Volourn

"I think NWN:II was based on Kot0R... " No. NWN2 is based on NWN1. KOTOR series ia 'rip off' of NWN (though, honestly, it's kinda ahrd to rip off your own games, R00fles!). NWN2 has the most in common with NWN and it acts, looks (though better graphically), feels, and plays like it!!!

"I spent an ungodly amount for the bloody game" Yeah, $50 or so is an 'ungodly' amount. R00fles!

Roshan WINS and CRUSHES poor little Taks. Espicially since game devs have repeated stated that game writing and other forms of writing are DIFFERENT. The main difference between them is obvious - giving the player as much control as possible. This is espicially true in RPGs. Game over.

Did Hatcher rape or moms or soemthing? You really seem to hate him that much. WOW!

I like the NWN2 toolset overall; but the way it shows the map ons cren is rather poor. I'd love to be able to see the entire map clearly. And, the undo button beeds to be finaggled. <> I still haven't found an easy way to remove things that I want to get rid of (be it palceables, terrain, or whatever). But, the new way of adding mixed terrain is cool, and everything else is very manageable.

"This thread makes me want to play NWN2 so bad." See, folks, this is why a spoiler thread is awesome. Even ina thread like this where I'm pretty negative despite liking the game can get someone to *really* want to play the game. LONG LIVE SPOILERS!!!! HIP HIP HOORAY!!!!!

"It adds amusing cutscenes, " Can alreayd have these with the joinables you choose to ahve in your party. "enables NPC-dependent plot twists" Alreayd have these. ", and allows the convenience of automatically collecting all possible NPCs at your base." A convience that one shouldn't be needed. Check out both PST and BG2 (DEAD GAMES LOL) for examples of how you can have deep, interesting joinable npcs that have a part to play in the story without being wholy forced on you. korm: Did the gobs go hostile though? I think that's what Takls is complaining about.

It also removes all buffs and temporary poisons (if you have any) as well. I don't mind it myself except when it happens moving from city block to city block.

Not lame, Taks. Discussing games is *almost* as fun as playing them. Even if it's with people I constantly disagree with. It's good to read different perspectives. Deg, I tend to rest inbetween dungeons only except in REALLY long ones. Don't forget, NWN2 auto rests you when travelling on the world map.

Yup, even NWN 1 OC iwth its lame death system, at leats gave us an option to ignore respawn if so wish so everyone won.

Comparing game and movie stories is a POOR argument. Espicially since game devloeprs have argued the opposite. The skills overlap; but you need different ones to write successfully for games than you need for movies, and vice versa. Movies aree completely linear, for example, games (espicially RPGs) are NOT.

The goblins aren't dumb. Even your average goblin is about as smart as your average human (lol, take that as you will _. HIPS brings up a whole 'nother issue. Heh.

"it advances the story. these players are central to the story, for one reason or another, and their presence advances it" Oh really? Neseshak? Khelagar? The bard? Yeha, yeah. Keep spinning. The game evengives you oiptions to side against them when you meet yet it eventually forces you to take them. That's lame. Plain, and simple. And, no, a well written story doesn't need that kind of npc. To compare a RPG story to a movie is dumb. Every game writer has said time and time again just because a writer is good atw riting movies or books doens't mean they'd make a good game writer. It's not exactly the same thing. The key to writing a good role-playing game is to give the player options not force them down a certain path all the time espicially in regards to joinable npcs. You trying to compare games to movies is funny and opposes most everything game writers have suggested. Alanshu: Does Neeshka have Hide in Plain Sight? No. And, I wouldn't be surprised if the gobs had a way to detetc invisisbility. Like I said, they should have given the option to try to steal it. The gobs would still likely turn red because it likely be easy for them to deduce that you were the thief. R00fles!

