Third person view

[Lord Grievous]

Any plans to add a 3rd person view when playing?

It would be nice to be able to enjoy you character's armor, and also during melee combat.

It's a bit of a shame this wasn't already included from the start. But maybe with an update?

[Laimma]

1 hour ago, Lord Grievous said:

Any plans to add a 3rd person view when playing?

It would be nice to be able to enjoy you character's armor, and also during melee combat.

It's a bit of a shame this wasn't already included from the start. But maybe with an update?

+1

 

[Doctor Atomic]

This would be nice, I play in first person but I like being able to see my character in the environment for taking pics.

[LoudAngryJerk]

Yeah, me personally, I can play 1st person games, such as call of duty and the like, but given the fact that one of the first things you do is play around in the character creator, I can't justify spending any time in there on cosmetics, beyond male or female. Which is frustrating. I really want to enjoy this game, but without being able to see my character I just don't feel a connection there.

That being said, this isn't just a choice or preference thing. Some people can't play 1st person games because it gives them headaches or motion sickness.

This is especially frustrating given the fact that third person exists in the game. The game has the capacity for 3rd person. Your character model is rendered in the world, you have 3rd person animations. And with some time spent messing with game files, it is possible to play in 3rd person, just not without going into the games guts. 

I really wan't to enjoy the game. And the second they add a 3rd person mode (or someone makes a mod to do it) I will absolutely buy the game (i've already played it on the Xbox games service).  But right now I can't spend more than an hour in the game without becoming incredibly apathetic. 

Edited November 1, 2019 by LoudAngryJerk
rewording

[Selnor1983]

Already discussed to death in these very forums. 

Game design and level design has to be changed quite a bit to account for 3rd person. 

Games with both tend to not be great at either. Look at Fallout 3 and 4 for how compromises have to be made in its design. 

 

 

[Ethics Gradient]

And for what it's worth, the player character doesn't have the full set of animations needed to make the 3rd person view look particularly smooth.

It's possible that some enterprising modder could "enable" such a mode, but everyone will probably note the player movements are janky and the camera keeps clipping out of bounds.  For third person to be done right, those animations and camera rigging would have to be added to the game first, and that's not taking into account QA or possible level redesign.

Since it's much more than an On/Off toggle in the options menu, the official stance is currently: not going to happen

Edited November 1, 2019 by Ethics Gradient
spellin'

[thearmourofGod]

no 3rd 

good grief

[LoudAngryJerk]

4 hours ago, Ethics Gradient said:

And for what it's worth, the player character doesn't have the full set of animations needed to make the 3rd person view look particularly smooth.

It's possible that some enterprising modder could "enable" such a mode, but everyone will probably note the player movements are janky and the camera keeps clipping out of bounds.  For third person to be done right, those animations and camera rigging would have to be added to the game first, and that's not taking into account QA or possible level redesign.

Since it's much more than an On/Off toggle in the options menu, the official stance is currently: not going to happen

1) it doesn't need to be smooth. Fallout 3, and new vegas, werent, 4 wasn't, skyrim wasn't. 

2) you already CAN have 3rd person by going into the game files and changing them, and so far the consensus by those who have done so is that while yes, it is a little janky, most of that is because you had to go into the game files to do it. 

3) it really isn't much more than an on/off toggle, and no one is expecting for it to be added overnight, nor is anyone expecting it to be perfect, only for it to exist.

Having third person doesn't require a huge overhaul in how the game works, or the level design is, as shown in the fact that it's in there. Not having it doesn't add anything, it exclusively takes things away. Also again, the point of neither my previous comment or (I would assume) the post in general, is not to say 'game sux, gib thrd person or else', it's to point out that as great as the game is, third person is something we want, and adding it now (meaning post release now, not right this second now) would only  bring more people in to play the game.

Why not let people play the way they want to?

 

Edited November 1, 2019 by LoudAngryJerk
reformatting

[Ethics Gradient]

2 hours ago, LoudAngryJerk said:

Why not let people play the way they want to?

While you can view your character model via the idle animation or using the dev console mod to enable the free cam, your player still doesn't have the animations it needs to move about the game.  I'm not saying this because I hate 3rd person modes, it is just information that the devs have told me and others when asked.

Third person, by offsetting the camera behind the player, would more or less look like the below video.  For it to be an official feature, the character would need new animations, and levels would have to be QA'd to ensure things still work then the viewport is no longer at a predictable height/angle.  It's just not something that the devs can flip on in its present state, and have further stated that it is a feature they do not intend to implement in this game.

 

[Wormerine]

On 4/19/2019 at 7:05 PM, Chairchucker said:

They specifically said it wasn't in their budget also I think there's already a thread on this.

 

Here, again, is Mike Dowling explaining the reason there will be no Third Person Camera. https://imgur.com/a/0Ty2I24 Stolen from Ethic Gradient's Reddit post.

 

[Doctor Atomic]

22 hours ago, Selnor1983 said:

Already discussed to death in these very forums. 

Game design and level design has to be changed quite a bit to account for 3rd person. 

Games with both tend to not be great at either. Look at Fallout 3 and 4 for how compromises have to be made in its design. 

 

What kind of changes or compromises have to be made to play in both 1st or 3rd person view?  I don't play a lot of shooters so I am not that familiar with the subtleties of the genre.

 

[imitenotbecrazy]

8 minutes ago, Doctor Atomic said:

 

Time and budget, which they were short on both 

[Lord Grievous]

It might not be as easy as changing the camera, I know they need to add the necessary animations too.

But it could be added with a patch. This way they can also test it out for the sequel

[Selnor1983]

10 hours ago, Doctor Atomic said:

 

With a 3rd person design you have to account if different enemy speed, level design as to not have the camera clipping geometry. Player animations, more graphical detail, more shadowing on and from the character. Among others. It's not a simple as just allowing it in any game designed to be a First person view. 

