Provisional Builds

[Dr <3]

Very nice ideas

[Jojobobo]

Yeah I'm pretty pleased with the new dominator Wizard build, it's one of the playthroughs I've got on the go alongside the unarmed Barb. Considering Ryngrim's Enervating Terror is a -28 Will debuff, adding that onto the Citzal's Martial Power boosted Gyrd Háewanes Sténes Dominate accuracy of 131 means it has an effective accuracy of 159. As far as I'm aware, Will isn't even a strong defence for enemies on the whole, so those 27 second Dominate crits should be relatively common - which is an thoroughly ridiculous time to have an enemy on your side for.

 

Adding onto that the spell-binding Dominates and Whispers of Treason (which as mentioned work under Citzal's Martial Power), you can use a couple of them to get the ball rolling (though the accuracy is 5 to 15 lower than Gyrd Háewanes Sténes Dominate) and then try for the high interrupt Gyrd Háewanes Sténes Dominate blasts for more procs (with even Confuse procs periodically from Company Captain's Hat on any hit you receive - even spells).

 

My only concern is that the build might not be tanky enough for some of the bosses - but I'd imagine taking control of the enemy (even a lot of the dragons) should mean you won't be targeted too often. I also wouldn't be surprised if they nerf the new Vailia outfits seeing as the defence boosts are very high (as they're going to have to hotfix a lot of the texture issues people are having, the might want to rebalance at the same time too), which would knock the defences a little further, however I still think it will be solo PotD viable.

[Dr <3]

Wizard will always be viable. In worst case scenarion you can just nuke everything. I just think that you might not completely dump might to gimp all your not cc spells. Anyway tell us how is going!

 

Edit: and for the rogue crit version: you can also bring with you godshantyur as alternative weapon in case of prone-immune enemies

 

Edit2: wood elf should be better for wiz

Edited November 22, 2017 by Dr <3

[Jojobobo]

I guess the idea is that Dominate itself will be adequate CC, as the enemy will be too busy killing itself to turn on me. When there's one or two enemies left, I'd say spells even with Might dumped should be fine for clean-up. Wood Elf should be fine too, but for solo play it's normally better to squeeze for every ounce of tankiness you can get. In addition, I don't think there'd be too many issues with accuracy, and with the natural -1 to Might that Orlan have you can dump it even harder than usual - allowing you to have it distributed into something more usual.

 

For the Rogue, I'll probably use Cladhalíath as a back up, as it also can have Stun and has the spear accuracy bonus. There's not too many Prone immune enemies though I don't think so it should be alright. The reason the one handed build hits an okay Deflection is because the huge +12 accuracy from going one handed means you can dump Per entirely and instead invest in Resolve for more Deflection, and you can also Prone and Stun lock with much lower Dex and Int than when using a weapon and bash shield.

[sarcongin]

Yeah I'm pretty pleased with the new dominator Wizard build, it's one of the playthroughs I've got on the go alongside the unarmed Barb. Considering Ryngrim's Enervating Terror is a -28 Will debuff, adding that onto the Citzal's Martial Power boosted Gyrd Háewanes Sténes Dominate accuracy of 131 means it has an effective accuracy of 159. As far as I'm aware, Will isn't even a strong defence for enemies on the whole, so those 27 second Dominate crits should be relatively common - which is an thoroughly ridiculous time to have an enemy on your side for.

 

Adding onto that the spell-binding Dominates and Whispers of Treason (which as mentioned work under Citzal's Martial Power), you can use a couple of them to get the ball rolling (though the accuracy is 5 to 15 lower than Gyrd Háewanes Sténes Dominate) and then try for the high interrupt Gyrd Háewanes Sténes Dominate blasts for more procs (with even Confuse procs periodically from Company Captain's Hat on any hit you receive - even spells).

 

My only concern is that the build might not be tanky enough for some of the bosses - but I'd imagine taking control of the enemy (even a lot of the dragons) should mean you won't be targeted too often. I also wouldn't be surprised if they nerf the new Vailia outfits seeing as the defence boosts are very high (as they're going to have to hotfix a lot of the texture issues people are having, the might want to rebalance at the same time too), which would knock the defences a little further, however I still think it will be solo PotD viable.

Your build sounds great! Have you had time to test it further?

[Jojobobo]

 

Yeah I'm pretty pleased with the new dominator Wizard build, it's one of the playthroughs I've got on the go alongside the unarmed Barb. Considering Ryngrim's Enervating Terror is a -28 Will debuff, adding that onto the Citzal's Martial Power boosted Gyrd Háewanes Sténes Dominate accuracy of 131 means it has an effective accuracy of 159. As far as I'm aware, Will isn't even a strong defence for enemies on the whole, so those 27 second Dominate crits should be relatively common - which is an thoroughly ridiculous time to have an enemy on your side for.

 

Adding onto that the spell-binding Dominates and Whispers of Treason (which as mentioned work under Citzal's Martial Power), you can use a couple of them to get the ball rolling (though the accuracy is 5 to 15 lower than Gyrd Háewanes Sténes Dominate) and then try for the high interrupt Gyrd Háewanes Sténes Dominate blasts for more procs (with even Confuse procs periodically from Company Captain's Hat on any hit you receive - even spells).

 

My only concern is that the build might not be tanky enough for some of the bosses - but I'd imagine taking control of the enemy (even a lot of the dragons) should mean you won't be targeted too often. I also wouldn't be surprised if they nerf the new Vailia outfits seeing as the defence boosts are very high (as they're going to have to hotfix a lot of the texture issues people are having, the might want to rebalance at the same time too), which would knock the defences a little further, however I still think it will be solo PotD viable.

