vaxen83

I have to say that the K2's actual story in the game could have been developed further but I am generally ok with it except the ending maybe.

I have come to appreciate Atton even though he acts like a scoundrel as he has practicality mixed with occasional humour.

Environmental effects would also mean having wider variation with the sounds apart from the usual music of the different locations on the planets.

I think the idea for having characters in K3 who use only single weapons like Kreia just makes things unnecessarily tedious. Now that I think of it, the way OE made the game, and this is for all PCs, most of the characters were actually restricted to certain PC settings, like having to be Female to get Disciple and getting Mira only with LS PCs. This is simply a convoluted way of restricting characters to one part of the story. One of the reasons for doing this is whichever of those characters were prevented from being made available to any kind of PC regardless of Male/Female and LS/DS is that OE might have wanted to but could not integrate characters like the Handmaiden, Disciple, Hanharr, and Mira together. K2's storyline was not just abrupt, but due to lack of interaction of these characters, it was not exactly synchronised. (Like preventing a PC from having Disciple and Handmaiden in the same game, no link to K2 story between them) The only characters in K2 that are always there and who are already Jedi or can be trained as Jedi are probably Bao-Dur, Atton and Visas. (Meaning not having to adjust playing style so tediously) The rest of the characters are either limited to certain PC settings or characters without Jedi training potential. (Kreia can be quite long-winded throughout the game) Besides characters like Atton, Bao-Dur and Visas are easier to listen to and sympathise with.

Class-specific lightsaber colours for Sith prestige classes might have helped. It's odd to see that Sith Assassins use only weapons that look like Force Pikes. There is only one Elite Sith Assassin in the game that uses lightsabers, one being viridian colour. And Sith Lords on Dxun using violet lightsabers. Although there were several different types of Sith enemies, those who used lightsabers always seemed to use red. (Including those Sith Lords and Marauders in the Trayus Academy) Also, those Sith that use colours that are not red could have AI scripts for employing Force power usage. (They are called different names but their fighting style always seems to be almost the same) Another thing is that there is no logic in being asked by Atton about the colour of your saber if it can only be found randomly, since those colours can only be randomly found. (Colours other than blue, green, purple and red) It is a pain to have to look so hard throughout the game for the colour crystal you want for your lightsaber. And if they were included in shop inventories on Dantooine, have more than one of them for those of us using double lightsabers.

When I first saw Atris' Darth Traya appearance in the Xbox guide, it looked almost like a double of a DS Visas to me. And I think her face looked almost like an angry version of Queen Talia. (If I remember what I saw since it has been six months)

In terms of DS force powers in K2, Force Crush was actually a force power that did not really need to be in the game as there was already DS Wound, Choke and Kill. The other thing about learning a DS Force power after Kreia abandons the PC could have been something like a power which I might call Force Breath (different from Breath Control). This power which is Force Breath might actually merge three different DS powers of Plague, Insanity, and perhaps Force Scream into one power that has a lower FP cost. This would be slightly like the Marlboro Bad Breath attack from FF8 where party members were weakened with various status effects. (Sleep, Zombie, Confuse, Berserk, Poison, Silence, Petrified, Blind, and not forgetting Meltdown which reduced both Vit and Spirit to 0 for characters) So the DS force power of Force Breath that could have been learned in place of Force Crush would be slightly like Force Enlightenment (Burst of Speed, Valour and Shield) Besides, bosses like Kreia, Sion and Nihilus and the Greater Storm Beast could have been defeated without Force Crush. Also, there is damage to both force points and health of groups of enemies with Force Storm. If K3 had a force power that would combine those DS force powers that had status effects into one, it would help, especially if it affects a group of enemies. (Except that poison damage might be left out as the force power is meant to only weaken opponents)

My thoughts on Vrook using a DS PC: Use Plague on him and that will slow him down. If he keeps healing, just Plague him until he decides to chase your PC. Keep leading him around one of your party members without running too far from him but enough to keep out of attack range (Run in narrow circles). As you are running, (making sure that Vrook is not too far behind you) use Force lightning on him. Just keep Plague and Force lightning in effect. This worked for me as my physical attacks missed many times even with Master Speed. Besides, Plague works on any enemy except maybe the Tukata' on Korriban. (Same for K1)

As a way of suggesting the G0T0 description from the SW movies, think of Bao-Dur's remote as a miniature model of a Death Star. Subtle?

