Overuse of the double-bladed saber

[Drakron]

 

And and sniggy, Exar Kun was given his Staff before Lucas made Ep. I ... so it did not feel special, just that Lucas obsession with fannel driven him completly insane.

[sniggy]

(And and? huh?)

 

hmm. you're right about Kun- i guess lucas thought that it'd be cool to actually see that in action.

 

but no, i also mean stuff like dookus curved blade or chewbaccas weapon. once unique weapons cease to be unique, fans start complaining of course.

 

but as to some peoples obsession with lucas (not meaning you, D, but i noticed that on these boards):

 

he's not doing all the stuff himself, eh? theres a whole staff or art directors and designers who come up with ideas- he just goes: like this. hate that. etc. so it's not like he actually comes up with people like maul.

[Drakron]

True, I remenber Lucas asking for someone making a scary thing and he did and Lucas saying it was too scary, Maul image concept is the second choice.

 

I guess the reason Maul have a staff is because he was going to fight two people at the same time and the staff allowed more impressive fighting on a 2-1 that if he used a regular blade.

[Victus]

That is your argument, its not based on rules, its not based on the universe (Maul used a staff and Anakin dual wield and NEITHER were anything more that aprencides at that point)

Ehh

 

So what Maul was an apprentice? This doesn't mean he cannot use a lightsaber effectively. He was able to take two Jedi at the same time... his arrogance was his weakness.

 

Anyway, the rule of two seem to give use two really powerful sith. I guess this is to make up for the Jedi having power in numbers.

[Topaz Quasar]

I agree it is overused.

 

One thing I noticed is that two-handed weapon support feats meant the penalties for using 2-blade lightsaber/melee blades or dual-wielding pistols/blades/lightsabers were removed. Dueling feats meant you gain both attack & defense bonuses as long as you are using only one lightsaber/pistol/blade, hence making the single saber a "defensive" method.

 

The reason so many Sith seem to use it is because they're obsessed with offensive power.

 

If you noticed, most of the Jedi in KOTOR used single saber styles. Bastila seemed to take a special interest in the double-bladed style. Jolee already had some duelist feats learned when you get him. Only Revan & Juhani were "undecided" (e.g. no preselected duelist/two-handed feats)

[alanschu]

Also Maul is nothing more that a aprendice so it shows the "Sith Lightsaber" is not prestigue at all if a aprendice can use it and lets not forget Maul was simply a aprendice, the rule-of-two made sure they would only be one Sith Lord and his only aprendice.

Being an apprentice to the Dark Lord of the Sith is not the same as being some sort of Jedi Newb or anything.

 

He's basically number 2 in the ranking of the Sith....the only person more powerful is the Dark Lord himself. Hence, Darth Maul being only an "apprentice" doesn't mean much IMO.

[guns1inger]

Also Maul is nothing more that a aprendice so it shows the "Sith Lightsaber" is not prestigue at all if a aprendice can use it and lets not forget Maul was simply a aprendice, the rule-of-two made sure they would only be one Sith Lord and his only aprendice.

Being an apprentice to the Dark Lord of the Sith is not the same as being some sort of Jedi Newb or anything.

 

He's basically number 2 in the ranking of the Sith....the only person more powerful is the Dark Lord himself. Hence, Darth Maul being only an "apprentice" doesn't mean much IMO.

That's exactly what I'm saying. There's a definitive difference between Maul's apprentice status and the apprentice status used in KOTOR. Maul was THE apprentice to the Sith lord. That's a title only held by one person. The dark apprentices appearing seemingly everywhere in KOTOR were NOT unique in their status.

[Weiser_Cain]

The bottom line, I think, is that the staff is supposed to be extremely rare. Like to the point that only two user in the last 5000 years are known. I can see giving the PC the chance to weild one because of how popular Maul is but even then I'd restrict it. Make it an easter egg...

