SW: The Old Republic Part 5

[Raithe]

 

Remember, flipping power from shields to guns and back again at various moments really becomes a key strategy.

 

It's a key strategy even in the easiest ones for me

 

 

It makes them all easier, but it only becomes something you really HAVE to do for those heroic high level space missions.

[Spider]

Yeah, keeping your shield at maximum while maintaining as much firepower is very important.

[Gorth]

You get to practice a bit when you get your first converter at level 25, but you only really need that one for the last few of the standard missions.

 

Anyway, bounty hunter week is back and my toons are all over the galaxy maxing out my weekly reputation limit. Was fortunate enough that my marauder (level 35) found a guild member at level 55 who didn't mind giving a hand with kingpins (even in some of the remote places on the maps). Key is to *not* group together before triggering the kingpin (because he scales to the highest level of the group. A group of say level 27, 22 and 19 just take an example, would be royally screwed). Solo them with a high level backup that isn't grouped with you or, very unlikely, find somebody in your level range at the same time with the same kingpin mission (yeah right).

[Hassat Hunter]

http://www.swtor.com/info/news/news-article/20130910

Way to go with odd decisions BioWare...

 

Common thinking is that they're making people lvl up to 55 for the next digital expansion. But what crazy loonie would buy it if it goes free 3 months later? I know I wont, I'm gonna dough it out... silly BioWare.

Needless to say, a LOT of people are pissed ATM.

 

As for the space, I like heroics. Except for the Ice Field. It's too long and annoying and wheter you win or not really depends on the last 20 seconds, or you have to do it all over. I never do that one anymore.

The escort one mentioned before has to be my second favorite (after the Ambush, which is one of the easiest, even if somehow everyone lists it as Hard). The key to destroying the bombers is using your EMP on the last group. Softened up like that it only takes a few more shots to kill, easily netting you around 20 free kills.

And if you don't know it yet (dunno) you can hold the right mouse button to lock up all your missiles at once at different targets. It's also very helpful taking out bombers, capital ships and many other different situations.

[Gromnir]

looks like the major complaint is related to the $10 worth o' cartel coins folks get if they bought the expansion w/i the last month.  subscribers who purchased many months ago is rage spiraling 'cause their $10 purchase gets them an in-game title but no coins.

 

"Khan!"

 

am thinking we mentioned our thoughts regarding cartel earlier, so no need to heap more scorn and derision 'pon ea and bio's little scheme/scam.  

 

HA! Good Fun!

[alanschu]

 

 

Common thinking is that they're making people lvl up to 55 for the next digital expansion. But what crazy loonie would buy it if it goes free 3 months later? I know I wont, I'm gonna dough it out... silly BioWare.

Needless to say, a LOT of people are pissed ATM.

 

Is it the word "free" that bothers you?  Because it's not uncommon for the price of goods to decline, especially video games.  They just don't usually hit "free."  (Although in some cases, like TF2 and whatnot, they actually do).  Would you still be upset if it only cost $5?  $2?

[Spider]

If I start playing WoW today, I believe I get three full expansions included in the game, expansions that others had to pay for when they were released.

 

Sure, the time frame is a bit short, but I have no problem with this and no one in my guild has expressed displeasure over it (that I've seen), and a vast majority of us have bought it.

[alanschu]

The timing is definitely short (especially compared to WoW), but ultimately if one hadn't picked it up, they wouldn't be playing it now, which may be less than ideal to them.

 

 

It's like people complaining that a game goes on a Steam sale a month after you buy it.  Well, yeah, it'll probably have a Steam sale at some point.  But that doesn't help much if you are interested in playing it now.

[Gromnir]

some horrible metaphors. you guys should be ashamed. 

 

you buy a widget on Jan 1, 2001. congrats.  now as a proud widget owner we doubts you begrudge the owner of widgetXLT purchaser in 2005 who gots a better widget than did you. similarly, if 1 year after you buy your widget for 2 thousand grumlacks the same model is selling for 1 thousand grumlacks you is too angry or surprised. this kinda stuff is reasonable and rationale and commonplace.

