Ukraine Conflict

[xzar_monty]

12 hours ago, Mamoulian War said:

anyone know, how much weight this has in the international “waters”? Especially with the fact that no one voted against, nor abstained.

It is a strong recommendation for member countries, so if they all publicly agree with it, then it starts to have at least some weight.

Here is the NATO document. The relevant bit is #19.i.: https://www.nato-pa.int/download-file?filename=/sites/default/files/2022-11/RESOLUTION 479 - NATO POST MADRID .pdf

Edited November 22, 2022 by xzar_monty

[xzar_monty]

Apart from being terroristic, the current Russian regime is also inhuman towards its own. There is already ample evidence for it, so whether this story turns out to be exaggerated or not does not make much difference. But it is, yet again, an awful story.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/nov/21/russians-accused-of-burning-bodies-at-kherson-landfill

 

Also, info on Russian equipment losses. Serious stuff:

 

Edited November 22, 2022 by xzar_monty

[BruceVC]

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/uk-sends-brimstone-2-missiles-to-ukraine-to-counter-russian-invasion/ar-AA14o5sf 

 

The UK has sent one of its most advanced missiles to Ukraine, the Brimstone 2   

[xzar_monty]

Some more Russian spies in Sweden: https://www.aftonbladet.se/nyheter/a/69qE2z/gift-par-fran-ryssland-gripna-for-spionage-levde-dubbelliv

[Mamoulian War]

 

[Mamoulian War]

15 hours ago, xzar_monty said:

Apart from being terroristic, the current Russian regime is also inhuman towards its own. There is already ample evidence for it, so whether this story turns out to be exaggerated or not does not make much difference. But it is, yet again, an awful story.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/nov/21/russians-accused-of-burning-bodies-at-kherson-landfill

 

Also, info on Russian equipment losses. Serious stuff:

 

According to locals, there was a lot of stench during occupation period coming from that location…

 

 

[xzar_monty]

Meanwhile, a story from the West: if you provide inaccurate information that can potentially be very dangerous, it can have consequences.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/media/2022/11/21/james-laporta-associated-press-poland-russia-missile/

[pmp10]

Among the recent UK arms package to Ukraine are the Sea King helicopters.
These would be the first western aircraft delivered to Ukraine, even if intended for not-combat usage. 

[Mamoulian War]

New ammunition for HIMARS and M270 launchers are production ready. Range 150km.

https://www.saab.com/products/ground-launched-small-diameter-bomb-glsdb

[Lexx]

Seems like russian terror does have an effect tho: https://thenewsglory.com/residents-of-odessa-blocked-the-road-in-protest-due-to-blackouts/

[Mamoulian War]

Investigation of alleged war crime in Makiivka by Ukrainian soldiers, has started in Ukraine.

https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2022/11/22/7377474/

 

Edited November 23, 2022 by Mamoulian War

[Mamoulian War]

European Parliament voted for recognizing Russia as state sponsor of terrorism.

[PK htiw klaw eriF]

3 hours ago, xzar_monty said:

Meanwhile, a story from the West: if you provide inaccurate information that can potentially be very dangerous, it can have consequences.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/media/2022/11/21/james-laporta-associated-press-poland-russia-missile/

Edit: posting on a phone, forum not nice to quoting 

Not consequences for the editors who pushed it through without bothering to get a second source. I don't doubt that LaPorta ****ed up and even may have lied (though the explanation sounds like management throwing someone under the bus to me), but the second editor is laughably irresponsible.

LaPorta shared the U.S. official’s tip in an electronic message around 1:30 p.m. Eastern time. An editor immediately asked if AP should issue an alert on his tip, “or would we need confirmation from another source and/or Poland?”

After further discussion, a second editor said she “would vote” for publishing an alert, adding, “I can’t imagine a U.S. intelligence official would be wrong on this.”

But a person at the Associated Press familiar with the larger conversations surrounding the story that day said LaPorta also told his editors that a senior manager had already vetted the source of LaPorta’s tip — leaving the impression that the story’s sourcing had been approved. While that editor had signed off on previous stories using LaPorta’s source, that editor had not weighed in on the missile story.

Easton said the organization did not anticipate any discipline for the editors involved.

Edited November 23, 2022 by Make a contract with KP

[Malcador]

Not sure of the damage, other than making some people get oddly excited for a NATO-Russia war.  Not as if the players involved are basing actions majorly off the papers, considering what's involved. 

 

[pmp10]

Seems Ukrainian power grid is nearing the breaking point:
24 hours of blackout for the whole country is announced after missile strikes today.

This also means no power in Moldova and stoppage of any pipelines that were still pushing gas and oil to the EU. 

[BruceVC]

35 minutes ago, pmp10 said:

Seems Ukrainian power grid is nearing the breaking point:
24 hours of blackout for the whole country is announced after missile strikes today.