[guns1inger]

The bottom line, I think, is that the staff is supposed to be extremely rare. Like to the point that only two user in the last 5000 years are known. I can see giving the PC the chance to weild one because of how popular Maul is but even then I'd restrict it. Make it an easter egg...

THANK YOU!!! Finally!!! I was really wondering if I was speaking Greek or something. That's all I've been saying--in a nutshell of course.

 

(BTW--Victus, if your signature is about my earlier comment, it was directed toward drekron not you )

[Drakron]

Being an apprentice to the Dark Lord of the Sith is not the same as being some sort of Jedi Newb or anything.

 

He's basically number 2 in the ranking of the Sith....the only person more powerful is the Dark Lord himself. Hence, Darth Maul being only an "apprentice" doesn't mean much IMO.

Considering he is n

[Drakron]

The bottom line, I think, is that the staff is supposed to be extremely rare. Like to the point that only two user in the last 5000 years are known. I can see giving the PC the chance to weild one because of how popular Maul is but even then I'd restrict it. Make it an easter egg...

First I have to point we only have the Tales of the Jedi comic line on that time period and they adress a few years.

 

First lightsaber technology is Jedi in origin and developed after the regenegade Jedi left and create the Sith, the Sith used swords and later lightsabers (from the Jedi design, they did not come up with then)

 

Also around the Great Hyperspace War Lightsaber technology still required the lightsaber hilt to be connected by a cord to a separated power source so things like a lightstaff were too dificult to create due to the current technology.

 

Later we have Kun that creates a lightstaff on a time were lightsabers have their powersource in the hilt, now Exar Kun started as a Jedi and not as a Sith so his lightstaff design comes from his own mind and not from some kind of "Sith Lore" since, naturaly,a Lightstaff was impossible to create during the Sith Empire age because of technology was not being advanced enough.

 

Not oddly enough after Kun time the comics shifts to Ulic death (that was not due to natural causes) and then to the Jedi vs Sith comics that takes place about 1000 years before the prequels and then nothing until the prequels.

 

So we have Kun and then a 2986 years span were we know nothing about, we then have about 1000 years were we AGAIN know nothing about.

 

THAT what I would like to people THINK about it, the fact we have a 3000 years hole were nothing was written about.

[Quiquag]

gunslinger, though you are new to the boards, i would like to say you make great and useful posts

[Frosty_V2.1]

point is that there are some weapons which made some characters in the SW universe unique. double bladed sabers is one example.

That's more or less what I think, I'm not a SW or EU junkie but usually stuff like dual wielding or "light staff" are used for effect, to show a more unique menace and skill or badassedness or unique/special character. Just like the the black attire with cape and breathing apparatus of Vader.

 

Level restrictions or what not don't worry me much in regards to the PC but better placement on enemy NPCs would be good, only putting them on stronger enemies like higher level "leaders" of groups that attack you for example. Would be good to do that with specific robe styles(I guess they did this once or twice with KotOR with the Darth Bandon type armour) and such too so you can see the grunts vs. masters etc...

[Child of Flame]

gunslinger, though you are new to the boards, i would like to say you make great and useful posts

[Adria Teksuni]

Anyhoo....

 

I can definitely agree with making double lightsaber or lightstaff usage a mastery feat, I was surprised when it wasn't, to tell you the truth. I think it was because you had waited so long to be a Jedi in the first place...

[Child of Flame]

Anyhoo....

 

I can definitely agree with making double lightsaber or lightstaff usage a mastery feat, I was surprised when it wasn't, to tell you the truth. I think it was because you had waited so long to be a Jedi in the first place...

No, it was becuase the first game was made by the Bioweenies, for the **** fans. I pray to all the powers that may be that the former Black Islanders can get it right this time around. <_<

[guns1inger]

gunslinger, though you are new to the boards, i would like to say you make great and useful posts

[guns1inger]

Also, I think the same should apply to dual saber wielding as well.

