President Ahmadinejad's Speech at Columbia University

[Yuusha]

@Everyone: Hahahaha.... man the double standard in this forum sickens me! I only made like two 'humorous' posts and almost everyone here like: "grow up" "don't be such a troll" etc etc...

 

But when guys like Tale, the architect or Kaftan Barlast do it you guys are like: "Oh man that was funny" "Tale wins" "Kaftan, you are so cool"

 

:yucky:

[Gorgon]

But, it's possible to track individual batches of plutonium by their composition so it should theoretically be possible to determine where any given detonated bomb comes from. Of course if no one knows where Iran gets their plutonium from to begin with it doesen't matter, but, neuclear bombs aren't usually anonimous.

 

Iran has been actively pursuing their interests by sponsoring and infiltrating Hezbolah and Hamas, but to actually give those groups something as potent as an A bomb is probably detrimental to their own interests. I believe they only want one finger on the button, their own.

Edited October 1, 2007 by Gorgon

[Meshugger]

@Everyone: Hahahaha.... man the double standard in this forum sickens me! I only made like two 'humorous' posts and almost everyone here like: "grow up" "don't be such a troll" etc etc...

 

But when guys like Tale, the architect or Kaftan Barlast do it you guys are like: "Oh man that was funny" "Tale wins" "Kaftan, you are so cool"

 

:yucky:

 

Yeah! Totally duuuude! It's liek hypacrazy an' stuff!

 

Really, calm down and explain rationally, without insult on how the rest of the forum is wrong and why he is right and a nice guy in the world of politics. And no quotes, use your own words.

[Guest The Architect]

@Everyone: Hahahaha.... man the double standard in this forum sickens me! I only made like two 'humorous' posts and almost everyone here like: "grow up" "don't be such a troll" etc etc...

 

You made two humorous posts? But, I don't even see one.

 

But when guys like Tale, the architect or Kaftan Barlast do it you guys are like: "Oh man that was funny" "Tale wins" "Kaftan, you are so cool"

 

 

That's not entirely correct, since I'm not seen as one of the forum comedians around here. My presence in the WoT section generally goes unnoticed, or at least I believe so anyway, not that I'm complaining or anything. It's all good.

[Walsingham]

Can anyone summarise so far? I was busy all weekend.

[Sand]

President of Iran gave speech at Columbia.

 

People got pissed for various reasons.

 

Yuusha makes some silly comments.

 

People got pissed for various reasons

 

Yuusha gets sillier.

 

Some decide to ignore it and go to other threads, while others don't in order to bash the silliness.

 

You posted. I posted.

 

I hope that clears things up, Walsh.

[Yuusha]

@Sand:

He supports terrorism. He is a terrorist. When he was in the US he should have been taken immediately into custody as an enemy of the state. He is puppet leader of a country whose state religion supports bigotry, fascism, and discrimination. He is no better than Osama Bin Ladin, and should have been shot on sight.

Let me make one thing clear to you Sand. Islam DOES NOT support bigotry, fascism and discrimination!!!! Islam does not recognize the caste system found in Hindu, slavery and above all, Islam teaches equality.

 

Iran has one of the largest Jewish community in the middle east, and the Iranian government acknowledges their every right. They even have a representative in parliament. If you don't believe me, feel free to do your own research. If, as you say, Mr Ahmadinejad is no better than Bin Laden, there wouldn't be a single Jew left alive in Iran today.

 

"Shot on sight" What? No trial?

 

The guy is a major idiot as well. He denies that the Holocaust happened yet there are strong documentation and eye witnesses that it did, yet believes in some religion where there is no proof that God ever spoke to Muhammad whatsoever except that he said He did. Hmmm... One has proof yet denies it while the other has no proof but he believes it to be true. Sounds pretty idiotic to me.

Mr. Ahmadinejad is not an idiot. He's a professor at a university and teaches regularly. So what if he's a theist? It doesn't change the fact that he's a very intelligent man. He questions the holocaust because of his firm believe that there just might be 'inaccuracies' in popular history. What is so wrong about that? Is it not the mark of an intellectual to question things?

 

It's a shame Bush didn't got the balls to debate Mr. Ahmadinejad at Columbia University. I would've loved to watch Mr. Ahmadinejad PWNED Bush's hairy behind!

