +fire damage enchant.

 

I play my monk in Cloth (0) armor unarmed on hard difficulty with campaign companions and he is destroying everything. My priest and Wizard are debuffing and if he still take too much damage you can just start CC the mobs.

 

Sounds like a DW Rogue, Fighter, Barb but without the capability to use life-leech weapons and no escapes.....and has to actually get hit resulting in pointless micro and wasted Priest spells.

 

Monk isn't terrible, but could use some love.

 

What kind of love?

I really don't have a problem with monks now. The opposite in fact. I love using lots of CC and controlling the fights while doing great damage.

The priest spell is mostly interdiction witch is 1 per encounter.

 

By pointless micro I don't know what you mean? Like pressing abilities or?

[Mazuo]

To begin with a functional wounds system.

[Smorensky]

 

Like Smor said. Transcendent Suffering is making up for much of missing enchant for damage and accuracy and Turning Wheel is like a +fire damage enchant.

 

I play my monk in Cloth (0) armor unarmed on hard difficulty with campaign companions and he is destroying everything. My priest and Wizard are debuffing and if he still take too much damage you can just start CC the mobs.

 

Sounds like a DW Rogue, Fighter, Barb but without the capability to use life-leech weapons and no escapes and overall less utility.....and has to actually get hit resulting in pointless micro and wasted Priest spells.

 

Monk isn't terrible, but could use some love as he's not really the best at anything.

 

 

You haven't tried playing monk, did you?    Ok I'll do a comparison between monk and barbarian for the sake of argument

 

Barbarians can do massive dmg due to Carnage passive making all of their attacks do slightly less dmg in a small aoe radius (best used with high INT due to aoe range increase and increased duration on all active skills).

Their main downside is low deflection (15 base compared to monk's 25) further lowered when using Frenzy. This makes barbarians very fragile early game and requires some hvy investment into defensive talents if you don't plan to hide behind a dedicated tank. Their massive bonus to healt helps out with this issue.

 

Barbarians have several activated abilities and two activated dmg dealing attacks these are:

Frenzy - Might and Con +4, deflection -10 for 12 seconds. 1 per encounter

Barbarian Yell - AoE fear for 12 seconds. 1 per encounter

Barbarian Shout - AoE Terrify for 12 seconds. 1 per encounter

Savage Defiance - Self buff providing massive heal over time for 12 seconds (if upgraded also provides +10 deflection and +10 all defences for 15 seconds). 1 per encounter

Bloodlust - bonus attack speed for 8 seconds. 1 per encounter

Barbaric Blow - massive aoe full attack with bonus crit chane and crit dmg (carnage works with it, offering even greater aoe dmg). 1 per encounter

Hearth of Fury - massive aoe attack doing +25% dmg (carnage also works with it). 1 PER REST.

 

Other Barbarian abilities include a variety of passives that can nake a barb dish out more dmg or be slightly more tankier.

 

So in a single combat encounter a barbarian will use Frenzy and Bloodlust, then move into the fray (once dedicated tank engaged most of the enemies). Normally barbarians do most of their dmg by simply autoattacking. If enemies are clustered together (and you have high INT) u can also use Brabaric Blow to deal extra aoe dmg. Since Heart of Fury is usable 1 per rest you will want to save this for more dificult encounters. Savage Defiance will help save you in case your health starts dropping too fast.

 

 

Now for the monk...

 

Wounds mechanic is monk's greatest weakness and at the same time their strongest weapon. The reason for this is simple you have to take dmg to do dmg effectively. Fortunately monks have excellent base deflection (same as fighters 25) and can take several passives to further enhance their defence without sacrifising their dmg dealing capabilites.

 

How wounds work: for every 10 points of dmg received you get 1 wound. If you take lesser wounds passive you get a wound every 8 dmg received.

 

"Why I think monks are easily the best dmg dealers in the game"

 

The reason is simple, monks have 3 active dmg dealing abilities:

1. Torment's Reach (costs 1 wound) - Full Attack with +50% bonus crush dmg in a line (2m aoe) that also reduces enemy might by -2 for 20 secs. Full Attack means you attack with both weapons (unarmed counts as two wapons) meaning the above mentioned effect strikes twice...

2. Force of Anguish (costs 2 wounds) - deals normal dmg and knocks a target back 7m while also knocking it down for 10 seconds... This means you kick the enemy across the room and out of the fight and also leave it lying there for 10 seconds... Not sure about you ppl but this is easily one of the best CC attacks in the game...

3. Flagelant's Path (costs 3 wounds) - A very fast charge attack doing 20-30dmg to all enemies between you and your target (range 10m).

