Remember FALLOUT!

[Arkan]

I don't see the point of arguing.  You will not change my views and I won't change yours.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

SHHHhh!!!!!!! Don't give the secret out, or you will ruin the internet.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Yeah, I can see these forums dying a quick death.

[Dark_Raven]

And the dialogue in NWN was meaningful?  HAHAHAHAHA! 

 

Good one, Volourn.

 

There was actual dialog in Oblivion, Volourn, that had has much depth and meaning found in NWN.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

LOLZ NWN and Morrowind dialogues were not that great. I've seen better and worst.

[6 Foot Invisible Rabbit]

I agree. Both were equally bad.

[Dark_Raven]

Good, acceptable. Not great or bad.

[Slowtrain]

Heck, even the biggest fanboys of Bethesda don't usually defend ES games by defending the quality of dialogue. At least the wise ones don't.

 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Quite true. The dialogue in ES games has always been horrible, both in writing and in implementation. MW actually has overall the best dialogue and dialogue system of any game in the series by far. The speechcraft skill actually is useful and a lot of the dialogue is fairly interesting. Oblivion's dialogue is wretched.

 

The speechcraft mini-game in Oblivion is quite puzzling. I've yet to come up with a reason why it ever woudl have been considered worth including with the actual game. My only conclusions are that either the devs couldn't come up with anything better or tha they were all having a huge crack fest the day they put it into the game and were too embarrased later to remove it.

 

It really just should have been left out. If the devs wanted to focus on the action side of a crpg, fine. Drop Mercantile and Speechcraft as skills and add back short blade and some other skill more related to action. Keeping in token skills that are essentially useless, both in and of themselves, but also to the game as a whole seems pretty questionable to me.

 

edit: speeling

Edited September 20, 2006 by CrashGirl

[alanschu]

Well, Mercantile is still "useful."

 

It just levels up so slow that it essentially has no point.

[Slowtrain]

Well, Mercantile is still "useful."

 

It just levels up so slow that it essentially has no point.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

True, it does have a use, in that it saves you some money, especially early when you are really poor, and with the perks can make you a bit later. But as usual with crpgs, once the daedric longswords start falling out of the sky, money becomes, um, not so much of a big deal.

 

If the money had been tighter throughout the whole game and the if mercantile skill really made a big difference, it might have been actually really useful.

 

Speechcraft has absolutely no use throughout the game as far as I can tell, other than in a few information quests it can save you a bit of money on bribes.

 

Every once in a while I make a character with speechcraft as a major skill just to see what I can do with it. Those characters usually don't last very long.

[alanschu]

Well, raising your speechcraft will let you raise your personality, which as far as I can tell, gives you a higher threshold for the rating of someone.

 

Much of the dialogue options are related to how well a person's disposition to you is. I'm noticing that now with my recent playthrough as I didn't make speechcraft a class skill (mostly because I recognize how pointless it is, and how easy it was to level up).

[Volourn]

"I agree. Both were equally bad."

 

Weird. Your next answer will either make you considered sneaky wordsmith or illogical (again).

 

So...

 

MW's dialogue/writing is as bad as NWN's... and, Oblivion's is much better? Hmm... Ok then.

 

P.S. At least I gave examples of NWN's dialogue/writing being meaningful and worthwile. You have given none for either MW, or Oblivion.

 

Coincidence? Hmm..

[Darque]

Well, raising your speechcraft will let you raise your personality, which as far as I can tell, gives you a higher threshold for the rating of someone.

 

Much of the dialogue options are related to how well a person's disposition to you is.  I'm noticing that now with my recent playthrough as I didn't make speechcraft a class skill (mostly because I recognize how pointless it is, and how easy it was to level up).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Speechcraft is a pointless skill.

 

Level 25 Illusion allows you to make a +100 point charm spell on a 5 second timer.

 

Disposition is automatically 100 when you use it.

 

The game wasn't balanced.

[metadigital]

No, it doesn't add depth.  It makes the Speechcraft skill useless.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No, it adds playing depth, as the player can utilize the probability process of the speechcraft skill.

[alanschu]

Well, raising your speechcraft will let you raise your personality, which as far as I can tell, gives you a higher threshold for the rating of someone.

