What was lame in KOTOR?

[TheHutt]

The repetitive alien dialog... same phrase over and over again..

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I completely agree

Mucha shaka baka or w/e the f it was meant 50 different things in one conversation! Come on LucasArts... your making up a language and you can't even make more then one phrase per race? :ph34r:

[Jedi Master D Murda]

The Robes. They are now better so <_<

[Kaftan Barlast]

The scrapping of Sleheyron and its consequence that the wonderful miss Ban could not join your party as a full NPC.

 

 

 

..and that the plot was lifted from NWN

[Craigboy2]

What i found poor was when on Mannan, after i confessed to breaking in to the Sith base, i was put to death in a cage. HOW LAME. Being level 20 at the time, why the hell would the PC just allow them to do that jedi or Sith. Any others?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Because they lack of freedom, there were like 10 of them and i thought **** i can take them on, but it didn't let me, and i lost the trial and and and ( ) i hadn't saved in a long time.

[Craftsman]

I dont think the game should not protect the player from their own stupidity. I what they do causes 100 selkath to run at you, bring it on:)

[nightcleaver]

The scrapping of Sleheyron and its consequence that the wonderful miss Ban could not join your party as a full NPC.

 

 

 

..and that the plot was lifted from NWN

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Well you know, some theorize that there are only a few stories that are told over and over again throughout all of literary history. Funny thing is, they can't seem to agree on WHAT stories are repeated over and over again, exactly.

 

Also, I would've rather they did away with the more amateurish voices, or at least made them into caricatures (like they did in BG) instead of assaulting my ears with the inflectionless crap they did every now and then. I would've preferred lettered dialogue instead of badly acted dialogue.

[LORD GRAVEN]

i loved kotor but there were some minor letdowns, like how it took forever to ge a decent outfit. only revans robes were on the forge well if u recreated them and the ls version wasnt as good as ds version. guns not very good unless u bought casses fetts gun and upgraded it. outer space slow as ith underwater. levels good.more conversation optons would be good also.

[Zach Morris]

I dont think the game should not protect the player from their own stupidity. I what they do causes 100 selkath to run at you, bring it on:)

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

That would make the game a lot more fun I think. That way I read the dialogue choices and really think about them.

"Hmmm. Should I click this one? What if they all attack me? Maybe I shouldn't. I'll play it safe here."

 

Also I would have liked a Jedi Master difficulty setting after I beat the game.

[Shneider]

The generally petty, capricious dialogue options for 'dark side' characters. I expected much more from BioWare with CRPG titles like the Baldur's Gate Saga and Planescape Torment under their proverbial belts.

 

The mini-games were too long and too boring to bother with, My advice to Obsidian: read the Han Solo trilogy, learn Sabacc, implement Sabacc.

 

The lack of anti-Force user tactics. Take a lesson from Thrawn or any number of bounty hunters and just provide more options than x arcane sorcery or y hack and slash option. And I don't mean lay an 'elaborate' mine-field; write unique AI's for certain NPC's e.g. when protagonist sets a mine, Malak uses the Force to cause it to blow up in their face; or instead of fighting a possible trio of Jedi/Sith Calo Nord decides to attack from the relative safety and advantage of his speeder instead of engaging in honorable combat.

 

Scripted events, convenient captures and escapes: Perhaps the hallmark of Star Wars, but then perhaps it is time for a change. Don't leave prisoners unguarded, use some sort of psuedo-scientific scan to make sure no party members are left aboard to perform a rescue (this is science fiction after all), and in the words of Irenicus: "You warrant no villain's exposition from me." Take this lesson to heart shall we? Also, provide the option to massacre any security force that attempts to detain you; remember the Cowled Wizards from Shadows of Amn?

 

Combat techniques need some refinement. Provide stun settings for blasters. Let people aim for any limb, head or tail, not just the torso.

[alanschu]

I would agree that the Manaan trial should have had endless hordes of level 20 guys (and possibly with damage resistance) coming at you to detain you.