 

And that same thing applies when people think you can just add a first person view to a 3rd person game. 

Opting for both means sacrifices for both. Leaving both modes not optimal. 

[StormFX]

On 11/1/2019 at 11:32 AM, Selnor1983 said:

Games with both tend to not be great at either. Look at Fallout 3 and 4 for how compromises have to be made in its design.

And, you know, Skyrim. If Bethesda got one thing right, it was the first/third person setup. The fact that in 2019 games are still going first-person only is frankly pathetic. Though I can understand budget constraints.

As far as motion sickness, etc, tweaking the FoV and  disabling some of the garbage post-processing effects (chromatic aberration = developer fail) can make a  notable difference.

[Selnor1983]

6 hours ago, StormFX said:

And, you know, Skyrim. If Bethesda got one thing right, it was the first/third person setup. The fact that in 2019 games are still going first-person only is frankly pathetic. Though I can understand budget constraints.

As far as motion sickness, etc, tweaking the FoV and  disabling some of the garbage post-processing effects (chromatic aberration = developer fail) can make a  notable difference.

There is a ton of issues in Skyrim. So many parts of the 3rd person experience is poor. From animation, to camera issues. Compared to a game made to be entirely 3rd person, Skyrim has many issues in 3rd person. 

 

And as a result the enemy speeds are slower. It's far to easy to just run and escape enemies as a result. 

[Omgilovesteak]

Character models have a potato arse anyway so 1st person is fine 

[Lord Grievous]

I never felt that first person/third person gameplay was bad in games like Skyrim or FNV.

Sure they're not as tight as dedicated fps or 3rd person games, but they never felt bad.

Let's not forget that games like TES, Fallout or TOW are rpg/fps hybrids. So there always will be compromises.

I fail to see why it would be impossible or undesirable to add 3rd person view to this game with a patch.

[Ethics Gradient]

3 hours ago, Lord Grievous said:

I fail to see why it would be impossible or undesirable to add 3rd person view to this game with a patch.

The feature is neither impossible or undesirable.  However they told us nearly a year ago not to expect it, and as recently as a week ago said again that it wasn't going to happen.

The good news is that TOW seems to have been a success, and things like mod support and third-person cameras are solidly on the radar as they contemplate further entries in the series.

[uuuhhii]

5 hours ago, Selnor1983 said:

There is a ton of issues in Skyrim. So many parts of the 3rd person experience is poor. From animation, to camera issues. Compared to a game made to be entirely 3rd person, Skyrim has many issues in 3rd person. 

 

And as a result the enemy speeds are slower. It's far to easy to just run and escape enemies as a result. 

the third person in bethesda game are awful

but atleast less nausea inducing than first person

[Selnor1983]

4 hours ago, uuuhhii said:

the third person in bethesda game are awful

but atleast less nausea inducing than first person

I think herein lies the problem. For those that are fine with fps, I'd prefer them to design the game fully around fps so it's the best possible experience. 

 

Trying to account for 3rd person on anyway just means thr level design and enemy movement is sacrificed for fps. So it's catch 22. 

 

I suppose that sounds a bit selfish, but there's 3rd person RPGs out there with no fps also. So it's swings and roundabouts. 

IMO the Dev is better off perfecting one viewpoint and pleasing fans of that said viewpoint. Rather than trying to be mediocre in both to accommodate everyone. 

[Wormerine]

16 hours ago, StormFX said:

And, you know, Skyrim. If Bethesda got one thing right, it was the first/third person setup.

BUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

I mean sorry, but they got none of those right. First person is somewhat functional, though clunky, and Third Person View is an absolute joke. 

 

PS. Disliked Bethesda games before it was cool. 

[ComradeYellow]

TOW 2.

[StormFX]

14 hours ago, Selnor1983 said:

There is a ton of issues in Skyrim. So many parts of the 3rd person experience is poor. From animation, to camera issues. Compared to a game made to be entirely 3rd person, Skyrim has many issues in 3rd person. 

And as a result the enemy speeds are slower. It's far to easy to just run and escape enemies as a result. 

The issues with third-person in Skyrim, etc, aren't implementation issues, though, they're because it's third-person. Any time the camera has to adjust for collision, etc, there will be oddities, especially given how different the player's collisions can be between the two perspectives (eg, you can't use a simple polygon for third-person without issues). Regardless, those of us that prefer third-person will generally always opt for buggy third-person over first-person. As far as NPC speed goes, not sure what you're on about there. Camera position has no direct effect on that.

4 hours ago, Wormerine said:

I mean sorry, but they got none of those right. First person is somewhat functional, though clunky, and Third Person View is an absolute joke.

Being able to swap between first- and third-person by scrolling in/out based on the confines of your environment was pretty nice. Even the worst of any third-person implementation is better than being locked in first-person. But then you've already demonstrated your bias, so you're comment is irrelevant.

...

In any case, they've already stated it's not going to happen so that's that.

Edited November 3, 2019 by StormFX

[Wormerine]

37 minutes ago, StormFX said:

 But then you've already demonstrated your bias, so you're comment is irrelevant.

Bias? Against what? I play both FPS and TPS games and more! I have seen those done well and I have seen those done poorly. Skyrim is bad at both. but yes, I am yet to enjoy Bethesda games. I think of them as community play boxes to create mods with. I heard Morrowind is nice. I will need to give it a go one day. 
 

It’s nice to have both FPS and TPS, and I hope Obs mill manage to add it for the sequel as clearly many people want it, but I would rather have one done well, and I don’t care which one, then both being shoddy and unenjoyable to use. And Outer Worlds has even functional UI! I don’t remember Bethesda game having functional UI!