Cameo Appearance Spoils Story's Premise

[destinasi]

Playing LS with LS Revan, Bastila's appearance on the Republic ship Admiral Onasi spoils the premise that the Exile is the last Jedi around. I had assume that Bastila went walkabout with Revan after KOTOR1. Bastila is a powerful Jedi and if she is running around in Republic space with Onasi, why didn't Nihilus track her down. Instead it's just the Exile who produced "a disturbance in the Force", or something like that. Visas didn't mention anything about "detecting" Bastila. What do you guys think?

[E_Motion]

Yep. It's quite a problem. The only possible explanation I could think of was that maybe, just maybe she had abandonded the Jedi order altogether. But if so, it was something that should have been said or implicit according to the circumstances of her cameo.

[STDSkillz]

I think it's entirely possible that Bastila was so ashamed by the fact she embraced the dark side, that she could have abandoned the Force after Revan saved her.

 

Think about it, she was so overly-critical and hard on herself. How do you think she would have taken it, after coming back to the light. She probably tortured herself endlessly because she gave into her passion, and all that stuff.

[destinasi]

But a Jedi cannot disassociate him/herself from the Force voluntarily. That is also the premise of the story. The Exile managed it involuntarily and the Jedi masters can use special techniques to remove it from the other Jedi. Removing it from Bastila would cause a wound in the Force, just like the Exile.

[firehawk12]

But a Jedi cannot disassociate him/herself from the Force voluntarily. That is also the premise of the story. The Exile managed it involuntarily and the Jedi masters can use special techniques to remove it from  the other Jedi. Removing it from Bastila would cause a wound in the Force, just like the Exile.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

It's possible that she's "in hiding" with the rest of the (former) Jedi. It's just that she's not important enough for you to have met/sought out.

 

Remember, at this point, your character is in Exile, so s/he wouldn't even know about Bastila.

 

I mean, by the same token, where's Juhani? Jolee? Vandar?

Given that they're barely mentioned (other than Jolee's robes), you gotta assume that they're in hiding as well.

 

Of course, the most important part is that Kreia finds the Exile first, meaning she is probably the one that set Sion, if not Nihilus against him/her.

[The Yeti of 66]

If you did not kill Juhani she should have died from food poisoning or on Katarr so we don't have to see her again. There is no way to add interest to that character.

 

Jolee is in hiding no matter what. Let's say that Revan's hate blinded him/her if you went dark and didn't strike a killing blow.

 

Bastila is in hiding. She isn't all that powerful, she is quited skilled, with her battle meditation and all but not so powerful that you can sense her like that. If she was then Malak would have nailed her in a heartbeat, or been down to capture her. I don't think she left the order, she's just waiting for the right time to do whatever Revan told her, which is most likely to train or seek out Jedi.

[firehawk12]

If you did not kill Juhani she should have died from food poisoning or on Katarr so we don't have to see her again. There is no way to add interest to that character.

 

Jolee is in hiding no matter what. Let's say that Revan's hate blinded him/her if you went dark and didn't strike a killing blow.

 

Bastila is in hiding. She isn't all that powerful, she is quited skilled, with her battle meditation and all but not so powerful that you can sense her like that. If she was then Malak would have nailed her in a heartbeat, or been down to capture her. I don't think she left the order, she's just waiting for the right time to do whatever Revan told her, which is most likely to train or seek out Jedi.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Well, the point is, all of them are minor Jedi... they'd have no reason to go to Katarr and aren't important enough to try to seek out, so...

 

(But then again, if you're a male PC, you actually know, or at least heard of Jolee... at one point, he says Handmaiden is pulling a "Bindo").

[destinasi]

Well, I disagree that Bastila was a minor Jedi. I levelled her up to be very powerful by the end of KOTOR1. Seriously, why would Malak want to take a minor Jedi and make her his apprentice with the potential to be a Sith Lord?

[Count Dooku]

Yoda was one of the most powerful force practitioners out there and yet he managed to avoid detection from both Darth's Vader and Sidious so there must be some kind of technique in the force to assist with keeping yourself hidden.

 

Perhaps ole' Basty, Juhani and Jolee are all out there still. Obsidian has just kept things ambiguous for the sake of those Darkside fans.