 

make actual similar hypo. you buy your widget and 5 months and 28 days later, the maker o' widgets announces that widgets is gonna be free in 3 days time. in addition, anybody that purchased a widget in the last 28 days, and for next 3 days, gets a special flapper-doodle. some widget purchasers become angry. the majority o' those expressing displeasure is not bothered that widgets will soon be free but rather that the guys being rewarded with the flapper-doodle is the ones who purchased most recent. 

 

the flapper-doodle, a silly bit o' fluff that Gromnir thinks is nonsense, is nevertheless something many people wants. from a business pov we could see offering the flapper-doodle to anybody who purchases in the next 3 days. sure, many widget owners would still be angry that they lost out on such a keen reward, but would no doubt be dismissed as just another ploy to generate revenue before end of the quarter.  but the previous 28 days? is just... wacky. 

 

to us the whole situation is amusing, but we get why folks is unhappy.

 

damn. we didn't complete metaphor. we will fix to be fair. those who purchased widgets in first 5 months of release gets a special ribbon they can wear on their cardigans or blouses. ribbon is a merry shade o' yellow and gots one word emblazoned 'pon it: chump.

 

HA! Good Fun!

Edited September 11, 2013 by Gromnir

[Raithe]

Hm, managed to carve out some time to run through my first Bounty mission. Spend a fair bit of time running around shady characters before I finally managed to get four of them to talk. I think I ended up interrogating about 27 shady characters to get those four successes.

[Gromnir]

bad luck for you, but use your booze and torture probe for an almost guaranteed 2 wins. 

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Spider]

Talked a bit more to guildies and the only negative comment I've gotten is that they think the reward for people who bought it at launch should maybe be something more interesting than a crappy title, something more substantial (but no cartel coins, something more fun).

 

Other than that value is a relative thing. The expansion was worth $10 to me at launch, so I bought it. For me it was even worth paying early to get in on early access so I preordered in january.

 

If I had known the expansion would be free 4-5 months after launch, I would still have paid $10 for an extremely early access, because it held that value to me.

 

Everyone who felt it was worth it then probably has bought it already, so naturally the value of the product diminishes. has it diminished as far as to having no value? probably not, but I'm not very educated in Bioware's business. If it makes sense to them to give it away for free, then that's their decision.

 

Your widget analogy is missing a key component. The producer of said widget has a limitless supply and isn't selling anything of it anymore. So they have to make the choice of throwing away their entire supply, or use it as a marketing tool.

 

Do I understand why some are upset? Yeah, people don't like getting the value of the stuff they bought to diminish. I just don't agree with them that it's a problem.

[Hassat Hunter]

I've only bought it around 2,3 months ago? Just because the guild moved on to lvl 55 stuff and get a bit more story. If I knew it would go free in such a short amount of time, of course I would have waited (as would zbyl). And just giving us a title (I think I don't even get that, not being a sub atm) is certainly a kick in the balls. It was lazy to celebrate KOTOR, it's lazy now.

 

But I supposed the people getting RoHC now do get less value than me, what with BioWare breaking Seeker Droid Hunting and haven't fixed it at all yet and all. Starting to get really tired here of all the bs.

 

And tell me which title had such a huge pricedrop so fast on Steam. Some recent titles did have like 25% or 30% pretty rapidly... but "pretty rapidly" was already around 3-4 months. Not 100% at 6 months.

And I expect this will hurt them so much the next digital will dry up sales even sooner (hence my "free in 3 months"). It seems overall a REALLY bad move. Trying to gain a few more subbies currently. With hurting the other subbies. And while diminishing the value of subs with recent patches and 2.4 too. It's like, what the hell? The right hand wants more free players (thus restrictions gets lessened), and then the left hand goes all "we loose subs, let's get subs!" and then thinks this was a good idea, and not making it worse. Nothing seems to go right there. Recent wave of hotfixes seem to tell the same. What's going on?