 

Much of the dialogue options are related to how well a person's disposition to you is.  I'm noticing that now with my recent playthrough as I didn't make speechcraft a class skill (mostly because I recognize how pointless it is, and how easy it was to level up).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Speechcraft is a pointless skill.

 

Level 25 Illusion allows you to make a +100 point charm spell on a 5 second timer.

 

Disposition is automatically 100 when you use it.

 

The game wasn't balanced.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Maybe Illusion is just overpowered!

[Darque]

Nothing about Oblivion's magic system was overpowered.

 

Try a mage in morrowind and then move to oblivion. It's like moving from college to kindergarden.

[alanschu]

Meh, I continue with my ninja abilities.

 

Though I have hit level 25 in restoration. I am about 20 in Illusion I think too.

[Arkan]

So, we're onto oblivion now, eh? I had way more fun with Oblivion than NWN (OC, here). Something about being able to be a orcish tank that settles things with fists (much more fun that anything else I tried), and just pounding everything to a pulp. Of course, I never made it to the hardest "level" of spawned enemies, but it was still fun.

[Darque]

Meh, I continue with my ninja abilities.

 

Though I have hit level 25 in restoration.  I am about 20 in Illusion I think too.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Should have went with Alchemy and bypassed magic all together

[CoM_Solaufein]

And the dialogue in NWN was meaningful?  HAHAHAHAHA! 

 

Good one, Volourn.

 

There was actual dialog in Oblivion, Volourn, that had has much depth and meaning found in NWN.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

LOLZ NWN and Morrowind dialogues were not that great. I've seen better and worst.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

NWN had good dialogues.

[Tigranes]

OC and SOU? God forbid.

[LoneWolf16]

Isn't it a little illogical to claim that a game's dialogue isn't better than anothers' when you haven't even bothered to play it, Volo?

 

Admittedly, there's some hokey and wooden acting going on in the game, but there's certainly more life to it than in NWN's dialogue. I like NWN, don't get me wrong, but in this area, Oblivion has it beat.

 

 

Aside: Dude, Darque, love the Kerrigan avie. :D

[Volourn]

"Isn't it a little illogical to claim that a game's dialogue isn't better than anothers' when you haven't even bothered to play it, Volo?"

 

I've played previous Bethesda games. I doubt they've improved THAT much., I've seen dialogue screenshots. I've heard the horror stories about its dialogue espicially its dialogue system. I have enough evidence through those three means to make an educated guess.

 

And, the more people on this board go to the wall to defend Oblivion's dialogue yet give exactly zero examples of its 'good' dialogue while I have given a few examples of NWN's dialogue makes me even more sure I'm correct.

[Judge Hades]

You want examples, go play the game. I have played both Oblivion and NWN and well, they are about equal in quality. Both suck.

[Arkan]

"Isn't it a little illogical to claim that a game's dialogue isn't better than anothers' when you haven't even bothered to play it, Volo?"

 

I've played previous Bethesda games. I doubt they've improved THAT much., I've seen dialogue screenshots. I've heard the horror stories about its dialogue espicially its dialogue system. I have enough evidence  through those three means to make an educated guess.

 

And, the more people on this board go to the wall to defend Oblivion's dialogue yet give exactly zero examples of its 'good' dialogue while I have given a few examples of NWN's dialogue makes me even more sure I'm correct.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

For me, the dialogue in both games was just a means in which to move on to the next part (killing things, in these instances). Neither are particularly good or bad, but what drags Oblivion down is the voice acting. It really detracts.

[Judge Hades]

Aribeth's voice acting was better than most of the voice acting in Oblivion.

[Slowtrain]

what drags Oblivion down is the voice acting. It really detracts.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Do you mean the actual quality of the spoken words (the "acting" aspect of it) or the fact that only a coupdl voice actors do the voices for all the races.

 

For me, although the quality is spotty (the Nord/Orc Female voice actor is wretched, but the Imperial male voice actor is pretty good), having so few voice actors voice so many npcs really detracts from the whole voice acting aspect of the game. I don't think every single NPC needs a seperate voice actor, but to have thousands of NPCS done by 5 or 6 voice actors is a bit less than impressive.

[Judge Hades]

What? You don't like Linda Carter?!?! SHAME ON YOU!