Your build sounds great! Have you had time to test it further?

 

I'm tweaking it and playing it as we speak - I'm just not going to dump Might as mentioned somewhere for the build. I'm also going to package it up with a few other ideas that I've not mentioned here to round it off a bit better. Should be an extremely versatile all-rounder when it's finished, while being on of the best builds for Dominating given the Martial Power/Gyrd Háewanes Sténes combo.

 

One nice thing is that the build makes it incredibly easy to dump Resolve, as if you take both Ring of Changing Heart and Gyrd Háewanes Sténes even with 3 base Resolve you now have 9, so this build shouldn't feel near as much a punch for dumping it on solo compared to other builds.

[sarcongin]

cant wait for more info! first I was going to do a solo run but now I want to try your mesmer wiz with a sneaky rogue to stab them to death :D

[Jojobobo]

Well ask, and you shall receive!

 

Alluded to earlier, I recently found out that Citzal’s Martial Power works with all Spellbinds - not just Charm effects. This offers three obvious advantages: (1) the +20 accuracy boost on the spell rolls, (2) the +8 Might adding to damage and (3) the +8 Dexterity increases speed of spell-casting.

 

With this concept in mind, I wanted to use Citzal’s Martial Power was to combine both Charming and offensive spell bindings to make a very versatile all-rounder, unlike the fairly shrimpy purely Charming build I mentioned above. Citzal’s Martial Power also works with spell-holdings too that proc on hit and crit, so Gyrd Háewanes Sténes can be used for innate Dominate potential after you’ve blown throw all your big AoE spells (with its Dominate effect having +10 accuracy unlike that of Ring of Changing Heart – very nice).

 

Island Aumaua is a natural race for the build, giving you an additional slot to house a Spellbound weapon for free, and I added a slight Interrupt focus too. With that, here’s what I came up with:

 

 

 

Starting attributes (Island Aumaua, The White That Wends):

 

Might 20

Con 10

Dex 8

Per 19

Int 18

Res 3

 

Buffed Attributes:

 

Might 35 (Citzal’s Martial Power, Training Grounds bonus, Belt of the Royal Deadfire Cannoneer, Gift from the Machine)

Con 22 (Citzal’s Martial Power, Iron Circle)

Dex 20 (Citzal’s Martial Power, Viettro’s Formal Footware)

Per 25 (+2 Armor, Song of the Heavens, Hylea’s Boon, Aldwyn’s Boon)

Int 22 (Belt of the Royal Deadfire Cannoneer, Aldwyn’s Boon)

Res 6 or 9 (Ring of Changing Heart, Gyrd Háewanes Sténes when equipped)

 

Weapons and Armor:

 

Set 1: The Flames of Fair Rhîan + Little Savior

Set 2: Taluntain’s Staff

Set 3: Gyrd Háewanes Sténes

Bonus: Firebrand

 

Armor: Sun-Touched Mail of Hyran Rath (+2 Per)

Rings: Ring of Changing Heart plus Iron Circle

Gloves: Gauntlets of Accuracy

Headgear: Munacra Arret

Boots: Viettro’s Formal Footware or Shod-in-Faith or Animancer’s Boots or Echoing Misery

Necklace: Amulet of Summer Solstice

 

Spells featuring in discussion:

 

Level 1

Spirit Shield (Mastery)

Eldritch Aim (Mastery)

 

Level 2

Merciless Gaze

 

Level 3

DAoM (Mastery)

Llengrath’s Displaced Image (Mastery)

 

Level 5

Llengrath’s Safeguard

Ryngrim’s Enervating Terror

 

Level 6

Citzal’s Martial Power

 

Talents:

 

2 – Veteran’s Recovery

4 – Blast

6 – Gallant’s Focus

8 – Envenomed Strike

10 – Quick Switch

12 – Interrupting Blows

14 – Scion of Flames

16 – Weapon and Shield Style

 

 

 

This leads to the following juicy effects:

 

Spell accuracy...

 

20 (Wizard base) + 45 (level 16) + 15 (25 Perception) + 5 (Gauntlets of Accuracy) + 16 (+1 per level for spells/abilities) + 4 (Gallant’s Focus) + 20 (Citzal’s Martial Power) = 125

 

Defence Debuffs (factoring in attribute debuffs):

 

Blind (Sunbeam) = -28 Reflex

Weakened (Ryngrim’s Enervating Terror) = -24 Fortitude

Weakned + Terrified (Ryngrim’s Enervating Terror) = -28 Will

 

Modifiers: 35 Might, 22 Intellect, Scion of Flame

 

Sunbeam (+10 acc) vs. Reflex, 135 accuracy total, 6 per rest

42-73 Fire damage, 24 second Blind

 

Fireball (+15 acc) vs. Reflex, 140 accuracy total, 6 per rest

53-73 Fire damage

 

Torrent of Flame (+15 acc) vs. Reflex, 140 accuracy total, 1 per rest

84-126 Fire damage

 

Envenomed Strike (+5 accuracy – I think) vs. Fortitude, 130 accuracy total, 3 per rest

121.9 Raw damage over 14.4 seconds

 

Ring of Changing Heart Dominate (base acc) vs. Will, 125 accuracy total, 2 per rest

16 seconds

 

Munacra Arret Whispers of Treason (+10 acc) vs. Will, 135 total, 3 per rest

16 seconds

 

Gyrd Háewanes Sténes Dominate (+10 acc) vs. Will, 135 total, 10% on hit or crit

16 seconds

 

Given that any of these can hit a severely de-buffed stat and be cast rapidly, there should be plenty of crits all over the place.

