KotoR 3: Ideas, Suggestions, Discussion, Part 22

[WILL THE ALMIGHTY]

Back to already mentioned suggestions?

[DeathScepter]

Improved Lightsaber forms and having feats and Force powers as a part of the requirements to both unlock and improve the saber form.

 

 

 

Make all lightsaber forms for all Jedi classes(yes including Counslars,Sith Lords and Jedi Masters).

 

 

 

I don't like the force forms as much as I do like lightsaber forms.

[Tale]

Have I mentioned fixing the swords > blasters nonsense?

I don't care what era of Star Wars it is, unless you're a Jedi, you're not going to be carrying a sword anyway.

[Darth Mortis]

Have I mentioned fixing the swords > blasters nonsense?

I don't care what era of Star Wars it is, unless you're a Jedi, you're not going to be carrying a sword anyway.

 

Well real-world soldiers do carry knives for use in close combat, and I guess the logic would be that in the SW universe soldiers would carry knives as well. The catch is that SW is aimed at kids (of all ages ), so I can't imagine them putting knives in one of their games. The last thing LA wants is some kid play-acting a fight from KOROR using their parents kitchen knives. Replacing knives with swords in the games is, ironically, safer if only because fewer people are likley have have a Katana lying around. Thus the kiddies will either use one of the plastic sabres you can buy, or a cardboard tube, if they get carried away and stage a couple of fights basied on SW.

Edited May 16, 2007 by Darth Mortis

[Tale]

Have I mentioned fixing the swords > blasters nonsense?

I don't care what era of Star Wars it is, unless you're a Jedi, you're not going to be carrying a sword anyway.

 

Well real-world soldiers do carry knives for use in close combat, and I guess the logic would be that in the SW universe soldiers would carry knives as well. The catch is that SW is aimed at kids (of all ages ), so I can't imagine them putting knives in one of their games. The last thing LA wants is some kid play-acting a fight from KOROR using their parents kitchen knives. Replacing knives with swords in the games is, ironically, safer if only because fewer people are likley have have a Katana lying around. Thus the kiddies will either use one of the plastic sabres you can buy, or a cardboard tube, if they get carried away and stage a couple of fights basied on SW.

You're seriously overthinking it. Swords are used because the add an element of diversity, are fantasy staples, and easy to implement. In a game where the player uses a Jedi, swords serve to balance the Jedi > Everyone by giving everyone a near Lightsaber equivalent. However, it's just not Star Wars.

 

For your example to apply reasonably with swords being a knife substitute, then soldiers would have to specialize in knives and commonly run at their enemies from down a hallway, knife drawn, to slash him. The knife is first and foremost a survival tool with some combat application, not the primary weapon of any soldier. And I certainly don't see anyone with a double knife that is wielded like a mini staff.

Edited May 16, 2007 by Tale

[pantherus]

In KOTOR - Melee is blatantly overpowered compared to ranged combat. There are a few reasons why swords are in there:

1) They give you a non-lightsaber melee option; useful when you either don't have a lightsaber (i.e. before you get it) or for a non-jedi to be melee.

2) They give you a melee weapon that doesn't do energy damage. Since enemies use energy shields freely, especially later in the game, that kinda helpful

3) as Tale said - this is a fantasy game, with fantasy elements; and you can't have fantasy without swords. Think about it - Sword & Sorcery -> Lightsaber & Force... I would seriously love to see a game using the gameplay and functionality of KOTOR games transitioned back into a D&D universe. Baldur's Gate still just didn't cut it for me...admittedly I haven't played NWN yet, is that more like it?

 

...ahem...KOTOR III !!!

 

But yeah, I personally love the swords in the game; but I'd love to have blaster's more reasonably powered to make them more useful.

[Darth_Nihlus]

i beat the game using only a sword (i destroyed all my lightsabers at workbenches) i was a guardian turned sith lord, i believe...

i also reallly like the double sword (double vibro looks dumb, but doble sword is cool)

 

K3 needs more futurified swords maybe...like the movie blade..that sword is....future....y

Edited May 16, 2007 by Darth_Nihlus

[WKlingbeil]

