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Cheese builds. What are your favorite and/or most fun?


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If they are fun for a whole playthrough - or don't make a playthrough too easy and don't turn your charcter into a one-trick pony.
If the cheese is so strong it makes most stuff too easy and makes all other stuff meaningless it's not fun anymore.

For example the Draining Touch Grimoire trick is cheesy, but it doesn't really break the game - yet is powerful enough to be fun to play. Same with Arkemyr's Brilliant Departure with Assassin/Wizard casting only CC/debuff spells which won't break the invisibility.
 

Resonant Touch + Whispers of the Wind with Hand Mortar & Fire in the Hole is gamebreaking and cheesy (Binding Smoke generates Resonant Touches). But it comes so late that it doesn't make a whole playthough boring. It's more like a really good reward.

Same with Avenging Storm and Hand Mortar (also Blinding Smoke). Although here it becomes boring if you use a scroll of Avenging Storm instead of a genuine ability - because you can get access to the scroll a lot earlier. 

Streetfighter with Powder Burns is borderline boring for me personally. But maybe because it's so obvious. :) 

Stuff like Brillant + Salvation of Time or Wall of Draining is already too strong and dominates everything the character does so that's too boring for me in the long run.

 

 

Edited by Boeroer
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Deadfire Community Patch: Nexus Mods

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Absurdly broken builds aside (i.e. the Shadow Camembert thread I just posted), I do appreciate cheesing a bit the stealth/aggro-deaggro mechanics with Rogue multiclasses, especially Assassin ones.

I mostly play Solo PotD Upscaled, which basically means that odds are going to be very much NOT in your favor - unless you're playing optimized power builds, which narrows down options and tends to limit creativity. An Assassin brings very unique abilities and the potential to break up fights easily, which unlocks IMO more classes and builds as Solo PotD viable and most importantly fun, without a huge grind... At the same time, it remains challenging because many higher-level fights cannot be ended without all enemies defeated (e.g. SSS Arena fights) so you still need to get creative. But Assassin/Whatever gives you a lot of flexibility in how you approach your other class and how you solve each encounter.

I haven't played it personally, but everybody loves Troubadour/Whatever with Grave Calling to kill your own skeletons and create crazy amounts of enemy-only Chillfogs + have the Grave Calling unique paralyze effect hitting every foe. Special free-for-all variant is Troubadour/Berserker.

"To cheese or not to cheese, that is the question" - Tekehu ( who is basically a mix of Kevin Costner in Waterworld and the Naavi's from Avatar).

Edited by Not So Clever Hound
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I’ve been using your soul sniper build for my first play through. I’m at level 13. It’s great fun. But this is about the time I start wanting to try new stuff. I have strange game psychology. Once I completely finish a game I’m unmotivated to play again. I generally start over a bunch of times and then just finish once. Poe1 I have about 200 hours but only finished it once. 

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10 hours ago, Jitsuka said:

I have strange game psychology

It's not that strange really, you'll notice that many folks on this forum have a similar approach that is only amplified by a game like Deadfire with so many different and cool class combos. I don't even know how many times I've been through Maje at this point :).

My only humble advice would be to take your Mindstalker a bit closer to the end and get a flavor of the DLCs especially in terms of difficulty as this is where it ramps up again. That will give you a good feel for future playthroughs.

You can also use your Mindstalker at high level to hoard equipment and recruit custom adventurers to "try out" builds before actually committing to a playthrough. Saves you lots of time and energy.

I don't know what you like and dislike but a next run involving Bloodmage one way or another could be very nice. This is arguably the most versatile and powerful Single and Multi, probably with Monk and Assassin as close contenders. Chanter has very powerful possibilities but mostly multiclass AFIK.

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A party of 5 chanters. Different flavours and types, if you so desire. At least one beckoner. The beckoner really should be an orlan so his or her skeletons match. Have all of them get the skeleton summoning spell and the skeleton summoning chant. Start a battle. Retreat to safety. Summon skeletons endlessly in safety and send in skeletal sorties to engage your enemies. Maybe send a few spirits, too. Roleplay that you are a death metal band, touring the Deadfire, and spreading musical mayhem wherever you go. Have your undead roadies clear the area of malcontents. 

A lot of people are probably scratching their heads right now, and that's fine. But trust me, this is cheesier than it sounds. 

Skeletons make for a surprisingly good boarding party, because most of the pirates have pistols and such. I discovered, quite by accident, that I could start boarding boats pretty much as soon as I left Port Maje. On PotD. After a few cautious attempts, I became the scourge of the seas, bringing death metal to the masses and sending them to suckle from Ondra's icy tit down in the briny depths. 

