Series of Detective/Investigative Quests

[agewisdom]

If I remember correctly, BG2 has a small quest requiring investigation on some murder cases. In order to have more interesting quests, could we have something like this.

 

There could be a series of preliminary small quests given by a guild or gathering of detectives. Undertaking these quests could improve one's awareness and detective skills. After undertaking a series of smaller quests, the PC could stumble onto the main quest.

 

This could be an overarching plot, such a a secret clut ala Cthulhu that is trying to revive their Dead God by performing a series of macabre rituals through certain locations empowered by lay-lines (i.e. magically empowered locations). The local authorities in each of these regions are stumped as they are working individually.

 

Throughout his adventures, the PC will stumble onto the aftermath of these bizzare rituals. If he is intelligent enough or has a companion who is, he will detect similarities between each of these rituals. E.g. the murder victims were killed the same type of weapon, death occured during full moon etc.

 

This may set him off to investigate the individuals in town and uncover the conspiracy taking place amongst the cultist. The finale may involve the PC either:

1. Exposing and eliminating the cult

2. Threatening the cult and obtain bribes to keep his mouth shut.

3. Joining the cult and fusing his soul with the Elder God for awesome powers in the current gameplay, at the cost of permanently damning his soul...

[Merin]

NWN 2 and KotOR both had great investigative sequences as well. I'm all for them.

[generic.hybridity]

Yeah, always a good style of quest. Helps break from the tedium of just running from A to B.

[Darth Trethon]

I rather not, I'd much rather be thrown in an epic struggle for power over the world not unlike in Fallout New Vegas but with magic, far more epic conflicts and a grand end where you can potentially(depending on choices) become emperor or perhaps even become an immortal/invulnerable deity(mage class should be required for such ah ending imo). Investigating petty cults seems meh...I rather go right to exterminating them, you know, skip the boring parts.

[Merin]

Investigating petty cults seems meh...I rather go right to exterminating them, you know, skip the boring parts.

 

We have different definitions of "boring" - slaughtering people does't entertain me.

[Monkcrab]

If it's a series of deaths, I'd rather investigate a Hannibal Lecter-styled serial killer who's intelligently evil and can charm and outwit you, with the killer potentially killing off important NPCs if you don't piece together the clues in time.

[ohmygodsquad]

I rather not, I'd much rather be thrown in an epic struggle for power over the world not unlike in Fallout New Vegas but with magic, far more epic conflicts and a grand end where you can potentially(depending on choices) become emperor or perhaps even become an immortal/invulnerable deity(mage class should be required for such ah ending imo). Investigating petty cults seems meh...I rather go right to exterminating them, you know, skip the boring parts.

 

Couldn't disagree more. The investigation/trial quests in BG2, KOTOR, The Witcher, NWN2, were some of the best quests in their respective games. I always love a good mystery. And you're acting like the main quest is the only quest in the game, nothing wrong with side quests.

[Darth Trethon]

Investigating petty cults seems meh...I rather go right to exterminating them, you know, skip the boring parts.

 

We have different definitions of "boring" - slaughtering people does't entertain me.

 

It's all in how you do it. I enjoy noncombat means as much as combat depending on circumstances but I really see nothing else to do with a cult unless I could persuade them to worship me and investigating it seems redundant....they're a cult....what do you expect they're into, baking cookies?

Edited September 24, 2012 by Darth Trethon

[ohmygodsquad]

Investigating petty cults seems meh...I rather go right to exterminating them, you know, skip the boring parts.

 

We have different definitions of "boring" - slaughtering people does't entertain me.

 

It's all in how you do it. I enjoy noncombat means as much as combat depending on circumstances but I really see nothing else to do with a cult unless I could persuade them to worship me and investigating it seems redundant....they're a cult....what do you expect they're into, baking cookies?

 

I dunno, you could prove to them their deity is actually a manipulative mage using illusions and tricks to gain their adoration?

