Volourn Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 Wow. Grom doesn't want magic to be magic. He wants it to be just like 'real world' stuff. Might as well not call it magic, then. Let's call it Alternate Talents. And, sorry, 1/3 of DA spells are not useless. That's silly talk. You sound like the people who said a bunch of spells in BG2 were useless. They aren't. Just ebcause YOU don't find them useful (cause you didn't figure them out), doesn't mean they were useless. DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoonDing Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 One might as well respec and make Wynne & Morrigan Arcane Warriors. That would break the game completely. The ending of the words is ALMSIVI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oner Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 One might as well respec and make Wynne & Morrigan Arcane Warriors. That would break the game completely.+ the PC. Giveaway list: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1DgyQFpOJvyNASt8A12ipyV_iwpLXg_yltGG5mffvSwo/edit?usp=sharing What is glass but tortured sand?Never forget! '12.01.13. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entrerix Posted November 24, 2009 Share Posted November 24, 2009 is arcane warrior that overpowered? Killing is kind of like playin' a basketball game. I am there. and the other player is there. and it's just the two of us. and I put the other player's body in my van. and I am the winner. - Nice Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoonDing Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 (edited) Can anyone explain why my mage's fatigue is 10%, even when completely stripped naked? Is this a bug? I reckon it should 0.0% is arcane warrior that overpowered? You're invulnerable as arcane warrior against everything save bosses, but due to the huge fatigue penalty basically you'll only be able to cast Blood Magic spells. So basically it's pretty boring... auto-attacking every mook to death. Edited November 25, 2009 by virumor The ending of the words is ALMSIVI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gromnir Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 ... tell us again how wonderful the mako stuff were in ME and how magic in a Game is necessary unbalanced. is always some new silliness right 'round the corner when vol posts. bah. vol likes pie. is easier that way. HA! Good Fun! "If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927) "Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deraldin Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 Can anyone explain why my mage's fatigue is 10%, even when completely stripped naked? Is this a bug? I reckon it should 0.0% Do you have any sustained spells active? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volourn Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 "tell us again how wonderful the mako stuff were in ME and how magic in a Game is necessary unbalanced. is always some new silliness right 'round the corner when vol posts." yeah, it is horrible for someone liking something you don't. OMGZ ! Volourn likes the mako! What a horrible, horrible person he is. R00fles! As for arcane warrior, I've never tried so can't say but for those who have it does seem to be the strongest specialty. DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WILL THE ALMIGHTY Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 DA has no Mako, right? I'm buying it then. "Alright, I've been thinking. When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade - make life take the lemons back! Get mad! I don't want your damn lemons, what am I supposed to do with these? Demand to see life's manager. Make life rue the day it thought it could give Cave Johnson lemons. Do you know who I am? I'm the man who's gonna burn your house down! With the lemons. I'm going to to get my engineers to invent a combustible lemon that burns your house down!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volourn Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 Did you know that ME and DA are set in the same universe? DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oner Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 (edited) I'm sure I saw Kane at the Landsmeet . Archmage bicsiz, feel my fiery fury! Edited November 25, 2009 by Oner Giveaway list: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1DgyQFpOJvyNASt8A12ipyV_iwpLXg_yltGG5mffvSwo/edit?usp=sharing What is glass but tortured sand?Never forget! '12.01.13. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaesun Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 Did you know that ME and DA are set in the same universe? Some of my Youtube Classic Roland MT-32 Video Game Music videos | My Music | My Photography Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monte Carlo Posted November 25, 2009 Author Share Posted November 25, 2009 Does that mean lots of cliched NPCs with laser guns can be recruited to fight the Darkspawn? Because that would be so cool my head would like explode. Or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanschu Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 I would chuckle if there was an easter egg in ME2 about the DA planet actually existing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WILL THE ALMIGHTY Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 Sounds like bad fanfic. "Alright, I've been thinking. When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade - make life take the lemons back! Get mad! I don't want your damn lemons, what am I supposed to do with these? Demand to see life's manager. Make life rue the day it thought it could give Cave Johnson lemons. Do you know who I am? I'm the man who's gonna burn your house down! With the lemons. I'm going to to get my engineers to invent a combustible lemon that burns your house down!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoonDing Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 Do you have any sustained spells active? That seems to be the culprit, thanks. Does that mean lots of cliched NPCs with laser guns can be recruited to fight the Darkspawn? Because that would be so cool my head would like explode. Or something. The ending of the words is ALMSIVI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junai Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 (edited) Balance.. IMHO, in a good rpg-setting it's unnecessary to balance classes damage-wise as long as they all play important roles in the campaign. Take the second Conan-movie; the thief - Marek - is a total clown and completely hopeless, yet indispensable. In the same way, the party's mage - Akiro, saves the day a few times. He defeats a at least one major opponent in a very particular mage-battle. Why shape crpgs after a D&D 4'th ed. model where every class does exactly 3[W] damage on a certain level, whether they are fighters or mages? Systems and settings like that are just unimaginative. One thing that frustrated me to no end with NWN1 was all the useless acid-traps which did 10-20-something hps. As a fighter I just walsed thru them and paid no attention. Now if the OC had a few original and completely lethal traps, playing a rogue might have been interesting. Or if a locked treasure-chamber was accessible only to an experienced thief. When a char of every class can pick a lock, open