I would agree that they need to work on the ranged combat options. Especially in the beginning of each game, as you have a one in 17 chance of hitting them, or so it seems. I've tried dedicating myself to leaving Carth, or Canderous, or any idiot from KOTORII as ranged combatants, but they are useless. So, I get frustrated and go right back to having everyone dominate using swords, lightsabers, and other melee weapons, and the game is fun again! One of my favorite things from KOTOR was speaking with Ajunta Pall's spirit, which I think should be a more used aspect in KOTOR III, only with even more legendary Sith and Jedi. I would love to learn from Exar Kun, or Naga Sadow, and maybe someone like Qel Droma, or another famous Jedi that I cannot think of at the moment. I don't care if it takes me a year to finish this game, I think the longer the better. I mean, if they could combine the storyline quality and intangibles of KOTOR I, and the little additions of II (turning your party into Jedi, having that secondary Jedi/ Sith title choice), and I wouldn't mind a little more freedom when it comes to your party conversation choices, and more freedom in other missions. Oh, and I'm sure this one has been said before, but I'll add my support to it, but I think that if you go down the dark side, you should be able to kill any random individual walking down the street, much like GTA, but more fun. Obsidian, please don't break my heart like EA did with TWC, I knew EA would stab us all in the back eventually, that's what corporate giants do, but you're more down-to-earth, you guys are gamers too.... I would build a dozen..... or maybe one, doghouses in your name, and I would name my first-born after a developer of your choice if you make it, and make it right..... and I'm hoping that you've already begun production on the game, and you're just being silly little teases right now.

[WILL THE ALMIGHTY]

hate to say it, but KotOR combat needs some serious fixing.

 

1- Guns can't shoot anywhere near straight enough. How the hell can I miss when I'm 2 bloody feet away.

2- Swords are weird, and overpowered.

3- Animations need some love. Or polish.

4- The Jedi styles don,t really change much graphically.

5- Styles need some more uniqueness and impact.

6- Stealth is completly, utterly useless. Nobody ever uses the damn thing. Give us a few nice missions where Stealth REALLY comes handy.

7- Some abilities or feats are useless, and never used.

8- Guns are so repetitive. And weak.

Edited May 17, 2007 by WILL THE ALMIGHTY

[Xard]

hate to say it, but KotOR combat needs some serious fixing.

 

1- Guns can't shoot anywhere near straight enough. How the hell can I miss when I'm 2 bloody feet away.

2- Swords are weird, and overpowered.

3- Animations need some love. Or polish.

4- The Jedi styles don,t really change much graphically.

5- Styles need some more uniqueness and impact.

6- Stealth is completly, utterly useless. Nobody ever uses the damn thing. Give us a few nice missions where Stealth REALLY comes handy.

7- Some abilities or feats are useless, and never used.

8- Guns are so repetitive. And weak.

 

 

"1- Guns can't shoot anywhere near straight enough. How the hell can I miss when I'm 2 bloody feet away."

 

Your stats and feats suck for blasterslinger

 

"2- Swords are weird, and overpowered."

 

I guess you're talking about normal swords and not about lightsabers.

 

It indeed is quite weird but hey, this game is made to be melee oriented (being jedi and all) and you can't fill all the damn world with dark jedis to fill up melee-combat area.

 

Although "cortosis swords" was quite sad (but only working) explanation for why lightsabers doesn't automatically destroy them.

 

Besides, remembering how rare jedis are, we would be facing bloody blaster fighters through whole game. LAME, and even easier than now (and that's like veryveryveryveryvery easy)

 

"3- Animations need some love. Or polish."

 

This is utterly most ridiculous thing I've heard in a long, long time.

 

Kotors have the VERY BEST combat animations in any RPG EVER, only other game that has some sort of chance against Kotors in this field of game is Jade Empire.

 

Animations are extremely smooth and well done, and certainly have enough polish.

 

Congrats, you just won price for stupidest criticism ever

 

"4- The Jedi styles don,t really change much graphically."

 

Goes under category cool, not under needed. I would love if every style had its own set of animations, but do you have any time how much developing time that would take? Or money? Or resources?

 

Fact that best games ever are still from 90's (although Fallouts death animations are still best ^_^ ) alone should tell this has no meaning. At all.

 

"5- Styles need some more uniqueness and impact."

 

Isn't that exactly same as your above criticism?

 

"6- Stealth is completly, utterly useless. Nobody ever uses the damn thing. Give us a few nice missions where Stealth REALLY comes handy."

 

Eh? There is such missions already, and I do use stealth from time to time. Apart from sneak attack it indeed doesn't have much use.

 

But wha does that have to do with combat?

 

 

"7- Some abilities or feats are useless, and never used."

 

Such as?

 

"8- Guns are so repetitive. And weak."

 

Well d'oh, they have their damage stats which should tell how weak or strong they are.

 

Blasters tend to be repetitive, you know. And have you ever compared guns in movies to guns in games? There's quite a bit difference in amount and variety of them...