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5 hours ago, The Berathian said:

A party of 5 chanters. Different flavours and types, if you so desire. At least one beckoner. The beckoner really should be an orlan so his or her skeletons match. Have all of them get the skeleton summoning spell and the skeleton summoning chant. Start a battle. Retreat to safety. Summon skeletons endlessly in safety and send in skeletal sorties to engage your enemies. Maybe send a few spirits, too. Roleplay that you are a death metal band, touring the Deadfire, and spreading musical mayhem wherever you go. Have your undead roadies clear the area of malcontents. 

A lot of people are probably scratching their heads right now, and that's fine. But trust me, this is cheesier than it sounds. 

Skeletons make for a surprisingly good boarding party, because most of the pirates have pistols and such. I discovered, quite by accident, that I could start boarding boats pretty much as soon as I left Port Maje. On PotD. After a few cautious attempts, I became the scourge of the seas, bringing death metal to the masses and sending them to suckle from Ondra's icy tit down in the briny depths. 

Well, I'd find it really hard to resist making one of them a Berserker multiclass wielding Grave Calling...

Preferably a Pale Elf.

 

That way, from being relatively harmless, we'd have uber-monster-cheese flooding the whole archipelago!

And bringing forth White Frost... or whatever's Rymargand cold called - upon the world.

 

Edit: A MC druid with Weather the Storm could be a nice addition to try to survive the Cold.

Edited by Haplok
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8 hours ago, Not So Clever Hound said:

If they're all Corpse Eaters you could recreate a nice Cannibal Corpse vibe. But you can only play with Trial of Iron to enable Megadeth (permadeath).

 

6 hours ago, Haplok said:

Well, I'd find it really hard to resist making one of them a Berserker multiclass wielding Grave Calling...

Preferably a Pale Elf.

 

That way, from being relatively harmless, we'd have uber-monster-cheese flooding the whole archipelago!

And bringing forth White Frost... or whatever's Rymargand cold called - upon the world.

 

Edit: A MC druid with Weather the Storm could be a nice addition to try to survive the Cold.

There's a problem with both of these. Well, not a problem. Not exactly. 

The whole purpose of this lark was absolute safety. I didn't think it would actually work when I did it. But when it did work, I leaned into it really hard to see where it would go. It allowed me to do things I really should not have been doing. I ventured into triple red skulled dungeons and waltzed back out again, completely unscathed. I think I was level eightish or ninish when I did Poko. Yes, it was a slog. Yes, it was slow going. Yes, it was like pulling teeth and it took me hours, but I did it in complete safety and none of my living party members took even a single hit point of damage. This team allowed me to really explore the game and go into places that I hadn't gone yet. The only toon that saw occasional danger was the orlan, who was a thief and a beckoner. Traps had to be undone, and occasionally, a dot was applied. But she stayed safe with shadowing beyond and smoke veil and other means. 

With this crew, I took down some of the nastiest places in the game at a relatively low level, and to me, that reeks of stinky cheese. Mostly because summons in overwhelming numbers break the game. Skeletons are great! Really! You just have to amass them in great numbers. Spirits are great, but, again, you have to assemble them in numbers. Are they better than wyrms or animated weapons? That's not a fair comparison because those summons have a different aim, a different purpose. It's like comparing oranges vs a can of spam. An army of skeletons turns your game into a pirate-themed Ray Harryhausen game. This skeletal horde will allow you to make mistakes without much in the way of consequences. 

It was also with this very crew that I learned the AI scripts of the game. I developed some really convoluted and specific stuff that basically automated gameplay. Like scripts that target animal companions specifically, that will heal the party, but the healers will not waste their spells on the undead or summons. It was the crew that caused me to fall in love with this game, and why I have over 800 hours. 

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1 hour ago, The Berathian said:

With this crew, I took down some of the nastiest places in the game at a relatively low level, and to me, that reeks of stinky cheese

That reminds me a bit of the old "Sir Sit a Lot" Solo build. The joy of infinite resources/summons - and in Sir Sit a Lot's case, infinite DoT.

Coming back to your Death Metal Band, I can totally see the safety benefit and the satisfaction of going into very dangerous places at a low level. A solo Arquebus Assassin type could also venture prematurely in higher level encounters as soon as they have Gouging Strike and Smoke Veil. But as you pointed out, I can't even imagine how much time it might have taken to fell the Engwithan Titan on Poko Kohara with skellies summons..? On PotD (upscaled?). Did it die of boredom? ;) You're up to play a whole concert every time you see a hostile!

