Oblivion First Impressions

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

Well I finished the main quest and just one word really. Dull.

 

As an RPG nothing to write home about. However as an offline MMO (theres a contradiction) with a series of instanced dungeons it's rather good fun.

 

I was level 28 at the end. Breezed through thanks to three items. None of the memorable bits were plot related. The ending was rather predictable too.

 

My character has now retired to Skingrad wearing his shiny new armour. Nice house too, shame 25k is like pocket change at that level.

 

Got another week till Dragon Quest VIII arrives so I'm going to make a cute female Dark Elf and pattern her after an EQ Shadow Knight. Ignore the plot competely and just go exploring.

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

Slightly spoilerish..

 

 

But the "Stark Reality" quest was the funniest.

And dealing with level 4 vampirism while trying to find a cure was one of the best.

 

 

Edited April 2, 2006 by metadigital

[Gabrielle]

Spoilers?? i'M going to quiet readin these threads.

[LoneWolf16]

Lyr.......That was one of the most disturbing, yet somehow alluring, things I've ever read in my entire life. I don't know where the urge to write, or do, all of that came from, but for your sake, keep it within the walls of your home. Acting like that outside tends to draw the attention of armed uniformed men with clubs and firearms, and then later, people in white coats who introduce you to straight jackets and the wonders of a padded room. :ph34r:

 

Creative though, and I couldn't help but laugh at it......morbidly, of course.

[Tigranes]

Noes, he stolez it off dar Codex!!11oneoneonelolz.

[metadigital]

Spoilers?? i'M going to quiet readin these threads.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Not anymore.

 

Everyone, please

do not post SPOILERS

in this thread without the [ S P O I L E R ] tags!

 

Thank you.

 

Noes, he stolez it off dar Codex!!11oneoneonelolz.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Whomever the author, they have an intimate knowledge (carnal, some might say:D) of the hidden cogs, gears and discombobulations and urges of the psychopath ...

[Tigranes]

Well, it probably beats somebody else's (successful) attempt at recreating a lesbian position with Havoc... this one is more morbid and more sloppy (thus saving the author a miniscule amount of grace. Wait, no.)

[Meshugger]

@ Llyranor's "love"-story.

[Kaftan Barlast]

When I grow up Im going to make a CRPG that dispenses with sidequests altogether. Whichever way you put it, it doesnt make any sense whatsoever to waste precious time helping a wine affecianado gather 12 bottles of vintage for 50gold.. when the whole world is just waiting to go down the toilet at any minute!!!!!!!!

 

 

It could be alright unless it was as its now that sidequests make up 70% of the game and that you more or less have to do a good part of the in order to level and have all the gear you need to finish the actual story.

 

 

I thought the game was rather difficult at my level (43 I think), but then I suddenly maxxed out my light armour skill and gained 50% armour from that alone. Now the daedra lords can't touch me anymore! I must say the game became more fun when it's a bit easier and every fight doesn't take 10 minutes any longer.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

I had the same problem and I just set the difficulty down to 25% itsmuch more fun to be able to drop your enemies with a single good whack! with a two-hander :D

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

When I grow up Im going to make a CRPG that dispenses with sidequests altogether. Whichever way you put it, it doesnt make any sense whatsoever to waste precious time helping a wine affecianado gather 12 bottles of vintage for 50gold..  when the whole world is just waiting to go down the toilet at any minute!!!!!!!!

 

It could be alright unless it was as its now that sidequests make up 70% of the game and that you more or less have to do a good part of the in order to level and have all the gear you need to finish the actual story.

 

 

I had the same problem and I just set the difficulty down to 25% itsmuch more fun to be able to drop your enemies with a single good whack! with a two-hander :D

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well in a normal CRPG sidequests help you complete the main plot rather than hinder you :D It is silly though when somethings about to happen and you tell them you will be back later (and show up in a couple of weeks)

 

Well the main quest isnt very long and consists of go here kill this and collect that. Kind of repetative too since you have been doing that most of the time anyway. It's got to be one of the the least engaging plots I've played.

 

My difficulty breaker came when I had.

 

 

Azura's stone (I didnt hand it in. I handed in another useless artifact. Soul tap and a couple of weapons with +35 damage +35 hp drain which basically healed me every time I hit something.

 

 

just a case of summoning and tapping your own creatures to refil the charge counter and anyone can get 25 conjuration

[Llyranor]

Sidequests that make little sense in the context of the story really just add to its implausibility. Disappointing design, if anything.

