Piracy or not?

[Malcador]

Interesting how it's seen as no choice, heh.  But usual growling as expected.

[Hurlshort]

 

You are setting a pretty low bar here for humanity.  Is it really that much to ask people to have some perspective on the value of entertainment?

 

I think your argument would hold more water if there wasn't a huge plethora of entertainment available for free all over the internet.  That should be the alternative, not piracy.

If you set your bar on humanity on such things as copyright violation I feel sorry for you, I would be more interested how did you act against mining companies which plunder your country? Maybe I am wrong but i think you did nothing against it - but I know, its easy to talk on forums about morality than actualy do something meaningfull

 

 

Whaaaa?

[BruceVC]

I dunno I've been very poor most of my life and we simply went without. Luxury goods were bought on steep discounts and usually bargain bin after months of saving up and waiting so I guess I just find it hard to sympathize 

 

This post for me is the most reasonable and obvious comment  that disputes the  justification around pirating. Since when did we get to a point in society where people feel entitled to pirate something because they deem the cost of it too expensive? The irony here is they wouldn't walk  into a Rolex store and steal a Rolex watch if they couldn't afford it because the risk of being caught is too great. So the reality is most people don't pirate because its a way of protesting against exorbitant prices but because they want a particular item and there is really no  risk of being caught and suffering some  consequence

[Malcador]

Not really irony in that case, just common sense as you say the risk is too great.

[Gromnir]

 

 

I dunno I've been very poor most of my life and we simply went without. Luxury goods were bought on steep discounts and usually bargain bin after months of saving up and waiting so I guess I just find it hard to sympathize

shush. don't you realize that it is complete unfair that some folks can afford ferraris and private jets? is nothing we can do about such injustice, but piracy helps level the playing field, if only a smidgen. no longer will expensive day one releases o' software be enjoyed only by the rich. sure, we could says that, particularly for games, all one needs do is wait a year and the title will likely be 50% as expensive, but is that a hurdle the damned bourgeois need consider? no! is manifest inequitable, and folks in eastern europe and southeast asia have no choice but to pirate games and movies in their fight to make the world a better place for puppies, grandmothers and cancer patients.  does shadysands have something against cancer patients, grandmothers and puppies?  

 

HA! Good Fun!

 

Not sure if that was good topic for irony

 

Ha! Stupid Fun!

 

actually, given the nature o' the arguments in favor o' piracy, am thinking irony is particular appropriate. 

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Malcador]

Not all bad though, technically abandonware is piracy no ?  Did laugh when I saw a release of 7th Guest a while back.  Kind of scratched my head wondering who could possibly be looking for a decades old game.

[Amentep]

I think, technically, it is possible for some fairly early 80s stuff to be out of copyright (and some games may be out of copyright if not properly registered), but yeah most things considered "abandonware" should still be under copyright.

[Gizmo]

 Since when did we get to a point in society where people feel entitled to pirate something because they deem the cost of it too expensive?

Years ago

 

You see this quite often with 3DStudio Max & Photoshop; people want them, but can't afford them ~so they decide that it's wrong, and that it's wrong that they should have to pay more than they can afford... so they endeavor to get them for free.

 

Can't say a thing to them about the reasons for this; because the message is ignored when it's understood to mean 'No soup for you!'.

Edited June 3, 2014 by Gizmo

[Rosbjerg]

In 2006 Microsoft announced that no less than 60million machines failed to pass their WGA test. Source. So piracy has always been widespread where people feel it's more convinient to copy than buy.

[Amentep]

I remember back in the days of the C64 knowing a lot of guys who'd buy one C64 game, then copy the contents of the disk to another disk and swap and share. Heck, some times they would get multiple games on a single disk. While there were attempts to stop the copying, they generally didn't seem to make a dent in anything.

 

It was a lot harder to pirate the cartridge C64 games (which, I imagine, was part of the appeal to developers about consoles like the NES).

[Gromnir]

In 2006 Microsoft announced that no less than 60million machines failed to pass their WGA test. Source. So piracy has always been widespread where people feel it's more convinient to copy than buy.

oh, the fundamental wrong o' information piracy is ridiculous old. without paying, a couple o' guys sneak into a tent to watch melanie the magnificent do her dance of twelve veils. even before codified notions o' theft or trespass, it were kinda obvious that the sneaks were doing something wrong. our petty voyeurs might complain that melanie weren't all that magnificent and that the ticket prices were ridiculous. far less likely they might observe that melanie were a slave and that their sneakiness were a protests 'gainst the way in which the performer were being exploited. heck, is not as if our sneaks stole anything and they weren't even preventing any paying customers from seeing melanie. after seeing melanie the first time they might agree that the show were worth the cost o' admission and so they were gonna pay to see her next time, honest. in fact, their viewing were creating an additional advertising opportunity for the show-- melanie and her promoters oughta' thank the sneaks for their help.  etc.

 

is old stuff we is talking 'bout. ridiculous old. the excuses is as lame today as they were in prehistory. 

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Malcador]

I remember back in the days of the C64 knowing a lot of guys who'd buy one C64 game, then copy the contents of the disk to another disk and swap and share. Heck, some times they would get multiple games on a single disk. While there were attempts to stop the copying, they generally didn't seem to make a dent in anything.

 

It was a lot harder to pirate the cartridge C64 games (which, I imagine, was part of the appeal to developers about consoles like the NES).