----------------------------------------

 

@TheArchitect:

Who in their right mind would support a hypocritical, homophobic, holocaust denying, ****-talking person like President Ahmadinejad? Ah yes, I know who. An Indonesian hippy who laughs at their own jokes that nobody else finds funny. Sound familiar?

For your information, I'm not the only one who strongly believe in Mr. Ahmadinejad. Almost a billion Muslims around the world see him as the Imam (spiritual leader) we've been searching for all this time. He's influence is increasing even as we speak. What about your precious George W Bush? Can you say the same about him?

 

Oh and thank you for your slightly racist comment. It was swell.

------------------------------------------

 

 

@Messhuger:

Yeah! Totally duuuude! It's liek hypacrazy an' stuff!

 

Really, calm down and explain rationally, without insult on how the rest of the forum is wrong and why he is right and a nice guy in the world of politics. And no quotes, use your own words.

You're right. I apologize for letting my emotion get the better of me.

 

When those lunatics hit the twin towers they didn't just victimize the innocent 3000 people that were killed that day. They also victimized a billion+ Muslims around the world that absolutely had nothing to do with it. And now every time I go online I have to deal with idiotic comments and videos that said Islam this and Islam that and everything that goes with it. After a period of ignoring I guess I kinda snapped.

 

Anyway, let's get on with it shall we and I'm not gonna tell you what you don't already know.

 

The root of Islamic extremism is Palestine. I'm sure most people here know this, but choose not to care for some unknown reason. The US since 60 years ago have been stealing the Palestinian lands to form the ever expanding state of Israel. The Iranian government since the days of Khomeini, have been continuously fighting the US's unfair middle eastern policy. You must understand that although there are 'factions' within Islam, most of us Muslims agree that the forming of the state of Israel is unacceptable for reasons mentioned above.

 

The US with its godlike power have 'crippled' almost all Muslim countries around the world. The Kingdom of Saudi Arabia is no longer a threat since the assassination of King Faisal (some believed it was staged by the US). Pakistan, Indonesia, Malaysia etc are Muslim countries that pose no real threat to the US' hegemony due to lack of resources.

 

But then Mr. Ahmadinejad came along with his plans on acquiring nuclear program. And just like the previous great leaders of Iran, he is a man that inspires hope. It's no wonder that the western world sees him as some homophobic, bigoted whatever even comparing him to Hitler no less (though he hasn't done anything to deserve that). The western Media (controlled mostly by Jews) is successful in shaping the opinion of the public that Mr. Ahmadinejad is out the destroy the world. The power the media has over the mindless masses truly frightens me.

 

Mr. Ahmadinejad stated time and time again that the Nuclear program he is trying to acquire would be of peaceful purposes. Honestly, even I don't buy that. I'm not saying he's gonna actually use it against Israel or the US, but it's indeed a powerful bargaining chip. After all, power conceived is power perceived. Or is it the other way around? Doesn't matter.

 

So Mess, to answer your question as to why I support Mr. Ahmadinejad. Here's my answer: He fights to liberate our fellow Muslims in Palestine. He fights for justice!

[Sand]

Islam teaches equality, eh?

 

Tell that to women who are forced to wear viels and burkas, or can't even get driver's licenses just because they were born female. Tell me how many women in Islamic Middle Eastern countries are allowed to participate in the military. Tell that to the homosexual men and women who have to live in fear for their lives because if they are found out they are killed.

 

Also if there are such an equal society why, oh why, is there such a need to keep the genders separate in mosques and in places of business. Segregation and separation does not ever equal equality, Yuusha. Never has and never will. Islam supports treating women as second class citizens. Plain and simple.

 

Also you didn't get what I said, Yuusha. There is no credible sources of God's existence. None whatsoever. Yet he believes in God. Now, there are quite a number of credible sources that dictates that the Holocaust happens. One has no credible sources, yet he believes it, the other has credible sources yet he denies it. That is why he is an idiot.

 

I don't give a rat's ass about faith. I go by the facts and credible sources of information only. The Quran is no more a credible source of information than the Bible, the Book of Morman, or the Torah. Since there is only one source of information that talks about Muhammad's teaches and his experiences with God I find it quite questionable.