 

Here are some nice combat manoeuvres, which you should probably use more or less in the order written:

 

 

 

“Plain Ol’ Defensive Buffing” – Spirit Shield (per encounter), Llengrath’s Displaced Image (per encounter), Llengrath’s Safeguard. The Concentration on this build isn’t great, so Spirit Shield helps a lot with that. Llengrath’s Displaced Image helps with your shoddy Deflection, and Llengrath’s Safeguard is always a nice panic button.

 

“Death Sentence” – Eldritch Aim (per encounter) + Ryngrim’s Enervating Terror, followed by Citzal’s Martial Power + Envenomed Strike + Dominate/Whispers of Treason. Use this to effectively mark a troublesome enemy for death (e.g. a spell caster), making their buddies attack them and having them take 100+ raw damage from Envenomed Strike. The massive debuffs to both Will and Fortitude from Ryngrim's Enervating Terror should hopefully facilitate crits due to the already massive accuracy.

 

“Barbeque Pit” – Citzal’s Martial Power, a couple of Sunbeams, 6 Fireballs, Torrent of Flames, also any scrolls you want to use. Drop your Sunbeams to get good Blind coverage on a mob, and then start lighting them up with your spellbindings. It’s that simple.

 

Then:

 

“Kite and, erm, Domin-ite” – Merciless Gaze, DAoM, Citzal’s Martial Power, Gyrd Háewanes Sténes blasts. Once you’ve dropped your AoEs, you can start blasting away at the remaining mob, getting semi-frequent Dominates and interrupts.

 

Or...

 

"What can only be described as 'Cast AoE Spells'" - Eldritch Aim, any AoEs you have as spells that you haven't been able to cast due to Citzal's Martial Power. Everyone loves a nice Ninagauth's Shadowflame - I left the spell choices purposefully vague so people can use whatever they like.

 

And finally...

 

“Fiery Finisher” – Merciless Gaze, DAoM, Citzal’s Martial Power, Firebrand, Sunbeam if any left. When there’s only a single guy or two left, Firebrand provides an effective punch to wipe them out quickly, if you can Blind them with a remaining Sunbeam even better.

 

 

 

And here’s a quick Q&A to cover any anticipated questions...

 

 

Q: Talking about spell-bindings, where’s Bittercut, Scath Gwannek, White Crest Armor, White Spire and… well that’s pretty much all the good ones? And why isn’t Arms Bearer taken?

 

A: I wanted to focus on spellbindings that could benefit from Scion of Flames, and also provided debuffs – hence all the Sunbeam bindings. However, all these items can be carried along to give you some alternate per rest uses to stop such frequent resting and to in case of fire immunity. As Taluntain’s Staff and The Flames of Fair Rhîan are late game, you’ll probably want to use the White Spire mid-game with Curoc’s Band and Gyrd Háewanes Sténes.

 

Arms Bearer wasn’t taken as there simply wasn’t enough room for it while trying to keep the build an all-rounder. In party play you can easily dump off either Veteran’s Recovery and/or Weapon and Shield Style for it and maybe Secrets of Rime – taking both Scath Gwannek as the shield pairing to Fair Rhîan and the White Spire in the extra slot.

 

Q: What if I want to use Looped Rope and an item of Protection for the defensively challenging encounters?

 

A: Take Looped Rope, change the headgear to Maegfolc Skull to maintain good Might, and change the Gauntlets of Accuracy to Spirit Spiral if you still need to Charm enemies. You can easily drop Amulet of Summer Solstice for a Cloak of Protection if you feel like you're defences need an extra boost for a particular fight.

 

Q: Terrible Resolve and Dexterity, this build must suck early on for getting interrupted!

 

A: That’s not really a question, but yes it does a bit. Fortunately the Deadfire Belt gives you a form of retaliation with Flame Shield on enemy crit, so that with good armor and Spirit Shield to keep your concentration up does a good enough job Act I. In Act II you can start using resting bonuses for things like more Dex until you get Citzal's Martial Power, then you can change it to Might.

 

Q: No Penetrating Shot or Penetrating Blast, what gives?

 

A: It’s again a case of their being little room for them, and really you need Golden Gaze to make best use of a Blaster in the first place. These can again be options if you shed some of the defensive talents in party play.

 

 

 

And there you have it. This build, as I think it'll be ridiculously good fun, has become my top priority and I'm testing it as we speak.

 

If anyone has any suggestions, I'm all ears. While I think the Talent set is solid for solo-play, I'm not too sure if the order is quite right for my tastes. Arguably Interrupting Blows is maybe the most useless Talent so could be taken later - but if you're taking it at level 16 then what's the point in taking it at all? I guess that's why I've pitched it at level 12 - but I'm not wholly convinced.

 

Sorry for typos and general incoherency, it's late so I'll try and catch that in the morning. Hope you enjoy!

Edited January 3, 2018 by Jojobobo

[Dr <3]

Very nice idea, you should alredy post it as a build ( since it is ).

 

I have only a couple of humble suggestion:

- as boots you can even use echo of affliction ( you found them in gavalin lab), they can be a nice alternative over animancer boots

- there is also the new nice saber from the deadfire merchant, that gives you a 10% chance of crushing wave. 10% is a bit low, but the spell in itself is very powerful. For max pawnage effect you can go also for shodding sheet (? The mantle that do a crushing wave on hit on yourself), obviusly only if you are not solo.

- with all your strenght, int and accuracy when buffed, an interesting thing to add could be a plain and simple godshantyur+shield, so you can permastun

[Jojobobo]

Very nice idea, you should alredy post it as a build ( since it is ).