 

Not every cult is an evil, baby killing cult. It could apply to any religion outside the norm.

 

Besides, its not like we have to investigate a cult, that was just an example. There could be a series of murders, or a crooked merchant, or a thieves guild, or a gang. It could be anything. I don't see why anyone wouldn't like being a detective to break up the monotony of monster slaying.

[Darth Trethon]

I could potentially enjoy investigating something on a grand scale....a missable/optional line of side quests that if completed ties back into the main plot in a major way. It's all in how it's done I suppose.

 

As for cults....well a group has to be harmful to others or preach hate to earn the classification. The term has been misused quite a bit where it didn't really apply to niche groups but that's the definition more or less.

[agewisdom]

ohmygodsquad,

 

There doesn't always need to be combat in the cult. The inner circle may require direct combat but most of the followers and people on the fringe wouldn't need killing. They are just misled... A really devious PC could use this to his advantage and milk the followers for oh... just about anything, power, money, s*x, etc....

 

Exactly, the cult investigation is just an example. There could be many other types of investigations, just think of the X-Files or Templars...

[Metabot]

Yes, but make it so you really have to think and ask the right questions, etc.

[curryinahurry]

Investigating petty cults seems meh...I rather go right to exterminating them, you know, skip the boring parts.

 

We have different definitions of "boring" - slaughtering people does't entertain me.

 

It's all in how you do it. I enjoy noncombat means as much as combat depending on circumstances but I really see nothing else to do with a cult unless I could persuade them to worship me and investigating it seems redundant....they're a cult....what do you expect they're into, baking cookies?

 

I think (hope) the OP was using this as an off the cuff example. I would much prefer investigative quests to be rooted in political intrigue or factions trying to screw each other over.

 

I would also like them to take us in unexpected directions; a missing child leads to uncovering a secret slave trade, as an example. Or a situation where the PC gets hired to hunt down rivals to a political faction or a brutal landowner and finds a secret organization acting in the shadows to do good for commoners, etc.

[Wombat]

Desirably, depending on how the players to deal with quests, even the same can be solved in an investigative way, as well as a bloodthirsty way. It would be not wise to expect suth thing in every single quest but, at least, I think that is what the designers are aiming at.

[agewisdom]

Metabot - yeah... the hard part is in designing a well thought out quest...

 

Darth Trethon - about going straight and eliminating the cult in a big battle... Well, firstly, cults are by their very nature secretive... I'd very much doubt they'll going about shouting... here I am, a cultist - come and eliminate me.... Hmm... actually a lot of CRPGs are like that - which is just wrong! Secondly, even if you eliminate the cult HQ, what makes you think you've really discovered the inner circle or heads of the cult? Without proper investigation, going in and attacking people is going to land you into a hot soup, esp. if the Cultist Leaders are powerful, influential and politically connected people.

 

Curryinahurry - Yep, it's just a simple example ... quite generic I know. But you know what, we could always turn the stereotypes on its' head... What if you find out that the Cultist are a shade of grey and you actually agree with some of their actions. And then find out that the faction that's hunting them is really the ones that's in the wrong? You may decide to side with the Cultist and eliminate the faction that's hiring you instead....

 

These are just ideas but I'd really like some investigation style quests where you don't quite know what's going on... and get a feeling of trepidation as you progress further into the case.

Edited September 24, 2012 by agewisdom

[Darth Trethon]

With their entire cult wiped out the leaders would either disappear or they would come at me seeking revenge, presuming they got away.....either way they'd be of no concern.

[agewisdom]

With their entire cult wiped out the leaders would either disappear or they would come at me seeking revenge, presuming they got away.....either way they'd be of no concern.

 

1. Only if you could find their hidden HQ in the first place. Unless you're going undercover or spy on them, how are you going to do that? They wouldn't announce this....