Edited October 2, 2007 by Sand

[kirottu]

The guy is a major idiot as well. He denies that the Holocaust happened yet there are strong documentation and eye witnesses that it did, yet believes in some religion where there is no proof that God ever spoke to Muhammad whatsoever except that he said He did. Hmmm... One has proof yet denies it while the other has no proof but he believes it to be true. Sounds pretty idiotic to me.

Mr. Ahmadinejad is not an idiot. He's a professor at a university and teaches regularly. So what if he's a theist? It doesn't change the fact that he's a very intelligent man. He questions the holocaust because of his firm believe that there just might be 'inaccuracies' in popular history. What is so wrong about that? Is it not the mark of an intellectual to question things?

 

So death of 11 000 000 000 people could be just an "inaccuracy" and didn

Edited October 2, 2007 by kirottu

[kirottu]

Islam teaches equality, eh?

 

Tell that to women who are forced to wear viels and burkas, or can't even get driver's licenses just because they were born female. Tell me how many women in Islamic Middle Eastern countries are allowed to participate in the military. Tell that to the homosexual men and women who have to live in fear for their lives because if they are found out they are killed.

 

Also if there are such an equal society why, oh why, is there such a need to keep the genders separate in mosques and in places of business. Segregation and separation does not ever equal equality, Yuusha. Never has and never will. Islam supports treating women as second class citizens. Plain and simple.

 

Islam doesn

[Sand]

For me, it is.

 

You either support freedom and equality, as a whole, or you don't. I hold Islam the same standards as I do Christianity, Judaism, and any other religions that has popped up here and there over the centuries.

[Tale]

The guy is a major idiot as well. He denies that the Holocaust happened yet there are strong documentation and eye witnesses that it did, yet believes in some religion where there is no proof that God ever spoke to Muhammad whatsoever except that he said He did. Hmmm... One has proof yet denies it while the other has no proof but he believes it to be true. Sounds pretty idiotic to me.

Mr. Ahmadinejad is not an idiot. He's a professor at a university and teaches regularly. So what if he's a theist? It doesn't change the fact that he's a very intelligent man. He questions the holocaust because of his firm believe that there just might be 'inaccuracies' in popular history. What is so wrong about that? Is it not the mark of an intellectual to question things?

 

So death of 11 000 000 000 people could be just an "inaccuracy" and didn

[Sand]

I hope not. There was only about 3 to 4 billion people around in WW2.

 

Roughly 5.5 million Jews died due to the holocaust, not 11 billion.

Edited October 2, 2007 by Sand

[Meshugger]

Let me make one thing clear to you Sand. Islam DOES NOT support bigotry, fascism and discrimination!!!! Islam does not recognize the caste system found in Hindu, slavery and above all, Islam teaches equality.

 

The women, homosexuals, other religious factions disagree with that.

 

Iran has one of the largest Jewish community in the middle east, and the Iranian government acknowledges their every right. They even have a representative in parliament. If you don't believe me, feel free to do your own research. If, as you say, Mr Ahmadinejad is no better than Bin Laden, there wouldn't be a single Jew left alive in Iran today.

 

Yep, they have the largest jewish community in the middle east. But can they have saturday off because of the sabbath? Nope. Can they teach hebrew? Nope. Do they have the same job-oppurtunities as their fellow muslims? Nope. Should i go on? Nope.

 

Mr. Ahmadinejad is not an idiot. He's a professor at a university and teaches regularly. So what if he's a theist? It doesn't change the fact that he's a very intelligent man. He questions the holocaust because of his firm believe that there just might be 'inaccuracies' in popular history. What is so wrong about that? Is it not the mark of an intellectual to question things?

 

I've been to the Bergen-Belsen concentration camp, and our schools have had lectures from the survivors of the holocaust. The nazis carefully documented every single jew that died in their camps. Trust me, he is using it as a political ploy to rally muslims around the world for his cause. Read about the "Einsatztruppen", read Shirer's "The rise and fall of the third reich".

 

For your information, I'm not the only one who strongly believe in Mr. Ahmadinejad. Almost a billion Muslims around the world see him as the Imam (spiritual leader) we've been searching for all this time. He's influence is increasing even as we speak. What about your precious George W Bush? Can you say the same about him?