 

How is this different from a barbarian or a fighter? Easy, THERE IS NO LIMIT TO HOW MANY TIMES PER BATTLE YOU CAN USE THESE ATTACKS. Normally when I engage 2 enemies I generate around 4-5 wounds during the first 2 seconds of a fight. That means I can kick one of them to the other end of the room and use Torment's Reach 3 times in quick succession (monks attack rly, rly fast when unarmed) doing massive aoe dmg if there are more enemies on the field. Not to meniton that I will still be generating wounds every time I get hit, meaning I will constantly spam all of the monks active abilities... The 3rd ability Flagelant's Path is capable of doing ridiculous dmg if enemies are groupd up, being able to use it several times in a row is just totaly crazy, not mentioning that it doubles as an escape ability...

 

All this would be insane on it's own without monk's passive abilities... Here's what some of the passives do:

Turning Wheel - for every wound suffered you do +5% bonus fire dmg, capping at +50%.

Rooting Pain - every time you suffer a wound you do 10-15 aoe crush dmg (1.25m radius)

 

Conclusion: Monk has a totaly different philosophy compared to barbarian, rouge or fighter. Your HP will constantly go down in a fight, there's no avoiding it, but you will also do extreme dmg for every point of HP lost... The main issue here is ballancing dmg vs tanking as you will need to strike an ideal ballance. You don't want to be too squishy as you won't be able to survive long enough to use all those wounds you accumulated, on the other hand being too tanky means you won't be able to generate wounds fast enough to power your abilities.

 

All in all it is a very fun and powerfull class to play and I heartily recomend everyone to try it out at least once. The enchantments you miss out if you use unarmed only? The loss is almost completely irrelevant, as you will still dish out insane dmg.If you want to max your character out, you can always use fully enchanted weapons in both hands (as all monk abilities work with weapons as well).

 

Well I hope this clarifies a few issues for anyone looking to play a monk

 

[Dongom]

I did try, I died far too much trying to get wounds.  Then again this was early game and I was a complete noob, so maybe i'll try again.  One wrong step and I just keeled over.   t was either I don't get wounds, or I get wounds and certainly die.   

 

 

I think I went too far on dps and completely forgot about tankyness.  But then doesn't dmg suffer? Don't those small fist hits end up kinda crappy against DT?

 

What kind of gear are you wearing and What kind of stat spread?  Race? Monk is my fav class in most games but I was put off in this one, however I will try one my next play.

Edited March 31, 2015 by Dongom

[Ahzrab]

I finished my normal game today with a Monk.

 

My build was terrible (since I built it pretty much after my Dungeons & Dragons Online Monk build, which was a big mistake), I fought unarmed and only in cloth and still had a lot of fun. Just stick to your character for your first playthrough.

[Smorensky]

Well I did have to make my monk a bit tankier :D the build I use is on hard atm: fire godlike, 19 might, 10 con, 13 dex, 10 perc, 10 int, 16 resolve. I used leather armor for some added DR early on and fire godlike's racial helps out a lot, since it gives +4 DR and burn dmg when struck, once your endurance drops below 50% (and it tends to happen a lot :D).

 

It does require some micro-management in combat but it's not a big issue. Looking at the stats, if survival is being a problem you could move those 3 points away from dex and into resolve and perception for +3 deflection, since monk's attack speed is pretty good even without investing in dex.

 

Another thing worth mentioning is that in order to generate a wound you have to take 10 points of dmg within a certain time frame, I cannot be 100% sure about it without some added testing, but so far that seems to be the case. If you have high DR it is possible that you can loose most of your HP without generating a single wound (but it will take along time). That's why I recommend getting lesser wounds as soon as you can as it improves wound generation a lot and greatly improves survivability. Also my advice early on is to send Eder into the fray first, followed by your monk, ideally you want Eder tanking most of the mobs with you dealing with only 1 or 2 at least until you can get your hands on some better gear and higher lvls.

 

As for the gear, as I mentioned I used leather armor early on for 4DR and tried to get my hands on ring of deflection as soon as possible, additionally I used dual spears (for added accuracy bonus and higher dmg) until I reached lvl4 and got Transcendent Suffering 2, for that extra unarmed dmg. Aside from that you want an amulet of endurance, boots with +1 constitution and the belt sold by the blacksmith in Gilded Vale (adds bonus slashing/piercing DR). Later on once you find quality robes you can use them instead of leather armor for more attack speed.

 

And yes, early on playing a monk is a bit more dificult thant other classes :D

[sp0q]

Absolutely stick with it! I created an exactly identical monk as Sensuke had suggested in one of his videos and had the same doubts.

 

Up until level 4/5 she was squishy as hell (going unarmed, only some cloth with 2DR and -5%). But somewhere around level 6, especially when you acquire a second tank (I didn't create any additional npc's, went only with the in-game ones), she started to show her value.

