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Pathfinder Kingmaker is bigger then Deadfire


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Some additional reflections, and a tentative systemic comparison between Pathfinder (mostly based on my deep knowledge of 3.5. Cheeky, I know) and Deadfire:

I have read up on Pathfinder quite a bit now, and in many ways the system is like some sort of D&D 3.75, where you have even more options. Bloodlines, for instance, seem like a dream.

It seems that fighter classes have gotten the short end of the stick at later levels, though (in general, and only slightly), whereas spellcasters have even more ways to turn out mean and lean.

 

While I really, really liked Deadfire in many ways, and I was happy that you could slow down the combat speed the way you wanted, I didn't have as much fun building characters and parties as I had hoped. There are a few reasons for this, but one of the more important ones was the lack of options of making unique character builds.

Deadfire had a few passive talent options tacked on at higher levels, but they were the same, more or less, for most classes, and in many ways, I felt that my building was done at around mid-levels, a bit later if multi-classed. Deadfire also had plenty of weak choices of passive abilities for the very first levels of some classes.

Moreover, given all the overlapping of abilities in Deadfire, if you go for a full party, it pretty soon ceases to feel unique combat-wise. And if you like I did during the beta and also in the full game, programmed the AI, you could use one trick ponies on all of your characters and then let the game play itself almost entirely.

And I didn't need to change my AI programming, not even the priority orders, as I progressed in levels. So, something isn't right in the character building system and its successive progression and variety offered.

Theoretically, this means that P:KM should be able to offer a much more complex character/party building system, with a better distribution and pacing of the fun you invest in your character builds and their synergies. *Fingers crossed* If it does, then that would mean true replayability as far as combat goes.

 

Well, for those of you who just want to get a feel for the game, seeing the basics and the lovely resting system, take a gander here. It's based on a several months old beta build, though:

[Youtube]

Edited by IndiraLightfoot
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Some news and tidbits:

-Top 5 selling game on Steam in Europe and No. 17 globally atm.

-The release build was wrapped up on Saturday, and they will patch it Day 1!

Edited by IndiraLightfoot

*** "The words of someone who feels ever more the ent among saplings when playing CRPGs" ***

 

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Alright, Owlcat is actually attempting to release the game earlier than expected.

Here's a fresh tweet:

"We asked Valve to release at midnight PST / 9am CET. For some reason, Steam is showing a later time right now. To be frank, we're not really sure why. Still chatting back and forth with them."
 
If they manage to strong arm Valve, that's 12h earlier than normal!
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Although not a true D&D game per se, this is actually the first full and meaty D&D 3.5-like CRPG released since NWN2: Storm of Zehir in November of 2008!

So, some of us have been waiting a decade for something like this…

 

Let's hope our patience will pay off a little.

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This is very exciting. Let me know how it turns out :)

Just what do you think you're doing?! You dare to come between me and my prey? Is it a habit of yours to scurry about, getting in the way and causing bother?

 

What are you still bothering me for? I'm a Knight. I'm not interested in your childish games. I need my rest.

 

Begone! Lest I draw my nail...

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Rest assured I will! As for computer gaming, D&D 3.0 and especially 3.5 have been my CRPG comfort food of preference, as it were, so my appetite is whetted to the point of extensive drooling while plotting my first main character for over 24 hours now…

 

*Normal guy?^*

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For those of you with slow internet bandwidth:

"Pre-load on Steam will be live at around 5:30 pm CET tonight."

 

Correction: Owlcat has promised a preload, but this date is looking more and more dubious, since the game will soon be released.

Perhaps you'll see a preload, but I doubt it, judging by other forum comments.

 

Well, the preload button is there, but if you press it, you'll download 0 bytes. So, we'll have to wait and see a bit longer.

Edited by IndiraLightfoot

*** "The words of someone who feels ever more the ent among saplings when playing CRPGs" ***

 

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We all thank you for these constant updates, God bless you for your thorough knowledge and your willingness to share!

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Just what do you think you're doing?! You dare to come between me and my prey? Is it a habit of yours to scurry about, getting in the way and causing bother?

 

What are you still bothering me for? I'm a Knight. I'm not interested in your childish games. I need my rest.

 

Begone! Lest I draw my nail...

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Owlcat just confirmed that they are actively working on fixing the preload hiccup.

 

Important info just now! Final release hours (still 3h earlier than expected):

"Valve just informed us that the main game release has been moved to 7AM Sept 25 Pacific time meaning 16:00 CEST / 17:00 Moscow time 
Sorry for the delay, everyone!"

Edited by IndiraLightfoot

*** "The words of someone who feels ever more the ent among saplings when playing CRPGs" ***

 

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...snip...

 

While I really, really liked Deadfire in many ways, and I was happy that you could slow down the combat speed the way you wanted, I didn't have as much fun building characters and parties as I had hoped. There are a few reasons for this, but one of the more important ones was the lack of options of making unique character builds.

Deadfire had a few passive talent options tacked on at higher levels, but they were the same, more or less, for most classes, and in many ways, I felt that my building was done at around mid-levels, a bit later if multi-classed. Deadfire also had plenty of weak choices of passive abilities for the very first levels of some classes.

