Elric Galad

Problem is that it is not doable. All you can do is recover a random used slot between Tier 1 and Tier x (you can do it on initial cast, on event, on tick...) You can also add a random effect that : - do it only with a % chance. - add a random component that restore an used slot between Tier 1 and Tier x OR Tier 1 and Tier y OR Tier 1 and Tier z (but this breaks invisibility on the initial caster, so it's a bit ugly) For class you can either : - Restore stuff for pre-defined classes (for example, all non-casters) - Restore stuff for all classes (so both in case of multiclass)

Tweaks always lead to some benefit. It doesn't change much from before, I think, except for 2 people parties, since Ascendant can currently switch party members. Yes, that was my initial intention, I admit. But I had to face the technical possibilities of Gamedata files. If you need to code an effect into [Possibility 1; Possibility 2; Possibility 3], you need to use an object qualified as "Attack". Attack would break invisibility on the caster which would be weird. That's why I went with this twist. Without using an Attack all you can do is [% Possibility 1 ; Nothing] Cycling Tier seems impossible. Selecting Tier is also impossible, you can only use range [1 - X]. That's why I copied Blood Sacrifice way of working : because, well, it works. I don't pretend this is the best design, but it seems to be the best technically possible design Sorry, it's hard to keep people informed about the technical limitations. EDIT : I havven't been very clear that the reason behind the Brilliant change was in reality the introduction of this random Tier component. ..

Yup, in addition to the sarcastic answer I gave (which was still true about what you needed), I would say : go Single Class. Tier VIII (Symbols or Hand of Weal and Woe) and Tier IX (Magran's Might) are a league of their own when it comes to damage dealing. I would go Berath rather than Magran. Magran offers more damage possibilities, but they are all Fire-Based. The main pb of damage priest is that they have poor Tools vs fire resistant foes. Symbol of Berath is great and deals Corrode damages. Touch of Rot is nice as a Tier I too. Rot Skulls... needs Community Patch to work properly. But Magran is great too, of course. Just be prepared to switch to Support/Healing vs Fire resistant foes.

Yup, I think it's easier to balance TB into RTwP than RTwP into TB (unless using an ATB system, like it has been said from the beginning of TB Beta).

Okay, I'm set on the idea to change Brilliant to +5 INT, +3PL and gives Ancestor's Memory +3 ressources on cast in addition to Brilliant (+3 ressources with random Tiers for casters, as for Bloodmage). The question now is : how to rework Tactician ? I want the class to be more balanced but still provide some ressource regeneration for both Tactician and a possible multiclass. - I think I'm going to keep Brilliant Tactician with the "new" Brilliant. Still a very distinctive feature since +3PL is noticeable. - Penalty vs non-engaged target makes sense. So no change planned for this one. - Tactician Dilemna is weird. Shaken can be avoided by simply taking Fearless Feat. Confusion is avoidable too, or alternatively Flanked can be avoided completely. I am considering removing it completely : since I consider adding new feature, simplifying unecessary rules is an option. - I am considering adding a +20% recovery to the class. This is a noticeably penalty, but it would be counterbalanced by the +3 PL from Brilliant and ressource regeneration. Act less, but with improbed abilities/more abilities. I think this one would make sense. - Discipline on Interrupt could add ressource for both classes. But as Thelee pointed previously, it has gruesome interraction with things like Slicken. Maybe this combo should be limited too. I'm considering limiting it to Weapon Interrupt, but this would incitate a bit too much to go for Xbows/Arbs or certain magical weapons. - Ressource on Interrupt might not be enough to keep the old vibe of Infinite ressources (especially vs Dorudugan. I know it is 1 encounter, but I don't like to make tactician nearly useless vs this one). I'm wondering if a ressource regen on certain event could be added. But it shall not be too frequent. 1 ressources /6s was way too strong. I'm aiming Something like 1 ressource / 30s. I can't make new icons for new active abilities though. If a ressource regeneration for all classes is added, I think it would be better to go for random Tiers for casters, as for Bloodmage. Problem is that the only possible implementation of cancels invisibility (for technical reasons). Do you have any ideas about it ?

You mean... buffing Bloodmage ? Don't get me wrong, the change is nice, but this would be a good amount of powercreeping.

