Dragon Age Tactics

[HoonDing]

Is there a tactic that lets rogues automatically get behind & backstab enemies? Nice thing about warriors is that they don't require much micromanagement and can simply wade in and do their thing. Same thing goes for archer girl who does her thing well without getting into throuble. I basically always micromanage my mage, who runs around the battlefield throwing fireballs, freezing/shattering mooks, casting sleep, etc.

 

If I make a PC rogue, I don't have the energy to constantly micromanage two party members in RTwP and figure in this case I'll have to bring along Wynne and not rely on any offensive magic damage aside from the pew-pew staff... and basically rely on the rogue for damage. Which would kinda suck a lot. So with my style of play, I'm not really seeing a playthrough with a rogue.

 

I've actually already made a Dalish Elf rogue and will test a bit, but I will probably reroll a Dalish Elf DW warrior.

Edited December 1, 2009 by virumor

[jaguars4ever]

Is there a tactic that lets rogues automatically get behind & backstab enemies?

The closest I've got is "enemy-->attacking player-->attacking main character-->attack. I also like to throw in a coat-weapon-with-poison instruction for added effectiveness...but this can be pricey.

 

BTW virumor, are mage gloves that add % elemental damage of any use to my Arcane Warrior? I'm curious as to how they work: would they add elemental damage to all my spells, just the complimentary elemental spells, my staff attacks, or my sword attacks?

[Monte Carlo]

^ Yeah, good point. There are two ways around this:

 

1. There's a feat, I'm not sure what it's called but you can get it from the rogue skill tree at level 4. Combat tactics? It widens the arc for possible backstab, which is pretty effective... it works pretty well as long as you get a tighter flank in for the attack. Less micromanagement.

 

2. For mob battles I just stealth the rogue and move him in behind the mob. When it all kicks off and they are mobbing a taunting, heavily armoured character I'm already in position, and using the feat above I'm getting in good hits. I can then fall back and use archery (with Imoen Chick I did this all the time with scattershot etc).

 

Still a bit of micromanagement, but not as dull as constantly clicking on the rogue to make sure he's in exactly the right place.

 

Cheers

MC

[jaguars4ever]

^You know, another way to automate back-stabs (or back-stab equivalents) that's guaranteed to get the job done is by using 2 tactics:

 

1) Enemy-->Nearest Visible-->Stealth

2) Enemy-->Nearest Visible-->Attack (or any special attack)

 

Of course, you'll have to have at least level 3 stealth in order to cloak in combat.

[HoonDing]

Playing with a rogue is where I wish the combat was turn-based.

 

BTW virumor, are mage gloves that add % elemental damage of any use to my Arcane Warrior? I'm curious as to how they work: would they add elemental damage to all my spells, just the complimentary elemental spells, my staff attacks, or my sword attacks?

I think any % elemental damage on anything save staffs only adds to spell damage.

 

Staff damage is calculated by multiplying a factor (ranging between 0.1875 and 0.25) with Spellpower, IIRC. Elemental bonuses & Staff Focus further increase power.

Edited December 1, 2009 by virumor

[alanschu]

^ Alan, so what you're saying is that an Icewind Dale syle game using this engine would be pretty impractical? Because I could create an awesome, game-breaking team of bespoke characters?

 

I can see this mod coming pretty soon, just like in BG2 you could 'multiplay' your own party as a single player. T'would be a shame, although I suppose you could just make the battles harder too.

 

An icewind style game would have to be more difficult IMO.

[HoonDing]

I think I'm just going to make my Dalish Elf rogue a pure archer and take Ranger specialization. It may be a bit underwhelming in the beginning (ha!), but eventually with Arrow of Slaying & Scattershot it is pretty good. Doesn't matter anyway, since mages do 50% of party damage in my playthroughs.

 

Not to mention those summoned pets don't sound bad.

 

But eh... archery isn't bugged like the daggers, is it?

Edited December 1, 2009 by virumor

[jaguars4ever]

^The only purpose summoned pets serve are blood sacrifices for my Blood Mage.

[Monte Carlo]

Trying to build the perfect jack-of-all-trades Rogue.

 

It's not easy, what with there being no meaningful explanation of the games mechanics and my irrational fear that the DEX hotfix will break my game

 

So in the end I though a smidgeon of STR so I can wear a bit of armour now and then, lots of DEX and a fair bit of CUNNING. I'm going to carry very light weapons and almost no armour. I want to be able to:

 

* Fight. Properly, in melee combat without tanking obviously

 

* Use bombs and poison

 

* Shoot Stuff, like a ninja sniper assassin

 

* Sneak about

 

* Open every lock in the game

 

This is what a rogue should be. I have been experimenting and it's tough --- you just don't have the points to do everything you'd like to do.

 

Anyhow, I've made a satisfactory character who is of course silly rich (left Ostagar with 23 gold pieces without selling my Red Dragon Armour and with the two bargain rucksacks). I've been very picky with combat skills, tending towards the passive (less micromanagement). I've yet to go archery, but that's my next set of skills to get the Critical Shot O Death ability.