 

The only ones seing Bush as their spiritual leader are the looniest of the evangelian groups, predominately in the US.

 

You're right. I apologize for letting my emotion get the better of me.

 

When those lunatics hit the twin towers they didn't just victimize the innocent 3000 people that were killed that day. They also victimized a billion+ Muslims around the world that absolutely had nothing to do with it. And now every time I go online I have to deal with idiotic comments and videos that said Islam this and Islam that and everything that goes with it. After a period of ignoring I guess I kinda snapped.

 

Anyway, let's get on with it shall we and I'm not gonna tell you what you don't already know.

 

The root of Islamic extremism is Palestine. I'm sure most people here know this, but choose not to care for some unknown reason. The US since 60 years ago have been stealing the Palestinian lands to form the ever expanding state of Israel. The Iranian government since the days of Khomeini, have been continuously fighting the US's unfair middle eastern policy. You must understand that although there are 'factions' within Islam, most of us Muslims agree that the forming of the state of Israel is unacceptable for reasons mentioned above.

 

Israel is there and trying to destroy it will not bring back any good. There will be no peace until both sides want it. And the situation isn't that rad either, settlers in the west bank makes it difficult to create a west bank according to the 1967 borders, but the internal fighting between Hamas and PLO doesn't make it any easier.

 

The US with its godlike power have 'crippled' almost all Muslim countries around the world. The Kingdom of Saudi Arabia is no longer a threat since the assassination of King Faisal (some believed it was staged by the US). Pakistan, Indonesia, Malaysia etc are Muslim countries that pose no real threat to the US' hegemony due to lack of resources.

 

But then Mr. Ahmadinejad came along with his plans on acquiring nuclear program. And just like the previous great leaders of Iran, he is a man that inspires hope. It's no wonder that the western world sees him as some homophobic, bigoted whatever even comparing him to Hitler no less (though he hasn't done anything to deserve that). The western Media (controlled mostly by Jews) is successful in shaping the opinion of the public that Mr. Ahmadinejad is out the destroy the world. The power the media has over the mindless masses truly frightens me.

 

Mr. Ahmadinejad stated time and time again that the Nuclear program he is trying to acquire would be of peaceful purposes. Honestly, even I don't buy that. I'm not saying he's gonna actually use it against Israel or the US, but it's indeed a powerful bargaining chip. After all, power conceived is power perceived. Or is it the other way around? Doesn't matter.

 

So Mess, to answer your question as to why I support Mr. Ahmadinejad. Here's my answer: He fights to liberate our fellow Muslims in Palestine. He fights for justice!

 

Personally, i am very anti-nuclear, regardless on who owns it. But yeah, in the world of realpolitik, such a naive idea means nothing. And don't blame the media on the jews, that's like saying that there is an Shintoist conspiracy in video-games and anime, or that there's a christian agenda involved biotech-research. I can understand that there's a surge in the muslim community for a leader that speaks up about what they feel is injustice for them in an intellectual way, since no-one with a rational mind (regardless of religion) takes Osama Bin Laden seriously, but considering the situation in Iran and by various speeches by Ahmadinejad, i can easily tell that he is no Martin Luther King, he is no Mahatma Gandhi and certainly no Robin Hood of the middle east either, even if he tries to.

[Hurlshort]

Islam is a beautiful religion. It's a shame that many Americans only see the radical and extreme elements of it. Millions of Muslims practice their religion peacefully and are positive member of society. Islamic law is also extremely varied depending on the country, so throwing out blanket accusations is fairly ignorant of the full spectrum.

 

Wearing a burka does not equal gender discrimination. In many places it is the female's choice to do so.

[Sand]

In many places it is not.

 

As I don't see a difference between the various Christian sects, I don't separate the various Islam sects. As I said, I treat both religions the same and pretty much have the same view on both.

[Tigranes]

The burka was never even strictly necessary before the late 19th / early 20th century. The only reason it became so necessary and symbolic of the faith was because 1/ many women themselves chose to wear the veil, and preferred to do so rather than walk around nearly naked like some Western women; 2/ many men also felt this to be the case, and the social climate soon became such that even women who didn't feel (1) was compelled to.