Well, as strong as Enfeebled is (great Combo potential), I would not say it's the most powerful Affliction. It isn't even a Hard Crowd Control effect. Ciphers get Dominated on the same Tier which is arguably the strongest affliction, so I don't think Enfeebled is above the curve. Priest of Woedica can inflct it in an AoE, FF can inflict it at will, so I don't think Cipher's version is that unique. EDIT : And in mod 1.1, Heartseeker will cause Enfeebled with Infinite duration (for 4 Bonds again) (I'll keep your feedback in mind though, in case others would say the same)

Pick Priest Pick Barring Death Door Pick Salvation of Time Have someone in tout party cast Brillant on you once (Cipher's Ancestor Memory or Robes of the Weyc ) Profit. Trust Me, it's as lame as it sounds.

I have made futher tests on Blood Sacrifice and it appears that it doesn't regenerate ressource exactly like described in Thelee's Gamefaq. When used, it procs following effects randomly (and causes a proportional health loss : - "Minor" Blood Sacrifice : Recover a Spell Slot from Tier 1 to Tier 3, - "Medium" Blood Sacrifice : Recover a Spell Slot from Tier 1 to Tier 6, - "Major" Blood Sacrifice : Recover a Spell Slot from Tier 1 to Tier 9. But each effect will randomly select a Spell Slot from the possible range among the Spell Slots already spent. For example, Major Blood Sacrifice will randomly choose between a Tier 1 Spell Charge and Tier 9 Spell Charge if they are both available. Major Blood Sacrifice does not select the higher tier slots in priority (that's the difference with the Gamefaq description, which is still a better description than Obsidian's , hey !). It leads to interesting consequences. Using low Tier spells will give more chance te recover a charge but can decrease the chance of recovering an higher Tier. For example, if a character has only spent a Tier 9 charge, Blood Sacrifice will have 1/3 chance of regenerating it and 2/3 chances of doing nothing. However, if a character has only spent a Tier 1 charge and Tier 9 charge, Blood Sacrifice will have 1/6 chance of regenerating the Tier 9 one and 5/6 chances of regenerating the Tier 1 one. I think the optimum (in term of spell level regenerated, of course, in certain situation some lower tier spells can be better) is probably reached by only using Tier 6 and 9 (or 7 for MC). This way, you have Blood Sacrifice has 1/3 chance of doing nothing, 1/2 chance of restoring a Tier 6 spell and 1/6 chance of restoring a Tier 9 (7 for MC) spell. The overall effect is great, but not as much as what Brilliant ticks provide. I think I will still nerf Bloodmage by giving Blood Sacrifice a 3s Recovery and a 6s sef-target Hostile effect preventing any healing for its duration (the later is to avoid the Tactician Unbending + Bloodmage WoD infinite Combo which is the only Immortality Combo remaning once SoT and WoD are tweaked). This would be sufficient while not removing the subclass its access to potentially unlimited powers. I am considering using the exact mechanic for Brilliant ticks (and a couple of similar effects) for Caster Ressources. It would prevent spamming Maelstorm every 6s and mitigate spamming of Tier 6- spells (2/3 chances of getting a Tier 6+ slot back is closer to martial 1 ressource ; even if slightly better, it comes at the price of randomness and commitment to not use lower Tiers). Also this would be good for ruleset consistency since the effect does not come from nowhere. EDIT : errr, it does not seem to be possible. It seems that Status cannot be randomized unless they com from an attack. Brilliant Ticks are not attack. EDIT EDIT : might be not totally impossible with a few tweaks (I'm going to remove ressource regen from Brilliant and put it on Ancestor's Memory instead, but as a 1-time effect)

Dual mortar is very good for Cipher. It generates plenty of focus. Bow are better vs single target. I don't know specifically about Frostseeker though. INT from duality is excellent for both Cipher spells and Mortar AoE.

My bad. And It can't be edited anymore. I will correct it for 1.1 update.

Yes. Better in case you hit your friends. Phenomenon did it for Carnage in his CP Add-On. Check for it. I don't plan to do it myself (the mod has been a lot of work honnestly).

0:1 0:2 Pending, I've not actually tried yet. 0:3

I just provided a second mean to reach the same effect. Modals provide the effect for free and can be applied thourgh Clear Out and similar effects, while Strike the Bell makes it applicable with a wider range of weapon (and the upgrade makes it Infinite Duration). It's not like there were no other redundant effects in the game... (and it feels less redundant than the original Strike the Bell effects) No, because for some reasons, only main target get debuffed by Strike the Bell (it's the case currently). It's an exception to the normal rule of debuff applications. So it's 2 Guiles per target. You have to rely on your Fighter buddy to apply reflex debuff with Clear Out. Spirit Frenzy AoE is triggered when you kill your target with Spirishift weapon in the base game. Spirit Frenzy AoE triggered when you crit your target with Spirishift weapon in my mod.