 

Eder and Pallegina are locking the first wave while the karate-chick runs around them and engages the casters and archers. Seriously, this looks hilarious cause she can interrupt any spell (skill 2/encounter) and if they actually manage to wound her they start flying across the screen :D I can't give you any statistics right now, but it really looks like she is killing half of the opposing force before others bring one or two guys down ; )

 

And I didn't even try to enchant anything yet so she's still running around with base stats.

 

Somewhere inbetween I tried to give her two spears but it felt like armed combat was pulling her down.

 

edit. oh and I played 'hard' from the beginning.

Edited April 1, 2015 by sp0q

[Valtonis]

are you guys serious?

 

i'm playing a solo monk on the highest difficulty and just wrecking the crap out of nearly everything

seems more like wrong distribution of attributes, skills and race selection

 

and sensuki's guide is off

 

you max out might and con not dex, use fire godlike race

get the attack speed ability, and the one that add fire damage on wound and lightning when attack speed ability is active

[sp0q]

I won't argue that Sensuki's option is the best possible since I still don't exactly get this system. But it shows that the class can perfectly get around in the game, even without necessarily min/maxing.

[Lasci]

Monk was a good choice. They're very versatile and with a modicum of sense it's very difficult to build a monk poorly. Outside of picking some really wonky abilities and talents, any monk that you make is going to be serviceable, if not an outright star.

 

In my playthrough, I went into it on Hard with a druid. My first non-NPC character was a sub optimally built monk -- it was something along the lines of a oceanic human with a near even balance of might, dexterity, and constitution with the perception background. Yikes, right? But shortly after a bumpy conquering of Caed Nua, I very quickly realized that my monk was probably the most powerful person on my team. I was running with Eder, the monk, my druid PC, Aloth, Durance, and Kana. My monk was consistently tearing through enemies with such hilarious speed that I ended up taking her out of the party because I felt like I had broken something because my monk with zero DR was destroying things while staying at a consistent half health!

 

As a DPS monk (a monk with a priority in might and dexterity, and maybe intelligence), you have natural damage resist despite not needing to trade speed for DR through your armor. This means that you turn squishy mages and anybody who has to charge abilities into an inactive punching bag. You get insanely accurate, ten second knockdowns through Force of Anguish. You do 150% damage with a single wound with Torment's Reach -- and reduce the damage of the cluster of enemies hit by you AoE. Can't hit something because its deflection is too high? Just hit them with one of your abilities instead -- they target fortitude and reflex. It's insane how easy it is to tear through a selection of enemies in quick time.

 

As a tank lugging around full plate, monks have the benefit of that additional wound DR, on top of the fact that they get better as they get hurt. Most other tanks are fairly passive. Eder can occasionally target high priority targets for knockdowns and pulls. Pallegina has a party-wide buff, a revive, and a heal; her damage enhancer is pretty boring and usually unreliable. Chanters are the squishiest of the other tanks, but they get nice summons and great debuffs after a certain amount of time. A monk? A monk wades into a group of enemies, lets herself take a bunch of wounds, and then has a retinue of great abilities with no limitation on how many times they're used in prolonged encounters. They're safe, proactive, and bring a lot of utility to the table that the other tanks can't match in either potency or availability.

 

Stick with the monk. You'll find something you like in it soon, I'm sure. Just remember that if you aren't purposely trying to tank, you need to come in after someone like Eder takes to the front line. Don't let yourself get too overwhelmed. Going head to head with a single creature is enough to get an armorless monk the wounds she needs to cut through the enemy flanks soon after.

[Emptiness]

I did try, I died far too much trying to get wounds.  Then again this was early game and I was a complete noob, so maybe i'll try again.  One wrong step and I just keeled over.   t was either I don't get wounds, or I get wounds and certainly die.   

 

 

I think I went too far on dps and completely forgot about tankyness.  But then doesn't dmg suffer? Don't those small fist hits end up kinda crappy against DT?

 

What kind of gear are you wearing and What kind of stat spread?  Race? Monk is my fav class in most games but I was put off in this one, however I will try one my next play.

 

Moon Godlike = Thank you for those wounds, now I will autoheal a bunch of that damage back.

 

I do recommend taking Vulnerable Attack to cope with high DR enemies.  I built my Monk for fast attacks, so I just leave it on all the time, but it's a toggle so you can turn it on or off based on your target if you prefer.

[Smorensky]

Unfortunately Lightning Strikes ability is bugged atm did a test a while ago and most of the time it only adds 1% dmg instead of 10%. Occasionally it works as intended adding 10% dmg (noticably only when Turning Wheel is active with 2 or more wounds) but without it it adds only 1%, so I would avoid using it untill patch 1.03 is out.

 

As for Vulnerable strikes, it's a must have