Just a question here: How many of us who have been posting in this thread want to continue using this thread for K3 discussions? Or does anyone want to have a thread for Part 13? I'm generally ok with continuing with this thread, actually.

Am almost through my first DS game of K2. Playing as DS PC is actually harder than LS. (Mainly due to Jedi Masters) Two force powers that help in terms of healing: Battle meditation (slight increase in life regeneration since Heal is LS force power but short time) and Death Field. Force lightning also helps quite a bit. Somehow, LS games are easier to understand and play in K2...

For Vrook, as I am almost finishing a K2 game playing as a DS character, what I will say is this: Master Vrook was one tough nut to crack. Yet, the other thing is this has been my first game as DS and I was able to beat Vrook using Force Lightning, athough he kept on healing so many times. When he used lightsaber attacks, I used Force lightning. When he healed himself, I used lightsaber attacks. (Just tried to drain his life within a duration of Master Speed) Master Speed also helps for the rapid running rate. Master energy resistance for damage reduction. Ironic as it is the first battle with him and still defeated him. Thankfully, Vrook only had one lightsaber...

I have already PMed Fionavar. Since there has been no news from the global moderators, I will assume that we can continue to post in this thread till we receive news about posting in an unused thread later. Back to what I was discussing about earlier, in terms of effects for K3, there might be some sort of interaction between the environment and force powers for the PC. There might be atmospheric conditions which are the result of concentrated dark side energies that greatly decrease the effectiveness of the PC's force powers. As a few examples, damage done by powers like Force Wave may be reduced to a third of the usual damage done, and perhaps status effects like stun may not work as often as expected. Healing effects or powers like Force Drain are halfed. The other side of this is that dark side force powers like Death Field, which people would expect to use as a way of draining life, contradictarily heals the monster it is used upon. So, since Death Field drains life from a group of enemies, it has an opposite effect of healing them. And perhaps, in specific parts of the game, only force powers like Healing and Death Field work as usual with Master Force Barrier and Master Energy Resistance, while other force powers are rendered redundant temporarily until a certain point in the game is reached. So the PC has little choice but to rely on skills and lightsaber fighting attributes.

The last thing I would like to look at is the occurrence of a relationship attachment between two members of the Jedi Council. Not too sure which female is being referred to, so I will just leave it there...

Combination I prefer is a Consular/Sith Marauder character if I ever play through the dark side. Through the shadows I go... in search of the light.

Going back to what was discussed earlier, there were not that many monsters in K2 except for Hsiss, a drexl, and the different beasts on Dxun. If there were going to be certain monsters in K3, some of the ideas in K1 could be built upon, including the tarentatek from the shadowlands of Kashyyyk. There might be a greater version of the tarentatek-type monster in K3. The name I would suggest is a Greater Tarentatek, which basically thrives on a substantial amount of DS energy, several times more than the tarentatek that was responsible for the deaths of the Jedi involved in the Great Hunt. Here are some suggested properties in terms of attacks for this monster: Each hit scored by a Greater Tarentatek would afflict the PC with Plague and Poison statuses. That means losing 4 points of vitality every turn and having attributes lowered by 12 points progressively. So this is actually a combination of the occasional rakghoul effect and the K1 tarentatek poison. The other thing is higher amount of vitality than the initial K1 tarentatek. Also, a modified or DS controlled monster which might be a modified version of a rakghoul. This monster might have an ability to choke the PC and other characters, (slightly like DS Force power Kill) whic can be avoided by Fortitude save. Differences between this and the rakghoul would be that this monster might have dark grey skin. The name I would give it is a Misshapened Ghoul, which is much more difficult to defeat than a Rakghoul Fiend. The other thing about it is it can cause slight vibrations in the ground, and make characters lose their balance, if they do not succeed on their Reflex saves. A force power called Force Shake has yet to be introduced although I doubt that it would be included in K3. (Force powers usually occurr without environmental effects) Feel free to suggest any ideas people might think off...