Yep (anf from Inspired Strike too) but : - Tactician can get Disciplined Strikes instead. - The INT + PL part of Brilliant has always been redundant with Tactical Barrage anyway.

Well, your solution is good, but does not work with 2 Brilliant priests. My already implemented solution for SoT is actually close to what you describe for WoD (I knew I had to copy it in my previous post ) : Salvation of Time : Change to a lasting beneficial effects which adds 0.5s to every beneficial effects every 1s. That effectively halves their ellapsing speed of buffs (including SoT itself : it lasts 20s with a base duration of 10s). Basically still add 10s but : - Now benefits from PL and INT - Now applies to effects cast after it (especially useful for Vanishing Strikes...) - Useless to cast several times in a row - The most important : now a single effect cannot have its duration more than doubled. It is still a very good spell, even better than before, but it is now impossible to abuse by combining it with Brilliant, and all other buffs will also have to be re-cast again at some point.

What I plan to do, second version : Nerfs & tweaks : His Heart Did Fill with the Light of the Dawn (already in the mod): +1 Ressource -> +2 RessourcesDoes not affect the caster anymore. Blood Mage -> Blood Sacrifice Recovery to 3s Blood Sacrifice regenerated Tier chances aligned with the table below. Tactician : Brilliant Tactician -> Acute (it shall not be as good as a Cipher Tier VII Power, so I see no obvious way to keep Brilliant) Add passive negative effect "Tactician Prudence" : +20% Recovery to everything (subclass has more ressources, but uses them slower). Add passive beneficial effect "Backup Plan" : 1/ressource per class every 30s (unconditional). This is to put a harder limit on ressource regeneration for both classes while addressing the trick to constantly "reboot" Brilliant to get the initial +1 ressource. WoD : Procs trigger a hostile lasting effect : for 6s ,-2s beneficial effect per 1s Procs trigger a (non-cumulative) beneficial lasting effect on catser : for 6s, +0.66s beneficial effect per 1s This essentially triples the duration of beneficial effects on caster, and divide per 3 the duration of beneficial effects on foes. Works better on ennemies crossing the wall, works better as a dispell, but nerf hard the self buffing part (but still better than my version of SoT at this) @Raven Darkholme : this is close to what I did for SoT. For Brilliant, Blood Mage, His Heart Did Fill, and the new "Tactician Backup", I want the ressource regeneration for casters to work like this (I have to check if possible) : 3/6 chances to restore Tier I-III 2/6 chances to restore Tier IV-VI 1/6 chances to restore Tier VII-IX (interestingly, this is WoD Tier) I think there should still be ways to immortality (Tactician Unbending + Bloodmage WoD spamming), but most likely so tedious that it is below my alarm line. For a complete playthrough, they won't work well against dispells anyway. @thelee : feel free to comment if you find Something Broken (not just slightly OP ) Buffs (to address the general problem of Single Class Martial ressources) : Stunning Shot : add 10% chance Bond on Crit Heart Piercer : back to 4 bonds (my mod tuned it to 3), Enfeebled set to infinite duration (sort of passive) Distracting Training : in addition to my previous duration buff to 15s, I will allow it to work on any Attack (not just melee) Wall of Flashing Steel : add 10% chance Guile on Crit Vengeful Defeat : add 2 Rages on Unconscious Note that the On-Crit ressources have good synergy with Rogue's Gambit and general ability of Ranger to generate a tons of attacks through driving flight, Twin Shots or Whriling Strikes. That's why the percentage has to remain low. It would also favors Blunderbusses (even with their Acc malus), but I hope not too much.

