Legalise marijuana

[Humodour]

Simply put, your anecdote does not match reality, IMHO. "Local losers" are losers when they sober and drunk, as well as speeding - keep that in mind.

 

Let's get some details - did they smoke it or inject it or snort it or swallow it? Because injecting and smoking are a lot more addictive and powerful then a pill or snort. Amphetamine isn't a hallucinogen, either. You don't 'trip' (unless you haven't slept for days and/or take waaaaaaaaaay too much) - you get a rush. It augments reality rather than blurring it as the narcotics, depressants and hallucinogens do. Was it methamphetamine (more potent and damaging than non-methylated amphetamine, also known as ice or meth or crystal)? Dextro-amphetamine (obesity, narcolepsy and ADHD medication)? Street speed (dextro and laevo-amphetamine)? Methylendioxy-methamphetamine (Ecstasy/MDMA)? Were they even on amphetamines or was it actually cocaine (a related stimulant)?

 

Compared to alcohol, the long-term health impacts are less for amphetamine, too (alcohol's cancer and disease risk is very high). Alcohol also has a pretty strong addiction potential (both physical and mental). To the point that if an alcoholic immediately goes cold turkey they can die (delirium tremens). Amphetamine also doesn't get metabolised into a carcinogen in your body.

 

Amphetamine is used illicitly to party, but also by scientists, mathematicians (Erdos is a good example), lawyers, truck drivers, and fighter pilots to augment their abilities in their respective fields.

 

I think the issue here is not that amphetamine is harmless (it isn't), but that alcohol is harmful. Perhaps you have an overly rosy view of grog?

Edited July 7, 2010 by Krezack

[I want teh kotor 3]

Sweet. Less money for the government to spend on futile efforts.

[Purkake]

 

Oh wait this was about weed legalization? Yeah, alright cool, go for it.

 

Awww man, she looks delicious.....

Why would you use a "dat ass" picture in response to a boob picture? Does not compute.

 

 

Everyone loves Larissa Riquelme, though.

 

Edited July 7, 2010 by Purkake

[Walsingham]

Not that govts don't waste money in other interesting ways.

 

Viz this shocking scandal of the former government paying Serco

[Humodour]

What damage does marijuana cause to society, Wals? Economic loss from people forgetting to set their alarms for work because they were too stoned the previous night?

 

I'm sorry, I don't buy the 'societal damage' line. Marijuana is less addictive than alcohol and causes people to lay around. They don't go stealing TVs to get their next hit, and they don't get all worked up and start fights in pubs.

 

I think marijuana is beneficial to society. It leads to creativity, socialness, and relaxation. All good, positive things in a high-gear consumption society.

 

Edit: Yes, that's the only part of your post I took issue with.

Edited July 7, 2010 by Krezack

[Nepenthe]

Simply put, your anecdote does not match reality, IMHO. "Local losers" are losers when they sober and drunk, as well as speeding - keep that in mind.

I'm not saying speed made those guys losers, I'm saying it's the drug of choice for "antisocial elements" around here. I have no idea what it is (it's always just "amphetamines" after the blood test, anyway, or MDPV for the past ~6 months), and I doubt the users do, either. All I'm saying is that on that scale, and in my experiences, speed did have a relatively high correlation with violent crime. As in, from personal experience, I'll be a lot more wary with people who do speed than those who drink

 

But I guess so does alcohol, and pretty much any substance (including dog poo) can be abused in some manner. 'shrug*

 

Edit: my thoughts made more sense before I started editing the post initially. But I guess I don't really have a particularly strong attitude towards weed, at any rate, I'm just doing some fairly heavy eyebrow raising at the "scale". While I've had cases of people being killed over cigarettes, it always seemed less directly related to the substance than, say, speed freaks psyching out and stabbing random old ladies on the street.

Edited July 7, 2010 by Nepenthe

[Purkake]

@Krez: Isn't just "laying around" detrimental to the society, though?

Edited July 7, 2010 by Purkake

[Humodour]

@Krez: Isn't just "laying around" detrimental to the society, though?

 

Why? That's sounds a bit too much of an argument for central planning for my liking. People are entitled to relaxation. People are entitled to only work as many hours as they need the money and get stoned the rest. People are even entitled not to work at all, foolish as that is. I'm pretty sure allowing all this is healthier for society than jailing millions of people for nothing more than trying to relax.

 

But anyway, I imagine you've smoked before, so you know that laying around stoned is no worse a use of time than spending the night on the pisser.

 

The other thing to consider is that people who are smoking weed are less likely to do other things (alcohol, cocaine, cigarettes, etc).

[Purkake]

Geez, I was just kidding.

 

Having fun is probably also detrimental to the society or at least profitability.

[Hurlshort]

Krez is a little high strung for a stoner.

[Humodour]

Geez, I was just kidding.

 

No annoyance was meant. Perhaps my tone is wrong. I am stoned.

 

Having fun is probably also detrimental to the society or at least profitability.

 

But this hints at a deeper question: why should we seek ever-increasing profits? The main argument for increasing population, too, is increasing the economy. To what end? The aim of society should be human happiness, freedom, quality-of-life, and contentedness, not profit and money. This is no anti-market rant, but simply an observation that sometimes there are things that trump consumption and capitalism.

[Gorgon]

What damage does marijuana cause to society, Wals? Economic loss from people forgetting to set their alarms for work because they were too stoned the previous night?

 

I'm sorry, I don't buy the 'societal damage' line. Marijuana is less addictive than alcohol and causes people to lay around. They don't go stealing TVs to get their next hit, and they don't get all worked up and start fights in pubs.

 

I think marijuana is beneficial to society. It leads to creativity, socialness, and relaxation. All good, positive things in a high-gear consumption society.