 

I have only a couple of humble suggestion:

- as boots you can even use echo of affliction ( you found them in gavalin lab), they can be a nice alternative over animancer boots

- there is also the new nice saber from the deadfire merchant, that gives you a 10% chance of crushing wave. 10% is a bit low, but the spell in itself is very powerful. For max pawnage effect you can go also for shodding sheet (? The mantle that do a crushing wave on hit on yourself), obviusly only if you are not solo.

- with all your strenght, int and accuracy when buffed, an interesting thing to add could be a plain and simple godshantyur+shield, so you can permastun

I don't know, I want to give this one more of a thorough playtest before posting first. It mentions somewhere that builds should be playtested before submission, so really I need to do that on both this one and the Rogue one I posted up before they should be added to the list.

 

Echoing Misery definitely seems like a good alternative, I'll edit it in as a potential option. I think the main reason I listed Viettro's Formal Footware as the no. 1 option is that I like the nice round 30 Dexterity gets buffed to when it's equipped (though it's definitely redundant, as the Deadfire belt is already buffing it by +3).

 

For the saber, I think Gyrd Háewanes Sténes would be used too much to make it worthwhile for it to be on the build. I'm reasonably sure that the Dominate chance of Gyrd effects everyone in the Blast radius, so when you think of it like that the chance becomes quite reasonable over a minute or so. Also, the Raw lash with the two damage types on Gyrd is also very nice to put out consistent damage - whereas the Saber is easier to wall. If I had Arms Bearer maybe it could be stuck in the extra slot with Scath Gwannek - I suppose I still might take Arms Bearer over Weapon and Shield Style anyway as I don't think the Reflex really requires the shield buff (it's +50 Reflex from 20 Dex and 25 Per, plus +20 from Llengraths - not too bad) and you only lose a smidge of Deflection anyway.

 

Again Godansthunyr is a pretty good option, especially as it buffs Might so it gives a little boost to all the Sunbeams and Torrent of Flame - but as it's single target and Firebrand should do a good job against single target anyway it probably wouldn't pull it's weight as much as more spellbindings if I were to take Arms Bearer.

 

One thing I was considering was Abydon's Hammer with Arms Bearer. It has a per encounter AoE Stun which benefits from Citzals, and the +4 Might makes Sunbeams and Torrent of Flame extremely potent. Before looking to re-incorporate the Charming angle, I was originally thinking of going pure Might and spell-binds - if you go Living Lands, Lyrinia's Boon and Galawain's Boon with Maegfolc Skull and Abydon's Hammer you can have 44 Might under Citzal's. This means you now do +102% damage with Torrent of Flame, your Sunbeams and Envenomed Strike, which is pretty ferocious IMO - but I think the Charm angle is slightly more versatile so I think the above version is slightly better.

 

EDIT: I up and changed my mind on the build again, this time dropping Interrupting Blows which I wasn't keen on anyway (I think the build really needs to attack faster to make that work) and Weapon and Shield Style, and instead taking Arms Bearer and Secret of Rime - opting for the White Spire in the extra slot.

 

I also think Animancer's Boots and Scath Gwannek are a must, and Rotfinger Gloves can be taken over Gauntlets of Accuracy to add in Touch of Rot.

 

Over the original spread, I would now recommend the slightly modified spread of (with Living Lands background):

 

Might 21

Con 14

Dex 9

Per 17

Int 18

Res 3

 

Going for Galawain's Boon, Song of the Heavens, Gift from the Machine, Training Grounds bonus, Lyrinia's Boon, the Cannoneer Belt, Ring of Changing Heart, +2 Per on the armor and Citzal's Martial power, this all becomes:

 

Might 39

Con 24

Dex 20

Per 20

Int 20

Res 6 or 9 (9 with Gyrd implement)

 

I think the 4 point shift into Might will be felt, and while lowering the Per and not opting for Gauntlets of Accuracy means a 10 point drop in overall spell accuracy - I think with the debuffs this build has honestly that's okay.

 

The per rests with the new suggested gear are:

 

3 Charm

2 Dominate

3 Touch of Rot

3 Spreading Plague (Hobbles, another Reflex debuff)

6 Fireballs

3 Winter Winds

3 Blizzards

3 Jolting Touches

1 Torrent of Flames

 

You also get:

 

Gref's Authority (1 per encounter from Gyrd) - a raw damage/Stun single target attack

10% Dominate Chance on hit or crit (Gyrd implement)

 

That's a hell of a lot to churn out from +20 Accuracy +8 Might, so it really should make for much better stopping power.

Edited January 3, 2018 by Jojobobo

[sarcongin]

Wow. Just wow. Think ill drop the rogue and run that bad boy solo. Cant wait until evening.. three kids, two jobs and a wife keeps me quite busy

[Jojobobo]

It's that time again, we're I get slightly bored of my previous build and post another provisional build.

 

I started playing the unarmed Barbarian in this thread (I've finally tweaked everything so I'm really happy with it, with the build hitting 100 accuracy with fists which should be more than enough, and while it dumps resolve a few situational equipment changes mean you can hit Resolve 8 for fights where Concentration becomes an issue), but Barbarians are Barbarians, they play the same whatever you do and so you have to be in the mood to pursue that - which I wasn't.

 

Here's the updated spread for those curious, the key changes were to drop the idea of DR reduction to favour zero recovery (when you think about it a guy in exceptional plate has 16 DR against crush - and they can be considered well armored - this build can do 40-46 fist damage so I don't think DR reduction is necessary), hitting 100 accuracy, and the dumping of Resolve as mentioned:

 

 

 

===================================

The [name kept secret for when I hopefully Class Build this son of a gun!]

