nikolokolus

I think you just described about 100% of the people on this message board.

as an aside, in a world without a reductive alignment system, who determines what is "right, just and lawful?" Aren't those conventions largely fungible from society to society?

From what I understand nobody draws power from the gods, all power is drawn from the soul of the character.

Only if it's restricted to fighter-types only and it unlocks a paladin sub-class. If a fighter can't become an archamge, then I don't want to see mages being called paladins. Not even as a title. I totally agree ... well almost totally. I think militant clerics should be able to qualify for such an order too.

Non core classes are always going to have shades of their parent class, but for me it boils down to mechanics. Any subclass should be rooted in some specialization that differentiates it from the parent class enough to make it distinct. (particularly in a CRPG where enforcing behavior oriented mechanics is problematic). In terms of combat roles I'm not sure there's enough differentiation between a paladin and a fighter or a priest; they borrow from both, but don't do anything mechanically that is distinct. Even properly playing a paladin in PnP required a lot of careful monitoring by a GM and a lot of subjective judgments about a character's motives and actions, otherwise they were just a cool fighter with some magical abilities thrown in and not many disadvantages. Being a paladin ends up being about 90% roleplay enforcement and about 10% game mechanics to do it right, now take out an alignment system and how do you manage that type of character in a gameworld where the idea of pure good and pure evil are left behind for a faction reputation system? The only logical conclusion I can draw is that if there are paladins in Eternity, then they are a faction unto themselves -- a religious, monastic order of knights -- rather than a broad based general class of character.

I'll assert it again: I think Paladins should be included, but it really should be a titular role gained by proving yourself worthy through the course of the game. Going all the way back to 1st ed. AD&D, the whole notion of the class seemed to be defined around their deeds and philosophical rigidity. Wouldn't some of you guys that love paladins rather earn it than having it handed to you?

Bigger screens and higher resolutions being a norm on PCs should hopefully help the developers take better advantage of the user interface ... plus not having to simultaneously cater to the console crowd. I like the idea of color coding speakers within text blocks and having slightly larger fonts to improve readability for dialogue and lore. Hopefully the devs take note or are already thinking about this kind of thing.

I like that. A lich doesn't necessarily have to be evil. Just driven. Au contraire!! they must be evil!!

"De gustibus non est disputandum" -- In matters of taste there is no debate. I for one love the Barbarian stretch goal. Love it, love it, love it!! But that's just me.

Loved Torment, but let's be honest. Within a niche community like RPGs it was niche of a niche, it just wasn't for everybody As others have said, just because they are talking about mechanics doesn't mean that the story is going to be crap or that the characterization and tone of the world is going to be all hack'n'slashy. They have to talk about systems and gameplay mechanics first because that is the foundation for any game and the tableau upon which a story rests.

As long as the "mule" is a hill giant that my barbarian enslaves and constantly humiliates by forcing it to carry all of my shiny toys then I'm all for it.

Well, whatever happens they need to be given the quivering palm

Personally I think Paladins should be included ... but not as a base class, but rather as a title for joining a particular order and proving yourself worthy through deeds in the game.

Pretty much all of this verbatim. ps. Good god, DA2 ... ugh, I don't even know what to say about that POS.

Absolutely this. Ritual magic, or divination spells would be pretty cool ... not sure how they should work exactly, but perhaps lore could be gleaned if cast on an ancient statue, gating demons to ask questions (with great risk!), using charm on a pickpocket to learn about more about the thieves guild, etc.

Cool. Thanks for responding Adam. Loving the way this thing is shaping up.

I always kind of liked school specializations ... not to say that they should lift that mechanic whole cloth from D&D, but it would be nice to have some variation built into the class' specialization tree (or whatever they come up with).

I like this quote this much

Conan wants to hear more

I've nothing against them (I loved playing a paladin when I was in my early teens) but perhaps these archetypes don't fit into the P:E universe? On the other hand maybe they do and they will be stretch goals. However, from the description of the base classes, it sure seems like Rogues cover enough ground for there to be minstrel vagabonds in the game as a character background, but sans the spell casting and special class powers from the D&D games. Likewise for Paladins, without an alignment system, but a faction reputation system, how do you write scripts that adjudicate "good" or "evil" behavior?

It's ultimately pretty hard to divorce the iconic image of the Shaolin monk Caine from Kung-fu, wandering the wilderness, seeking adventures -- As that was almost certainly the inspiration behind the monk class in the 1st ed. AD&D books that Gygax released in '78 -- but that doesn't mean that the lore in this world has to come from that same well spring. Maybe it's miplaced, but I have faith that there will be some lore-sensible reason for monastic ascetics, who like to punch birch wood boards with their knuckles.

For good or ill it doesn't even look like they've even got that design decision down. Im pledging some tentative support, but if i dont see a clear vision about what they want to do -- and them picking "whatever the fans want" won't cut it-- then ill be pulling my support sometime in the near future.

In-combat cooldowns suck major balls, but the tentative plan to have some type of system that cuts out spam resting is intriguing. For now I'm "undecided" and it all comes down to execution by the devs.

Ok

I couldn't make my self vote. Broken poll and a weird set of questions.