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16 minutes ago, Not So Clever Hound said:

But as you pointed out, I can't even imagine how much time it might have taken to fell the Engwithan Titan on Poko Kohara with skellies summons..? On PotD (upscaled?). Did it die of boredom?

I ordered the roadies to cut down the mightiest tree in the forest... with a herring! And they did. Because they're dumb like that. 

There's a really good safe space in the little alcove where you exit. If you tuck your party in there, and leave your rogue on the very edge of the battle, you can stay 100% safe with no threat to the party. Then, you send in the lumberjacks armed with herrings... and wait. Maybe fix a cuppa. The skellies tend to do about 1 to 3 damage per poke. Sending in a few summoned spirits helps. 

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Also, as an aside, but also on topic, if I ever did this again, I would make one of the band members a chanter / nalpazca monk. He (or she) would be that questionable sort that is all messed up on drugs all the time, but contributes so much to the band that you'd never kick them out. But then the death metal band would become a bit more Spinal Tap, and there are no inflatable stonehenges in the Deadfire. The cheese smells strong with this one. Unsure of chanter class. Maybe bellower? I mean, with 30+ int and other factors, those would be some impressive bellows. 

"Here I go again on my own!" Followed by skirting dangerously close to the enemy to maybe say something to inspire the roadies. 

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Boeroer's geomancer build, on page 2 of this thread, in which you summon an Essential Phantom with permanent draining touch, might be really fun accompanied by four chanters perma-spawning skeletons. You'd have a horde of disposable skellies as well as two brawny minons that would hit hard, the ranger pet and the phantom. Chants could empower all of the summons with their phrases. Might be particularly fun if one of them was an ancient theurge, casting wild growth. Ship battles would be totally overcrowded! You'd definitely want animancy cat as your pet for this party.

Edited by dgray62
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16 hours ago, The Berathian said:

 

There's a problem with both of these. Well, not a problem. Not exactly. 

The whole purpose of this lark was absolute safety. I didn't think it would actually work when I did it. But when it did work, I leaned into it really hard to see where it would go. It allowed me to do things I really should not have been doing. I ventured into triple red skulled dungeons and waltzed back out again, completely unscathed. I think I was level eightish or ninish when I did Poko. Yes, it was a slog. Yes, it was slow going. Yes, it was like pulling teeth and it took me hours, but I did it in complete safety and none of my living party members took even a single hit point of damage. This team allowed me to really explore the game and go into places that I hadn't gone yet. The only toon that saw occasional danger was the orlan, who was a thief and a beckoner. Traps had to be undone, and occasionally, a dot was applied. But she stayed safe with shadowing beyond and smoke veil and other means. 

With this crew, I took down some of the nastiest places in the game at a relatively low level, and to me, that reeks of stinky cheese. Mostly because summons in overwhelming numbers break the game. Skeletons are great! Really! You just have to amass them in great numbers. Spirits are great, but, again, you have to assemble them in numbers. Are they better than wyrms or animated weapons? That's not a fair comparison because those summons have a different aim, a different purpose. It's like comparing oranges vs a can of spam. An army of skeletons turns your game into a pirate-themed Ray Harryhausen game. This skeletal horde will allow you to make mistakes without much in the way of consequences. 

Thing is, you're not giving up anything important (IMO) by making one Berserker multiclass and swinging Grave Calling against your own skellies. You're not forced to attack your own summons, you're not forced to use Grave Calling all the time. Furthermore, when that safety is a primary concern, you can simply clear Berserker Confusion with equipping upgraded Modwyr, equipping Devil of Caroc Breastplate with appropriate enchantment (before combat), not using Berserker Rage or a number of other means and then the Chilling Fog you conjure will be party-friendly (while still blinding and paralyzing enemies... just not killing them nearly as rapidly,  paralyzing them slower/over a smaller radius... and failing to fry your graphics card).

Edited by Haplok
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Fun fact: if you are confused and trigger some Chilling Graves by killing skeletons (which will kill all other skeletons, leading to the Chillfog chain of paralyze-death) and THEN switch to Modwyr or take some Svef suddenly all Chillfogs are foe-only again. The friendly fire is not fixed (at casting time). It will change immediately (on still active spells, too) as soon as you are no longer confused.

Edited by Boeroer
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The ranger/beckoner aka "the pet master" is a very fun build (ideally a nature godlike with 35int and max stealth to maintain the Animated Weapons without downtime). You remain stealthed the entire fight summoning pets, while the animal companion is used to keep you in combat. Chants and auras from Sasha's Singing Scimitar (with Companion's Prelude), Changeling's Mantle, as well as the Animancy Cat will help your summons in combat. It should be possible to play also as a SC beckoner and use traps to trigger the combat.

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