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

Sidequests that make little sense in the context of the story really just add to its implausibility. Disappointing design, if anything.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

It's just like a MMO.

[Shadowstrider]

When I grow up Im going to make a CRPG that dispenses with sidequests altogether. Whichever way you put it, it doesnt make any sense whatsoever to waste precious time helping a wine affecianado gather 12 bottles of vintage for 50gold..  when the whole world is just waiting to go down the toilet at any minute!!!!!!!!

 

It could be alright unless it was as its now that sidequests make up 70% of the game and that you more or less have to do a good part of the in order to level and have all the gear you need to finish the actual story.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well in a normal CRPG sidequests help you complete the main plot rather than hinder you :D It is silly though when somethings about to happen and you tell them you will be back later (and show up in a couple of weeks)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Sidequests that make little sense in the context of the story really just add to its implausibility. Disappointing design, if anything.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Uh... thats what sidequests are. Quests on the side. If a side quest is involved in the main quest, it isn't a side quest, really. Look at Baldur's Gate 2, a game most people here know and love, dozens of side quests that have nothing to do with the main quest. Oddly, people didn't complain about that.

 

I mean, what does Firkraag have to do with the main quest?

 

To me, this is just a case of people biased against the game.

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

Uh... thats what sidequests are.  Quests on the side.  If a side quest is involved in the main quest, it isn't a side quest, really.  Look at Baldur's Gate 2, a game most people here know and love, dozens of side quests that have nothing to do with the main quest.  Oddly, people didn't complain about that.

 

I mean, what does Firkraag have to do with the main quest?

 

To me, this is just a case of people biased against the game.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well doing the sidequests definately hindered my completion of Kvatch :ph34r: .

Reason no one complains about it in BG2? Could be be because in BG2 gaining levels is a useful thing which helps with completion of the main quest.

 

There are exeptions in Oblivion. Though these tend to carry a minimum level.

Umbra for example, definately a big help in the completion of the main quest

but most of the "junk" quests serve only to raise your level and thus make life harder.

[Cantousent]

No matter how you cut it, SS, there are a lot of goofy side-quests in Oblivion. Firkraag just isn't on the same level as wine hunting, root pulling, or fish mongering. There are a lot of goofy side quests in all these game, and I've complained about folks setting their attention on side-quests while the world is burning around them.

 

I don't think it's a bad thing. Hell, I really enjoyed the Dream side quest. I've enjoyed a lot of the side quests. ...But all side-quests are not created equal and so comparing something like the quest to kill a red-dragon (something perhaps compelling enough for the PC to deviate from his over-arching goal) to running back to a village to save a cat from a tree is just silly.

 

You're using the wrong argument anyhow. The point isn't that all games have side quests. The point is that Oblivion is built upon them. If you don't like the very idea of side-quests, then Oblivion might not be for you. Nevertheless, it's that very freedom to explore and interact and take on a silly side quest or two that makes the game compelling for so many of us.

[Shadowstrider]

Well doing the sidequests definately hindered my completion of Kvatch :ph34r: .

Reason no one complains about it in BG2? Could be be because in BG2 gaining levels is a useful thing which helps with completion of the main quest.

 

There are exeptions in Oblivion. Though these tend to carry a minimum level.

Umbra for example,  definately a big help in the completion of the main quest

but most of the "junk" quests serve only to raise your level and thus make life harder.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

The primary reason that these quests make life easier is that you can only do them at one point in the story, and help you gain experience, like the underdark quests. After you leave underdark they become unavailable. Doing them makes it easier to complete the underdark maze.

 

This isn't the case in Oblivion, [almost] any quest, any time.

[Shadowstrider]

No matter how you cut it, SS, there are a lot of goofy side-quests in Oblivion.  Firkraag just isn't on the same level as wine hunting, root pulling, or fish mongering.  There are a lot of goofy side quests in all these game, and I've complained about folks setting their attention on side-quests while the world is burning around them.

 

There are a lot of goofy side quests in most games. Oblivion simply has more sidequests available so people notice.

 

I don't think it's a bad thing.  Hell, I really enjoyed the Dream side quest.  I've enjoyed a lot of the side quests.  ...But all side-quests are not created equal and so comparing something like the quest to kill a red-dragon (something perhaps compelling enough for the PC to deviate from his over-arching goal) to running back to a village to save a cat from a tree is just silly.