 

 

I agree Kotor combat needs revamping, but none of your points above wold enhance combat in any way

[Xard]

edit: woo, double posts

Edited May 17, 2007 by Xard

[freaker]

it will be good, if there are many BIIIIIG battles with lightsabers!

 

Do we have a release date?

[WILL THE ALMIGHTY]

What I meant by animations need some love, is sometimes yur character just stands there, getting hit, or waiting to get hit.

Stealth has to do with combat because stealth is about killing something in one shot without alarming anyone else.

 

Blasterslinger, even with nice feats and skills, is still incredibly imprecise. I agree sometimes the accuracy is about the one firing, but when doing a sniper shot, why does my shot land at my feet?

 

Kotors have the VERY BEST combat animations in any RPG EVER, only other game that has some sort of chance against Kotors in this field of game is Jade Empire.

 

Animations are extremely smooth and well done, and certainly have enough polish.

 

Congrats, you just won price for stupidest criticism ever

 

See what i meant? Anims are smooth and well done, almost perfect, but sometimes it looks weird. It goes under polish because sometimes the combat doesn't look as intense when no one is moving.

[SteveThaiBinh]

I think one of the devs called them 'combat fidgets' - a character's animation when, thanks to the d20/turn based system, he's got time to fill but no attacks left. I'd definitely like to see them, and combat as a whole, become more realistic - you should be able to watch a character fight for a minute or so and make a reasonable stab at what his skill is with his current weapon, because it's reflected in the animation.

[Darth Mortis]

it will be good, if there are many BIIIIIG battles with lightsabers!

 

Do we have a release date?

 

No, in fact there is not only no release date there is no indication they are even working on K3 yet. (Pessimism to maximum) Come to think of it there is no sign that they are even thinking of developing K3 as of yet-just vage comments about not leaving the KOTOR series behind, which could just mean they have the title down for some point in the future when they run out of other SW crap to spew out.

Edited May 17, 2007 by Darth Mortis

[LadyCrimson]

I think one of the devs called them 'combat fidgets' - a character's animation when, thanks to the d20/turn based system, he's got time to fill but no attacks left. I'd definitely like to see them, and combat as a whole, become more realistic - you should be able to watch a character fight for a minute or so and make a reasonable stab at what his skill is with his current weapon, because it's reflected in the animation.

I agree. Even if it was only "for show only" dodging motions or something, it would be better than them standing stock-still.

[pantherus]

I think one of the devs called them 'combat fidgets' - a character's animation when, thanks to the d20/turn based system, he's got time to fill but no attacks left. I'd definitely like to see them, and combat as a whole, become more realistic - you should be able to watch a character fight for a minute or so and make a reasonable stab at what his skill is with his current weapon, because it's reflected in the animation.

I agree. Even if it was only "for show only" dodging motions or something, it would be better than them standing stock-still.

 

Definately agree. Maybe co-ordinating them somewhat with what moves ARE taking place - like if an attack misses - the defender blocks or ducks it for a bit more realism. Also with the unarmed combat - I think more punches/kicks would look much better than the weird grappling stuff that KOTOR2 seemed to display A LOT, especially in the Handmaiden duels.

 

Speaking of which - I am a HUGE fan of duel-style side-quests. I reckon they're lots of fun and you get a real sense of completion when you do them. It's a really common thing to do (KOTOR 1 - Duel Arena, KOTOR 2 - Handmaidens & Mandalorian Duel rings, Jade Empire - Tournament Arena, Fable - Arena & Unarmed Duel Rings, etc etc) but for me, it's often the most fun part of the game.

 

I'd love for the character in K3 to be on a planet with a huge Tournamet Arena, and you fight in various matches that have specific rules for them that you can use your whole party at some stage. For each match, you could 1, 2, or 3 (or 4?) party members to fight, depending on specification, which would help the usefulness of some characters. Examples:

- Swords only

- Blasters only (make blaster-focussed NPCs have a specific use)

- Droids only (if you have, like, 3 droids in your team by this stage, you can send just them (not your PC) into the duel and they work together. The expert droid (T3?) could be moving around disabling some droids and stuff while the combat droid(s) (HK?) blasts them...you control who you want.

- Solo, Duo, or Team duels against similarly balanced foes.

- Wookies only!!!

 

The dueling rules in K2 were a cool concept - they should build on them. make them more than just what you can and can't use/wear/weild; go the whole hog with characters you can use and things like that - I would love that so much!!!