This also means no power in Moldova and stoppage of any pipelines that were still pushing gas and oil to the EU. 

Its a funny thing, you target energy infrastructure  with missiles and that energy infrastructure is damaged

And its just another example of the cowardly nature of the Russian military, they cant win the conventional war so they resort to targeting civilian infrastructure. Thats why they deserve to seen as  a state sponsor of terrorism 

 

[Malcador]

Poor Moldova here

[xzar_monty]

I was listening to a presentation given by a retired high-ranking intelligence officer, and it contained a couple of interesting points concerning some of the reasons Russia decided to attack Ukraine.

For instance, he pointed out that outside of Moscow and St. Petersburg, much of Russia still qualifies as a developing country; apparently one third of all Russians still only have an outhouse, when it comes to their toilet facilities. The rampant looting of washing machines and such testifies to the fact how backward much of Russia continues to be. Russia has nothing to contribute to the current technological advances in the world -- except raw materials. This has created an enormous reservoir of jealousy and bitterness towards "the West", and what makes Ukraine particularly annoying is the fact that Ukraine has managed to make a significant move towards becoming a more Western country -- even if corruption, for instance, still remains a huge problem and Ukraine is obviously nowhere near to qualifying for the EU.

Ukraine is, for Russia, doubly culpable, for not only has it got closer to "the West", it has also simultaneously made a clear move away from what Russia regards as their trinity: Russia, Belarus, Ukraine. This is unforgivable. (Interestingly: Belarus would almost certainly make the same move if it could, i.e. if it wasn't ruled by Putin's puppet, with everything that that entails.)

There are all sorts of strategic, economic, imperialistic and probably just personal (Putin) factors that also help to explain the war, but the former officer wanted to draw attention to these considerations, which are also significant.

 

 

Also, there's this today:

 

Edited November 23, 2022 by xzar_monty

[Mamoulian War]

Maybe I am missing something, so can anyone explain to me, why an armed mob just bends over and takes it from behind, instead of doing something to solve that kind of situation? Like removing their officer from command chain…

 

[xzar_monty]

Some possible answers in the Twitter thread you just posted. Could be a variant of the Stockholm syndrome; heck, maybe there's even a name for what these soldiers are engaged in, it's just that I don't know it.

Your question, while seemingly relevant, is somewhat akin to the question of why someone in a violent relationship simply doesn't get up and leave, because surely that is an easy and sensible option. For someone looking from the outside in, this is how it is, but the view can be completely different from the inside: the person abused and exploited can be psychologically broken to such an extent that leaving would require resources far beyond that which they can muster.

Incidentally, for anyone who's played Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous, the character of Ember personifies one kind of "twisted" survival strategy as a result of utter humiliation, abuse and violence. (That's not the only way you can see her, but surely that's one way.) Not only does Ember not leave, she sort of embraces the evil that's been done to her. Interpreted this way, Ember is a heartbreaking character.

[Malcador]

Could also be that they'd get cut down by other troops if they tried.  Strange the commanders need their agreement.

Related for a chuckle -https://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/polish-leader-briefs-russian-pranksters-posing-macron-93794020

[Zoraptor]

4 hours ago, Malcador said:

Not sure of the damage, other than making some people get oddly excited for a NATO-Russia war.  Not as if the players involved are basing actions majorly off the papers, considering what's involved.

The damage was to the reputation for informational integrity more than anything. Which is pretty important if that's what your job relies on but doesn't really alter any facts on the ground.

Firstly there's a massive amount of information pushed by anonymous sources 'vetted' by the press in exactly the same way that information was vetted, now every bit of that should get the skepticism warranted (uh, haha no).

Then there was the... intemperate reaction from the Ukrainians which did a lot of reputational damage and may have done some actual political damage too. Nothing quite like hearing that every person saying it was a Ukrainian missile is peddling conspiracy theories- basically a direct quote from Kuleba- and Zelensky going almost as far when those Russian shills are the US and NATO military.

And thirdly, as much as the media tried to massage the later parts of the story away from their initial reactions you could not miss that they'd bought wholesale into an inaccurate story without showing much critical thinking about it at all.

[xzar_monty]

57 minutes ago, Zoraptor said:

And thirdly, as much as the media tried to massage the later parts of the story away from their initial reactions you could not miss that they'd bought wholesale into an inaccurate story without showing much critical thinking about it at all.

For the media that I follow, this is true to a larger extent than I'd want it to be, but I still wouldn't use that blanket term "the media", because there were differences mostly related to what language the medium was using and where it was based. The English-speaking media certainly did not handle the incident well, from what I saw.

[Mamoulian War]

Pictures depicting daily life in Kherson after 8 months of Ruskiy Mir.

 

[Mamoulian War]

Lithuania has crwodfunded three naval drones for Ukraine. The wordplay used in naming them is hilarious