 

Also, the bounty hunter event is on again? Got pretty sick of it last time, and it's not been enough time since then, so I think I will give it a pass. Maybe next month I'm in the mood for annoying load-screen heavy grind. The idea is good (getting people back on the planets) but oh, that loading screenage. And the fleetlag.

[Gorth]

Hm, managed to carve out some time to run through my first Bounty mission. Spend a fair bit of time running around shady characters before I finally managed to get four of them to talk. I think I ended up interrogating about 27 shady characters to get those four successes.

 

Random numbers can be a pain in the rear. When reverse engineering level 53 prototype aim armour mods (66's) for my main guy, I only succeeded to get artifact quality result on the 21st. That was a lot of expensive material wasted

 

I've since learned to make all level 53 mods and armours in all qualities, but the rest was considerably less ornery about giving results. So, always on the lookout for a good bargain on Beryllius on the GTN (and keeping my own guys with critical chances looking for rich/bountiful missions across all toons).

 

As for the ongoing discussion, not sure what the fuzz is about the expansion being given away. The only titles I made effort in getting were the bounty hunter ones... for adding to my bounty hunter.

 

Yes, games lose value fast. Most software does. That's why you can now (sometimes voluntarily, sometimes not) pay through the nose for upgrades and annual "maintenance" fees (another way of putting thumbscrews on customers).

 

Makes sense if sale of expansion has dwindled to insignificance to throw in as marketing tool. Heck, I still think the Pret-a-Hutt (Dr. Something) was worth the pre-order, just for having a level up station at hand when far away from home.

 

Not going to edit my previous post, but I think I called my level 35 for a marauder, he's actually a juggernaut. I just play him as a well armoured dps.

 

Edit: (yes, the irony of it) Speaking of random numbers, did 6 henchmen yesterday. Having not met DX-3 before, I got him 5 times out of 6. Random indeed. Now I just need to find T'Rubba and take him down twice (dead and alive). Then there are still a few kingpins to go.

[Gromnir]

 

Your widget analogy is missing a key component. The producer of said widget has a limitless supply and isn't selling anything of it anymore. So they have to make the choice of throwing away their entire supply, or use it as a marketing tool.

 

Do I understand why some are upset? Yeah, people don't like getting the value of the stuff they bought to diminish. I just don't agree with them that it's a problem.

horrible.  you wanna create a limitless supply AND have them dispose of such supply? your busted rationale is exactly what leads to people advocating piracy. 

 

also, keep in mind we noted that using as a marketing lure were having a valid economic component... albeit a very marginal one as we is talking about Three Freaking Days. the insanity is that purchasers is retroactively rewarded for past month worth o' purchases. 

 

and you can keep saying that everybody you talked to is fine with this (save one,) but that ignores the thread hassat linked, the facebook feedback, and some fleet dialogues we has seen... though most folks on fleet seem to be focused on bounty week yet. 

 

and speakings of bounty week, we noted that the kingpins is now weekly rather than daily. is not a big deal to us as we mindlessly farmed enough rep on the last run to near get us to legend anyway, but it does diminish their value somewhat.

 

sidenote:

 

we recent level'd another toon and hit the 40's.  am conflicted at 40. if we is doing pvp we wanna level as slow as possible to increase our comm pool. if pve, we take the 30% fp xp boost and make a lightning charge to 50. the reason we mentions is 'cause red reaper fp annoys us. is clearly busted, and has been busted for a Long time. as we does virtual nothing but fps 'tween 40 and 50, we see a good bit of red reaper. the thing is, if a person in your foursome doesn't know about weird aggro/spawn at the start of rr, a party wipe is likely... and worse. have seen people die 4 or 5 times as they keep trying to re-enter battle. dunno if it has become some kinda inside joke for bio not to fix or if people just don't complain. just yesterday we were lucky enough to warn a tank before he/she engaged first pull. afterwards he/she thanked us profusely: "i have been doing this for a year and didn't know about that trick." no trick. is just busted spawn. well, at least repair bills ain't as messed up as they were at the start of 2.0. 

 

HA! Good Fun!