 

Realistically, I don't think it would be possible to get out of Manaan after you admit to killing the Sith for fun....but rather than just cutting to your execution, set up an impossible fight where you get knocked unconscious, captured, and executed.

 

However, having said all that, you were likely already incapacitated in some form when you were on trial. They probably should make this endless horde come when you attempt to resist capture. It'll give the illusion of doing your own thing, but still limit the player down an easier to maintain path.

[Blarghagh]

Lame things? Well, first of all, I agree with everyone who said that Yuthara Ban couldn't join you.

 

The game forcing you to do mini-games.

 

Underwater/Space walking. Why was it so slow?

 

Lightside Revan Robes which were damn ugly compared to the Darkside.

 

The utterly boring characters Zaalbar and T3. The overwhelming amount of angst that was Juhani. And, of course, Carth running away when you play darkside even though throughout the whole game he's a huge hero. This left you with no true 'hero' to kill. Just sidekicks and other villains. In darkside, you didn't play a villain, you played as a backstabbing gangster.

 

Having to go on a mission from the Jedi Council even if you play darkside.

 

Malak being a carictature instead of a character. I expected more from a villain made by Bioware. Jon Irenicus was a better villain, in my opinion.

 

Sith all being losers instead of badass warriors.

 

How you don't really see that there's a war going on in the galaxy.

 

The shortness of the romances.

 

How the Star Forge was basically another Death Star. Can't we think of an original danger to the whole galaxy?

 

Having only one possible solution for a lot of quests.

 

The Rakatan. But that's just because they personally annoyed me.

 

The lack of different models and textures for buildings. This made a lot of parts very boring.

 

How damn easy it was.

 

There were also a lot of good things, though. Cool sidequests, humour, some really cool environments to balance out the bad one's(Taris, The Leviathan), HK, etc.

[maxSmart]

I thought that the lame thing was the reven thing after finding out not able make anyone know it plus i felt that upon reciving that and that some of your memories came back you should have been able to get some kind of bonus like a fp or feat theat reven might have had. The carth romance that just was insults not flirting funny maybee. And that playing female basstila still said basically all the same things in the same way that should have been changed a bit more. Whith carth in male play there are in many of the talks less options or even different.

[Spook]

When I come to think of it...Pazzack was so boring it was lame.

[Craftsman]

Lets hope if they cant change it to sabbac, they make the expereice a little more challenging. But still its only a minigame, so just focus on the main thing devs

[Evil_Manbeastly_Beast]

the leviathan sucked!!!! taris was the best planet....also why are people saying that the star forge robes were good? they sucked worse than anything! the first time i got them i expected darth revans robes..not some pathetic girly skirt.....the star forge was a good thing and i do admit it was a rip off from the death star but the star forge was still great...but not the way it was destroyed...they could have come up with something a bit better than 10 capitol ships bombing this tiny singular pillar on the top and then having the entire thing explode...that part sucked aswell...

[MASTER]

walking/ running was better, but still slow.

[Guest Darth Banooby7]

The selkath sounded like a toilet flushing and then clogging

 

The Star Forge. They should have made 3 or 4 powerfull jedi fight you, and have it take a long time. Like have a droid or two try to stop you at first, then a powerful Dark Jedi, a few Sith troopers, another moderately powerfull Dark Jedi, Bandon, Bastila, and THEN Malak, that way you would feel like you had fought a real battle rather than feeling annoyed at fighting 50 billion chumps. Malak must not have been 2 smart to send all the Dark Jedi to slow you down, what a waste of troops!

[Guest Darth Banooby7]

Obsidian, pleeze let us cut off body parts like in Jedi Academy!

[Guest Darth Banooby7]

Imagine how dramattic it would have been to cut Malaks hand off, and show him fall to the ground wounded!

 

One time in JA, I stabbed this dude where the sun never shines!