it with a spell or bash open the chest - it just gets boring. And when they all do the same damage, it's just a watered down consol-system. Rp gone. J. Edited November 25, 2009 by Junai Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gromnir Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 "One thing that frustrated me to no end with NWN1 was all the useless acid-traps which did 10-20-something hps. As a fighter I just walsed thru them and paid no attention. Now if the OC had a few original and completely lethal traps, playing a rogue might have been interesting. Or if a locked treasure-chamber was accessible only to an experienced thief." with a party of two and utilizing the D&D rules, such a thing were impossible. having genuine lethal traps when your 2-man party might be absent a thief would be resulting in more than a little player frustration. and use Conan the Destroyer as example is probably not your best approach. *shrug* like it or not, da is a combat heavy game. Most crpgs is combat focused. even thiefy skills is actual related to combat potential. why does you care what is in that locked and trapped chest? find gold or 10075. the gold and 10075 is used to improve your equipment... which makes you better in combat. in a pnp rpg you can play a gimped character and it can be fun... 'cause pnp role-play has very little in common with single-player crpg role-play. is no genuine cooperative and impromptu storytelling with a single-player crpg. very few crpgs is anything other than glorified tactical combat games... with some rpg elements thrown into the mix. da, in particular, is a combat intensive game. unlike the pnp role-play game in which playing the gimp can be fun, and dm/gm can tailor so as to keep fun, a combat crpg is somewhat less entertaining if it appears that like one class choice is clearly most efficacious in combat. alan observed that the game testers and bio folks believed that the most powerful da parties were three mages and a tank/meat shield. sorry, but that is bad design. can you make a game where every class is equal fun even if there is a disparity in combat power? sure you can... but with a combat heavy game like da... the crazy-stoopid aspect of da is that while mages is clear having the most potential power, they is also the most easy to gimp in character creation and advancement. there is some sucky da spells, regardless of what vol believes, and if you make some seemingly rational but wrong choices, your mage may be less than fun to play. is a fun game... but the biowarians developed a somewhat peculiar system with some serious balance issues. no doubt they can fix before da2... though am not sure they will. HA! Good Fun! "If there be time to expose through discussion the falsehood and fallacies, to avert the evil by the processes of education, the remedy to be applied is more speech, not enforced silence."Justice Louis Brandeis, Concurring, Whitney v. California, 274 U.S. 357 (1927) "Im indifferent to almost any murder as long as it doesn't affect me or mine."--Gfted1 (September 30, 2019) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entrerix Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 i agree with a lot of what gromnir is saying here, but i should add that the respec mod takes a lot of the awful guesswork out of the equation. i think good rpg balance requires your party to be an even mix of all available classes. dragon age doesnt really nail this because mages are so strong. 4th edition doesnt nail this either because it doesnt really matter what classes are in a party, they are all similar enough to eachother that it makes little difference (from my play experience, only about 15 hours) Killing is kind of like playin' a basketball game. I am there. and the other player is there. and it's just the two of us. and I put the other player's body in my van. and I am the winner. - Nice Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanschu Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 there is some sucky da spells Which spells in particular did you find were useless? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entrerix Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 (edited) mana drain. i tried using it several times and it's just a crap spell, for it to be of any use you need to keep their mage alive, which is a tactically terrible idea. it would have been way better if using it were just like taking a lesser lyrium potion at the enemy's expense. Edited November 25, 2009 by entrerix Killing is kind of like playin' a basketball game. I am there. and the other player is there. and it's just the two of us. and I put the other player's body in my van. and I am the winner. - Nice Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoonDing Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 Mana Drain eventually leads to Mana Clash, which is an awesome spell. In fact, if enemies would use this spell on your mages, the game would be almost impossible to play. Spell Might is a great spell since it is necessary for Storm of the Century combo, but again you need to take 2 crap spells to gain access to it... so in the end one might as well simply take Inferno. The ending of the words is ALMSIVI. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volourn Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 (edited) "with a party of two and utilizing the D&D rules, such a thing were impossible. having genuine lethal traps when your 2-man party might be absent a thief would be resulting in more than a little player frustration." Never needed a rogue in BG2 and that was a 6 character party. In fact, i have never played a D&D game where you needed any class let alone a thief. "is some sucky da spells, regardless of what vol believes" Never thoughtr you'd be so ignorant. I didn't say there were NO useless spells. In fact, I named an entire line of spells that I find 'useless'. Just remember, a spell YOU find useless may not be so 'useless' to someone else. Just like BG2, or any other RPG with spells. Or heck, same with non spell talents/skills. Also, there was some rather dangerous traps in NWN - just as many as in any IE game. My perfect strategy for an IE game trap - run through it. R00fles! Edited November 25, 2009 by Volourn DWARVES IN PROJECT ETERNITY = VOLOURN HAS PLEDGED $250. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanschu Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 In my experiences thief characters seemed more useful, and perhaps more "necessary" in Baldur's Gate than in NWN. Although by Thief character I was content with Imoen. Just someone that could disarm traps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
entrerix Posted November 25, 2009 Share Posted November 25, 2009 trap disarming was pretty important in bg. i thought it was moderately important in dragon age too actually. mana drain does lead to mana clash. but mana drain by itself still generally sucks balls and is a poor spell, not even worth the time to cast it, and alan was asking which spells were not useful, so i named one Killing is kind of like playin' a basketball game. I am there. and the other player is there. and it's just the two of us. and I put the other player's body in my van. and I am the winner. - Nice Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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