[Arkendale]

Yoda managed to avoid detection because there was a lot of Dark Side energy on whatever planet he was hiding on to mask his presence.

 

But Count Dooku is right, there must be some technique to hide yourself. Even if they couldn't detect Yoda, they would have found Obi-Wan on Tatooine.

[Bastilla_Skywalker]

Bastila just sticks aroun Carth because she is good freinds with Carth and since she knows him best. Bastila I guess sticks around because they both were cdomrades with Revan.

 

cute!

[Zulu 86]

I think Bastila left the Order - not the Force though of course. If you play out her "quest" long enough and well enough, she will meet her mother and agree to meet her on Coruscant after everything is done. Even discounting all that whole Darkness bit she did, by seeking out her family it breaks the whole Jedi Code thingy so she probably packed it in - especially as the rest of the Order collapsed anyway. So after Revan left she went with Carth back to Telos and stayed there. The Sith didn't go after Atris, they probably didn't find Bastilla for the same reason. Personally though I think the whole "Last of the Jedi" was a fib - while it is true they were trying to rid the Galaxy of Jedi, I think the bad guys were chasing the Exile down because all the Exile was was a pawn in a greater power game played between Kreia, Sion and Nihilus.

 

Well, that's what I think anyway. I think because you could murder Juhani on sight probably means that they'll never talk of what happens to her after KOTOR, because she could have died before she even got involved - though I would have thought that if you establish Revan as being LS, there's a good chance that Revan would have let her live.

Who knows though?

[E_Motion]

There is one thing about that cameo -- Bastila doesn't appear until after Exile leaves the room. So part of the message of the cameo is that Bastila is in hiding. Given that the Sith actually found Exile only due to Atrias' efforts to use Exile as a pawn; only found Atrias because of Kreia's intervention; and never located most of the remaining Jedi Council; perhaps it was enough that Bastila's whereabouts were carefully guarded.

[Hey Steve]

There are limits to Nihilus' ability to detect Jedi. Note that he wiped out Katarr because the Jedi council gathered there, basically creating a "force beacon". Vrook mentions that wherever Jedi gathered, they died (leading to the decision to scatter). So if there's just one Jedi or two, even if they are powerful, that doesn't allow Nihilus to detect them (at least, not easily). So the Exile wasn't really the last Jedi, just the last one that the Sith (Nihilus & Sion) know about. Hence, it's not problematic that Bastila is around.

[firehawk12]

There are limits to Nihilus' ability to detect Jedi.  Note that he wiped out Katarr because the Jedi council gathered there, basically creating a "force beacon".  Vrook mentions that wherever Jedi gathered, they died (leading to the decision to scatter).  So if there's just one Jedi or two, even if they are powerful, that doesn't allow Nihilus to detect them (at least, not easily).  So the Exile wasn't really the last Jedi, just the last one that the Sith (Nihilus & Sion) know about.  Hence, it's not problematic that Bastila is around.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yeah... when they say "last Jedi", it should probably be, "the last Jedi they know of"...

[Zulu 86]

There are limits to Nihilus' ability to detect Jedi.  Note that he wiped out Katarr because the Jedi council gathered there, basically creating a "force beacon".  Vrook mentions that wherever Jedi gathered, they died (leading to the decision to scatter).  So if there's just one Jedi or two, even if they are powerful, that doesn't allow Nihilus to detect them (at least, not easily).  So the Exile wasn't really the last Jedi, just the last one that the Sith (Nihilus & Sion) know about.  Hence, it's not problematic that Bastila is around.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yeah... when they say "last Jedi", it should probably be, "the last Jedi they know of"...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well I think Kriea - or what it Atris - kept saying "They believe you to be the last of the Jedi"

[metadigital]

There are limits to Nihilus' ability to detect Jedi.  Note that he wiped out Katarr because the Jedi council gathered there, basically creating a "force beacon".  Vrook mentions that wherever Jedi gathered, they died (leading to the decision to scatter).  So if there's just one Jedi or two, even if they are powerful, that doesn't allow Nihilus to detect them (at least, not easily).  So the Exile wasn't really the last Jedi, just the last one that the Sith (Nihilus & Sion) know about.  Hence, it's not problematic that Bastila is around.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yeah... when they say "last Jedi", it should probably be, "the last Jedi they know of"...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well I think Kriea - or what it Atris - kept saying "They believe you to be the last of the Jedi"

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

This is backed up by the fact that the Exile keeps tripping over Jedis -- how can the Exile be the last Jedi with three (potentially five: why was Atris not still on the Council?) Jedi Council Members that the PC finds in situ during the game?