[Seeker1]

I think the lamest part was the minigames.

 

Pazaak was fine. You never had to play if you didn't want to. As it was, I almost never did, there were plenty of places to get credits without relying on a game of chance (I hate gambling). It also struck me as a simply superficially altered version of the casino game "21".

 

Swoop racing? It would have been fine if, like Pazaak, you could do it as an OPTION, which is the case on any planet, except for Taris, where they MAKE you do it to further the main quest. Couldn't there have been a "rescue Bastila" alternative path BESIDES that?

 

And that damn turret-fighter minigame. Ack. I would have found it OK *IF* they had included a cheat code for insta-victory for it (all the "restart minigame" cheat ever did was crash my game) or simply to ignore it. I even would have put up with it if it was a random encounter you occasionally got between planets. I simply would have quicksaved between each planet run and restarted from that save until I didn't get the encounter. However, to further the game plot, you HAVE to complete the minigame three times throughout the plotline, and the result of failure is irremediable. Couldn't they just have you crash on a planet and have to repair the ship like they did on the Unknown World?

 

I bought KOTOR to play an RPG, not an RPG with some half thought out arcade-type minigames stuck in it. The point of RPGs is not to test your arcade/handeye/twitch skills, but your CHARACTER's skills. So, why is it that when me/Revan has a 25 dexterity and 20 heavy weapons skill, hitting those damn fighters remains as hard as ever? Why can't I upgrade the Ebon Hawk's turrets to fire smart bombs or something or augment its shields? And, since there are tons of hints that you should be able to upgrade your swoop bike, why can't you?

 

I know some people found the turret minigame pathetically easy, me, I found myself constantly being blinded by the sun, finding the radar reading on the fighters deceptive and inaccurate, and what looked like direct hits on the fighters as they were retreating from an attack run being ignored. Plus, what was all that flotsam that kept floating through my field of fire, distracting me?

 

Bottom line is, it wasn't optional, and neither was the swoop racing. More irritating was that to save Bastila, you had to get a lousy time, and then a good one. Because if you post a good time on the first run, the challenger automatically beats your first run, and then you have to beat him. Unfortunately, I didn't know this at first, found myself unable to beat his beating of my first run, and suddenly found myself back at the load game screen. Not even a cutscene with somebody coming to tell me that I lost the race and game over. Yuck. :angry:

 

Anyway, I read in the FAQ that KOTOR2's minigames will be both improved and totally optional, to which I say hurrah. I do not even mind if there are, for example, certain results and items you can ONLY get through the minigames, as long as you don't HAVE to do them to win.

 

Other miscellaneous observations --

 

1. poor implementation of the Bastila romance. Why nothing at the end showing the result of her confession of love to you at the Star Forge. I guess as you are both Jedi so things still can't go forward (I understand the SW III movie will show that it is Anakin and Padme's romance that causes his downfall), but there's no discussion of it at the end.

 

2. wasn't bothered by the space or undersea scenes. It is kinda funny seeing you tramp about slowly in either an underwater diving suit or space suit, and even funnier if you use the turbo cheat during either scene. However, the undersea scenes seem "pointed" (even if I never could figure out how many times to fire that sonic emitter to kill the sharks or what would happen if I failed to fire it n number of times; I just kept hitting it over and over again until they died). The spacewalk scene seems kind of like an afterthought. Sure, it's your alternative route to the Leviathan bridge and all, but nothing happens between A and B, unlike your undersea trip.

 

3. the Manaan trial was a bit strange. I thought I put on an excellent defense of the guy, and he was still convicted. Even odder, I got XP for it! As it turns out, many game guides/walkthrus seem to indicate (spoiler alert???) he WAS guilty, so maybe I'm simply being rewarded for making the best of a worst situation? There was a darkside way to get him off scot free, by force persuading the hotel desk clerk to lie, but I chose not to use it. I saw no other way to win an innocent verdict, but then, apparently, I shouldn't have been able to ... ?