 

2. You'd be surprised how easily cults can mushroom again given the right conditions. If there's a trodden underclass, a charismatic evil NPC can easily recruit large numbers provided he has cash and influence.

 

Anyways, the cult is just an example. There could be a lot of different other cases that Obsidian can use.

Edited September 24, 2012 by agewisdom

[curryinahurry]

Metabot - yeah... the hard part is in designing a well thought out quest...

 

Darth Trethon - about going straight and eliminating the cult in a big battle... Well, firstly, cults are by their very nature secretive... I'd very much doubt they'll going about shouting... here I am, a cultist - come and eliminate me.... Hmm... actually a lot of CRPGs are like that - which is just wrong! Secondly, even if you eliminate the cult HQ, what makes you think you've really discovered the inner circle or heads of the cult? Without proper investigation, going in and attacking people is going to land you into a hot soup, esp. if the Cultist Leaders are powerful, influential and politically connected people.

 

Curryinahurry - Yep, it's just a simple example ... quite generic I know. But you know what, we could always turn the stereotypes on its' head... What if you find out that the Cultist are a shade of grey and you actually agree with some of their actions. And then find out that the faction that's hunting them is really the ones that's in the wrong? You may decide to side with the Cultist and eliminate the faction that's hiring you instead....

 

These are just ideas but I'd really like some investigation style quests where you don't quite know what's going on... and get a feeling of trepidation as you progress further into the case.

 

I think that example could be fine. In all honesty, its more the word, "cult" that I am responding to as they seem to be such a staple of this genre; sometimes done well, but often done poorly. But yes, if the PC's investigation into such an operation met with interesting twists such as you mentioned, or if, in another example, you were about to move against a cult and an unexpected party (a respected local, or government official), and that uncovered a deeper and broader conspiracy, I would be all for such quest development.

[Darth Trethon]

With their entire cult wiped out the leaders would either disappear or they would come at me seeking revenge, presuming they got away.....either way they'd be of no concern.

 

1. Only if you could find their hidden HQ in the first place. Unless you're going undercover or spy on them, how are you going to do that? They wouldn't announce this....

 

2. You'd be surprised how easily cults can mushroom again given the right conditions. If there's a trodden underclass, a charismatic evil NPC can easily recruit large numbers provided he has cash and influence.

 

Anyways, the cult is just an example. There could be a lot of different other cases that Obsidian can use.

 

Do what? I plan to do nothing unless they come after me in which case the finding them is very easy. With their followers wiped out I don't figure people would exactly line-up to join and go chase the guy that wiped them out in the first place....that would be idiotic and suicidal. If it really came down to it fresh recruits should be far easier to extract information out of but I seriously doubt it would come to that.

[dknight99]

I love me a good old mystery. Who wouldn't want a little Ace Attorney in my CRPG?

[agewisdom]

Do what? I plan to do nothing unless they come after me in which case the finding them is very easy. With their followers wiped out I don't figure people would exactly line-up to join and go chase the guy that wiped them out in the first place....that would be idiotic and suicidal. If it really came down to it fresh recruits should be far easier to extract information out of but I seriously doubt it would come to that.

 

I see that the word "Cult" has raised quite a few misconception. Some of you are thinking this is a typical bwa-ha-ha, I am a member of an evil Cult that is wanted by the authorities and hated by everybody. The Cult based on my idea is more or less like a secretive religious organization that does a lot of good work on the surface.

 

If it's based on such a scenario, your decision is going straight into the Cult HQ and start massacring their followers will have grave repercussions. What's your justification? Without any investigation, you are just going to start killing old men, women, children also just because they happen to be in the Cult HQ? Perhaps, let me change the Cult HQ to say, a Learning Centre or a Temple. Are you going to kill them just because they happen to have different beliefs? I think the authorities will also come after you if you do anything like that.