 

Culturally speaking, the burka is only so anathema to the western mindset because its values are directly oppositional to the high modernist ideas of extremised freedom of expression. Personally speaking - and sure, this may be the Korean in me - I feel both are just as ridiculous if taken to an extreme, and the hyperexposure of skin is a symptom and cause of deep issues with westernised societies just as the burka can be.

[kirottu]

I hope not. There was only about 3 to 4 billion people around in WW2.

 

Roughly 5.5 million Jews died due to the holocaust, not 11 billion.

 

Natzis also killed gays, gypsies, handicapped, freemasons, jehovas witnesses, POVs and people who were deemed politically dangerous so the number does rise up to 11 billion people.

[Guest The Architect]

Well, Yuusha, good for you and anyone else who supports this Ahmad guy. I mean, if you want to support someone who called for the entire country of Israel to be wiped off the map and called the Holocaust a myth, designed to make the nation of Palestine pay, then kudos to you.

 

Then he comes out and says "No, I am not anti-Jew. I respect them very much." I mean sure, so what if he reckons Israel should be wiped off the face of the planet. That doesn't mean he has anything against them, right?

 

And so much for equality in Iran. Oh sorry, you're gay, you're going to be executed for something you have no control over. Or, you can hide your gayness, and live your life in fear until you get your ass out of our country. Wow, what terrific human rights.

 

According to Human Rights Watch, the Iranian Government routinely tortures and abuses imprisoned dissidents, including through elongated isolated captivity. And the source of this information from Human Rights came from their Judiciary, liable to Ali someone, and on other members appointed by this Ahmad guy, so don't question the credibility of the information.

 

I mean, what's wrong with you, supporting someone like this? What, just because he's an outspoken critic of Bush and is all anti-American and all that crap, that gives you enough reason to be on his little ****ed up bandwagon?

 

By the way, it's pretty stupid to presuppose who I do and do not politically support, since I have not stated my political views on this forum before. I mean, your "precious" Bush? Pfft, I'm not even a Yank for a start, nor am I a fan of the guy. I'm not an outspoken critic of him, but still, that doesn't mean I support him.

 

And I fail to see how I made any sort of racist comment towards you. I thought I made it pretty clear that by "Indonesian hippy who laughs at his jokes that nobody else here laughs at" I was referring to you.

[Rosbjerg]

I hope not. There was only about 3 to 4 billion people around in WW2.

 

Roughly 5.5 million Jews died due to the holocaust, not 11 billion.

 

Natzis also killed gays, gypsies, handicapped, freemasons, jehovas witnesses, POVs and people who were deemed politically dangerous so the number does rise up to 11 billion people.

 

11 billion people are more than are currently living today.

 

It's estimated that, including civilians, soldiers, POV, political captives, various executions and the Ethnical executions that 45-50 million people died in WW2 .. in all countries - but these are only deaths directly involved with the war. People dying of natural causes across the world are not included in this figure. Which means the various diseases that spread in 1940-1945, which also killed quite a few, are not included.

[Sand]

I hope not. There was only about 3 to 4 billion people around in WW2.

 

Roughly 5.5 million Jews died due to the holocaust, not 11 billion.

 

Natzis also killed gays, gypsies, handicapped, freemasons, jehovas witnesses, POVs and people who were deemed politically dangerous so the number does rise up to 11 billion people.

 

I think you got your billions and millions, mixed up Kirottu. There weren't even 11 billion people on the whole planet back in 1942. There aren't even a 11 billion people on the planet now!

[Xard]

I guess Kirottu meaned 11 million because IIRC that's the official number of nazi victims in their great purges

[Morgoth]

Yeah what's up with that confusion anyway? Where's that from? Million = 10^6, and Billion = 10^9, right?

[Guest The Architect]

Yes, that's right. And kirottu said 11 000 000 000, which is 11 billion, so that's where the confusion came from.

 

Xard, you would be correct. It's estimated that approximately 11 million people were victims of Nazi persecution. By chance, it just so happens that there were roughly 11 million Jews left in 1946, when in 1939, there was something like 16 and a half million of them, so nearly a third of them were wiped out in WW2. :sad:

 

Just thought I'd throw in that random factoid.

[kirottu]

Whoopsie! Yeah, my bad.