Dark Moth

What I mean is that when a child matures it finds it's own path and parents are generally proud of this. The anology of a christian in this context would be someone who lives in their parents basement and bothers them every time they have a problem. You believe got is all powerful ? Does he control the weather ? Ask those 120,000 Tsunami victims. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> First of all, it's not really like that. And even a parent would want to offer advice and guidance to a child who is lost or suffering. Maybe he can, but chooses not too. Every think about that? And I know you'd say "Well, why didn't he stop the tsunami?" First, if God controlled the weather, how would we know he wasn't controlling us? Secondly, if we could say he was controlling the weather, what would stop people from coming out and accusing God of being partial for giving some people bad weather and others good weather. God, I'm sure, was deeply saddened by the Tsunami. But at the same time, he can't treat the earth and humanity as his pawns.

A child might not but an adult does dont they ? That would Aethiests the adults I guess. While we are at it. Does a parent have a right to abuse and threaten their child ? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> I'm not sure what you mean in your first part, but... No, of course not. Do you believe God abuses you? Has it harmed you in any way?

Why do you assume he is lying about it? Besides, if you believe in God (at least the Christian God), you accept he was here before humanity. We are like children in that manner. If you believe that there is a being with vastly superior intelligence and consciousness, why would you assume you would automatically know better than it? Why do you believe he/she/it doesn't have the right? Who called you into existance? Does a toddler have a right to disobey his parents? For that matter, would a parent not have any right to issue commands to his/her child? Yes, it would. And once again, you have to look at this from the Christian perspective, which assumes the Bible is divinely inspired. But you see, that's where you have to take the leap of faith. The Bible teaches God's inability to lie. So you either have to accept the fact the Bible is lying, God is lying, the people who wrote it are lying (and subsequently a lot died for a lie), and all of Christianity is a sham, which many here tend to think. Okay, I hate monarchies, so I'll give you this one. But to stress a point: God does not control your life. You do. That's one thing Hades tends to overlook. He likes to blame God, not humanity. What makes you think he'll be a tyrant? In heaven, supposedly God would not really have to control us, cause there'd be no reason for him too. It'd be a paradise, where we live as humanity should. Do you realize what you said is a quagmire? If God is not omniscient, then he/she might be wrong. (also, I notice you refer to God as a she. Interesting.) And if she is wrong, then she could be giving you wrong guidance, then you yourself would be wrong. Likewise, you couldn't really trust your God, could you? You wouldn't even be able to trust the advice she gives you. Another quagmire. Of course you deny God by not believing in him/her/it. If God were capable, and you didn't believe in it, then you would of course be denying it. And remember Peter's denial of Jesus if you want to see what I'm driving at. BTW, I believe God also wants more than blind obedience. There is ample evidence in the Bible that God wants understanding from us, too. A person with blind, unjustified faith would be useless to it. That's not true faith, and that wouldn't benefit God in any way. And as you said, I too believe God wants us to enjoy life as well. For one thing, I believe a lot of God's commands were not merely for obedience, but advice on how we should live to survive. The 10 Commandments contain a lot of teachings we as humans agree with anyway, such as not killing, lying, coveting, etc. You of course could say we don't need God to tell us that, but if you look at human history, you can tell that there countless events that prove many humans don't always abide by those. Theoretically, if there was nobody saying that killing was wrong, then there'd be no reason not to kill, right? Besides, is it too much to ask that we give a little to God in return, such as thanking it and trying to live as it advises? I don't think so.

"Basky"! :D Cheers BTW <{POST_SNAPBACK}> That works! Thanks.

Judgement day, my friend. But as I said, "whoever is not against us is for us." If you're against Christianity, then you might have something to be worried about. Also, read Mathew 25:31-46. The passage focuses on deeds, not belief. No, it definitely said what I wrote it as. Perhaps I should check the original Greek just to be sure.

Wow, I've missed so much art. Kudos to Lord Gabreil, Bastila Skywalker, and Zulu for the awesome drawings! Especially to Bastila for being able to work with paint so well. You know, I at first was going to abbreviate Bastila Skywalker's name, but you can't really do it. Otherwise, you'd be calling her B.S. and that of course wouldn't work out very well.

I sometimes wonder that myself. I'm more inclined to believe Jesus meant that it was he who determined who should go to heaven or hell, not necessarily just those who believe in him. Jesus himself even said "whoever is not against us is for us" and "not everyone who comes to me saying 'Lord, Lord' will inherit the kingdom of heaven" (something like that).

I hand it to Blank for having the b**ls to make a thread like this, as topics like religion usually tend to degerate into flame wars. :ph34r: But I'll give it a go. As for ShadowPaladin's comment about God's lack of intervention in the world, I think we're all missing the point that God gave us all a free will. If he set up everything for us, why would there be any point to our existance? We'd all be actors following a script. Personally, I'd rather have that then be manipulated unknowingly by an outside force. Not really. A lot of religions are based on the assumption that they're the right ones. Why would you follow a religion if you didn't believe it was right? I have my own reasons for believing my faith is correct, but at the same time, I won't go out and smite others for their beliefs. If I ever did try to convert someone, it'd be as my faith teaches: in a respectful, friendly manner.