[Darth Trethon]

Do what? I plan to do nothing unless they come after me in which case the finding them is very easy. With their followers wiped out I don't figure people would exactly line-up to join and go chase the guy that wiped them out in the first place....that would be idiotic and suicidal. If it really came down to it fresh recruits should be far easier to extract information out of but I seriously doubt it would come to that.

 

I see that the word "Cult" has raised quite a few misconception. Some of you are thinking this is a typical bwa-ha-ha, I am a member of an evil Cult that is wanted by the authorities and hated by everybody. The Cult based on my idea is more or less like a secretive religious organization that does a lot of good work on the surface.

 

If it's based on such a scenario, your decision is going straight into the Cult HQ and start massacring their followers will have grave repercussions. What's your justification? Without any investigation, you are just going to start killing old men, women, children also just because they happen to be in the Cult HQ? Perhaps, let me change the Cult HQ to say, a Learning Centre or a Temple. Are you going to kill them just because they happen to have different beliefs? I think the authorities will also come after you if you do anything like that.

 

What you describe is not a cult....by definition the group has to be harmful to others(human sacrifices, violence towards outsiders, brutal initiations or other such things) to actually be categorized as such. As I said the word has been misused for all kinds of things from different religious groups to small and dedicated niche groups of fans but those are NOT cults though they may fancy themselves as such.

[septembervirgin]

What if the detective just doesn't like the cult (or any individual) and decides to insist that they're adjunct to any wrongdoing? Evidence can be planted, you know. Not all detectives are goodly.

[nikolokolus]

Do what? I plan to do nothing unless they come after me in which case the finding them is very easy. With their followers wiped out I don't figure people would exactly line-up to join and go chase the guy that wiped them out in the first place....that would be idiotic and suicidal. If it really came down to it fresh recruits should be far easier to extract information out of but I seriously doubt it would come to that.

 

I see that the word "Cult" has raised quite a few misconception. Some of you are thinking this is a typical bwa-ha-ha, I am a member of an evil Cult that is wanted by the authorities and hated by everybody. The Cult based on my idea is more or less like a secretive religious organization that does a lot of good work on the surface.

 

If it's based on such a scenario, your decision is going straight into the Cult HQ and start massacring their followers will have grave repercussions. What's your justification? Without any investigation, you are just going to start killing old men, women, children also just because they happen to be in the Cult HQ? Perhaps, let me change the Cult HQ to say, a Learning Centre or a Temple. Are you going to kill them just because they happen to have different beliefs? I think the authorities will also come after you if you do anything like that.

 

What you describe is not a cult....by definition the group has to be harmful to others(human sacrifices, violence towards outsiders, brutal initiations or other such things) to actually be categorized as such. As I said the word has been misused for all kinds of things from different religious groups to small and dedicated niche groups of fans but those are NOT cults though they may fancy themselves as such.

 

Uh ... nope ... didn't find that bit:

 

cult (kʌlt) — n 1. a specific system of religious worship, esp with reference to itsrites and deity 2. a sect devoted to such a system 3. a quasi-religious organization using devious psychologicaltechniques to gain and control adherents 4. sociol a group having an exclusive ideology and ritual practicescentred on sacred symbols, esp one characterized by lack oforganizational structure 5. intense interest in and devotion to a person, idea, or activity:the cult of yoga 6. the person, idea, etc, arousing such devotion 7. a. something regarded as fashionable or significant by aparticular group b. ( as modifier ): a cult show 8. ( modifier ) of, relating to, or characteristic of a cult or cults:a cult figure [C17: from Latin cultus cultivation, refinement, from colere totill]

 

http://dictionary.re...com/browse/cult

Edited September 24, 2012 by nikolokolus

[Shevek]

Investigation quests can work really well if the title does it right.

 

I loved that one Vampire: Bloodlines mission - "Ocean house." It was an investigative style quest. That was easily one of the game's highlights for me.

One of the first cRPGs I played was Raveloft: Strahd's Possession. That had a real investigative mood/vibe to it too. Love that kinda stuff.