 

A surprising thing I've discovered is that my dude does far more damage, very quickly, with two small weapons as opposed to one big weapon and one small one (decision = stop pumping STR) and, even wearing some weird barbarian fur ****tail dress I found in the Korcari Wilds I saunter about in combat without actually getting hit very much (decision = pump DEX). Even low level stealth is quite useful, it has changed the combat dynamics a great deal. One hugely annoying feature is that if you equip a bow and specialist arrows it empties your alt.weapon slot. Oh well.

 

Combat works a bit like this - I sneak about and lure bad guys into the rest of the party. I then cut about hurling bombs and backstabbing before retreating and shooting stuff. As someone who usually tanks, this takes a while to get used to... leaving the poor old warriors to play pin cushion for you.

 

Anyway, that's how the rogue is working out for me as a non-specialist 'D&D' style thief... my advice is don't fixate on having to go down one route and collect all the powaz... mix and match.

 

Cheers

MC

[Gromnir]

something seems strange with many o' the high cunning builds we has seen for rogues. high cunning may replace str for damage, but not hit v. miss. if you stop at 27 or 28 for str and 36 for dex, won't you end up kinda sucky at hitting the big bads? am recalling that more than a few elite type critters has that seeming persistent weakness aura that lowers attack and defense by 10 points. am aware that there is a couple o' powhaz that allow the rogue to add cunning score to damage, but it seems like many o' the cunning build folks act as f cunning is a replacement for str, and it ain't.

 

also, as we noted earlier, we has seen very few additional cunning based dialogue options... can count on one hand after finishing redcliffe, dalish and mage tower.

 

am looking at numbers and trying to figure out why folks is so enamored with cunning for rogues as we don't see a payoff compared to a high str rogue.

 

HA! Good Fun!

Edited December 1, 2009 by Gromnir

[Tigranes]

An icewind style game would have to be more difficult IMO.

 

Absolutely. I was pleased at how hard DA was at the start, but now I'll be transitioning into mod-land, using respec'd characters that minmax out to combat the evil that is fan-modded difficulty.

 

...That is, as soon as I get this idiotic thing working. Reinstalling now... maybe I'll just restart the whole thing with the Nightmare Plus mod fully on, and really screw myself.

 

MC, I'm wondering just how far you can go trying to do both melee and ranged - are you going to get the melee-oriented / backstab-oriented talents as well? They are a hefty investment and I wonder how viable that would be. If it was me I'd just go Stealth Archer route, but I guess you are trying the jack of all trades thing. Difficulty?

 

edit: high cunning = better stealth, i.e. need 26 to beat bosses, better stealing, open locks, better persuade i think, sometimes cunning dialogue, some combat benefits. I didn't see it as number one priority for my rogue, though.

[Monte Carlo]

^ I know, I'm as baffled. Am assured that with high cunning and the right items my Critical Hit chance can max out at 50% which with my already high attack speed, backstab and momentum will stack into a sick DPS build (am also going for Tier 4 stealth for the old Klingon cloaking trick). STR, apparently, doesn't come into it at all.

 

This is from my occasionally drunken perusal of geekily mathematical post on Bio social-networking thing.

 

Cheers

MC

[Gromnir]

^ I know, I'm as baffled. Am assured that with high cunning and the right items my Critical Hit chance can max out at 50% which with my already high attack speed, backstab and momentum will stack into a sick DPS build (am also going for Tier 4 stealth for the old Klingon cloaking trick). STR, apparently, doesn't come into it at all.

 

This is from my occasionally drunken perusal of geekily mathematical post on Bio social-networking thing.

 

Cheers

MC

 

lack o' transparency makes character building such a crap shoot.

 

HA! Good Fun!

[Monte Carlo]

MC, I'm wondering just how far you can go trying to do both melee and ranged - are you going to get the melee-oriented / backstab-oriented talents as well? They are a hefty investment and I wonder how viable that would be. If it was me I'd just go Stealth Archer route, but I guess you are trying the jack of all trades thing. Difficulty?

 

I play Hard on mobs and sometimes switch it down to Normal for boss fights depending on what it is. I don't play with optimal parties and find that the re-specced spellcasters just break the game.

 

Anyway, I'm taking the passive DW skills and want Momentum - not bothered about modal extra damage as my passive backstab is more than adequate. The critical chance archery tree is the other one. Add this to my panzer-grenadier antics (you really can have fun with bombs and poison) and I can easily take along good old Sten (frail!) and another rogue as well as Morrigan. Two rogues is a challenge I'm interested in playing for a bit.

 

Cheers

MC

[alanschu]

The only advantage strength had for me was utilizing bigger weapons. I found I did more damage in combat with two later game mainhand weapons, but even then my strength only peaked at like 25 or something (with a +2 boost). The vast majority of my points went into Cunning.

[CoM_Solaufein]

Closed for length.