 

Obviously the "last of the Jedi" was either a poor ruse that fooled nobody, or an early idea that was thrown out after a short time. I'm not sure where, but either overtly or in the subtext, it is made very clear that a lot of Jedi left the Order when the civil war started; the inertia of the Council helped turn a lot of Jedi away from the Order (and after all that good work my LS Revan did drumming up support and redirecting errant FSs to be Jedi rather than Sith ... )

[E_Motion]

After endlessly thrashing this over and over in my head, I've finally come to believe that this wouldn't be a problem at all, except for all the broken quests, unfinished dialogs, and rushed ending. It only takes a few times of wondering whether I missed something - only to find that something was left out - at least for me - to change how I would otherwise look at the whole picture.

 

Without all the other problems, this would have fit nicely. By the time of the Cameo, we know or suspect that both Atrias and Kreia were using the Exile, and leaking the fact of the Exile's and/or other Jedi's existence for their own purposes. So Bastila's existence just builds a stronger case of betrayal, and could have contributed to a more intense story line.

 

But as it was, the questions raised in the cameo weren't incorporated into the ending, leaving it as most likely just another loose, or perhaps contradictory, thread.

 

At the LS ending, one choice of questions is, "Why me?" Kreia's answer is to the effect of "Were you expecting some revelation?" -- Well honestly, I was expecting a lot more of a wrap-up than I got.

[hawk]

The idea behind last of the Jedi is not correct. I guess they say you are the last of the Jedi who could actually defeat Sion, Nihilus and Kreia.

The same thing goes for Luke, being the only one possibly strong enough to defeat Vader and Palpatine.

You think Obi Wan or Yoda could defeat Palpatine / Vader? No. You think Bastila could defeat Sion? No. Bastila would be a great help to defeat Nihilus but only by using her Battle Meditation to destroy the Ravager. Maybe she was actually there to aid Carth and therepublic fleet with her Battle Meditation.

 

I am curious though if Visas has detected Revan prior to Kotor II. He / She is so strong in the force that it couldn't be to difficult to detect.

Hopefully a lot will become clear in Kotor III if it will be made.

[mstormrage]

If you talk to T3 before you get to Telos you can uncover a message from Bastila.

[Jedi Master D Murda]

Interesting topic.

 

I have to say that even before the game came out most of knew that the Exile was not the "last of the Jedi", oh how I hate hearing that. I knew there had to be other Jedi out there and as you play the game you discover that there are.

 

I expected to see Bastila in this game in some shape or form and when I did it did seem she was hiding from the Exile. Could be she didn't know of the Exile's intentions, since if you play DS the Exile wants to murder all the Jedi. But I suspect she was just following Revan's order of keeping the Republic strong until he came back.

 

Regarding Nihilus detecting Jedi, isn't it weird that you have a ship full of Force Users: Exile, Kreia, Handmaiden or Disciple, Visas, Bao Dur, and Mira and yet he does not come after the Ebon Hawk. Whatever happened to "Where Jedi gather, Jedi die... guess they were too insignificant.

[Musopticon?]

There's a difference between being the last jedi, and the last known jedi.

[GhostofAnakin]

Playing LS with LS Revan, Bastila's appearance on the Republic ship Admiral Onasi spoils the premise that the Exile is the last Jedi around. I had assume that Bastila went walkabout with Revan after KOTOR1. Bastila is a powerful Jedi and if she is running around in Republic space with Onasi, why didn't Nihilus track her down. Instead it's just the Exile who produced "a disturbance in the Force", or something like that. Visas didn't mention anything about "detecting" Bastila. What do  you guys think?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

The Exile is the last KNOWN Jedi. I can't stress the word "KNOWN" enough.

[Musopticon?]

Slow

[GhostofAnakin]

I don't bother reading all responses to a topic if I know/think I know the answer to the original poster's question/comment.