===================================

Difficulty: Testing on Expert PotD solo, no respec, with full upscaling

--------------------------------------------------------------

Class: Barbarian

--------------------------------------------------------------

Race: Coastal Aumaua (or Dwarf/Aumaua of choice)

--------------------------------------------------------------

Background: Living Lands - Colonist

--------------------------------------------------------------

MIG: 21

CON: 13

DEX: 18

PER: 5

INT: 18

RES: 3

 

Boosted stats (DPS/large AoE mode):

 

MIG: 38 (+6 Greater Frenzy, +4 Maegfolc Skull, +3 Training Grounds bonus, +2 Lyrinia’s Boon, +1 Galawain’s Boon, +1 Gift from the Machine)

CON: 23 (+6 Greater Frenzy, +2 Armor Enchantment, +2 Lyrinia’s Boon)

DEX: 21 (+3 Ring of Thorns)

PER: 10 (+4 Mantle of the Excavator, +1 Song of the Heavens)

INT: 22 (+4 Gwyn’s Band of Union)

RES: 3

 

Boosted stats (higher Concentration mode, Gwyn’s Band -> Ring of Changing Heart, Lyrinia’s Boon -> Big Durmsey’s Boon):

 

MIG: 37 (+6 Greater Frenzy, +4 Maegfolc Skull, +3 Training Grounds bonus, +1 Big Durmsey’s Boon, +1 Galawain’s Boon, +1 Gift from the Machine)

CON: 21 (+6 Greater Frenzy, +2 Armor Enchantment)

DEX: 21 (+3 Ring of Thorns)

PER: 10 (+4 Mantle of the Excavator, +1 Song of the Heavens)

INT: 18

RES: 8 (+3 Ring of Changing Heart, +2 Big Durmsey’s Boon)

--------------------------------------------------------------

Abilities:

 

1 – Frenzy

3 – Savage Defiance

5 – Bloodlust

7 – Thick Skinned

9 – Wild Sprint

11 – Heart of Fury

13 – Barbaric Retaliation

15 – Dragon Leap

 

Talents:

 

2 – Weapon Focus: Peasant

4 – Novice’s Suffering

6 – Two Weapon Style

8 – Envenomed Strike

10 – Veteran’s Recovery

12 – Snake’s Reflexes

14 – Greater Frenzy

16 – Gallant’s Focus

 

Important quest talents: Gift from the Machine, Galawain’s Boon, Song of the Heavens, Second Skin, Blooded Hunter, Dungeon Delver.

--------------------------------------------------------------

Weapons and equipment (listing only custom enchantments):

 

Weapon set 1: Your bare hands!

Weapon Set 2: A fist or Cladhalíath (Superb, Stunning, Vicious, Durgan-Refined) plus Little Saviour (Durgan-Reinforced)

Boots: Sandals of the Forgotten Friar

Armor: Sanguine Plate (+2 Con, Crush-Proofed, Exceptional, Durgan-Reinforced)

Neck: Mantle of the Excavator

Belt: Looped Rope

Rings: Ring of Thorns and Gwyn’s Band of Union

Hands: Gauntlets of Swift Action

Head: Maegfolc Skull

--------------------------------------------------------------

Survival – 11 investiture (costing 66 skill points), 16 total with bonuses (+2 Sanguine Plate, +2 Colonist, +1 Barbarian) for third stage acc bonuses

Lore – 4 investiture (costing 10 skill points)

Mechanics – 4 investiture (costing 10 skill points)

Athletics – 2 investiture (costing 3 skill points)

Stealth – 1 investiture 

 

 

 

So I was thinking about other ways to do high DPS and whether they would be fun or not. My first thought was a Citzal's Martial Power Wizard going for minimal recovery with a two-hander. If you go for DoAM, Gauntlets of Swift Action, Durgan-Refinement and the Blade of the Endless Paths (the only two hander with a speed enchantment) you can achieve zero recovery in Durgan-Reinforced full plate - which is pretty cool.

 

However at the top end of 40 Might (20 base, +1 Living Lands, +4 Maegfolc Skull, +3 Training Grounds, +8 Citzal's Martial Power, +2 Lyrinia's Boon, +1 Gift from the Machine, +1 Galawain's Boon), with Savage Attack and Two Handed Style and a Superb Blade of the Endless Paths, the damage range is only 38-54. My unarmed Barb by comparison at Might 38 (trading Citzal's Martial Power for Greater Frenzy), with Novice's Suffering and Sandals of the Forgotten Friar, does 40-46 damage, also with zero recovery in full plate (Bloodlust, 3 x Frenzy with Sanguine Plate, Gauntlets of Swift Action), and having a much shorter attack animation with the fists plus access to HoF (and of course Carnage). Whether the Wizard would achieve better single target DPS was questionable, but even beyond that the Barb build in a whole range of different ways simply blows it out of the water.

 

So what other class could take the minimal recovery two-hander ideas I was thinking of and actually make it worthwhile... why it's a Rogue of course!

 

I mentioned in my Sprightly Scorpion build (and to a lesser extent in the Gunslinger build) the idea of chaining on-crit effects, particularly good for a Rogue as Deathblows becomes extremely trivial. One particular two-hander is ideal for this - the Hours of St. Rumbalt - as it also packs annihilation for big bad crits and the two damage types are extremely useful. With Dirty Fighting, Grave Step and Durgan-Refinement you achieve 55% hit-to-crit conversion (I didn't have room for Vicious Fighting to make it 65%) which means crits come all the time (particularly as Prone itself debuffs Deflection). Even in Act II with only Dirty Fighting, I'm already managing to chain crits and Prone thus creating criteria for Deathblows with my Strikes/Figurine Flanking/Shadowing Beyond (though I'm only level 8 currently, so no Deathblows yet).

