Continuity mistake with Mandalore

[DSLuke]

I believe you.

 

I remember that I have seen this dialogue when I was playing KOTOR.

[Planar Jedi]

Okay maybe my memory is weakening. Damn the dark side is growing too strong(though i still have a little doubt)

[Guun Fett Truss]

I like to think about it like this;

 

Mandalore is the leader of the Mandalorian Clans , but only to the clans he has united >> Someone is TRULY Mandalore only if ALL the clans are united .

>> Therefore, there can be many Mandalore, if the clans are not united.

>>Remember Canderous said that it would be a long time before all the clans were

>>united. Hence, I assume that someone has once again reunited ALL the clans and

>>therefore the TRUE Mandalore is back after years .

:cool:

 

This is my take on the problem

[QalOrt]

Hey they ie Lucas said early on Fett was an Ex police officer and also early on in 1996 said Obi Wan and Owen Lars were half brothers. Plus early on they said someone else not Revan killed Mandalore and it was not even at Malakor 5. how do i know the 2 mandalors are the same easy they both were killed at the end ot the Mandalorian war. and i only know of one mandalorian war. Pluse whats up with Sith War-Kotor 1 now in kotor 2 being called the jedi 'civil' war?

 

 

If your PC in Kotor 2 is a girl and you said Revan was a male do you think that the Kotor 2 pc and revan might have been lovers.

[Jad'en]

He is refering that, during KOTOR I, there were two alusions to a new Mandalore existing after the Mandalorian Wars. One was the last memory of HK-47, of being defeated by Mandalore, and as HK was supposed to have been build after the Mandalorian Wars, it is a new one.

 

Second ones are  the datapads on Kashyyk. The Mandalorians that are using the cloaking devices and attacking unarmed opponents have datapads saying Mandalore ordered them to test these weapons.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

The beginning of Revan and Malak's conquest of the galaxy begun with the mandalorians.

 

Hk-47 was made by Revan to destroy key Mandalorian targets in the war.

[bodrock]

Don't need to play game,

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Stopped reading right there.

[Charles Vrike]

Actaully it is fact. The dialogue pretty much gives all the info needed, and I see no reason to alter it for interpretation.

 

Mandalore is killed during the Mandalorian Wars. Canderous knows of this, and the Mandalore's death ended the Mandalorian Wars.

 

Revan and Malak find maps, and attack Galaxy. Revan builds HK-47.

 

Hk is sent to Mandalore Space and is defeated by New Mandalore

 

New Mandalore sends Mandalorians to Kashyyk to test weapons that were used against them in the Mandalorian Wars.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

then that one dies.

 

then

cady

finds the madalore's armor(or mask)* then brengs clan ordo to duxon.

 

then goes with the general (the kotor II pc) to get find more clans.

 

*in kotor 2 i remember that mandalore said that he fond the mandalor aromor(or mask i cant remeber that much) if you go to the madalorians clan on dant. or nar shadaa he will say some thing like that. (i think it was on nar shada thou. but check both)

[Darth_Shemo]

Wait, isn't Canderous the Mandalore in TSL's? I could have sworn traya saying something like that at the end of the game

[Force Reaper]

Wait, isn't Canderous the Mandalore in TSL's?  I could have sworn traya saying something like that at the end of the game

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

The minute you meet him it's obvious that he's Canderous.

[mastaGAW]

hk-47 says in this game he was bulit right after MalachorV as a result of that incident in reality Malachor V was the begining of the war against the Republic so he was built right after the start of the Jedi Civil War. He says basically you're his father because he was built has the result of the Exile's actions.

[Ostkant]

Look, the Mandalore in KOTOR 2 is

Canderous Ordo

, and the Mandalore before that was killed by Revan, most likely in the Mandalorian Wars, which would be the most logical time to do this.

 

After that Mandalore was killed, time passed by until

Canderous

became Mandalore, forming the Ordo Clan on Dxun.

[Kosiah]

Why are you all bothered by this and not by Malachor V being the defining and most devastating incident of the Mandalorian Wars, despite it never being mentioned in KoTR1?

 

In KoTR1 Canderous says, (I am pretty sure), that Revan besting the Mandalore in single combat won the war. He doesn't mention a shadow gravity bomb thing, nor is it entirely clear where the battle between Revan and the Mandalore took place. The only thing that is mentioned is that afterwards Revan made them all melt down the basilisks, etc. You could easily assume that this single combat was accompanied by a great naval battle or whatever, but it's not mentioned.

 

If it was so devastating, why isn't it mentioned?

 

I have no problem assuming several people tried to take the title of Mandalore, only to fail in some way before Canderous took it up.

 

How can Malachor V be the most devastating incident anyways, if there were no civilian casualties?

 

In other battles there were. That is mentioned too.

 

This seems like a larger plot hole to me, shrug.

[cewekeds]

There where civilian casualties one of your NPC lost their parents on Malachor V.

 

Look at the focus of the two games one was about the SF. Kotor 2 is all about Malachor V.

[Ostkant]

Did you just say that there were no casualties at Malachor? Do you have any idea on how many people died there? It's the reason

the Exile is deafened to the Force and why that place becomes such a dead place in the Force

 

 

It's all over the game, I read it several times. A lot of people died in that battle over Malachor.

[jedipodo]

Canderous said that he was the second man (or something like that) under Mandalore in the Mandalorian Wars. Perhaps he took his title after his leader's defeat. After some rivals rebelled against him and the killer droids were on his track he could've been stranded on Taris until Revan met him... And finally in TSL he reapeared as Mandalore.

 

What if Canderous was the Mandalore whom HK-47 should kill?