 

gorth said: Random numbers can be a pain in the rear. When reverse engineering level 53 prototype aim armour mods (66's) for my main guy, I only succeeded to get artifact quality result on the 21st. That was a lot of expensive material wasted 

 

our personal worst random number horror story is running seventeen hardmode 55 flashpoints before getting a black-market loot drop for one of our characters. didn't have much luck on our first attempt to get a tauntaun mount either... folks running 'round claiming it only took'em 40 o' those fruit thingies as we is hitting 112, 113, 114. "fortune is a fickle mistress," and all that. 

Edited September 12, 2013 by Gromnir

[Spider]

 

 

Your widget analogy is missing a key component. The producer of said widget has a limitless supply and isn't selling anything of it anymore. So they have to make the choice of throwing away their entire supply, or use it as a marketing tool.

 

Do I understand why some are upset? Yeah, people don't like getting the value of the stuff they bought to diminish. I just don't agree with them that it's a problem.

horrible.  you wanna create a limitless supply AND have them dispose of such supply? your busted rationale is exactly what leads to people advocating piracy. 

 

 

They HAVE an unlimited supply. Anyone wants to buy the expansion, they can spawn a new copy immediately. The question really is just whether that resource will gain them more money by being given away or by trying to cram cash for as many copies as possible. Obviously Bioware thinks this is best for their business and they should have a better grasp of things then I do. They could be making a mistake sure, we'll see.

 

 

and you can keep saying that everybody you talked to is fine with this (save one,) but that ignores the thread hassat linked, the facebook feedback, and some fleet dialogues we has seen... though most folks on fleet seem to be focused on bounty week yet.

 

Except that's specifically what I haven't been saying. I make specific references to people in my guild, because that's the gauge that matters to me. Not because it's people I know, but because they're a fairly wide selection of people with very differing opinions on things. It's a real world sample that is relevant to me, and has proven to be a fairly good one to measure these sort of things in the past. I know it's all anecdotal, but so are thread on forums and facebook.

 

Speaking of which, whine threads on forums and facebook do precious little to convince me something is an issue, because a vast majority of people that post on forums are the ones who have things to complain about. People who are fine with something generally don't care enough. This doesn't mean those that complain don't have a point, it just means they're not automatically speaking for any sort of majority.

 

If anything fleet chatter would have been a better indication, but I haven't even seen it mentioned there, so I just don't see the outrage.

[Gromnir]

 

 

 

Your widget analogy is missing a key component. The producer of said widget has a limitless supply and isn't selling anything of it anymore. So they have to make the choice of throwing away their entire supply, or use it as a marketing tool.

 

Do I understand why some are upset? Yeah, people don't like getting the value of the stuff they bought to diminish. I just don't agree with them that it's a problem.

horrible.  you wanna create a limitless supply AND have them dispose of such supply? your busted rationale is exactly what leads to people advocating piracy. 

 

 

They HAVE an unlimited supply. Anyone wants to buy the expansion, they can spawn a new copy immediately. The question really is just whether that resource will gain them more money by being given away or by trying to cram cash for as many copies as possible. Obviously Bioware thinks this is best for their business and they should have a better grasp of things then I do. They could be making a mistake sure, we'll see.

 

 

and you can keep saying that everybody you talked to is fine with this (save one,) but that ignores the thread hassat linked, the facebook feedback, and some fleet dialogues we has seen... though most folks on fleet seem to be focused on bounty week yet.

 

Except that's specifically what I haven't been saying. I make specific references to people in my guild, because that's the gauge that matters to me. Not because it's people I know, but because they're a fairly wide selection of people with very differing opinions on things. It's a real world sample that is relevant to me, and has proven to be a fairly good one to measure these sort of things in the past. I know it's all anecdotal, but so are thread on forums and facebook.

 

Speaking of which, whine threads on forums and facebook do precious little to convince me something is an issue, because a vast majority of people that post on forums are the ones who have things to complain about. People who are fine with something generally don't care enough. This doesn't mean those that complain don't have a point, it just means they're not automatically speaking for any sort of majority.