 

My second thought was that I still wanted to be using Deleterious Alacrity of Motion - and I didn't want to be chugging potions all the time. There's two items with this Spellbind - Angio's Gambeson and Twin Sting - and if I was looking to use the DoAM of Twin Sting with the Hours I would need Quick Switch to dip into it and dip out. The recovery with Gauntlet's of Swift Action, DAoM and a Durgan-Refined Hours, with Durgan-Reinforced Gambeson, is:

 

Recovery = [1 + 0.05 {Durgan-Reinforced Gambeson}] - [(1.5 {DAoM} x 1.15 {Durgan-Refined weapon} x 1.15 {Swift Action}) - 1] = 0.066 or 6.6% recovery - not bad at all. High Dex was chosen to shorten Rumbalt's attack animation and make this even peachier.

 

With an Intellect of 20, these two DAoM's will give you a minute and a half of pure maniacal Deathblows hack and slash action, which as the potions don't scale with Intellect is the equivalent of three potions - neat. It some ways it can be considered innate, which is really what I like to drive for in a build rather than an over-dependency on potions - plus it frees up potion slots. If you really would rather use DAoM potions, then you can use Nightshroud for an additional Shadowing Beyond in its place (and thus another per rest Backstab).

 

The final piece of this puzzle is attempting to keep the Rogue alive. The Rogue therefore got a bit of a Con focus, with a Belt of Bountiful Healing, Shod-in-Faith, Maegfolc Skull Unbending and Veteran's Recovery. With 35 Might, the belt, and the stage 3 Survival bonus, the healing you receive is [1 + (0.03 x 25)] x 1.25 x 1.6 = 3.5 or 250% extra healing. However, this still didn't sound enough to keep me alive for most encounters consider how bad my Deflection is - so I opted for an Island Aumaua and Tidefall. With Quick Switch, at a moment's notice you can slap on Tidefall and heal back around 70% of all the damage you do (20% damage dealt as endurance x 3.5 = 70%, but it has that Wounding Lash so you'll be getting back a little less) EDIT: See Dr<3 's comments below. Wound Binding was taken to make these heals worthwhile, as otherwise the Rogue simply wouldn't have the health pool to survive.

 

The idea then is quite simple - weaken a target with Deathblows, then drop Invisibility and do a Finishing Blow Backstab (I think they fixed it so they stack, even so Finishing Blow should be taken regardless. Again unfortunately no room for Devastating Blow). The beautiful thing about Shadowing Beyond on solo is that once you've killed off a big target with the first per rest use using Backstab, then you can use the second to entirely escape the encounter then rest up and try again. The idea is the healing received should facilitate the landing of a few of these heaving hits early in combat, and then when the more grindy sections of combat begin if they're too tricky you can just get out of there.

 

Without further ado, here it is:

 

 

 

===================================

The [not sure on a name yet]

===================================

Difficulty: Testing on Expert PotD solo, no respec, with full upscaling

--------------------------------------------------------------

Class: Rogue

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Race: Island Aumaua

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Background: Living Lands - Colonist

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MIG: 21

CON: 14

DEX: 17

PER: 7

INT: 16

RES: 3

 

Boosted stats (using cheap food for Might):

 

MIG: 34 (+2 Duc's Own Beefloaf, +4 Maegfolc Skull, +3 Training Grounds bonus, +2 Lyrinia’s Boon, +1 Galawain’s Boon, +1 Gift from the Machine)

CON: 18 (+2 Armor Enchantment, +2 Lyrinia’s Boon)

DEX: 20 (+3 Ring of Thorns)

PER: 12 (+4 Mantle of the Excavator, +1 Song of the Heavens)

INT: 20 (+4 Gwyn’s Band of Union)

RES: 3

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Abilities:

 

1 – Crippling Strike

3 – Reckless Assault

5 – Dirty Fighting

7 – Adept Evasion

9 – Blinding Strike (more like to crit if the enemy is Prone, but Withering Strike can be taken for Sap synergy)

11 – Deathblows

13 – Finishing Blow

15 – Sap

 

Talents:

 

2 – Veteran's Recovery

4 – Shadowing Beyond

6 – Weapon Focus: Soldier

8 – Two Handed Style

10 – Backstab

12 – Wound Binding

14 – Quick Switch

16 – Gallant’s Focus

 

Important quest talents: Gift from the Machine, Galawain’s Boon, Song of the Heavens, the Merciless Hand, Blooded Hunter, Dungeon Delver.

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Weapons and equipment (listing only custom enchantments):

 

Weapon set 1: Twin Sting for DAoM

Weapon set 2: The Hours of St. Rumbalt (Durgan-Refined, Legendary, Freezing Lash or choice), accuracy endgame = 105

Weapon set 3: Tidefall (Durgan-Refined, Superb, Burning Lash or choice, Beast Slaying or choice)

Boots: Shod-in-Faith

Armor: Angio's Gambeson (+2 Con, Proofing of choice, Exceptional, Durgan-Reinforced)

Neck: Mantle of the Excavator

Belt: Belt of Bountiful Healing

Rings: Ring of Thorns and Gwyn’s Band of Union

Hands: Gauntlets of Swift Action

Head: Maegfolc Skull

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Survival – 10 investiture (costing 55 skill points), 14 total with bonuses (+2 Mantle, +2 Colonist) for third stage healing bonuses