Yup, but if you know MTG, you also know that casting a card draw spell may give you ressources (cards) advantage, but you may loose the tempo by spending a whole turn without putting/removing nothing on the table. That's what I'm refering here too. Casting Ancestor's Memory has a cost. You're not conjuring ressources out of thin air and you may loose an advantage while spending time to cast it for later better ressources (although it is not as critical as in this MTG example). Yup, that's what I'm trying to do. I think Ancestor's Memory is fine when given to a SC Martial, around fine when given to MC Martial (but it's complicated to change the balance between these two anyway), vaguely useless on Cipher and to a lesser extant Chanters (maybe Chanter MC likes it a bit) and clearly overpowered on anything involving a caster (both when compared to effect on others and in absolute value). That's what I'm trying to address. But people like the infinite ressource generation, so I don't want to cut this possibility. Fun matters. FYI Putting it on AL9 is extremely tedious to do in a PoE2 mod though, because it would conflict with basically any mod revamping Cipher ability tree. Yup, but it's written nowhere that all Inspirations (and Afflictions) of a given tier should have the same level of power. Blind for example is extremely meh as a Tier 3 afflictions. But the spells inflicting it are good enough. It would have been "more beautiful" if they were, but it doesn't seem to be an underlying principle. Brilliant, however, is so much above the curve that it still feels weird even after admitting that Tier 3 inspirations could be of different powers. But I'm not the designer of the game, so I cannot really address that (and I don't really want anyway). For your information, here is the mod : https://forums.obsidian.net/topic/114861-balance-polishing-mod-release-10/ The nerfs are in a separate package, so they are optional anyways. And the files are all separate too, so if you don't like the changes I made for an ability, it's easy enough to erase it. It's a Single Player Game after all. But I still think a couple of nerfs (or tweaks) could help give a better overall experience, so that's why I include them (it also helps this bunch of powercrept stuff to feel more legit) That's why I'm so happy with my change to Salvation of Time (even if some finds it unsufficient ) It is improved for people who don't like to abuse it, and still prevent Broken combos from expert users I still don't have solutions as clean for most of what we are discussing now.

Yup, but does casting #1 instead of #2 is really better than casting #2 AND disintigrate in parallel (focus and cast time similar to Brilliant) ? To get the effect, you're combining Cipher and another character strengths. Granted it is not as simple as this since Brilliant also provides INT and PL, and will regenerate several spells (even with my proposed nerf to 12s), not just one. And also that if you want to regen the perfect spell, you have to restrain using others (that's a significant opportunity cost for a wizard - no DAoM, Mirror image, etc...) EDIT : Also, tweaking brilliant so it doesn't automatically give you back max level spell slot (as blood sacrifice) might be an option too. Yup, I was not confident about this one (and others), that's why I'm telling about it before implementing it.

I just said that I will lower it to 12s by the way , so I don't disagree entirely that Brilliant is too strong. As you said, I'm trying to mitigate things. Tier VIII- IX spells are approximatively Worth 3 ressources due to what I personnally call "Trickster equivalence table". So that make Casters better at receiving brilliant, but not really better than a multiclass martial. To be honnest, Brilliant isn't that relevant apart Megabosses battles either. 70 focus and casting time isn't that cheap just to recast a couple of spells on a caster who is far from being devoid of ressources. For 90% of fights, casting Ancestor's Memory is essentially bad action economy (or situational flexibility). At least this is my experience. So should I ignore it for this reason ? There are many things borderline OP in this game. I don't want to cut them all. Should I cut Unbending also ? Whispers of the Wind ? Should I cut Monk class ?

A good example would be Oberryn Martell in GoT. Charismatic Able to knockdown the strongest man in combat Oh wait

Don't judge him. If you had tentacles on your head, you might consider them as god's gift to kith kind as well.

Explain to me how modern media ruined my life again, I'm curious. However, I think I can see what you refer about these characters. I think the character you refer are all a bit "mannered". But I don't see this as a contradiction to be strong or charismatic. I guess charisma is subjective, so you might not find them charismatic. If you take the example of Atsura, he is hinted to be an extremely dangerous man. The one that can decide your execution in the glimpse of an eye if needed. Furrante is also hinted to be extremely treacherous an manipulative. All this character are interesting in my opinion, so it is not a problem. And I don't know why you see them as loosers. Atsura is obviously not a looser IMHO. But I think I can see the kind of character you would expect, with a more direct style as were for example the leader of torn bannermen, the Duke or even Thaos. Or Benweth in PoE2 but he doesn't live long enough in my playthroughs.

I strangely remember something like this too but I can't remember from where this idea comes from. Fig Campaign ? Even maybe another game ?

I've checked. By the way, there is also my Dire Straits cover band : the Direballs.