 

If anything fleet chatter would have been a better indication, but I haven't even seen it mentioned there, so I just don't see the outrage.

 

zoinks. they have no SUPPLY they is disposing of. there is no tangible goods. is no space being taken up on shelves or distribution costs or any such. doesn't change initial hypo in the least. am talking in circles.  and of course you Skip the relevant part 'bout how the actual concern is the Retroactive 1 month grant o' coins. you is seriously channeling vol at the moment.

 

" I know it's all anecdotal, but so are thread on forums and facebook."

 

well, no, the facebook and thread stuff is not necessarily anecdotal. is an actual number one can derive from such things as the threads and facebooks. in first hour after posting article, there were over 50 pages in the discussion with the lion's share o' responses being complaints. etc. you simple saying that you talked to handful o' folks in guild and none complained is anecdotal in worst way. is not like a case study or similar useful anecdotal evidence-- is simply your gut reaction.  oh, and your belief that whine threads is showing only a small % of total player reaction is true, but in this case it works much against you as well. if hassat hadn't posted link, we wouldn't have even known what bio/ea was doing. your almost nonsensical suggestion 'bout the the coin grant being a valid marketing ploy (which we noted in opur original hypo) is diminished significant given that there were no real marketing done save for that one article on the swtor site. what % of players do you thinks checks boards daily? am betting the majority o' players don't even play daily, but no doubt you got a different gut reaction based on communication with your guild fellows.

 

and the idea that fleet chatter is a better indicator boggles the mind. seriously. seriously? how many folks is ever involved in fleet debates at any one time? how many such responses is even relevant to issue at hand? 

 

"Your widget analogy is missing a key component. The producer of said widget has a limitless supply and isn't selling anything of it anymore. So they have to make the choice of throwing away their entire supply, or use it as a marketing tool." 

 

keep in mind that the above is what we has been arguing over por past couple posts and  you seems to have complete lost track.  there is No supply being discarded and we already had addressed the minimal marketing potential in Our hypo. so no, the component were neither missed nor key... and am thinking you is simple in reflexive defense posture at this point if you cannot simple see that you were flat-out wrong. serious.

 

HA! Good Fun!

 

ps we actually saw a Good rationale for the seemingly silly coin grant via spider's non-existent fleet chatter discussion. rationale is as follows: people who bought the expansion in the last month would probably feel cheated to know that game is going free so soon after their purchase... not getting $10 value if you buy in last few weeks. buy 6 months ago and you is more likely to have gotten value.  the coin grant for recent purchasers is, in effect, an apology/refund for recent purchasers.  kinda weak, but is understandable

Edited September 12, 2013 by Gromnir

[Gorth]

Looks like I might have a use for my complimentary xp boosts for my level 55 guy after all. He may not get any xp, but he still contributes "xp" to the legacy. Might as well use them then, as I'm not holding my breath for any imminent expansions that raises the level cap.

 

My Commando is now level 47 and getting busy leveling up to 50 (just for kicks, so I can complete the various republic space missions, need photon torpedoes for that).

[Hassat Hunter]

Pretty sure the XP-boosts don't boost Legacy XP (the legacy XP boosts don't).

[Gromnir]

just hold onto the bound boosts. eventually you will get use outta them. 'course Gromnir has 129 rackghoul dna samples in our inventory, waiting for them to become relevant once again, so perhaps we is not your best guide in this matter.

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Gorth]

 

Ok, I think I might just hang on to them then. It's not like there is an expiry date on them. I shipped out all the non-bound stuff to "younger" toons. My trooper is now level 48, heading for 49 (and really need to gets his gear upgraded before going into a flashpoint again).

 

Finished chapter 2 for the guy. Seems like there is a pattern there, get the 5th companion and lose one of the old ones. Then go do something before you can get old companion back.