[anari_quun]

The double bladed lightsaber (cough*gimmick*coughahem) was used by Maul, yes. It made him unique. And there is something to be said about just anybody wielding these weapons; it dillutes character importance in the overall scheme of things.

 

Maul was pretty much in the same shoes as Vader (DLotS), apprentice or not. Maybe he wasn't as powerful, but he killed Qui Gon and held off Obi Wan for some time.

 

But Darth Maul was defeated, and as for what happened when Anakin tried using two lightsabers, well...

 

Technologically, it's just two sabers fused at the hilt; it doesn't matter one way or another how it's built: you have a double sided lightsaber. End of story.

 

Of course, we wouldn't want to restrict anybody from using any type of weapon. Why, because they can't hold it? Ridiculous. So if some Sith guy wants to brandish a double bladed lightsaber, so be it. However...

 

He/she should be cutting their own limbs off trying to fight the enemy. Either that, or in trying not to hit themselves with the overabundance of exposed cutting surface they should become virtually worthless on the battlefield.

 

It just occured to me that a Jedi could use this to his/her advantage quite easily; just by slightly manipulating an opponent's double bladed weapon they could kill them. But I won't go down that road.

 

So, I'm all for making this ability to control a two bladed weapon or two separate weapons a much higher level feat. I also think that there should be three separate feats: Dueling, two weapon, and double bladed weapons.

[Weiser_Cain]

It's suppose to be very difficult to construct a normal light saber. So much so that luke failed in his first try. A double saber would be at least twice as hard.

[Drakron]

I almost agree with anari_quun.

 

One point I disagree is as it stands there are hit penalties for dual wield or staff use, the system works because the dificulty to use such weapon/style makes the user more concerned about not hitting himself and its not hitting the enemy.

 

Also I disagree with those "faets" ideas, true that a Exotic Weapons profience: Lightstaff feats tree sould exist but that would just give a +1 to BAB when using such weapon.

 

(I disagree about Maul but that is another argument)

 

Again the problem becames levels, at some point they are and sould be skillfull enough to wield such weapons ... the "Jedi Hunting" Sith teams we face early in SW:KotOR are not low level thugs, the Sith we face later would not be either ... its first and formost a RPG game.

[anari_quun]

Drakron, you bring us to an even more important problem: too many Jedi.

 

As I would like to believe, Force sensitivity is exceedingly rare. Where the heck are all these Dark Jedi coming from?

 

I think it would be much more interesting if there were only a few Sith/Dark Jedi in the game that each had their distinct identity instead of these ninja guys. Of course there's an overabundance of double balded lightsabers- there's an overabundance of Dark Jedi using them!

 

The enemies that have "grunt" status shouldn't be using the Force. Force sensitive opponents should be few and far between, and should be very difficult to defeat. I think this would help our problem considerably. I think it would also make the game more realistic and fun.

[Dereth]

Where the heck are all these Dark Jedi coming from?

 

Apparently the star forge pumps out more than ships. It also mass produces prefabricated dark jedi clones!

 

You'd have a sith officer sitting by the machine with a checklist "Skintight grey suit on the left, cloaks straight ahead, lightsabers on the right!"

[Ivan the Terrible]

Drakron, you bring us to an even more important problem: too many Jedi.

 

As I would like to believe, Force sensitivity is exceedingly rare. Where the heck are all these Dark Jedi coming from?

 

I think it would be much more interesting if there were only a few Sith/Dark Jedi in the game that each had their distinct identity instead of these ninja guys. Of course there's an overabundance of double balded lightsabers- there's an overabundance of Dark Jedi using them!

 

The enemies that have "grunt" status shouldn't be using the Force. Force sensitive opponents should be few and far between, and should be very difficult to defeat. I think this would help our problem considerably. I think it would also make the game more realistic and fun.

Seconded. Jedi and Sith should never be 'grunts'; they should be commanders and 'boss' enemies, rare and exceedingly dangerous.

[Weiser_Cain]

I'll back that, jedi should be generals not soldiers.