 

4. (Spoiler alert 2?) It's interesting the way they used a nice gender-neutral name like "Revan" so that regardless of what you play, the central revelation of the game makes sense. Honestly, it's never made clear why s/he//you were never recognized (did the Force cause plastic surgery to occur?), except they seem to indicate Revan always wore his/her mask everywhere (although not why -- unlike Malak s/he had no facial injury). Also, the one curious thing I will note about the game is that it sort of parallels Return of the Jedi in that the defeat of the enemy is sort of irrelevant. Luke and Anakin kill the Emperor on the Death Star Reloaded, but he would have been killed ANYWAY when Lando destroyed it. Likewise, the only thing you really do on the Star Forge that appears relevant is the redemption of Bastila (if you choose that path) and her turning her Battle Meditation back over to the Republic side, enabling them to win. It seems that Malak would have been killed anyway when it was destroyed...

 

5. I'm not sure I dug the class/game system. I don't think SWd20 is that impoverished...? Too few skills. Too few non-combat feats for anyone other than jedi or droids. No options to play as a nonhuman, even though you had alien and droid NPCs. I understand the need for nerfing ranged weapons in these games, but blaster fire was ridiculously inaccurate and weak even for lvl20 Carth with his uber blaster. I also would have appreciated a multiclass possibility for other characters, giving them the option to become jedi or maybe even having juhani stop being jedi (fallen?) and become something else (scoundrel?) Also, as a multiclassed jedi, I really hated not having 8 more levels to get some more jedi feats and powers... although there is a KOTOR hack that lets you start as jedi, it really appears to muck with the plotline on Dantooine... that and while scout/jedi sentinel made sense, as did soldier/jedi guardian, scoundrel/consular did not (I guess its the SW equivalent of mage/thief).

 

I liked the 9 NPCs, but I would have also liked to see a human melee soldier (Zaalbar is your main melee guy, but can't wear armor, and you can make Canderous into one, but he seems better suited as your machine gunner), and a human scout (Zaalbar really should be a warrior), and another scoundrel besides the good-natured young twilek girl with a soft heart... and a 2nd romance choice besides Bastila and ... Juhani.... for male PCs. That, and your dark side choices are limited. Only Canderous, HK, and Dark Bastila won't ditch you if you go the darkside route.

 

OK, long response to a simple question, but I'm done. I do hope all these things are improved in KOTOR2. Oh yeah, and that there's a Mac version.

[TheHutt]

The swoop racing wasn't that bad eh? People shouldn't complain about doing it ONCE... because it's just trying something new... if you don't like it fine but at least its a different experience.

Although I do agree most of the arcade games were a bit hacky.

In regards to the revan being a gender neutral name... I'm sure being experienced plot righters that Lucas Arts or w/e is, they had a sequal in mind. Keeping Revan gender neutral makes KOTOR2 more customizable and fun to replay. ( Along with the many other reasons )

I agree with the bastila/romance comment... that should have been expanded upon closer to the ending as of it was the most likely reason for her downfall giving into emotion.

Other than that, KOTOR was just the first game of the series and many things have been changed or improved upon that was disliked throughout this thread.

KOTOR2 is going to rule.

I think we all agree with that. I really enjoyed reading the reviews and FAQs.

[Guest Darth Banooby7]

I'm sure being experienced plot righters that Lucas Arts or w/e is, they had a sequal in mind.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Actualy, I read that KotOR 2 development started before KotOR's

 

with that in mind, THIS GAME SHOULD ROCK!

[Craftsman]

KOTOR 3 game engine is already being developed, if you didnt know.

[Guest Darth Banooby7]

Wow, COOL!

[Meshugger]

- Yuthura not being able to join your party.

- After your revelation, aren't taken seriously by fellow Sith(if you're playing DS).

- The level-design in some places, especially on Manaan.

- Ugly robes.

- The planets didn't feel like a planets, too few enviroments.