The hunt continues....

[Hildegard]

You took out three houses with 18 civilians - no Zawahiri in neither of them. The CIA launched an attack on Pakistani soil without even consulting the Pakistani leadership, but I guess with Bush's doctrine the CIA is allowed to take out anybody anywhere.

Flame at Al Qaida and terrorists all you want but the US in the last 60 years or so has done more harm and suffering upon the ppl of the world more then any terrorists ever will.

[Gorgon]

It's an equation in which effectiness, willingness to expose own forces, and willingness to accept 'colateral damage' are weighed against eachother. Often the variables are somewhat accurately predictable ahead of time.

[~Di]

You took out three houses with 18 civilians - no Zawahiri in neither of them. The CIA launched an attack on Pakistani soil without even consulting the Pakistani leadership, but I guess with Bush's doctrine the CIA is allowed to take out anybody anywhere.

 

Maybe Zawarhiri was there, maybe not. If those houses contained Al Qaeda, then they were legitimate targets, period. Al Qaeda started this war 15 years ago. They bombed the WTC, our embassies, our barracks, put out Fatwahs calling for the death of every American man, woman and child, and eventually flew planes into the WTC and pentagon, which was basically the last straw. Now it's war, plain and simple (not talking about Iraq here, I'm talking about Al Qaeda and any country which gives them succor).

 

Pakistan has protected Al Qaeda with impugnity long enough, in my view, because Bush is in bed with that corrupt bastard Musharif. So I don't give a fig what Pakistan thinks. Al Qaeda is our enemy, and wiping out their leadership should be our top priority.

 

 

Flame at Al Qaida and terrorists all you want but the US in the last 60 years or so has done more harm and suffering upon the ppl of the world more then any terrorists ever will.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I suppose that would depend upon your definition of terrorist. *shrug* Lots of regimes have caused millions, if not billions, of innocent deaths in the past 60 years. No sense in debating each of them here. I suspect you would confess that your hatred of America has colored your opinions, just as the fact that America is my home has colored my opinions.

 

The main difference between us is that I do not insult your country on a daily basis, nor do I wish for its destruction.

[Lucius]

Of course you don't. You'd have to know something about his country, like the name of it, first. Let alone pinpoint its whereabouts. "

[julianw]

Denmark is famous for its huge collection of fairytale stories and fables. That's pretty much all I know about the whole country. :"> (That and they fell to Germany within hours during W.W.II. )

[Lucius]

Denmark is famous for its huge collection of fairytale stories and fables. That's pretty much all I know about the whole country. :">  (That and they fell to Germany within hours during W.W.II. )

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Exactly...

 

And that's 24 hours to you.

 

On the bright side, many of my countrymen joined the Waffen-SS to fight them damn Commies. :angry:

Edited January 14, 2006 by Lucius

[~Di]

Of course you don't. You'd have to know something about his country, like the name of it, first. Let alone pinpoint its whereabouts.  "

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

It's my understanding he is Croatian. I may be wrong, of course. That happened once.

[julianw]

Lucius - Oh yeah, also that you guys own Greenland (I am so jealous. ) and lots of oil in the North Sea.

 

(Seriously, you guys should sue Disney for ripping off your nation.)

Edited January 14, 2006 by julianw

[mkreku]

..legitimate target..

 

..vast majority of bombs/missles and other ordinance used by the US military are extremely accurate..

I'm sorry, but we have to be in the same universe for this discussion to have any relevance. The above cuts from your post shows me you're living on planet Propaganda, with your friend Fox News.

 

There are no "legitimate targets". There are no "extremely accurate" bombs. Sorry.

[Lucius]

Lucius - Oh yeah, also that you guys own Greenland (I am so jealous. ) and lots of oil in the North Sea.

 

(Seriously, you guys should sue Disney for ripping off your nation.)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I know!

 

They say there's diamonds up there somewher under the ice... have spade, will travel. :ph34r:

 

(sue them for what, exactly?)

 

And Di, you got off easy, the Dragon prevented me from posting by lockin' it up. But know this; if someone baits me, I bite, so don't play the "look he proved my point, he got angry, I was right all along!" stuff on me, thanks.

[~Di]

I'm sorry, but we have to be in the same universe for this discussion to have any relevance. The above cuts from your post shows me you're living on planet Propaganda, with your friend Fox News.

 

There are no "legitimate targets". There are no "extremely accurate" bombs. Sorry.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Then I doubt we'll find any points of agreement, since I personally believe that members of an organization that have planned and implemented attacks killing thousands of American civilians over more than a dozen years are indeed legitimate targets.

 

And yes, comparably speaking, today's ordinance is "extremely accurate". Not as good as a sniper bullet between the eyes, but not too shabby either.

 

BTW, I don't watch Fox News, I am not a right-wing conservative, I did not vote for Bush and sincerely wish he'd just fall off the face of the planet, so your presumptions about me simply because I do not see everything eye to eye with you have thus far been well off the mark. I'm just saying...