 

...snip...

 

This is my only gripe with PoE as a whole. I play PnP Pathfinder, and I really love to experiments with strange builds, which looks gimped at first look, but can bring very interesting roleplay results in the end. My most loved character so far was Gnome Urban Barbarian specced into demoralizing of your enemies with crazy high Bluff. On level 4 I had almost +30 bonus to this skill due to one item, which I accidentally found in pawn shop in Absalom :)

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Sent from my Stone Tablet, using Chisel-a-Talk 2000BC.

My youtube channel: MamoulianFH Latest Let's Play Druidstone - The Secret of the Menhir Forest (in progress)

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My PS Platinums and 100% - 22 games so far (my PSN profile)

 

 

1) God of War III - PS3 - 24+ hours

2) Final Fantasy XIII - PS3 - 130+ hours

3) White Knight Chronicles International Edition - PS3 - 525+ hours

4) Hyperdimension Neptunia - PS3 - 80+ hours

5) Final Fantasy XIII-2 - PS3 - 200+ hours

6) Tales of Xillia - PS3 - 135+ hours

7) Hyperdimension Neptunia mk2 - PS3 - 152+ hours

8.) Grand Turismo 6 - PS3 - 81+ hours (including Senna Master DLC)

9) Demon's Souls - PS3 - 197+ hours

10) Tales of Graces f - PS3 - 337+ hours

11) Star Ocean: The Last Hope International - PS3 - 750+ hours

12) Lightning Returns: Final Fantasy XIII - PS3 - 127+ hours

13) Soulcalibur V - PS3 - 73+ hours

14) Gran Turismo 5 - PS3 - 600+ hours

15) Tales of Xillia 2 - PS3 - 302+ hours

16) Mortal Kombat XL - PS4 - 95+ hours

17) Project CARS Game of the Year Edition - PS4 - 120+ hours

18) Dark Souls - PS3 - 197+ hours

19) Hyperdimension Neptunia Victory - PS3 - 238+ hours

20) Final Fantasy Type-0 - PS4 - 58+ hours

21) Journey - PS4 - 9+ hours

22) Dark Souls II - PS3 - 210+ hours

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A few facts:

 

Number of companions: 11

Speccing companions: Yes, you have to tick a box not to autolevel them, and then you can spec them, but not respec their starting level class(es), IIRC

Level cap : 20

Kind of Pathfinder: Mostly standard, but Rogue and Ranger are Pathfinder Unchained versions, and Alchemist and Inquisitor were included from Advanced Player's Guide, but Cavalier, Oracle, Summoner and Witch weren't. The Ultimate Combat and the Ultimate Magic have been used in part

Voiced dialogue: Around 10% (Personally, a plus to me. I really liked the Deadfire VO, but I read far faster than the voice artists, so sometimes it was a drag.)

Companion AI: Hardly any - a simple autoattack setting, not using items

Acts on a timer: After Act I, no

Edited by IndiraLightfoot
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Some spoilerish info about the story, the main quest, branching, companions, and such. Source: MCA, https://www.rpgsite.net/interview/7792-pathfinder-kingmaker-interview-with-chris-avellone-on-storyline-writing-and-characters

*** "The words of someone who feels ever more the ent among saplings when playing CRPGs" ***

 

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In a new interview article with Aleks Mishulin and MCA:

https://wccftech.com/talking-pathfinder-kingmaker-crpg/

 

On RTwP: "You can stop the battle at any time to assess the situation on the battlefield and choose which spells or abilities to use. Area of effect spells can be placed precisely and their location can be changed while the spell is being cast. You can set up auto-pause to stop the game at the moments that are important for you. There is even an option to stop the game at the end of each round for each of the party members, which would make your experience quite close to turn-based battles."

 

Chris on Alignment in P:KM: "Maybe it’s the writer in me, but I tend to see an alignment system as an opportunity and an
expression of role-playing. I also feel the current alignment system (as long as it’s rewarded) provides a lot of flexibility just like it did on Planescape: Torment and I don’t feel the alignment system is constrictive unless the designers make it that way – and Owlcat certainly hasn’t."

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*** "The words of someone who feels ever more the ent among saplings when playing CRPGs" ***

 

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Would be something to see a WeGo-type system like what is implemented for the Combat Mission games used for a cRPG. Seems like a decent compromise between turn-based and real-time with pause.

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"Turned wrong way round, the relentless unforeseen was what we schoolchildren studied as 'History,' harmless history, where everything unexpected in its own time is chronicled on the page as inevitable. The terror of the unforeseen is what the science of history hides, turning a disaster into an epic.”