This is a Texas thread, people! At least keep the songs Texas-like! :angry:

Personally, I loved having to unravel the mystery of "what happened to the miners?" Besides, you get to save Atton & Kreia, at least... <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Meh. By the end of Peragus, I could've cared less about what happened to the miners. By that time the only thing I thought while playing was "get me out of this place, get me out of this place, get me out of this place..." And honestly, I would have left both Atton and Kreia on Peragus if I could have.

Bah. Obsidian did okay with K2. Only until NWN2 and PNJ are released will we be able to say whether or not they're a good company.

Visas was a good concept character, but not well flushed out at all. She had so much in common with the exile, yet was probably one of the least developed characters in the game. Bastila's character ended up being way deeper in the end. She undergoes a radical change of behavior and personality in the game, whereas Visas's change isn't all that apparent, and if you're darkside then the change is almost nonexistant. And as for what Kalfear said, of course Bastila is flawed. She is annoying at the start of the game. That's what the game intended. She was ment to be a dynamic (not static) character, and thus will undergo changes in the game, many times due to her own flaws. The important thing is what her character was like at endgame. BTW, for those who always point out she fell to the darkside, ask yourself this: what would you be like after the mounting stress of war, a father's death, conflict between your lover and your loyalties (Revan + the Jedi code), and finally being tortured and brainwashed endlessly for a weak? Hmm... Newsflash: the whole fall to the darkside was meant to be ironic. That's a major theme throughout the whole game: that even the staunchest of Jedi can fall. More importantly, you can't say that Bastila was redeemed only because she felt Revan was stronger than Malak. She acknowledges your strength after losing to you, but if you fail at persuading her, she still begs for you to kill her. The redemption goes deeper than her views on who is stronger. But you know, it doesn't really matter anyway cause Bastila still dominates the poll! But don't get me wrong, I love Visas too. She just doesn't hold up to Bastila.

Well, Bastila owns everyone else in the poll. As usual. :D

Key difference though is The Silmarillion is actually good. For it's supposed "shallow" storyline, I thought K1 had a lot of philosophy and twists behind it. K2's shortcoming was that it had no real resolution and no underlying moral theme. That, and the entire game seems more sympathetic to darksiders and more hostile toward lightsiders. That's what you get with Kreia as your mentor, I guess. K2 had some nice new stuff, but overall I (and the majority of players) feel K1 is still the better of the two.

Thanks. :D By the way... -10 T.O.M.B.S points for being nitpicky. Buckhorn Museum and Saloon is an animal rights activist's nightmare! There were even chairs made almost entirely out of antlers! Probably the weirdest/freakiest thing I saw down there was a display of an 8-legged baby sheep! Poor thing didn't live long, as you might expect. That was even weirder than the two-headed cow. BTW, there was also a fairly large model of a chapel built entirely out of matchsticks. And yes, there was a guy dressed up as a cowboy there who greeted us. We didn't have time to stop at the saloon, unfortunately.

Indeed it does! (J.K.) We you, Obsidian.

I'm missing the strange point <{POST_SNAPBACK}> *ahem* It's an inside joke. Ever see "Pee Wee's Big Adventure"?

So uh, did T.O.M.B.S. die again while I was away?

In case some of you happened to notice, I wasn't active these last few days as I was on a trip to San Antonio. (I know, I'm sure you all missed me) Despite the crappy hotel room, I had a great time for the most part. The entire purpose of the trip though was to see my sister's graduation from the air force. She just finished basic training, is now an Airmen 1st Class, and will ship off to tech school very soon. She also graduated in the Honor Roll in her squadron, which is pretty impressive considering the privelege was only given to less than 10% of her graduating squadron. :D So now, she's offically part of the Air Force. Though her tech school is long, we'll at least get to see her during Christmas. And since she's part of the reserve, there's only a very small chance she'll actually have to go to Iraq (thankfully). :ph34r: *end bragging* Some things San Antonio taught me were: 1. The Alamo is pretty small, though a lot of the original fort is gone. Also, they don't let you take pictures inside either. Strangely enough, there's no basement. 2. Most Texans actually don't walk around in cowboy hats and boots! Though there were a lot of Hispanics, as I suspected. 3. It's not all desert! The place actually has trees and grass! OMG!!! 4. The Riverwalk is a very nice and picturesque tour. 5. Ripley's Believe It or Not! Museum is not worth $18 per person, though there was some neat stuff in it. 6. There are a lot of birds down there, at least during winter. :ph34r: 7. Buckhorn Museum is a pretty neat place, especially the occasional "freak of nature" they have displayed here and there, such as a three-antlered buck. There was also this one section which displayed weird taxidermist creations, such as a crocodile head on a fish's body.

Dark Side (Undertaker's theme music)

Am I the only person here who wasn't bothered by Manaan? (okay, the selkath themselves bothered me a little, bu that's it) Voted Peragus II. It's easily the most boring part of K2, with Malachor V a close second. The devs could have cut Peragus's length by 75% and it would have been fine.

BAN PLZTHNX!!! I feel spammy today. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> E tu, Darkside?

LOCK PLZ!!!!!!!

Whatever you say.

Don Kwiksote? Pronounced Don "Kee-ho-tay"? Yup. And as a 4 year Spanish student, I think I know enough about pronouncing Spanish properly. But you see, those are all words from a different language. "Bastila" is not a Spanish name. "Bastila" is a name made in the English language by English speaking people. So naturally, it'd be pronounced in English manner.