 

I didn't compare that, in fact I didn't raise any quests in Oblivion. The mage's guild is a side quest. The dark brotherhood is a sidequest. I found both of these much more compelling than killing a red dragon.

 

I mean, if someone compare shadowbanish wine hunting to Firkraag, they're clearly an idiot.

 

You're using the wrong argument anyhow.  The point isn't that all games have side quests.  The point is that Oblivion is built upon them.  If you don't like the very idea of side-quests, then Oblivion might not be for you.  Nevertheless, it's that very freedom to explore and interact and take on a silly side quest or two that makes the game compelling for so many of us.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

That wasn't the argument I was making. At all.

 

People were saying side quests that distract from a game's main plot ruin the game. Thats what a side quest is MADE TO DO, essentially. It is completely inexplicable that this would bother them in Oblivion and not, say, Fallout.

[Llyranor]

Bias? Perhaps. Sidequests are pretty much an accepted norm in the CRPG industry, but that doesn't make me like them. All that investment infused into making a better main storyline would have made a more satisfying product for me. If the main storyline suffers because of diverging prioritization, then so be it.

 

Was Firkraag different? I enjoyed how performing the quest was linked with the rapid acquisition of gold in order to further the story. Proper motivation. If, of course, you cared for the story. I'm not that big a fan of BG2, but I appreciated how the sidequests could make sense within the context of the story - to an extent. Too bad I didn't like BG2's story that much. Yet, I have some relatively fond memories of how the sidequests/world related to the story. A rather effective means of nonlinear storytelling, sort of how the search for the waterchip brought about a natural sense of exploration. I don't agree completely with some of those games' design, but they were in many ways a step up from the norm.

 

How about in PST? My memorable moments in that games are virtually all related to the story/characters. The sidequests were, for the most part, grossly irrelevant. Some would argue that they helped define TNO's personality in terms of roleplaying, but I didn't see it adding much to storytelling. Would I have liked it more if those resources were devoted to increasing breadth and depth of the main storyline?

 

Where does Oblivion fit in all this? The main storyline in many ways was disappointing. It was an obvious improvement over Morrowind, and effort was observed. How much effort, though, is the question. I couldn't help but feel that they didn't really spend that many resources into making a particularly memorable storyline. Sure, it was an enjoyable excursion, but I'm not going to care a few months from now. Add to that a world/sidequests that can be perceived as detached from said storyline, and I couldn't help but feel disappointed. How much importance *did* Bethie invest into the main storyline, other than hiring big name voice-actors? But then, I guess, that was never really the goal of TES series. Too bad. Some people like to explore the world and create their own motivations outside of the storyline, stalk NPCs, murder and eat them, and that's fine too.

[StillLife]

I'm a sidequest fiend. Sometimes I don't wanna be the savior of the world, I just wanna be a dude wandering around getting in little adventures here and there--Kung Fu style. Given a typical character of mine, I'll even gladly save cats from trees... for a small fee. I like cats, and any character I make must like cats as well after all. One of Oblivion's greatest strengths is its sidequests. While I think they dropped the ball in many areas, the developers did seem to put a good amount of craftsmanship into them.

 

The problem is the sense of urgency your character has thrusted upon them from the moment you're dropped into the game. The threat of demons overrunning the entire world if a new emperor isn't appointed soon? That's pretty heavy stuff that would be hard for even the most apathetic of alter egos to ignore.

 

I thought three of the finest examples of mixing a "save the world" plot with lots of sidequests were the Fallouts, and BG 2. In both of the Fallouts, you basically just stumble into the overall threat, and you only find out how severe both of them are by really looking into them, at a point when it's too late to ignore them anyway. In BG2, you're presented with not so much of a save the world plot, but a save the elves one. And really, who cares about a bunch of goofy elves anyway? The real problem was the fact Irenicus had given your whiney kid sister a nasty shiner, and tried to syphon off your godliness. Now that was worthy of a good ass kicking. Still, there wasn't too much of a sense of urgency-- revenge is a dish best served cold after all.

 

It does feel a bit silly sometimes when you've just had an emperor die on your hands and beg you to save the world/empire, and instead my character chooses that moment to go off on an unrelated journey of self-discovery around Cyrodil. I've been writing it off as my guy(a fiercely loyal imperial legionairre btw) needing to prepare for the epic, treacherous journey a mile away. You really need lots of food, several houses, an uber horse, and God-like weapons and armor for such an arduous expenditure as talking to the bastard child of an emperor ya know?