 

We did that with diskcopy for DOS stuff, was fun to photocopy (and pay to do do this sometimes) the manuals to get the copy verification codes

[Hurlshort]

That was a fantastic analogy Gromnir.

[Gorth]

 

 

When you say "push people hard enough they'll take matters in their own hands" what do you mean?

Most likely dangling something attractive in front of their noses and having the audacity to charge money for it.

 

I'm pretty sure that we both know very well how the music industry (as a very obvious example) has been treating both consumers as well as artists, in that light I can't help but feel that your interpretation of my words is rather disingenuous.

 

 

I fail to to see anything "disingenuous" in that. Please explain exactly how the music industry is forcing people to take matters into their own hand then. The hyperbole used in the post referred to makes it impossible to take it serious.

[Malcador]

Get the sense he'd be wasting the effort if he did.

[Hiro Protagonist II]

There are many reasons. For example, people have been buying TV show episodes legitimately for two, three years and all of a sudden, that legal alternative has been taken away. And for a lot of people the only possible legal way to continue to watch that TV show is if the TV show is released on dvd. And not all TV shows are released on dvd. So the only alternatives left to continue to watch the show is the 'free' option or to wait years for the dvds to be released in your area. It's not right but I can understand why some people do it. And the studios/networks don't help themselves when they're party to taking away perfectly legal alternatives.

[Hurlshort]

Well that settles it,t he next time my favorite show gets cancelled, I'm going to kidnap the cast and crew and make them shoot new episodes.  

[Malcador]

Well that settles it,t he next time my favorite show gets cancelled, I'm going to kidnap the cast and crew and make them shoot new episodes.  

Some Firefly fan will do it, eventually, those people are loons.

[Hiro Protagonist II]

I'm just going on the recent debacle with Game of Thrones in Australia. It got pulled from iTunes and Google Play where people were buying it from. Now a lot of people can't watch the show. Companies, ISPs and Google have come out and want a more open market. Google may have self interest in this but they are right. When you take away the availability for people to purchase the show as it was the case before, they'll go else where to get it.

[Hurlshort]

That's pretty much the way HBO works, they make their content a rather large pain to get a hold of legally.  I've had issues with that as well.  Thankfully there are these books that cover the basics of the plot, so I don't have to worry about people spoiling the storyline for me.

 

It's just not much of an excuse though.  There are plenty of times where I really want to watch something, so I check out Netflix, Amazon, Hulu, etc.  If I can't find it, I give up and go watch something different.  My life isn't really dramatically different because I didn't get to watch the Mountain fight the Viper.  

[Hiro Protagonist II]

I'm not excusing or justifying piracy. I'm merely explaining the why in one example. Content holders take away content. The public is left wondering why. They see another alternative and use it. We then have a new social landscape and new class of people who are more 'tech savvy' with things they arguably shouldn't be and they weren't before. I don't see this as a good thing where more people are passing on their knowledge, especially to their kids. It's changed the culture and habits of people to circumvent and not for the better. I'd rather a market place where content holders would release their content easier to the public, not take it away.

[BruceVC]

That's pretty much the way HBO works, they make their content a rather large pain to get a hold of legally.  I've had issues with that as well.  Thankfully there are these books that cover the basics of the plot, so I don't have to worry about people spoiling the storyline for me.

 

It's just not much of an excuse though.  There are plenty of times where I really want to watch something, so I check out Netflix, Amazon, Hulu, etc.  If I can't find it, I give up and go watch something different.  My life isn't really dramatically different because I didn't get to watch the Mountain fight the Viper.  

 

I don't know Hurlshot, what if you went to work the next day and the headmaster called you into his office and asked " have you watched the latest Game of Thrones episode " and you said "no"

 

What if he fired you immediately in anger for lack of Game of Thrones commitment. Without a job and revenue steam this would impact your family and I would assume dramatically effect your life?

Edited June 4, 2014 by BruceVC

[Gizmo]

 

I don't know Hurlshot, what if you went to work the next day and the headmaster called you into his office and asked " have you watched the latest Game of Thrones episode " and you said "no"

 

What if he fired you immediately in anger for lack of Game of Thrones commitment. Without a job and revenue steam this would impact your family and I would assume dramatically effect your life?

 

?

Is this supposed to mean justification to steal, merely because not to have it affects the person negatively? That's never justified ~not even for heart pills... but with heart pills at least it's a lot easier to forgive... though the person should still have to pay for them somehow.  Yet... How does that work if it's two guys in a room with one pill, because one guy lost his? (Is it okay to steal it then?)  *Yes it's a serious question; it's exaggerated for the point.

 

Edited June 4, 2014 by Gizmo

[BruceVC]

 

 

I don't know Hurlshot, what if you went to work the next day and the headmaster called you into his office and asked " have you watched the latest Game of Thrones episode " and you said "no"

 

What if he fired you immediately in anger for lack of Game of Thrones commitment. Without a job and revenue steam this would impact your family and I would assume dramatically effect your life?

 

?

Is this supposed to mean justification to steal, merely because not to have it affects the person negatively? That's never justified ~not even for heart pills... but with heart pills at least it's a lot easier to forgive... though the person should still have to pay for them somehow.

 

 

No of course you are right, I was just joking and using an example  to demonstrate how TV series are not  really relevant or critical to a persons life

[ManifestedISO]

Watch the Cosmos TV series and you'll change your mind there. Plus, next season, when crack shot Hayley Atwell shows up as Agent Carter, it's gonna be ultra-critical TV. Female lead, man, basically a superhero character. Can't wait.