[envida]

Canderous said that he was the second man (or something like that) under Mandalore in the Mandalorian Wars. Perhaps he took his title after his leader's defeat. After some rivals rebelled against him and the killer droids were on his track he could've been stranded on Taris until Revan met him... And finally in TSL he reapeared as Mandalore.

 

What if Canderous was the Mandalore whom HK-47 should kill?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Not possible because Canderous/Mandalore tells you in the game that Revan told him to go find the Mandalore helmet, that is how Canderous got the helmet and became Mandalore. Canderous believed that Revan destroyed the Helmet when he killed Mandalore, but he didnt and later told Canderous to find it and become the new Mandalore....

[Charles Vrike]

^ i dont remember that revan was telling him that....

[envida]

If you ask mandalore about revan he tells you this....

[stoffe -mkb-]

Why are you all bothered by this and not by Malachor V being the defining and most devastating incident of the Mandalorian Wars, despite it never being mentioned in KoTR1?

 

In KoTR1 Canderous says, (I am pretty sure),  that Revan besting the Mandalore in single combat won the war. He doesn't mention a shadow gravity bomb thing, nor is it entirely clear where the battle between Revan and the Mandalore took place. The only thing that is mentioned is that afterwards Revan made them all melt down the basilisks, etc. You could easily assume that this single combat was accompanied by a great naval battle or whatever, but it's not mentioned.

 

(snip)

 

It is mentioned in the first game that the final battle of the war took place above Malachor V, though not much else is mentioned about it, when Canderous tells you about the Mandalorian War in KotOR. That conversation thread goes something like:

 

Cand: "We fought against the Republic forces for some time, over the course of many battles."

 

Cand: "At the start, they were not much of a threat to speak of, but once you had taken charge, things began to turn against us."

 

Cand: "The Republic fleets began to use more than just basic tactics. Feints, counterattacks, mass deceptions. You were a genius on the field. You are held in very high regard among my people."

 

Cand: "You abandoned worlds of their defenders so that others would be too fortified to strike. You made sacrifices in order to advance your goals."

 

Cand: "In the end, you proved too much for us."

 

Revan: "If I had not stopped you, someone else would have."

 

Cand: "There was no one else. The entire Republic had committed its forces behind you. The Sith had retreated back to their empire and there were none else strong enough to challenge us."

 

Cand: "It looked like the entire galaxy was within our grasp!"

 

Cand: "I still remember that final battle in the skies above Malachor V. The two fleets filling the space around it, outshining the stars..."

 

Revan: "But you eventually lost."

 

Cand: "Yeah, we lost. But there is no shame in it. We lost to the greatest single warrior the Republic has ever known."

 

Cand: "It was not your ships or your men or your vaunted 'fight for freedom' that won this, the final battle of the war."

 

Cand: "It was by the actions of one person - you - that the Republic prevailed."

 

Cand: "Your strategies and tactics defeated the best we could send against you. Even Mandalore himself was taken aback by the ferocity of your attacks, the tenacity of your defenses and the subtleties of your plans."

 

Cand: "You fought us to a standstill and then began pushing back. We didn't really have a chance."

 

Revan: "Why didn't you retreat?"

 

Cand: "It was what we had wanted all along, in a way. We wanted to fight the best in a battle that would be remembered for centuries. And we did."

 

Cand: "And you won."

 

Cand: "I hold no grudge against you, nor do any of my people. It was the greatest of honors to fight against you, even in defeat. It is even more of an honor to fight beside you now."

 

Cand: "Had you been born of the Mandalorian clans, surely nothing in this galaxy would have been able to stop us."

 

Cand: "But wishing for the past to be different is useless. Better to look to the future. As we should now. We'll talk more later, I think."

 

So, he mentions that the final battle was fought over Malachor V, but nothing about any fleet destroying gravity bombs, forbidden planets or such.

 

The start of the next conversation with Canderous suggests that Mandalore was killed by Revan, and it would likely have been at the Final Battle at Malachor, since Mandalorians don't retreat. It also suggests that most of the Mandalorians fought to the death in the final battle, leaving few survivors, but speaks nothing of what kind of casualties the Republic fleet and the embedded Jedi suffered. But obviously there where enough of them left to round up any Mandalorian survivors and destroy their weapons.

 

Cand: "The war we had with the Republic was supposed to be the most glorious battle of our history, but... it was a very costly one. I guess we didn't think of how much we could lose in it."

 

Revan: "But I kicked your tails so badly?"

 

Cand: "Yeah... yeah you did. You were a great warrior Revan. A great general."

 

Cand: "There weren't many of us left after that last battle. Mandalore himself was killed at the hands of the Jedi Revan. The best of us could not defeat you!"

 

Cand: "After that last battle, those of us that survived were stripped of our weapons, our armor, and our Basilisks."

 

Cand: "The Republic's forces destroyed them while we were forced to watch. Those who hadn't fled earlier were left with nothing to call their own: no weapons, no armor... only the honor of having fought in the battle we just lost."

 

Story continuity with the first game of the series apparently wasn't too much of a priority.

[Kosiah]

In the second game isn't it mentioned that no one lives on Malachor V? And that traditionally it's some sort of uninhabited planet that is sacred to the Mandalorians in some way? I was under the impression that the general habitat on the planet wasn't exactly pleasant, even before gravity wells.

 

I'd assume the NPC that lost relatives there did so because of who they were. Given the NPC in question, (unless there's another one I'm not thinking of), I'd asume those relatives were not exactly civilians. And no, I don't mean Cand.

 

I mention "civilian" casualties not just casualties, because I always inferred, from the text quoted above in KoTR1 that Revan and the Republic's tactics did have a high civilian body count. This is also suggested (at least to me) in the questions asked by the Kashyyyk computer.