 

Fortunately for both my bounty hunter and my trooper, it wasn't anyone I missed particularly much (Torian being a bit redundant for a BH) and Aric guarding the ship for most of the journey of my trooper so far. I liked him in the beginning, but once

Elara got on board and I had to chose who got promoted, things deteriorated a bit with his whinging

 

 

Tanno Vik is by far my favourite trooper companion. Let's see what the 5th and final guy brings to the table.

[Gorth]

Just re-appropriating this as my own little blog thread...

 

My Commando is now level 49 and having learned some lessons from my Bounty Hunter, I'm in no rush grinding the last two space missions. While I would love to have the fleet commendations for the later ship upgrades, they are also accompanied by a trillion experience points (rough estimate).

 

Who knows, he might actually get to play some of the later flash points before hitting 55 (and making the normal ones unavailable through group finder).

 

Tip to not level up: Stay away from GSI dailies, they give obscene amounts of XP too. Treasure hunting with the binoculars (my bounty hunter) is a nice diversion on odd occasions though, although it gets old quickly if overdoing it. Got a lot of speeder parts for that guy (something called Exploiter and Pleasure something speeders)

 

Read some patch notes about those parts (except one) becoming unbound in a later update, which means my toons can pool their resources presumably.

 

One thing I found that helps my crafting factory is the underworld trading mission "Secret Recipe" is a great source of Beryllius. Got two ship droids with critical modifiers in Underworld Trading and they regularly score critical hits giving an addition 3 of the good stuff. I use it to make the grade 66 purple mods for my main toons and just for good measure the assembly lines are now producing the same stuff although only in "prototype" quality for companions. Really need to get my Artifice guy up to speed though, need those Enhancement mods (the number of variants of those seems to explode exponentially when reaching higher level mods though).

 

Edit to add:

 

Regarding the bounty hunter event, I made a mistake and assigned Ord Mantell kingpin to two different toons. Forgot one had already traded in the contract for the quest. Bummer. Still only actually brough down two kingpins, as finding people your level, your timezone and your place all at once is a royal pain in the rear anatomy. Brought down the Hutta and Tattooine kingpins. Got the contract for the Nar shaddaa one (and two Ord Mantells). Still got a stockpile of 45+ henchmen contracts to purchase kingpin contracts for. Just not sure which characters would have the best chances of eventually bringing down their specific targets.

[Spider]

45?? You really liked killing henchmen did you?

 

I did just enough to get the achievements the first time around and a few extra this time so I could get legend status by yesterday, and I'm not close to killing as many as you have

[Gorth]

45?? You really liked killing henchmen did you?

 

I did just enough to get the achievements the first time around and a few extra this time so I could get legend status by yesterday, and I'm not close to killing as many as you have

My main guy went for the achievement. In the meantime, I had a large roster (15 in fact) of toons that is level 15 or higher (way back, I experimented a bit to see which advanced class I would stick with for a while). Half of them also have ships.

 

Parking them all on the fleet, they grab an assignment, priority transport capital world, talk, interrogate 4 (originally 5) shady characters, talk again, kill kingpin, quick travel back to have final chat and priority transport back to fleet. Depending on luck with shady characters it takes 10-20 minutes.

 

Doing one or two in the morning before going to work (while listening to news), one while waiting for dinner in the oven in the late evening and a few before going to bed. You can make 5 contracts in a day easily (twice as many on weekends if you spend a bit on time rotating between more toons)

 

Edit: Not to mention a good source of xp and credits for low level toons in the 15-19 range)

[Spider]

Oh, I know you could get them easy enough, just that with the five you bought you've done over 70 henchmen missions (well, two kingpins, but you said 45+).

 

For reference, I have maybe done 20-30 henchmen missions total, which was enough for legend status and the achievement (together with a whole slew of kingpin missions of course).

 

You do know the achievement is shared between characters? So kill or capture a henchman with one char and none of the others will need it? Just wondering since you said your main went for the achievement when it's a group effort

 

I was just curious to the amount. If you find them rewarding to do, then that's awesome. And I suppose you're right in that they give good xp, all my chars are 55 so wouldn't know really (and credits stopped being a problem for me a long time ago).