 

It would have solved so many problems people have with the game just to have the main plot alone require a certain power level to complete each stage of it. That way there would be less whining about leveling being pointless, and a reduced feeling that the plot really isn't quite so cataclysmic if for two months your character can wander around twiddling their thumbs and nothing bad really happens.

[StillLife]

Bias? Perhaps. Sidequests are pretty much an accepted norm in the CRPG industry, but that doesn't make me like them. All that investment infused into making a better main storyline would have made a more satisfying product for me. If the main storyline suffers because of diverging prioritization, then so be it.

 

Those games are abundant enough as it is. They are known as Japanese RPGs. Usually they focus entirely on the main plot, which is boring for an interactive game IMO. There are these things called books that are based entirely around a main plotline too.

[Llyranor]

Irrelevant argument. There is a difference between actual interactive storytelling and simple emulation of other mediums. If gamers are satisfied with just the latter, or with generally subpar storytelling, then there will be no progression. That's fine too, if you don't agree there'll lots of room for improvement in the field.

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

People were saying side quests that distract from a game's main plot ruin the game.  Thats what a side quest is MADE TO DO, essentially.  It is completely inexplicable that this would bother them in Oblivion and not, say, Fallout.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I'm not sure that you are getting it.

 

This is from two characters experiences of the early game. Spolier tags although most people will have done this anyway by now.

 

 

Character 1. Do side quests till level 12, find nothing particularly useful but gain a lot of levels fast. Arrive at Kvatch. Run into a clanfear. Die on the damage shield as you whack away at it. I couldnt actually kill a clanfear without damaging it some other way first.Try to break the siege of Kvatch and watch as guards were mown down because although the level scaled, the equipment did not

 

 

 

Character 2. Arrive at Kvatch at level 3 , break the gate encountering mostly scamp runts. And a couple of weak deadra. Charge into town, watch the guards actually being useful (not one died) clear the quest.

 

 

So where was doing the sidequests benifiting character 1 ? All the sidequests did , was weaken him almost to the point of uselessness.

In Fallout, the levels gained from doing sidequests would help in the completion of the main quest. Thats what seperates Oblivion from almost every "CRPG" out there.

Edited April 2, 2006 by ShadowPaladin V1.0

[ShadowPaladin V1.0]

Those games are abundant enough as it is.  They are known as Japanese RPGs.  Usually they focus entirely on the main plot, which is boring for an interactive game IMO.  There are these things called books that are based entirely around a main plotline too.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Funny I've played a lot of them and I've never seen one that dosnt have side quests. The sidequests may be less obvious than walking up to people in the street and clicking , but they are there.

[Dhruin]

I have often complained about the motivation in BG2 - I never liked Imoen in the first place, so good riddance. Still, in the context of the game, it's clear it will take time to search out answers and gain the power to face Irenicus so the urgency is somewhat balanced.

 

Oblivion makes it clear the world needs saving now - with the fate of the world resting on the shoulders of a criminal - who in my case simply wants to get on with joining the Brotherhood and causing mayhem. Knowing that Oblivion features an enormous free-roaming gameworld with a myriad of side quests, this was a poor choice of plotline.

 

The problem, as with some other things in Oblivion, is that Bethsoft wants to appeal to gamers who want a linear, epic, story-driven game as well as the explorers, which makes all sorts of things a compromise.

 

Other games do this as well, sure. But the contrast isn't usually as stark for obvious reasons.

[10k fists]

I'm not sure that you are getting it.

 

This is from two characters experiences of the early game. Spolier tags although most people will have done this anyway by now.

 

 

Character 1. Do side quests till level 12, find nothing particularly useful but gain a lot of levels fast. Arrive at Kvatch. Run into a clanfear. Die on the damage shield as you whack away at it. I couldnt actually kill a clanfear without damaging it some other way first.Try to break the siege of Kvatch and watch as guards were mown down because although the level scaled, the equipment did not

 

 

 

Character 2. Arrive at Kvatch at level 3 , break the gate encountering mostly scamp runts. And a couple of weak deadra. Charge into town, watch the guards actually being useful (not one died) clear the quest.

 

 

So where was doing the sidequests benifiting character 1 ? All the sidequests did , was weaken him almost to the point of uselessness.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

It appears as though the person playing that game doesn't understand the fundamentals of combat. Enemy scaling only maintains a similar difficulty level, given you know how to fight at higher levels, and have intested the time required to get equipment on par with your current level. Is it perfect? No. But it's not nearly as bad as you (or whoever you got that information from) make it out to be.