 

-Philip Roth, The Plot Against America

 

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A few facts:

 

Number of companions: 11

Speccing companions: Yes, you have to tick a box not to autolevel them, and then you can spec them, but not respec their starting level class(es), IIRC

Level cap : 20

Kind of Pathfinder: Mostly standard, but Rogue and Ranger are Pathfinder Unchained versions, and Alchemist and Inquisitor were included from Advanced Player's Guide, but Cavalier, Oracle, Summoner and Witch weren't. The Ultimate Combat and the Ultimate Magic have been used in part

Voiced dialogue: Around 10% (Personally, a plus to me. I really liked the Deadfire VO, but I read far faster than the voice artists, so sometimes it was a drag.)

Companion AI: Hardly any - a simple autoattack setting, not using items

Acts on a timer: After Act I, no

No!

 

I knew they were going to shaft the Witch and Warpriest. The Witch is one of the best classes that can be used for rebuffing, think 3.5 Warlock with some damage but better. Any level of witch can completely shut down encounters be it with a continually increasing Slumber or with the varied amount of debuffs that can be tossed around. A level 1 witch with slumber can bring experienced DMs to table flipping mode!

 

The Warpriest is basically a Fighter combined with a Cleric, which turns into a better Paladin than a Paladin. The only alignment requirement is that of a cleric, which allowed evil gods to have Paladins since the Anti-Paladin is shoehorned into being Chaotic Evil.

 

While the Witch can instigate table flips, the Summoner instigates this class is banned at this table because of their "summon". Think Ranger pet on enough steroids to make body builders feel inadequate, so it's a good thing they were cut.

 

The Oracle is also disappointing because they were basically the Divine Caster answer to the Sorcerer, but their mechanics are very difficult to translate into a none pen and paper game.

 

Alchemists are a surprisingly great class, so it's good they were added, but I don't recall much of Inquisitor.

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Thanks to Obsidian and their digital card game, I have at least been introduced to Pathfinder, the world of Golarion, and some of them legendary characters and such, but I haven't played Pathfinder PnP, that would be like a shower in awesome-sauce, though, I'm sure, with the right group of peeps, of course!

 

Otherwise. I should be working, but this waiting gets the better of me...

 

51jcNO9TEkL.jpg

 

Well, just an hour left.

 

EDIT: Now, this is scary. The Steam counter insists on a 1900 hours launch, and Owlcat set a 1600 release yesterday, CET. So, worst case scenario, there culd be 4 hours left. :(

 

 

One more little tidbit, on deities:

Core deities, minus Lamashtu, plus Gyronna. Also, there's a Groetus cleric, but player can't take this god.

Edited by IndiraLightfoot

*** "The words of someone who feels ever more the ent among saplings when playing CRPGs" ***

 

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To bad, player can't take Groetus. He can bring very interesting roleplay to the session :-)

Sent from my Stone Tablet, using Chisel-a-Talk 2000BC.

My youtube channel: MamoulianFH Latest Let's Play Druidstone - The Secret of the Menhir Forest (in progress)

Let's Play/AAR Europa Universalis 1: Austria Grand Campaign (completed)
Let's Play/AAR Europa Universalis 2: Xhosa Grand Campaign (completed)
My PS Platinums and 100% - 22 games so far (my PSN profile)

 

 

1) God of War III - PS3 - 24+ hours

2) Final Fantasy XIII - PS3 - 130+ hours

3) White Knight Chronicles International Edition - PS3 - 525+ hours

4) Hyperdimension Neptunia - PS3 - 80+ hours

5) Final Fantasy XIII-2 - PS3 - 200+ hours

6) Tales of Xillia - PS3 - 135+ hours

7) Hyperdimension Neptunia mk2 - PS3 - 152+ hours

8.) Grand Turismo 6 - PS3 - 81+ hours (including Senna Master DLC)

9) Demon's Souls - PS3 - 197+ hours

10) Tales of Graces f - PS3 - 337+ hours

11) Star Ocean: The Last Hope International - PS3 - 750+ hours

12) Lightning Returns: Final Fantasy XIII - PS3 - 127+ hours

13) Soulcalibur V - PS3 - 73+ hours

14) Gran Turismo 5 - PS3 - 600+ hours

15) Tales of Xillia 2 - PS3 - 302+ hours

16) Mortal Kombat XL - PS4 - 95+ hours

17) Project CARS Game of the Year Edition - PS4 - 120+ hours

18) Dark Souls - PS3 - 197+ hours

19) Hyperdimension Neptunia Victory - PS3 - 238+ hours

20) Final Fantasy Type-0 - PS4 - 58+ hours

21) Journey - PS4 - 9+ hours

22) Dark Souls II - PS3 - 210+ hours

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Ah 3 hours to go before release on Steam. The hours are just slowly crawling by now.

 

So very happy I finished the preload last night, so I do not have to worry about that.

 

[EDIT] : And it's live now. Heck yeah. Now 20 minutes to go for install. Time

 

to buy some snacks and A&W Root Beer. Onwards to the family mini van.

Edited by wolfrider100
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logical enough. You live, you affect your world. "

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They released it now, just like they said! Unpacking all files now! See you in Golarion, pals and gals!

 

EDIT: Hmm, lot to install, apparently. 10 more minutes to go. I'd better prepare with dark chocolate, caffeinated soft drink, and some extra snacks.

Edited by IndiraLightfoot
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