[WILL THE ALMIGHTY]

I think one of the devs called them 'combat fidgets' - a character's animation when, thanks to the d20/turn based system, he's got time to fill but no attacks left. I'd definitely like to see them, and combat as a whole, become more realistic - you should be able to watch a character fight for a minute or so and make a reasonable stab at what his skill is with his current weapon, because it's reflected in the animation.

I agree. Even if it was only "for show only" dodging motions or something, it would be better than them standing stock-still.

 

Definately agree. Maybe co-ordinating them somewhat with what moves ARE taking place - like if an attack misses - the defender blocks or ducks it for a bit more realism. Also with the unarmed combat - I think more punches/kicks would look much better than the weird grappling stuff that KOTOR2 seemed to display A LOT, especially in the Handmaiden duels.

 

Speaking of which - I am a HUGE fan of duel-style side-quests. I reckon they're lots of fun and you get a real sense of completion when you do them. It's a really common thing to do (KOTOR 1 - Duel Arena, KOTOR 2 - Handmaidens & Mandalorian Duel rings, Jade Empire - Tournament Arena, Fable - Arena & Unarmed Duel Rings, etc etc) but for me, it's often the most fun part of the game.

 

I'd love for the character in K3 to be on a planet with a huge Tournamet Arena, and you fight in various matches that have specific rules for them that you can use your whole party at some stage. For each match, you could 1, 2, or 3 (or 4?) party members to fight, depending on specification, which would help the usefulness of some characters. Examples:

- Swords only

- Blasters only (make blaster-focussed NPCs have a specific use)

- Droids only (if you have, like, 3 droids in your team by this stage, you can send just them (not your PC) into the duel and they work together. The expert droid (T3?) could be moving around disabling some droids and stuff while the combat droid(s) (HK?) blasts them...you control who you want.

- Solo, Duo, or Team duels against similarly balanced foes.

- Wookies only!!!

 

The dueling rules in K2 were a cool concept - they should build on them. make them more than just what you can and can't use/wear/weild; go the whole hog with characters you can use and things like that - I would love that so much!!!

 

Either a nice one one one duel, or a giant free for all. That might be fun.

[pantherus]

Either a nice one one one duel, or a giant free for all. That might be fun.

 

I just think anything different from a "no weapons or armour" 'duel' where you basically select attack (or power/flurry if it's good enough) and then sit back pressing the button to do it again, and again, and again, and again...watching the two fighters look they're wrestling for a chocolate bar.

[WILL THE ALMIGHTY]

Either a nice one one one duel, or a giant free for all. That might be fun.

 

I just think anything different from a "no weapons or armour" 'duel' where you basically select attack (or power/flurry if it's good enough) and then sit back pressing the button to do it again, and again, and again, and again...watching the two fighters look they're wrestling for a chocolate bar.

 

Or they're just drunk.

 

Drunk bar fights would be awesome.

[Yodaman]

Yeah, I want to see Revan drunken. Hitting just the table and jump in front of cars, like I did.

 

Well, the Arena in Fable was really great, I loved to fight first against creatures and after that against my friend.

In KotOR III, if there is Tatooine, they could insert the Jango Fett Arena. Well, maybe they work on the name, but there could be huge possibilities of rules, enemies or fighting styles. I think, it could be the Circus Maximus of Star Wars. And, I played Jedi Knight Rancor Riding, you know, sitting on a Rancor and Duelling each other, maybe there could be even Horse fights (without Horses) like in the middleage. You know, I think, in the Old Republic days, it wouldnt be too strange. Even Obi and Durge dueled on horses (okay, speeder bikes), and I liked it.

[Guest Accept]

Yeah, I want to see Revan drunken. Hitting just the table and jump in front of cars, like I did.

 

Well, the Arena in Fable was really great, I loved to fight first against creatures and after that against my friend.

In KotOR III, if there is Tatooine, they could insert the Jango Fett Arena. Well, maybe they work on the name, but there could be huge possibilities of rules, enemies or fighting styles. I think, it could be the Circus Maximus of Star Wars. And, I played Jedi Knight Rancor Riding, you know, sitting on a Rancor and Duelling each other, maybe there could be even Horse fights (without Horses) like in the middleage. You know, I think, in the Old Republic days, it wouldnt be too strange. Even Obi and Durge dueled on horses (okay, speeder bikes), and I liked it.

Yeah, medieval-dueling style but with Banthas.

 

 

[DeathScepter]

yeah bantha and Bantha poodo

 

 

 

 

Variety of melee weapons...........................Personally I want to throw Bantha poodo at someone in the game.

[Sturm]

Bantha Fodder?

[DeathScepter]

yep and the other verison too yes.