1. I cna see the option; but no matter how sneaky you are; it's kind ahard to steal something on a pedestal when you got half a dozen goblins staring right at it. I think they'd notice it. But, I guess they could give you at least a chance to though like possible major negatives to your hiding rolls. 2. Ahh.. I din't want to attack; but she gave me no choice as I wans't gonna steal from the innocent goblins. P.S. Nice. Alanshu is in such a hurry to tyr to 'one up'; he's erasing posts so it looks like I'm a lame double poster. Whatever, punk. LOL

Nope. If youc an gather a billion people who whoelheartedly support ANY design decision; I wouldn't argue anymore about it. Then again, you are exactly the same way. I have NEVER seen you admit you werre wrong unless someone dragged you kickinga nd screaming with flat out facts. Good luck!

Eh? That was a smart decsion. Yeah, the gobs are gonna allow you to steal the 'source of their power'. They even warn you a couple of time what would happen if you tried such a silly thing. P.S. The dryad *deserves* to be killed espicially if you are good. Even Elanee supports that decision. She helped wipe out an entire village. The dryad has gone psychotic.

Hard to argue role-playing with FAKE role-players. Ah well. *shrug* Stil, no evidence has been brought up thon how this 'fewature' adds anything to the game that the other method precludes. Not surprising since there is none. R00fles!

No, it's completely different. NWN1 OC (though the npcs aren't as well done as NWN2's), like any good nRPG, doens't force you to ahve companions. The NPCs in NWN2 are forced on you. This is undisputable, and it's poor writing if that's the only way they could manage the writing. And, for most of them it's not needed. Take the exmaples of Neeshka and KJhelgar. Ort the silly bard which adds NOTHING to the story (at least thus far). It's lame. And, they are part of the group. This is evidenced by the fact that they are fromt ime to time force dback into your group destroying your dynamics. Not to mention, the runours I've ehard that later on you'll have as many of 8 of them in yoru adventuring party aa time. It's lame, and its indefensible. It was weak in the KOTORs. It was weak in JE. It is weak in NWN2. The NWN1 OC npcs (aka mercs0 are NOT always part of the groupo. They ojnly join if you want them too. They arne't forced on you. Heck, only one of em even forces a convo on you, and that convbo is perfectly logical (the rogue tries to get you to hire him at the start of the first chapter as you leave the temple of tyr for the first time). Defend this POOR design decision all you want. There is absolutely no need for it, and adds NOTHING to the game. In fact, it only serves to annoy players as how many times does one read someone post,"I wish I could get rid of x NPC; I ahte him or her!". That says it all. Game over.

Yeah, I had one vien of ore that did that to me. I'm not sure where it was; but it could have been the orc cave. "don't agree with that. there are story reasons to do so. even in movies you see many situations of the sort "joeschmoe adventurama is going with you as a guide. you'll have to learn to like him for the trip." as long as you have an option to boot said NPC after his "role" is completed, i don't mind it." A well m ade role-playing agme would give you options. You shouldn't have to rely on one specifc being. Plus, in NWN2, you can *never* kick them out of your group. They're stuck to you like glue. Heck, the game flkat out gives you a bogus chocie when you meet Khelgar Neeshka. It's a joke! As for Bishop, I'm sure there could have been anotyher ranger/scout who could have helped you follow the kidnappers; but R00fles!

Simply shouldn't eb forced to ahve npcs in your adventuring party; or your noverall group. It's beyond nonsensical.

"And that's not all to say that NWN2 is a cakewalk." Eh? But, it is. The game is one of the easiest games I've played. Easier than TOEE, and quite possibly even easier than the KOTORs. There is simply a lack of challenge. Of course, there are a couple of exemptions to that rule. Quite frankly, I think a character should die at 0hp (or -10hp) and be done with it. I doubt most players would cry about that.

btw, I finally suffered my first crash! WOO HOO!!!

Most recently there was Aldanon's mansion as well as the traitourous lord's mansion that had obvious treasure/gold coins that were nothing more than tempting scenery. Not the biggets deal, mind you, just a tease. LOL

Night, I thought the two of us settled this on an earlier page. LOL