Lore – 5 investiture (costing 15 skill points) - possible to hit 10 with Library bonus, +2 Lore item and Aldwyn's Boon for casting of Prayer against Imprisonment for Lagufaeth

Mechanics – 5 investiture (costing 15 skill points), 10 possible in Act II to obtain Tidefall without Gloves of Manipulation using +2 Rogue base, +1 Gfeja's Boon, +2 Artificer's Hall

Athletics – 1 investiture (costing 1 skill points)

Stealth – 2 investiture (costing 3 skill points)

 

 

 

I hope someone enjoys the build, and especially for this one going solo the proof of the pudding is in the eating - i.e. will it be able to survive with such low Deflection and crummy DR but such high healing? I think there isn't a single Class Build yet dedicated to stupid-high damage for a Rogue in a single hit, most are DPS or offtank builds, so hopefully this build can fill that distinctly Roguish niche so to speak.

Edited January 12, 2018 by Jojobobo

[dunehunter]

A noob question, if u already has 0 recovery time, do u need to worry about interruption? Because your rogue seems to have super low concentration.

[Jojobobo]

A noob question, if u already has 0 recovery time, do u need to worry about interruption? Because your rogue seems to have super low concentration.

You can still get interrupted in your attack animation yes, and as mentioned the build doesn't quite manage zero recovery either - just very close to it at 6.6%.

 

However, just like the Barb, if you drop either Ring of Thorns or Gwyn's Band of Union for Ring of the Changing Heart and take Big Durmsey's Boon you hit a Resolve of 8 and really don't lose much. As the build is fast attacking as you say, Resolve of 8 should equal significantly less Interrupts over the dump at 3, and if it really really was getting interrupted to a miserable extent you can throw in a Dragon Egg Dish and the Chapel Resting bonus let it hit Resolve 14 (which I seem to remember is the benchmark for 50 Concentration over a Abbey of the Fallen Moon's monk Interrupt on a crit, meaning on their 1-100 roll you only get interrupted half of the time).

 

As such, I think there's situationally enough you can do to the build to make interrupts not too much of an issue, if the need arises. It's also important to note that DAoM gives a speed bonus, giving you the edge in finding decent positioning so you don't get crowded by too many guys who all may Interrupt you.

 

I think the real question is can it survive a ton of Deflection crits all the time (Adept Evaison and high Fortitude should help well enough with ranged spell attacks)? Currently the build is doing quite well at mowing through enemies, but later I think that high risk factor of can you kill them before they kill you will really come into full force - still that's all part of the fun.

Edited January 12, 2018 by Jojobobo

[Dr <3]

I have to say it: healing bonus doesn't work with the healing that comes from weapon dmg. Nice build anyway.

[Jojobobo]

I have to say it: healing bonus doesn't work with the healing that comes from weapon dmg. Nice build anyway.

That rings a bell now you say it, do none of them stack (including Might) or is it just the items and rest bonuses that don't? If Might alone worked, that's still a big deal as it'd be 35% health back at 35 Might (20% x 1.75, using Dragon Meat Dish over Duc's Own Beefloaf).

 

Even if none of the multipliers work, Deathblows with Tidefall should do heavy damage in the first place, so if I'm managing 150ish (which doesn't seem too farfetched, I'd dare say it's probably an underestimate but I'll have to wait and see) then that'd be 30 damage healed per hit - and this build hits fast, so I still think Tidefall is worth it's place on the list (and if not, Nightshroud for an extra Shadowing Beyond or an Arquebus would both work well).

Edited January 12, 2018 by Jojobobo

[Dr <3]

Afaik might works. I tried something like this in the past, the game will become tedious after the end of act 2, since you will encounter swarms of enemies wich are super boring to hack and slash one by one. You will have to split a lot and rest a lot for most fights. Or go super sneaky.

[Jojobobo]

Afaik might works. I tried something like this in the past, the game will become tedious after the end of act 2, since you will encounter swarms of enemies wich are super boring to hack and slash one by one. You will have to split a lot and rest a lot for most fights. Or go super sneaky.

Might would easily be enough, so that's okay. I guess a lull is to be expected in Act II (normally when I do White March Pt I solo), as it's really the start of WM Pt II when you get a lot of the sweet benefits (Durgan-Refinement, access to Grave Step).

 

What I have noticed is the build gets absolutely shredded by Deflection targeting spells (which won't mean good things for Magran's Faithful or Thaos, though at least with Magran's Faithful Shadowing Beyond means you can spilt it into several fights). Quite possibly I might go to Sanguine Plate or He Carries Many Scars if the build is too squishy even with the heals, end-game it would still be less recovery than I'm currently running (40%-ish with Gauntlets of Swift Action and Durgan-Refinement plus DAoM, compared to my current 70% with just DAoM and Angio's Gambeson) - though I would prefer to stick with the 2 per rest DAoMs. I'll try and see this one through and report my findings, high-risk high-reward strategies I feel need more clarification than other builds that are more sure-fire.

Edited January 12, 2018 by Jojobobo

[Jojobobo]

So I got Deathblows and realised... none of the Rogue abilities (Backstab, Sneak Attack, Deathblows) seem to stack anymore, making the damage a lot more lacklustre than I first thought (see bug thread here). I'm still having enough fun with the build, Deathblows hits in the 56-80 damage range (with an additional 14-20ish lash damage) but it's certainly not the damage dealing king I thought it would be. The damage for this build currently with Backstab, Sneak Attack and Deathblows (if it was all additive) should be 112-160 on a hit alone:

 

100% (base) + 50% (Sneak Attack) + 100% (Deathblows) + 150% (Backstab) = 400%. Damage range of 28-40 -> 112-160 with a 28-40 damage lash.