 

Edit: Yes, that's the only part of your post I took issue with.

What was the name of that special drug panel member under Brown who got the sack for saying acid and hash were mostly harmless and a waste of time to pursue legally...

[Gorgon]

Cannabis, while not completely harmless, is most certainly the best suited for moderate and frequent consuption of all the drugs I've tried, not counting small amounts of alcohol like a beer or two a day. I've used it for more than a decade, starting from when I was 13 and am a relatively succesful person with meaningful relationships and a good career. I'm pretty much the proof that you can be a daily smoker of weed and live a completely "normal" life (altho my life isn't that normal, but that's a lifestyle choice). I'm all for cannabis legalization, if only that kids as young as I was started later and with purer, better weed than what we had to smoke back then.

You may be coping, but I still say daily use is not recommend. It should be a weekend sort of thing as a rule of thumb just IMHO. It's not like the prime stuff is exactly cheap either.

[Humodour]

Cannabis, while not completely harmless, is most certainly the best suited for moderate and frequent consuption of all the drugs I've tried, not counting small amounts of alcohol like a beer or two a day. I've used it for more than a decade, starting from when I was 13 and am a relatively succesful person with meaningful relationships and a good career. I'm pretty much the proof that you can be a daily smoker of weed and live a completely "normal" life (altho my life isn't that normal, but that's a lifestyle choice). I'm all for cannabis legalization, if only that kids as young as I was started later and with purer, better weed than what we had to smoke back then.

You may be coping, but I still say daily use is not recommend. It should be a weekend sort of thing as a rule of thumb just IMHO. It's not like the prime stuff is exactly cheap either.

 

Yep. I value my lungs too much to smoke often. Need to buy a vapouriser for exactly this reason.

 

What damage does marijuana cause to society, Wals? Economic loss from people forgetting to set their alarms for work because they were too stoned the previous night?

 

I'm sorry, I don't buy the 'societal damage' line. Marijuana is less addictive than alcohol and causes people to lay around. They don't go stealing TVs to get their next hit, and they don't get all worked up and start fights in pubs.

 

I think marijuana is beneficial to society. It leads to creativity, socialness, and relaxation. All good, positive things in a high-gear consumption society.

 

Edit: Yes, that's the only part of your post I took issue with.

What was the name of that special drug panel member under Brown who got the sack for saying acid and hash were mostly harmless and a waste of time to pursue legally...

 

Yeah, that was a complete disgrace. Jacqui smith is a retard too. A bunch of the scientists got fired, a lot more resigned in disgust.

[Purkake]

Geez, I was just kidding.

 

No annoyance was meant. Perhaps my tone is wrong. I am stoned.

 

That would be awesome for a public speech

 

Having fun is probably also detrimental to the society or at least profitability.

 

But this hints at a deeper question: why should we seek ever-increasing profits? The main argument for increasing population, too, is increasing the economy. To what end? The aim of society should be human happiness, freedom, quality-of-life, and contentedness, not profit and money. This is no anti-market rant, but simply an observation that sometimes there are things that trump consumption and capitalism.

Damn you dirty hippies, some for us have to work for a living, you know.

 

Seriously though you need one to get the other, at least until we manage to establish a utopia.

[Meshugger]

I can think of the only reason to ban marijuana would be that people would simply stop taking life seriously if it was legal.

[Hurlshort]

This could be a terrible blow to the tourism industry in Amsterdam.

[HoonDing]

Tourism industry in Amsterdam depends on something very different from cannabis.

[Hurlshort]

Tourism industry in Amsterdam depends on something very different from cannabis.

 

American tourists can go to Nevada for that though.

[Krookie]

Pot should be legalized, but the same people that advocate so heavily for it are probably going to be the ones to abuse it. In my opinion.

[LadyCrimson]

If it's legal to grow at home in 25 sq. feet (with no permits required?) CA wouldn't see nearly as much revenue as some expect since it's very easy to grow (good stuff) in a couple containers in a closet, just for personal consumption, cutting out/limiting any need for a middleman grower. There'd be little need for taxed pot farms (like there is with fruit/vegie farms & distribution) except for hemp products like rope or whatnot.

 

Although, there could be revenue from permits from public places that might want to allow consumption on their grounds (weed bars!) and I suppose that could lead to having to buy/consume offered product instead of your own (like booze) and eventually it might become a normal enough thing to produce a lot of income.

 

Yes, it may be irrelevant in terms of whether it should be legal/not legal, but it is interesting to mull over the possible (social/political) results of legality. Such as, if it's legal to grow that much at home, will consumption initially rise dramatically enough to cause any problems for a while? I mean, if you can suddenly grow it (without any legal fear or neighbors paranoia) instead of having to scrounge up cash to buy it, over-indulgence could rise. Would this mean anything? imo, probably nothing more than a few more skipped classes/work days...but it'll be interesting to watch.

 

California, the land of sun, raisins, happy cows, and a pot plant growing on every balcony.

Edited July 7, 2010 by LadyCrimson

[Enoch]

Tourism industry in Amsterdam depends on something very different from cannabis.

 

American tourists can go to Nevada for that though.

Anybody in the U.S. with enough money to fly to Amsterdam probably doesn't have much trouble getting his or her hands on some reefer domestically.

 

It'll be a tricky balance, but I think that with the focus on enforcement and incarceration costs, we can get to a point where it is politically palatable to decriminalize marijuana without appearing to celebrate its use in doing so.

[Syraxis]

Why would you use a "dat ass" picture in response to a boob picture? Does not compute.

 

 

Everyone loves Larissa Riquelme, though.

 

Because I imagined for a moment my two hands on dat ass squeezin dem butt-cheeks.

[Humodour]

I'll certainly be adding California to my list of places to travel!

[Nightshape]

Yes, okay... I agree.