 

lol

[julianw]

(sue them for what, exactly?) 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Snow white, Beauty and the Beast, the Cinderella Story? All copyrighted by Disney now. :angry: You guys should at least get 50% of Disney's profits from films and theme parks!

[~Di]

And Di, you got off easy, the Dragon prevented me from posting by lockin' it up. But know this; if someone baits me, I bite, so don't play the "look he proved my point, he got angry, I was right all along!" stuff on me, thanks.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I sincerely was not trying to bait you, and apologize if you thought otherwise. There was no reason for you to explode with personal insult, in my view. I have been honest in explaining my motives. I've apologized, and I've clarified what I meant. The rest is up to you. Anything further should be taken to PM.

[Kinslayer]

Maybe Zawarhiri was there, maybe not.  If those houses contained Al Qaeda, then they were legitimate targets, period.  Al Qaeda started this war 15 years ago.  They bombed the WTC, our embassies, our barracks, put out Fatwahs calling for the death of every American man, woman and child, and eventually flew planes into the WTC and pentagon, which was basically the last straw.  Now it's war, plain and simple (not talking about Iraq here, I'm talking about Al Qaeda and any country which gives them succor).

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

That is where I disagree, I think you started the war....back in the 70s you've put your bases next to their holy sights, it is you who have put Shah back in power in Iran which caused suffering and death, it is you that have aided Saddam in developing WMD weapons when he was your allie against Iran, it is you that have aided and supported violent expansion of Israel against Arab states with your hypocritical double standards, it is you who support dictators in the ME who serve your economic and strategic interests....it comes all down to that - money and politics which has been your priority for so long executed on the shoulders of foreign ppl resulting in deaths of millions worldwide. One day, one day the US is going to pay for that crimes big time.

 

And plus I really laugh my pants out for how long are you going to wave the WW2 thing, 60 years has passed and in that time you my friend are certainly not liberators but oppressors, and those oppressors who think that are liberators are far worse then those oppressors that do so intentionally. Aditionally I love it when you Yanks say we wage wars so you Europeans can be safe - utter bullsh*t.

It is the west and Russia who armed Saddam, it is you who are responsable to a great extant fot the Iranian revolution, it is you (CIA) who trained ppl that are today Al Qaida - conclusion: Collect your own sh*t, leave Europe out of it and suffer the consequences of your actions, not ours (European) or anybodies else.

 

Pakistan has protected Al Qaeda with impugnity long enough, in my view, because Bush is in bed with that corrupt bastard Musharif.  So I don't give a fig what Pakistan thinks.  Al Qaeda is our enemy, and wiping out their leadership should be our top priority. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

In this last five years Pakistan is your main allie in the war on terror, without them ( Musharaf ) you wouldn't have damaged Al Qaida that much at all.

 

I suspect you would confess that your hatred of America has colored your opinions, just as the fact that America is my home has colored my opinions.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yes it has coloured my opinion and it has been coloured for a reason.

 

The main difference between us is that I do not insult your country on a daily basis, nor do I wish for its destruction.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I'm glad you understand latin so you can read my sig.

[Judge Hades]

As an American myself, I have to agree with Kinslayer on some of these things. We shouldn't have interfered at all. From the 1940's to now we have only made one mistake after another.

[213374U]

Woohoo! I was already craving this week's "let us bash Amerika" thread. Thanks Hilde for the fix.

 

 

Of course you don't. You'd have to know something about his country, like the name of it, first. Let alone pinpoint its whereabouts.  "

Man, that was lame. Throwing stereotypes around is the best way to prove you have nothing solid to attack someone with.

 

 

There are no "legitimate targets".

Hahahahaha.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

HAHAHAHAHA

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

HAHAHAHAHAHA

 

 

 

 

That was a good one. I guess the real world is too ugly for some people to accept. I envy you, though. Not everyone is so lucky to keep their innocence after they've grown pubic hair. Perhaps I'm assuming too much...

 

 

One day, one day the US is going to pay for that crimes big time.

It's unlikely you'll live to see that day, however. )

 

 

We shouldn't have interfered at all.  From the 1940's to now we have only made one mistake after another.

Right. We all know what a great business partner Nazi Germany would have been.

[~Di]

That is where I disagree, I think you started the war....back in the 70s you've put your bases next to their holy sights, it is you who have put Shah back in power in Iran which caused suffering and death, it is you that have aided Saddam in developing WMD weapons when he was your allie against Iran, it is you that have aided and supported violent expansion of Israel against Arab states with your hypocritical double standards, it is you who support dictators in the ME who serve your economic and strategic interests....it comes all down to that - money and politics which has been your priority for so long executed on the shoulders of foreign ppl resulting in deaths of millions worldwide. One day, one day the US is going to pay for that crimes big time.

 

Well, no surprise, I don't see it that way. I do not know which holy sites you are referring to that we put bases in during the 70's. I agree we should never have supported Iraq in the war against Iran, but the USA was hardly the only country that took sides there, and around the ME for that matter. Bad choice. Hindsight is 20/20. True, the USA (and many other countries) are allies of Israel, but we certainly didn't create the country of Israel. The UN did, when the British turned over what was then British land for that purpose. Your accusation about millions of deaths is just rhetoric, IMHO.