 

As I'm not dealing anywhere near what I thought I would be, I'll probably run into trouble late game, but for the time being it's okay.

 

EDIT: I clearly have no idea what I'm talking about. See MaxQuest's post here.

 

Bottom-line I'd say the Barb (doing 80-92 damage across a group from a full attack) is probably a lot better than this Rogue, but I'll probably still persevere with the Rogue anyway given it's still as good a damage that you can get with a Rogue more or less.

Edited January 15, 2018 by Jojobobo

[Boeroer]

I'm surpsrised you didn't know that dmg from MIG is only an additive bonus (and beause of that it's not that important for rogues who have a lot of other dmg mods).

 

In Deadfire it is multiplicative by the way, making it a lot more important for any dps build - which I don't like too much I must say.

 

Anyways: it's the weapons with high base damage that make you go "AWWW" with a rouge - like a Deathblow-Backstab with Firebrand for example (using invisibilty after summoning). Or same thing with an arquebus.

 

Also a Full Attack with dual sabres before the sabre nerf was pretty awesome. 

 

A rogue is still great for taking out high priority targets asap - if you can manage to keep him alive. One of my most favorite is a rogue with Tidefall with maxed MIG and 1 INT (Ultimate Hat of Alluring Perfection) with Runner's Wounding Shot and rogue's usual strikes like Binding Strike, later Sap and so on. I'll backstab one of the rushing enemies, then I'll "escape" to the enemy's backrow and aually with one or two strikes a squishy falls. Wounding DoT gets applied pretty fast with 1 INT and the combo of high dmg mods, high crit damage  and high MIG make wouding superpowerful. The only other class I like even better for this role is a dw Fighter with Charge. But Charge comes sooo late. It's a shame.

 

For me  rogue is not so much about sustained high dps throughout an encounter. Here I think barbs and monks are much better. He's a great "behind the lines" striker in my book. He also has the right tools for that (Escape and such).

 

But taking out casters and the like very quickly can be so benefical and completely change the course of the battle... much more important than to lead the party's damage highscore list.

 

Still: people saying that rogues are the best dps class (and stuff like that) are wrong in my opinion. For me, they are still the weakest in PoE - at least on PotD diff. Not in the early game, where they are very useful, but over the course of a whole playthrough. 

[Jojobobo]

I knew that Might was additive, but expected the Rogue damage to be multiplicative, seeing as the tooltips say "+X% damage" not "+X% base damage", and your character sheet lists "damage" for your weapon - so I'm not sure what the devs expected people to think. It's fundamentally misleading.

 

Still, this Rogue's damage should top out at 196-280 damage with the lash and before factoring the DR as I've mentioned elsewhere, and seeing as the recovery is 7% and the Dex is good it should be able to take out one or two of the beefy targets and then drop Shadowing Beyond and escape. This still isn't quite as amazing as other builds, but it is at least fun and pretty cool that the damage can get so high.

 

One thing I would change about the above build is that Finishing Blow should be dropped for Fearsome Strike - this gives four separate Strikes, two of which debuff Fortitude for better Overbearing Prone procs with Weakened (and a third from Sever the Soul should you need it). Deathblows should be more or less a given all the time because of this.

Edited January 16, 2018 by Jojobobo

[Boeroer]

That's the problem with nearly all description that wants to cover the combat mechanics: they are inaccurate or even flat out wrong. The mechanics are poorly explained. We had to dig into the code and to do millions of tests in order to find out all that stuff that's now shared knowledge here in the forum.

 

As I said in the other thread: clearly some people (designers, writers) don't seem to know how the mechanics "really" work. Or they just can't be bothered with explaining them properly. I hope it's the first reason...

[Jojobobo]

As I said in the other thread: clearly some people (designers, writers) don't seem to know how the mechanics "really" work. Or they just can't be bothered with explaining them properly. I hope it's the first reason...

Both reasons are pretty poor to be honest. What I was expecting was that all the Rogue damage mods would add together and then multiply the "damage" listed, seeing as that would be the most literal interpretation of their tooltip. It's things like this that really get under my skin, accurate tooltip descriptions should be a given and imply laziness on the devs' behalf. I've seen people call them out for it on the Deadfire subforums, so hopefully they'll have learnt their lesson, we'll wait and see.

 

I think I will be keeping Backstab on this Rogue anyway (was wondering whether to cash it in for Vicious Fighting, but 55% hit to crit sounds like enough), so in which case the top end of the damage on a Deathblows Backstab crit will be 266-381 before DR, so I think that's pretty fun. I may well take Nightshroud instead of Tidefall for 3 Shadowing Beyonds per rest, so that'd give a lot of these punchy hits in a tricky encounter. Plus, it's using the Rogue as was advertised by the devs, even if the implementation of Rogues does make using them as advertised difficult.

Edited January 16, 2018 by Jojobobo

[dunehunter]

I just tested the cloak I get from a stronghold quest l, that let u do one escape per encounter. Which I feel pretty disappointed because it cannot pass enemies, u will be blocked by anything in the line between u and the location u wanna teleport too.

 

Secondly, there is a recovery time after u use it!!! The Deadfire one is just much better. I cannot immediately hit someone after escape and the whole movement seems to be really slow.

[Boeroer]

The cloak's escape is also superbuggy. I tried it on a rogue who already hd escape (so I could use escape twice per encounter) and it toally messes up both escape usages.

 

The good thing about escape is the +25 deflection though.