The person who drew the art of Visas probably drew Visas' eyes with regard to the facial appearance of Nihilus, and may have assumed that Nihiulus himself did not have any eyes at all. (At least that is what I am thinking) Although as the PC in K2, we do not really get to see his unmasked face, there is actually a black cloth or hood behind that mask, although there are also noticeable slits in the hood, revealing a glimpse of a pair of eyes behind them. Which is merely enough for him to barely visualise those within range of his sight. Darth Nihilus: The other reason I can think of why Nihilus' eyes could not be seen was that they were black. Feel free to suggest any other ideas that people might want to describe...

Another option that might be considered in K3 might be the option of fighting opponents in order to level up without having to necessarily deal with overly difficult enemies while doing so. In K2, there were two places to do this: the time when fighting together with the Mandalorians on Dxun against the Sith stealth fighters while trying to get to Onderon. The other being the Sith cave where Hsiss keep on appearing. As it is, the purpose of leveling up is painfully tedious when having to fight through a group of force users to get to the Hsiss area. It would help to have the location of leveling up in a place that is openly available on a planet rather than right inside a cave of past visions with visions of force users right between the PC and the training area: And also the places in the Undercity and the Lower Sewers where rakghouls kept on appearing each time the transit back to the hideout was used in K1 which provides more than one place to level up, with five instead of two enemies to deal with: Besides, Force points could not be recovered while in the Sith cave on Korriban.

The only thing was that those characters only had one Jedi class with a non-Jedi class, so only bonuses from their Jedi class added to one attribute of characters, and some of them started as non-Jedi.

The three Sith Lords in K2 essentially might have had partial vision in some sense. Sion might have only been able to perceive visually through one eye. As for Nihilus, it is something of a mystery as to how he actually saw the things within the range of his visual vicinity. Sight was probably an issue for all of them. Still, it is hard to imagine how Kreia mentally maneuvers three floating lightsabers after the PC towards the end of the game while defending herself if she is attacked, given the condition of her visual ability, even with Force Sight perception.

The theme of a Jedi Master's corpse disappearing away into nothingness did not have to be shown in K1 as the story did not need such effects to be integrated into any deaths of the Jedi masters. (Dantooine was razed by Malak only in terms of dialogue with Saul Karath with the PC on the Leviathan) The part of the K2 story where the race of Miralukas on Katarr was wiped out with several Jedi members of the gathering there is questionable as its actual occurrence is not really made clear. The only thing I would say is that force users would inevitably be both Jedi characters/masters and Sith apprentices/lords. Not too sure why the effect of integrating characters that were killed off into visions was not adopted by OE in the production of K2. This idea was actually attempted by Bioware in the movies of the Star Maps as visions of the PC as Revan. Besides, visions are in some way related to the force, as only Luke was able to see visions of Obi-Wan Kenobi and Yoda towards the end of ROTJ. Vision of Obi-Wan Kenobi in ROTJ while speaking with Luke on Dagobah:

Kriea with double-bladed lightsaber:

Well, K2 does not actually have any classes for grey jedi. The thing is this, if you stay at neutral alignment, you won't be able to obtain either LS or DS mastery bonuses. And another thing, according to what Bulgarian Jedi discovered as shown above. Just to take an example: A Jedi Master with LS mastery would get +3 Wisdom bonus, however, a Sith Lord with LS mastery would also get the +3 Wisdom bonus. Similarly, a DS Jedi Master will get the 40-50 force point bonus as will a DS Sith Lord. So bonuses are alignment-dependent. I usually move my alignment to LS and go for Jedi Prestige classes. The one that I have used previously is Consular/Weaponmaster.

A reason why the mass killing of the Jedi Council was executed in a manner of inappropriateness is this: SW Episode IV: A New Hope showed Kenobi as being sliced through by Vader's lightsaber and disappeared in an instant. (No sign of being vapourised through with the saber) It is hard to validate the fact that bodies of trained Jedi masters remain even after being force drained by Kreia. And I doubt that, speaking through the nature of the Force, a timespan of four millennia allows for a difference in corpses of Jedi masters decaying like the corpse of an average person. If it was an average force-user like a Jedi apprentice, then normal death without the body disappearing might be ok, but for Jedi masters? Another instance was the corpse of Lonna Vash. Kreia's body not disappearing, after the battle at Malachor is understandable as she is of DS alignment.