 

And plus I really laugh my pants out for how long are you going to wave the WW2 thing, 60 years has passed and in that time you my friend are certainly not liberators but oppressors, and those oppressors who think that are liberators are far worse then those oppressors that do so intentionally. Aditionally I love it when you Yanks say we wage wars so you Europeans can be safe - utter bullsh*t.

 

*confused* I didn't say anything about WW2. You were the one who brought up the "60 years" thing. I've never said anything about the US waging war so Europeans can be safe. I don't mind clarifying my own words and positions, but I certainly can't justify what I've never said.

 

In this last five years Pakistan is your main allie in the war on terror, without them ( Musharaf ) you wouldn't have damaged Al Qaida that much at all.

 

We agree. If, however, Bush hadn't used the lion's share of military resources barging into Iraq... illegally, I might add... then we might have had enough military might to take care of Al Qaeda years ago, and take care of Pakistan if they continued to give Al Qaeda protection. Better than getting in bed with the likes of Musharif, in my opinion. Others can disagree with my blessing.

[Judge Hades]

Right. We all know what a great business partner Nazi Germany would have been.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Who said we would be business partners. As long as Germany didn't bother us why should we have bothered them? I would have saught to totally annihilate Japan for their attacks on Pearl harbor. I mean, complete destruction to the point that the lands of their island would be unuseable to sustain human life. You attack the US, you pay for it. You leave the US alone we leave you alone.

 

As for Al Qaeda we should have never aided them in the 70's and 80's. We should have never bothered Iraq and their politics. We should never have backed israel. But what is done is done and nothing that the typical pssiant American citizen can do about it. More death and more pain on the way because of our idiot leaders. Voting our politics is useless as well because the idiots of this country are cleary in the majority.

[213374U]

I guess the sarcasm was lost on you. No sense in trying to explain it now.

[Lucius]

I sincerely was not trying to bait you, and apologize if you thought otherwise.  There was no reason for you to explode with personal insult, in my view.  I have been honest in explaining my motives.  I've apologized, and I've clarified what I meant.  The rest is up to you.  Anything further should be taken to PM.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

It seemed so to me, sorry that I took it the wrong way.

 

And numbers, I was angry, you should know a thing or two about posting insults when you're pissed off.

 

By the way I really hate your avatar.

Edited January 14, 2006 by Lucius

[Judge Hades]

I am not in a receptive mood for sarcasm. Brain wants to shut down but the body is to hyper. I hate it when that happens.

[Dark Moth]

Who said we would be business partners.  As long as Germany didn't bother us why should we have bothered them?  I would have saught to totally annihilate Japan for their attacks on Pearl harbor.  I mean, complete destruction to the point that the lands of their island would be unuseable to sustain human life.  You attack the US, you pay for it.  You leave the US alone we leave you alone.

 

As for Al Qaeda we should have never aided them in the 70's and 80's.  We should have never bothered Iraq and their politics.  We should never have backed israel.  But what is done is done and nothing that the typical pssiant American citizen can do about it.  More death and more pain on the way because of our idiot leaders.  Voting our politics is useless as well because the idiots of this country are cleary in the majority.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yeah, and with your isolationist views on the world, you wouldn't give a crap about all those killed under Hitler's and Stalin's regimes. Oh, but who cares, as long as it's not you, right? It's people like you who give the U.S. a bad name. You of course introduce a quagmire by condemning the U.S. for its atrocities but support atrocities of a different kind.

 

I'm sure if we had known what al-Quaida would have become, we would never have aided them in the first place. Bottom line is, at the time, they weren't the threat, the U.S.S.R. was. That's something that can't be changed, unfortunately. As for your comment about us not doing a single thing right from 1940, it's times like these I'm glad people like you aren't in the office.

 

Flame at Al Qaida and terrorists all you want but the US in the last 60 years or so has done more harm and suffering upon the ppl of the world more then any terrorists ever will.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

(w00t)

Edited January 14, 2006 by Mothman

[Lucius]

(sue them for what, exactly?) 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Snow white, Beauty and the Beast, the Cinderella Story? All copyrighted by Disney now. :angry: You guys should at least get 50% of Disney's profits from films and theme parks!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

4 real?

[213374U]

And numbers, I was angry, you should know a thing or two about posting insults when you're pissed off. 

Nope. I never post when I'm angry. It prevents me from thinking clearly...

I make enough mistakes (such as the whole deal with the Danish and the Dutch) when I'm cool, thank you.

 

 

By the way I really hate your avatar. 

Yeah, I was thinking of changing it for Will Ferrell, but Vash beat me to it.

Edited January 14, 2006 by 213374U

[Judge Hades]

I don't support any atrocities, Mothman, but what a country does within its own borders is not my business. That is the business of the government and its people of that nation. Sure it is a sad and evil thing when millions are put to death but that is their problem, not mine.